tilikums' life today

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The situation is what it is. Unfortunately, no one here was around or involved in the capture of Tilikum over 20 years ago. This is his life, this is home. Make it as best as possible for him.

An I love how people say "he doesn't do anything but float in the middle of the tank"... it's what he's always done. I've been a passholder for years and saw him for years just hanging out in the middle of the tank. This isn't a new behavior from him. So quite trying to play the "poor tilikum" sob story.

sad, but it's true

i was surprised when i mentioned to a couple of friends that I had booked our 1st ever discovery cove dolphin swim and i got lectures like you wouldn't believe ranging from how the dolphins are being exploited to how dangerous it is to visit seaworld these days...since the whale/trainer incident.:confused3

this from women who wear fur:rolleyes1so long and thanks for all the fish;)
 
I love how people like to say one thing and do the other. But if you point it out, they don't feel it's on the same level as what they do.

It was a sad accident, and yes it involved an animal, but I think it's all gone to the extreme. When attacks happen that involve a certain specics that's been in several attacks/accidents before, like an elephant or tigers, no one seems to really care. They just mark it in the books as another one... Now an accident that happens with a specics that doesn't have very many marks, it seems to grab the world's attention.

I really hope those railings mean that Tilikum will be performing like usual. I guess part of the show will have to be modified as well. Like when the whales slide across it. Or if they ever get back in the water, when the trainers go sliding across it.
 


I know for a fact Tilly receives the best care and love each and every day and is not "Ignored" Its important to become familiar with his situation before making assumptions. Tilly was RESCUED by Seaworld in the early 90s from a park in Canada that could no longer support and care for him and was talking about putting him down. Tilly is a big whale and because of this, trainers are forbid from getting to close. Especially now after the accident. Seaworld does not have to tell you how the trainers interact and care for the whales on a minute by minute basis. But I know they care for every single one of their whales including Tilly for 24 hours a day 7 days a week 365 days a year.

If you know about Killer Whale society, it is a matriarch society, which means the female killer whales are in charge. The lowest of the low even below the baby whales in a killer whale society are the adult male killer whales, which is why Tilly is kept away from the other females in the park. The female whales do not accept him because of the matriarch society. There is only one other male besides Tilly and he is 4 or 5 years old and is still accepted among the female whales.

The article is one sided and biased. The best place for Tilly is his current home at Seaworld where he has the benefits of a professional training staff caring for him 24/7 and above all, they KNOW what it takes to take care of Tilly which is more than a random volunteer at a coastal seapen would know. And for the record, he would never last more than a few days in the wild due to his dependence on human care.
 
I know for a fact Tilly receives the best care and love each and every day and is not "Ignored" Its important to become familiar with his situation before making assumptions. Tilly was RESCUED by Seaworld in the early 90s from a park in Canada that could no longer support and care for him and was talking about putting him down. Tilly is a big whale and because of this, trainers are forbid from getting to close. Especially now after the accident. Seaworld does not have to tell you how the trainers interact and care for the whales on a minute by minute basis. But I know they care for every single one of their whales including Tilly for 24 hours a day 7 days a week 365 days a year.

If you know about Killer Whale society, it is a matriarch society, which means the female killer whales are in charge. The lowest of the low even below the baby whales in a killer whale society are the adult male killer whales, which is why Tilly is kept away from the other females in the park. The female whales do not accept him because of the matriarch society. There is only one other male besides Tilly and he is 4 or 5 years old and is still accepted among the female whales.

The article is one sided and biased. The best place for Tilly is his current home at Seaworld where he has the benefits of a professional training staff caring for him 24/7 and above all, they KNOW what it takes to take care of Tilly which is more than a random volunteer at a coastal seapen would know. And for the record, he would never last more than a few days in the wild due to his dependence on human care.


Well stated.....
 
I also have one major question. Everyone is so obsessed with Tillikum these days.

Where is everyone who should be protesting about Lolita and the size of her tank being the size of a backyard swimming pool? Where is PETA on that? Where is the public on that? I am fully aware that PETA has said a few things about her tank, but it is not a priority. Instead, people are freaking out about Tillikum. He has a more than adequate sized tank, premium nutrition, and state of the line care.

If everyone is looking for a animal that needs help, look to Marineland first.

the size of lolita's tank makes seaworld look like an ocean.

terrrible.

there was a doc made in 'slave to entertainment'
http://www.slavetoentertainment.com/

this site shows the speedboats capturing her and others in the nets, scroll down:

http://www.miamiseaprison.com/lolita.htm

no one can defend that picture. no one. you can all say they have a great life, they are loved, they enjoy doing the tricks or whatever it is you want to say.
but you can't say anything about that picture.
can't be done. because every single one of you on here knows that it is wrong.

one organisation have offered to buy her in order to try and re-introduced her back into the wild but marineland have said no.

