Can Disney charge DVC for parking?

JasonMouse

Mouseketeer
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Is there documentation, possibly in the contract or law that prevents Disney from charging for parking at DVC resorts? I hear people saying the maintenance fee pays for the parking lot, but that's not proof. I'm revisiting possibly buying DVC and an extra $240+ a year for parking adds up.

I'm also assuming theme park parking is probably something they will start charging for or making it a premium level AP perk.
 
They would probably have to remove the portion of the dues that goes to the parking lot. Not a lawyer, but I believe there is some kind of FL law.

In any event, I don't see them charging DVC members any time soon as it will be used as a selling point. So as long as they are selling new DVC resorts...
 
Looking at the DVC budgets, I don't see parking lots listed as a line item so I don't know if owners pay for them. No matter what, Disney/DVD/DVC can pretty much change the rules, policies and legal items to what ever they want or to what makes them the most money.

:earsboy: Bill

 
IF it is in there, it will be part of the maintenance line item (plus something in the capital reserves for long term replacement). Now I need to dust off the booklets this weekend to see what land (by way of the ground lease) is included in the condo association.
 


All this has reassured me that I do want to buy an additional 30-40 points, but no more. There is no telling what Disney will do with DVC members in the future. So a extremely modest amount of points, say 65-75 will be all I will want with DVC. Time to consider other vacation plans.
 
Are common elements spelled out by name or my guess is that Disney can modify as it benefits them. BLT TOTW was originally excluded from the association if I remember correctly and wasn't a common element, then Disney changed their mind and added it so owners would have to pay for the upkeep. Then they decided that they wanted the bar revenue so they leased it from the BLT owners all without a vote by the owners.

:earsboy: Bill

 


EB26AD4D-8011-4045-ADF7-B24882347FF0.png

The 2017 budget for Poly lists Pavement resurfacing as a capital expense being paid by dues.

Also, and I didn’t know this, but DVD exempts itself from paying dues on the points that it owns by offering a guarantee that they’ll pay the difference if they calculated dues wrong. Must. Be. Nice.
 
To me, if they COULD easily charge it, they would. Even if it's technically possible, I'd imagine that their legal department advised against it.
 
Just out of curiosity (not a DVC owner), if y'all have an ownership interest in the parking lots, could you petition to have some of the funds collected offset your dues? They are making money on something you own, without giving any type of remuneration
 
Just out of curiosity (not a DVC owner), if y'all have an ownership interest in the parking lots, could you petition to have some of the funds collected offset your dues? They are making money on something you own, without giving any type of remuneration

It's POSSIBLE they'll offset the dues slightly in future years where the DVC property shares a parking lot with the hotel. That said, nothing we say will ever have any impact. That would mean that they listen to the owners, which would be a sea change in and of itself!
 
From Poly’s master declaration in POS, page 205:

90C9FD02-72AC-49D1-BCAA-EA79A5A8D0C6.jpeg

There. It. Is.

DVD can regulate to some extent (designated parking space), they can charge a fee for valet, and the easement is non-exclusive, but owners have the right to park on condo property.

DVD is required to have paved parking spaces in the master declaration, owners have a non-exclusive easement within reason to use those parking spaces, and because they are a required part of the master declaration, they are common elements.
 
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03813C74-891E-4C44-B397-45A6DB02FBBC.jpeg

24DEF048-4DCC-4752-B5BB-D3C89D0B0041.jpeg

If you look at both pics, both parking areas are clearly within the master declaration for Poly and therefore are common elements of the resort.
.
 
Just out of curiosity (not a DVC owner), if y'all have an ownership interest in the parking lots, could you petition to have some of the funds collected offset your dues? They are making money on something you own, without giving any type of remuneration
No.

The declaration makes clear that owners have a non-exclusive easement to parking.

They must have parking spaces reasonably available, owners are allowed to park in them, but that right isn’t exclusive to owners.

They grant themselves an easement as well, and so long as there are reasonably parking spaces available, they have right of use as well.
 
There are many changes—financial and otherwise—which could be made over time to the detriment of owners. If you don’t have some amount of confidence that the timeshare manager will conduct itself in a reasonable manner, timeshare ownership may not be right for you.
 
I covered much of this in a few posts in the other DVC thread on this topic. For those who believe Disney may be doing us some favor by not charging us for parking while charging regular guests that reserve through Disney, it is not a favor. I have seen situations like this before in which the internal "suits," who often care little about the impact on customers, come up with another way to make money by charging fees to customers including owners of condominiums or timeshares. The usual internal process for something like this is the "suits" go to the lawyers and say we are going to charge fees (such as parking), and they usually have every intent of charging everyone including owners unless the lawyers say they can't. I am also guessing the lawyers in this situation said no, you cannot charge fees for DVC members use of the parking lot of a DVC resort.

