Same Sex Marriage?

[kaytieeldr]

Marriage is a religious term

As long as there can be a marriage of minds or a marriage of flavors, it's not a religious term.

And marriage isn't a religious term. My parents were MARRIED for 48 years - not civil unioned.

 

[dejr_8]

I also support same sex marriage.

I think the "slippery slope" argument is a cop-out. It's either right or wrong or you're undecided, but IMO an issue needs to be decided on it's own merit, not what you might foresee somewhere down the road.

For those who are against same sex marriage based on what it may lead to, do you also think that interracial marriage should never have been made legal? The similarities between that issue and this one are often pointed out, so some could say that Loving v. Virginia started us down the slippery slope that will lead us to same sex marriage, polygamy, and people marrying their goldfish.

Nope. Each possible new expansion of the definition of marriage should be looked at on it's own. As ZephryHawk explained, there are many reasons polyamorous unions don't fit into the marriage mold as well as same-sex unions do, and those should be analyzed if and when the time comes that the legality of such unions is questioned. Not as part of the issue of same sex marriage.

Note: in the statement below YOU is the general YOU not the specific YOU.

I am against it. No cop out here. The reason I bring up polygamous marriages is because I believe supporters of gay marriage are copping out on their convictions if they don't support polygamy.

You are only willing to move the line from no gay marriage to gay marriage but then you choose to stop there. Why?

Why is gay marriage acceptable and polygamous marriage not? Aren't you making a moral decision that one is acceptable but the other isn't? Why is that?

I choose to keep that moral decision at no gay marriage.

 

[J3nn78]

I guess I would have to say I am against gay MARRIAGE. I am a believer that marriage is religious and between a man and a woman. From a biblical and religious standpoint, I believe that homosexuality is a sin, but so is lying, adultery, steeling, etc... and we are ALL sinners.

However, I FULLY support legal civil unions that give couples the same rights and benefits as any married couple. It should not be the governments place to decide such things. I also think that polygamy should not be illegal-not talking about the issues that make headlines about the extremist groups and the children involved, but why should the government call a union between multiple of age consenting partners illegal? I believe they should have the same rights as well.

 

[mjkacmom]

I wouldn't mind having another husband!

I've been asking for a sister-wife for as long as I can remember! Even the kids know I want one, and I know many who would do nicely (if they weren't married - you know the type - clean homes, organized, great cooks). So far, my wish has not been granted, and it's all me!

 

[FireDancer]

You know, I'm not really sure where I stand on the civil vs. marriage thing. I get that marriage is just a word, and that most people can get the same thing out of it in a civil union, but it still seems wrong to me to keep excluding people.

It is kinda like saying that a blonde person can be married but a redhead can only have a civil union. I think that is where my hang-up lies.

But, my dear friend who cannot get health insurance coverage at his husband's work would give his hair to be able to have a civil union and doesn't really care what anyone calls it. (And frankly, he's a better housekeeper than I am so why is he penalized?)

I understand wanting the symbolism of getting "married" but if a civil union granted all the same rights as marriage just with a different word I think it would be a workable compromise. Sometime you have to accept the practical as opposed the ideal. I'm all for same sex marriage but I wouldn't get all worked up over a word. I'm still for same sex marriage though.

As for this being a civil rights issue as opposed to political, those aren't mutually exclusive. Civil rights only exist once they are protected and that protection has to come from the government.

The way to get this thread shut down is to argue back and forth. If someone is against gay marriage don't tell them why they are wrong or try to change their mind. They are entitled to their opinion as those who are for it. It is the arguing that will get the thread closed, not the civil discussion.

 

[RainbowBrite]

As a married lesbian I don't think it's any surprise that I support gay marriage. I'm very happy to have been able to marry DW in our home state of Massachusetts. We could have been married in a church because there are plenty here who will do it, but in the end we decided to have it elsewhere. My only hope is that every gay and lesbian couple can one day get married - not have a civil union, but a marriage. To me there IS a difference.

 

[TheZue]

As a married lesbian I don't think it's any surprise that I support gay marriage. I'm very happy to have been able to marry DW in our home state of Massachusetts. We could have been married in a church because there are plenty here who will do it, but in the end we decided to have it elsewhere. My only hope is that every gay and lesbian couple can one day get married - not have a civil union, but a marriage. To me there IS a difference.

People will argue there is no difference until somebody tries to take the word marriage away from them. I think there is a huge difference too.