People do protest outside marineland on the anniversary of her capture date.
 


I grew up in Miami, but we only went to Metro Zoo, so I can't speak of the conditions of Lolita or her tank. From a google map image, it does look significantly smaller than Sea Worlds.

She is an old whale, so I don't think moving her would be a good idea at this point in time. But she'd probably be a welcome addition to the Sea World Family. I wonder if they've ever petitioned to buy her.

But I don't think any one can take it out on the trainers. They love them as much as possible, and try to do everything they can for the whales. But it's up to corporate to agree to fork over the money for improvements to the park.

the size of lolita's tank makes seaworld look like an ocean.

terrrible.

there was a doc made in 'slave to entertainment'
http://www.slavetoentertainment.com/

this site shows the speedboats capturing her and others in the nets, scroll down:

http://www.miamiseaprison.com/lolita.htm

no one can defend that picture. no one. you can all say they have a great life, they are loved, they enjoy doing the tricks or whatever it is you want to say.
but you can't say anything about that picture.
can't be done. because every single one of you on here knows that it is wrong.

one organisation have offered to buy her in order to try and re-introduced her back into the wild but marineland have said no.

People do protest outside marineland on the anniversary of her capture date.

Lolita belongs where they take care of their whales, she needs to leave the Miami Seaqarium.
 
the size of lolita's tank makes seaworld look like an ocean.

terrrible.

there was a doc made in 'slave to entertainment'
http://www.slavetoentertainment.com/

this site shows the speedboats capturing her and others in the nets, scroll down:

http://www.miamiseaprison.com/lolita.htm

no one can defend that picture. no one. you can all say they have a great life, they are loved, they enjoy doing the tricks or whatever it is you want to say.
but you can't say anything about that picture.
can't be done. because every single one of you on here knows that it is wrong.

one organisation have offered to buy her in order to try and re-introduced her back into the wild but marineland have said no.

People do protest outside marineland on the anniversary of her capture date.

Lolita lives at Miami Seaquarium. Not Marineland. I have never been to Miami Seaquarium so I dont have a right to judge how things operate over there. Is it wrong? Yeah. But that was in the late 60s, early 70s. Times change. It doesnt happen in the U.S anymore. And Seaworld definitely doesnt use this method today. Nor do they get any animals from places that still do this today. (Like the Dolphin slaughter in Japan)

All but four of Seaworlds Killer Whales in all three parks combined were born in captivity. 3 of those four were captured in the 70s by parks that ARE NOT AND WERE NOT associated with Seaworld in anyway. Seaworld rescued those 3 whales, including Tilly from those parks when they could no longer support them and take proper care of them. Only ONE of Seaworlds 20+ Killer whales were collected by Seaworld. And this was 40 YEARS AGO. When it was acceptable at the time.

ALL of Seaworlds animals from late mid 1970 until present time were BORN AT SEAWORLD or RESCUED DUE TO THE ANIMAL BEING INJURED AND UNABLE TO FEND FOR ITSELF. Many of the injured animals include Manatees and Turtles all of which are released back into the wild once they are healthy enough to live on their own again. Releasing a Whale or dolphin that has lived in the care of man for son long is irresponsible and stupid. That animal will die within months, weeks or maybe even days. Like I said in a post above, Seaworld has the up most respect and care for every single one of its animals living at its parks. They are all treated for and loved 24/7, 365 days a year. The animals are NEVER forced to perform in shows and its their choosing to perform or not. With no consequences for choosing not to. The only result is the show would be canceled at that time. Food is NOT withheld for choosing not to participate in a show and there is no punishment whatsoever.

If you watch the cove, or blood dolphins or read these blogs and articles about Seaworld and their "wrong doing" , then you have been lied to. These are obviously biased accounts and they have no knowledge whatsoever of how Seaworld cares for its animals. Its all ASSUMPTION. The creator of "The Cove" and "Blood Dolphins" is Ric O Berry. Who was a dolphin trainer himself back in the 60s and 70s. He trained the original flipper. He was fired from his training job and in my opinion this is his way of getting revenge on aquariums. He accuses Seaworld of caring about money over their animals. But do you think for one minute that this guy doesnt make any money off of his movies and documentaries? How much of this money goes back into research rehabilitation and conservation efforts? ZERO. It goes to him and his crew. He may act as if he is saving dolphins. But look at him closer. He is using the dolphin slaughter for the all mighty dollar. FOR HIMSELF. The majority of Seaworlds profits go into conservation, rehabilitation, research and education. Which is more than Ric O Berry, PETA or any "Animal Rights" organization does. Go to http://www.petakillsanimals.com/ for more info on this. See how many animals PETA has killed in the past years compared to how many they have saved. 8 Animals yes EIGHT animals saved in 2009. 2,301 killed and put down.