The parking lots are common elements. The owners, and anyone to whom they rent or give (such as relatives) reservations have a right to use the common elements both under the law and under the declarations for the resorts. Moreover, such right, as a matter of law, is automatically included in any resale contract and thus you cannot distinguish between original and resale owners. No fees can legally be charged for use of any common elements absent such fees being spelled out in the original declarations or added by majority vote.

Of note here also is that the Disney entity that is actually setting and collecting parking lot fees is not DVD, the Association, or the managing entity (DVCMC) appointed by the association to run the DVC resorts. It is instead the Disney resort entity that has ownership of all the resorts except DVC, which cannot charge members for use of the common elements for the additional reason that entity has no real ownership interest in the common elements of the property except to the extent such interest is retained by the hotel part of the property.

However, that entity can likely charge for parking to resort guests who rent from Disney -- the charge is simply considered part of the rental fee applicable to the room and that guest's use of the resort. DVD retains a small ownership interest in each DVC unit, which interest includes its right to rent that interest and use the parking lots. Moreover, when owners trade out, DVD gets all the rights that owner has in the use of the unit and common elements of the resort; the same applies to when DVD gets the right to rent rooms at and after the 60-day breakage period from time of arrival. In those situations, DVD can likely charge a rental fee for parking to the guests to whom it rents, and such parking fees will not be considered amounts that need to apply to offset dues, except to the extent that it must first apply income from breakage period rentals to offset a small percentage of annual dues of the resort. However, the parking fees will likely add nothing to offset dues since annually the required amount used to offset dues has, in the past, been met for each resort just out of rents for the rooms themselves.

If Disney tries to charge parking fees to members, renters from members, or relatives or friends of members to whom a member gives a reservation, everyone should consider it wrong even if you never bring a car. My understanding is that for parking fees in California and Hawaii, there is no charge for anyone having a DVC reservation (even if not a member). Likely the same is happening in WDW. If Disney were allowed to get away with charging members, or guests of the members, for parking at the resorts, that would be the same as conceding Disney can charge any user fees it wants for use of the common elements. We could soon see charges for use of the pools, playgrounds, walkways, lobby, hallways, or just generally for the "use of common elements." Your common element use fees bill for a trip could easily excede your annual dues.
 
We could soon see charges for use of the pools, playgrounds, walkways, lobby, hallways, or just generally for the "use of common elements." Your common element use fees bill for a trip could easily excede your annual dues.

Do what?:crazy2::crazy2::crazy2:
 
Also, and I didn’t know this, but DVD exempts itself from paying dues on the points that it owns by offering a guarantee that they’ll pay the difference if they calculated dues wrong. Must. Be. Nice.
I think you are mischaracterizing the Developer Guarantee regarding payment of dues by DVD on points that it owns. Here is the wording of the Developer Guarantee from BLT's 2017 Annual Notice:

DVD has agreed to guarantee to each Purchaser and Owner that they will only be required to pay an assessment for operating expenses of $3.3680 per Vacation Point through December 31, 2017, exclusive of ad valorem taxes which are billed separately. In consideration of this guarantee and pursuant to Florida law, DVD will be excused from the payment of its share of the expenses which otherwise would have been assessed against its unsold Ownership Interests during the term of the guarantee. As a consequence of this exemption, during the term of this guarantee, existing Owners and current Purchasers will not be specially assessed with regard to Common Expenses, except as hereinafter provided, if Common Expenses exceed the guarantee per Vacation Point amount and DVD will pay any difference between actual expenses and assessments collected from all Owners and income from other sources.
There is also a Developer Guarantee to cover Capital Reserves expenditures.

its not that DVD only pays "if they [sic] calculated dues wrong." Instead, DVD has guaranteed that it will make up any shortfall in each Association's budget if revenues do not satisfy expenditures.

Since Member Owners account for no more than 98% of an Association's total points, there is an inherent "shortfall" in each budget for which DVD is liable. In addition, when Member Owners fail to pay dues, such as in foreclosure situations, the Developer Guarantee can make up for this lost revenue.

If DVD did not make this guarantee, it would be billed the exact same amount as any other Member Owner for the points that it owns. However, it would also mean that if there were any shortfalls in an Association's operating expenses or capital reserves, then Member Owners could be hit with a special assessment to cover any shortfalls.
 

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