 

[Wall-E1]

As a married lesbian I don't think it's any surprise that I support gay marriage. I'm very happy to have been able to marry DW in our home state of Massachusetts. We could have been married in a church because there are plenty here who will do it, but in the end we decided to have it elsewhere. My only hope is that every gay and lesbian couple can one day get married - not have a civil union, but a marriage. To me there IS a difference.

Of course there is. It's insulting and wrong. They should not appease the small minded and use a separate label. A consenting adult should be able to marry another consenting adult, no matter the gender. Equal rights should be for all.

 

[Katieinwonderland]

Note: in the statement below YOU is the general YOU not the specific YOU.

I am against it. No cop out here. The reason I bring up polygamous marriages is because I believe supporters of gay marriage are copping out on their convictions if they don't support polygamy.

You are only willing to move the line from no gay marriage to gay marriage but then you choose to stop there. Why?

Why is gay marriage acceptable and polygamous marriage not? Aren't you making a moral decision that one is acceptable but the other isn't? Why is that?

I choose to keep that moral decision at no gay marriage.

I think it's brave of you to be the only person on this thread to give an 'against' opinion, and you are entitled to your opinion so hopefully you won't feel like you're being attacked - it would be nice if this could remain a civilized discussion!

I actually don't think there is anything wrong with polygamy either. It's something I find a little harder to understand (I wouldn't be happy sharing my DH!) but again, as long as the adults are consenting and happy and in love, it doesn't affect me at all.

Is it that you think these sorts of marriages being legalized will somehow negatively impact society?

 

[Mrs.Toad]

"marriage is a religious term"

While I disagree with this statement (my marriage license has a spot for "officiant" to sign, and that can be a JOP as well as a clergyman), let's say it is a religious term, just for the sake of discussion.

Same sex marriages are performed and blessed by some religions, the Unitarian Universalists being the first one that comes to my mind. I know both same-sex and hetero couples who were married in that church. If they received the exact same religious sacrament, why is one considered good enough for the government to recognize and not the other?

 

[Mrs.Toad]

Note: in the statement below YOU is the general YOU not the specific YOU.

I am against it. No cop out here. The reason I bring up polygamous marriages is because I believe supporters of gay marriage are copping out on their convictions if they don't support polygamy.

You are only willing to move the line from no gay marriage to gay marriage but then you choose to stop there. Why?

Who is? I know you said "the general you", but why do you think that most people who are in favor of same sex marriage are against polyamorous marriage? That is not the impression I am getting in this thread, nor elsewhere. Personally, I have not given it enough thought to form an opinion. In general, I am fine with whatever relationship other consenting adults choose for themselves, it does not affect me or my marriage. I do see logistical issues with the legal recognition of these relationshiops that would not occur with same-sex marriage, but that does not mean I am against it. It just means that it is something that needs to be analyzed and all issues hammered out before I'm going to start arguing in favor on the internet.

Why is gay marriage acceptable and polygamous marriage not? Aren't you making a moral decision that one is acceptable but the other isn't? Why is that?

Again, who is saying one is acceptable and the other isn't? And even if "they" are, that is my point, isn't it? We make our moral decisions one issue at a time, based on each issue's own merits. That's why I think slippery slope is a lousy argument.

 

[Mrs.Toad]

People will argue there is no difference until somebody tries to take the word marriage away from them. I think there is a huge difference too.

This reminds me, I don't think it was the DIS, but another board I used to post on, someone suggested that instead of taking the word "marriage" away from the people who didn't have a religious marriage, they should come up with another word for religious marriage. "Goddled" was the word the poster suggested. The idea was that it was a certain group of people who wanted their own word for marriage that other people weren't allowed to use, so they should be the ones to create their own word, rather than forcing the people who don't mind sharing the word to do so.

Boy, people did not like that suggestion at all.

 

[dejr_8]

Is it that you think these sorts of marriages being legalized will somehow negatively impact society?

Yes. I don't believe gay marriage is a net positive for society.

 

[roscoepc1]

I support legal same sex marriage, I also support a church's right NOT to perform religious same sex marriages. I also live in Iowa, and know a lot of the churches here are taking that position, as they are morally against homosexual behavior, and consider it a hot button issue. I grew up in a very conservative christian household, and can ASSURE you that my parents are very against same sex marriage, as is my husband, who was also raised in a setting that would consider the very thought an aberrant one. But sincerely, I don't believe in a GOD that judges people, and I don't want my GOVERNMENT deciding such things either!