Open your mind and see through the lies of animal rights groups and Ric O Berry who try to convince you that Seaworld is a horrible place. Visit Seaworld and see for yourself how these animals are cared for and loved every single day and NOT ignored.
 
Lolita lives at Miami Seaquarium. Not Marineland. I have never been to Miami Seaquarium so I dont have a right to judge how things operate over there. Is it wrong? Yeah. But that was in the late 60s, early 70s. Times change. It doesnt happen in the U.S anymore. And Seaworld definitely doesnt use this method today. Nor do they get any animals from places that still do this today. (Like the Dolphin slaughter in Japan)

All but four of Seaworlds Killer Whales in all three parks combined were born in captivity. 3 of those four were captured in the 70s by parks that ARE NOT AND WERE NOT associated with Seaworld in anyway. Seaworld rescued those 3 whales, including Tilly from those parks when they could no longer support them and take proper care of them. Only ONE of Seaworlds 20+ Killer whales were collected by Seaworld. And this was 40 YEARS AGO. When it was acceptable at the time.

ALL of Seaworlds animals from late mid 1970 until present time were BORN AT SEAWORLD or RESCUED DUE TO THE ANIMAL BEING INJURED AND UNABLE TO FEND FOR ITSELF. Many of the injured animals include Manatees and Turtles all of which are released back into the wild once they are healthy enough to live on their own again. Releasing a Whale or dolphin that has lived in the care of man for son long is irresponsible and stupid. That animal will die within months, weeks or maybe even days. Like I said in a post above, Seaworld has the up most respect and care for every single one of its animals living at its parks. They are all treated for and loved 24/7, 365 days a year. The animals are NEVER forced to perform in shows and its their choosing to perform or not. With no consequences for choosing not to. The only result is the show would be canceled at that time. Food is NOT withheld for choosing not to participate in a show and there is no punishment whatsoever.

If you watch the cove, or blood dolphins or read these blogs and articles about Seaworld and their "wrong doing" , then you have been lied to. These are obviously biased accounts and they have no knowledge whatsoever of how Seaworld cares for its animals. Its all ASSUMPTION. The creator of "The Cove" and "Blood Dolphins" is Ric O Berry. Who was a dolphin trainer himself back in the 60s and 70s. He trained the original flipper. He was fired from his training job and in my opinion this is his way of getting revenge on aquariums. He accuses Seaworld of caring about money over their animals. But do you think for one minute that this guy doesnt make any money off of his movies and documentaries? How much of this money goes back into research rehabilitation and conservation efforts? ZERO. It goes to him and his crew. He may act as if he is saving dolphins. But look at him closer. He is using the dolphin slaughter for the all mighty dollar. FOR HIMSELF. The majority of Seaworlds profits go into conservation, rehabilitation, research and education. Which is more than Ric O Berry, PETA or any "Animal Rights" organization does. Go to http://www.petakillsanimals.com/ for more info on this. See how many animals PETA has killed in the past years compared to how many they have saved. 8 Animals yes EIGHT animals saved in 2009. 2,301 killed and put down.

Open your mind and see through the lies of animal rights groups and Ric O Berry who try to convince you that Seaworld is a horrible place. Visit Seaworld and see for yourself how these animals are cared for and loved every single day and NOT ignored.

how can anyone defend captivity? you know that you can't . every single one of you.

why are they made to do tricks - why doesn't the marine parks just let them be to swim around and not made to perform?

because a swimming dolphin/whale won't pull as much money in as a performing one.

people keep saying that seaworld care, etc. they probably do but they aren't doing it for the sake of it - it is a business. you all seem to forget it all about the $$$$. Everything in this life is about $$$$$.
Seaworld is a muti-million pound operation.

for people that are pro-capitvity what happens when captured whales want to migrate? no marine park can build a tank big enough compared to the ocean.
 
how can anyone defend captivity? you know that you can't . every single one of you.

why are they made to do tricks - why doesn't the marine parks just let them be to swim around and not made to perform?

because a swimming dolphin/whale won't pull as much money in as a performing one.

people keep saying that seaworld care, etc. they probably do but they aren't doing it for the sake of it - it is a business. you all seem to forget it all about the $$$$. Everything in this life is about $$$$$.
Seaworld is a muti-million pound operation.

for people that are pro-capitvity what happens when captured whales want to migrate? no marine park can build a tank big enough compared to the ocean.