I could have written this same response almost word for word - but substitute Massachusetts for Iowa and Roman Catholic for conservative Christian. Those in my family that are very religious are against it. I also know people who are pro same-sex civil unions, but have a problem with the word marriage. The women I know are more supportive of the idea than the men.

I can Kind of see (as a conservative Christian woman, raised in a VERY strict Christian family) how using the word "marriage" can raise some concerns within the Christian/religious community (Traditonal Islam feels the same way about homosexuality as Christianity...as does Traditional Judaism)...but I have zero issues about civil unions for anyone who wants to do so.

It's too bad the world can't come up with an alternative word to use.....I think it would stop a LOT of the controversy! I have no idea what word it would be, but it seems to me there should/could be one....

 

[roscoepc1]

"marriage is a religious term"

While I disagree with this statement (my marriage license has a spot for "officiant" to sign, and that can be a JOP as well as a clergyman), let's say it is a religious term, just for the sake of discussion.

Same sex marriages are performed and blessed by some religions, the Unitarian Universalists being the first one that comes to my mind. I know both same-sex and hetero couples who were married in that church. If they received the exact same religious sacrament, why is one considered good enough for the government to recognize and not the other?

Hmmmm....interesting point! I haven't heard that argument before! Good food for thought!

 

[sparklynails23]

I think it's brave of you to be the only person on this thread to give an 'against' opinion, and you are entitled to your opinion so hopefully you won't feel like you're being attacked - it would be nice if this could remain a civilized discussion!

I actually don't think there is anything wrong with polygamy either. It's something I find a little harder to understand (I wouldn't be happy sharing my DH!) but again, as long as the adults are consenting and happy and in love, it doesn't affect me at all.

Is it that you think these sorts of marriages being legalized will somehow negatively impact society?

How would a polygamous divorce be handled? Child custody and designation of property rights would be a nightmare. Also, how would benefits granted to one spouse be handled in relation to the whole "family?"

While I believe that gay marriage should be legal, I'm not so sure that it isn't a slippery slope, especially when you can't talk about just gay/lesbian people anymore. It's always GLBT. If bi-sexuality is recognized as legitimately as homosexuality, how can you stop bi-sexual people from marrying both genders (polygamously)? Wouldn't you be halting their "pursuit of happiness?"

 

[jekajekalynn]

I'm all for it.. My best friend since high school is a lesbian. If she decides to get married, I believed she should be allowed to . HER getting married doesn't affect me or my marriage one iota.

 

[roscoepc1]

Add Canada to the list.

I also support religions if they choose to not perform ceremonies which they feel go against their religion. At the same time I don't think that any particular religion should have the rights to the term marriage...it's older than all of them. My wedding and marriage has been Goddless and my marriage is more than a civil union thank you very much.

It's not older than Christianity (or Judaism), b/c Christians/Jews believe God instituted marriage just after the Creation of the world/universe...Ie, Adam and Eve.

Just to throw another twist out there, I couldn't care less about the legal standing of my marriage. My marriage, the one I care about, was done before God and witnesses. My vows were made before God. My determination to make the best of my relationship with my husband is formed by the fact that I vowed to do so to both my husband and to my God.

Yes, I filled out and filed the proper government paperwork, but that was a side issue and had nothing to do with my heart and convictions.

 

[roscoepc1]

That's because you and I don't believe it's wrong.

For those that believe that it undermines marriages or destroys the sanctity of marriage and makes it some sort of joke of marriage, most likely have the belief that a homosexual is less than a "true" or "real" person. So if you have two people who are exhibiting aberrant behavior marry, they believe that it makes a mockery of the "real" love between heterosexuals. It's akin to saying "well, then, who is to stop you from marrying your cat." At least this is how it was explained to me. Since they believe that the homosexual behavior is not right in God's eyes or behaves against the word of God, to have them marry would take away from the seriousness of a married union.

Not quite...the belief is that homosexual BEHAVIOUR is a sin (NOT the urge/attraction)...so it's more akin to saying murder is the equivalent of natural death....or lying is the equivalent of truth. Saying that anything considered a sin is equal to anything NOT considered a sin....

 

[luvmy3]

The term marriage means many things, Merriam-Webster says so

Definition of MARRIAGE
1a (1) : the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law (2) : the state of being united to a person of the same sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage <same-sex marriage> b : the mutual relation of married persons : wedlock c : the institution whereby individuals are joined in a marriage
2: an act of marrying or the rite by which the married status is effected; especially : the wedding ceremony and attendant festivities or formalities
3: an intimate or close union <the marriage of painting and poetry — J. T. Shawcross>