Defending captivity itself, and defending the care of the animals in captivity are very different.
If the whales didn't perform they would get bored, they're lives would not be as varied if all they had to do all day was to swim around.
Of course it's about the $$, I don't think anyone here would suggest otherwise, just because they make money doesn't mean they cannot care for these animals

Also I have a question for you, are you also saying all this on threads about Animal Kingdom/ Busch Gardens or is it only Seaworld you have issues with? (This is a genuine question not a bash)
 
i don't agree with dolphins/whales in captivity anywhere in the world. full stop.
 
Sorry, I don't think I was clear.
Is it only Cetaceans in captivity you are against or all animal captivity?
 
how can anyone defend captivity? you know that you can't . every single one of you.

why are they made to do tricks - why doesn't the marine parks just let them be to swim around and not made to perform?

because a swimming dolphin/whale won't pull as much money in as a performing one.

people keep saying that seaworld care, etc. they probably do but they aren't doing it for the sake of it - it is a business. you all seem to forget it all about the $$$$. Everything in this life is about $$$$$.
Seaworld is a muti-million pound operation.

for people that are pro-capitvity what happens when captured whales want to migrate? no marine park can build a tank big enough compared to the ocean.

Right. Without money, they cant help animals in the wild or continue the rescue, rehabilitation and education programs. The majority of Seaworld profits go to animals and conservation. That is why they are owned by an outside company and are not an independent company like Disney. Blackstone funds Seaworld who in turn make money for conservation and education programs.

The poster above me said it too. It would be a boring life just swimming around all day. That is why they have the shows. And like I said before the animals are NEVER forced to perform. If they dont want to, they dont. The shows are a form of enrichment which could be seen as the equivalent of the average person taking their dog for a walk. Its something fun and stimulating for them. It keeps them physically and mentally fit. The behaviors they do in shows, 90% of them are behaviors that they do naturally in the wild. Of course, if the trainers get back in the water, thats about the 10% that is unnatural, but this shows the unique connection that humans can have with this animal. But as far as the shows now go. The majority if not all behaviors performed in shows are things whales and dolphins to in the wild. For example, Spy hopping and breaching.

I know I can defend captivity because I can see through the lies of "Animal Rights" organizations. And I see all the good Seaworld does for animals and conservation and how they treat their animals with love and respect. Im totally against any type of animal captivity when the animal is being tortured or disrespected by using inhumane means to care and train them. The circus for example. But if a facility is caring and respectful for their animals and treats them humanly, like Seaworld, then I have no problem with animals being in the care of man.
 
i don't agree with dolphins/whales in captivity anywhere in the world. full stop.

problem is there are many in captivity, you can't just chuck them back in the ocean (ala free willie):confused3

btw, yes, the whales breeching in vancouver/alaska are amazing to see:thumbsup2. When on recent Alaskan cruise found it disturbing to hear from on-board enviornmentalist the numbers who are killed in the wild by large ships (commercial & cruise) especially in migratory periods despite following the current rules & regs. We were told the locals call them 'speed bumps':eek:. We had an outside suite on the ship & it was quite disconscerning to hear the whales bumping off the ship, even at the approved reduced speed & crew on watch.:sad2: It's ironic that those who book these cruises to see the whales can wind up unknowingly harming them.

my point is, even in the wild there are many dangers the whales face. When a species is close to extinction, sometimes the only way to preserve them is thru a breeding program wherein the young are re-introduced in a protected enviornment. This sort of program costs big bucks & it'd be nice to see SW continue (even amp up) these efforts.
 
Right. Without money, they cant help animals in the wild or continue the rescue, rehabilitation and education programs. The majority of Seaworld profits go to animals and conservation. That is why they are owned by an outside company and are not an independent company like Disney. Blackstone funds Seaworld who in turn make money for conservation and education programs.

The poster above me said it too. It would be a boring life just swimming around all day. That is why they have the shows. And like I said before the animals are NEVER forced to perform. If they dont want to, they dont. The shows are a form of enrichment which could be seen as the equivalent of the average person taking their dog for a walk. Its something fun and stimulating for them. It keeps them physically and mentally fit. The behaviors they do in shows, 90% of them are behaviors that they do naturally in the wild. Of course, if the trainers get back in the water, thats about the 10% that is unnatural, but this shows the unique connection that humans can have with this animal. But as far as the shows now go. The majority if not all behaviors performed in shows are things whales and dolphins to in the wild. For example, Spy hopping and breaching.

I know I can defend captivity because I can see through the lies of "Animal Rights" organizations. And I see all the good Seaworld does for animals and conservation and how they treat their animals with love and respect. Im totally against any type of animal captivity when the animal is being tortured or disrespected by using inhumane means to care and train them. The circus for example. But if a facility is caring and respectful for their animals and treats them humanly, like Seaworld, then I have no problem with animals being in the care of man.


so what would happen if whales/dolphins DIDN'T perform at seaworld would people still go? would they not visit an ordinary aquarium that would be cheaper instead?
would seaworld still make as much as money with non performing dolphins/whales?

we both know the answer is no.

so giving them dead fish is stimulation for them?

wild whales swim up to 100 miles a day - they don't need 'stimulation' in the wild - they with their own family - hunting for fish, swimming where they want to.

i love how the shows are made out to be 'stimulation' for the whales/dolphins! LOL - nothing to do with drawing in the crowds then?

you said 'It would be a boring life just swimming around all day.' - yep wild whales must be bored out of their minds. do you really think that? you joking right?
if you are not saying that then you are saying that captive whales must be bored just swimming around all day - what does that say about captivity - yep you said it. whales must be bored out of their brains looking at those four walls.

and you think a concrete tank is big enough for a 12 tonne creature aka tilly?

good luck with that.
 
Seaworld rescued those 3 whales, including Tilly from those parks when they could no longer support them and take proper care of them. Only ONE of Seaworlds 20+ Killer whales were collected by Seaworld. And this was 40 YEARS AGO. When it was acceptable at the time.

ALL of Seaworlds animals from late mid 1970 until present time were BORN AT SEAWORLD or RESCUED DUE TO THE ANIMAL BEING INJURED AND UNABLE TO FEND FOR ITSELF.

if seaworld 'rescued' tilly (i say 'bought') as you say why didn't they put the whale in a sea pen and re-introduce the whale back to the wild slowly?
because there is no money to be made in releasing a whale back in the ocean is there?
but there is money to be made to see a whale on display and doing tricks.
 
if seaworld 'rescued' tilly (i say 'bought') as you say why didn't they put the whale in a sea pen and re-introduce the whale back to the wild slowly?
because there is no money to be made in releasing a whale back in the ocean is there?
but there is money to be made to see a whale on display and doing tricks.

Have you been to Seaworld before? If so, you have nothing to say! If not, you are just on this site because you want to engage someone in a fight!
 
so what would happen if whales/dolphins DIDN'T perform at seaworld would people still go? would they not visit an ordinary aquarium that would be cheaper instead?
would seaworld still make as much as money with non performing dolphins/whales?

we both know the answer is no.

so giving them dead fish is stimulation for them?

wild whales swim up to 100 miles a day - they don't need 'stimulation' in the wild - they with their own family - hunting for fish, swimming where they want to.

i love how the shows are made out to be 'stimulation' for the whales/dolphins! LOL - nothing to do with drawing in the crowds then?

you said 'It would be a boring life just swimming around all day.' - yep wild whales must be bored out of their minds. do you really think that? you joking right?
if you are not saying that then you are saying that captive whales must be bored just swimming around all day - what does that say about captivity - yep you said it. whales must be bored out of their brains looking at those four walls.

and you think a concrete tank is big enough for a 12 tonne creature aka tilly?

good luck with that.

Yes its a business. I said the majority goes to conservation and education not "ALL" of it. The point of a business is to make money. Duh.

Ill admit, that yes, it would be boring to look at those walls and thats an added reason to have the shows. But they also get stimulation from the trainers, and various toys they are given throughout the day. And yes, Seaworld's pools are some of the largest in the world.

The point of the shows is to give the animals stimulation and yes to show people how powerful and smart these animals are. You bring awareness to people when they see shows.

Im not going to sit here and argue with you. You are close minded like every other anti captivity person. Dont assume based off of lies. Go to Seaworld and see for yourself if you have never been. If your to blind to see all the good that Seaworld does for not only whales and dolphins but other marine and wildlife throughout the world, then something is wrong with you. How much money do you donate to conservation efforts? Do you go out and rescue animals in need? Or do you just sit on a computer all day and spew "Free The Whales" on message boards? and like a poster above me said, if your looking to pick a fight, then go elsewhere. No body cares what you think.
 
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