Central Park “Karen”

[BlueStarryHat]

Equating minor Facebook drama with real-world murder trivializes the murder...and helps normalize it, which is demonstrably not okay.

This 'minor Facebook drama,' as you term it, is indicative of what African-Americans in this country put up with every single day. This woman got in his face and made a deliberate attempt to escalate the situation. When this didn't work, she got on the phone and tried to escalate the situation in a racist manner. Now, I'm not saying that she was trying to get him killed, but Mr. Cooper did not know WHAT would happen when the cops showed up. As a black man, he knew he had to stay calm at risk of his life. To me, this is the same as making black man doff their hats when a white person walks by like in the bad old days, and it's sickening.

This incident is the exception that proves the rule.

 

[JimMIA]

This 'minor Facebook drama,' as you term it, is indicative of what African-Americans in this country put up with every single day. This woman got in his face and made a deliberate attempt to escalate the situation. When this didn't work, she got on the phone and tried to escalate the situation in a racist manner. Now, I'm not saying that she was trying to get him killed, but Mr. Cooper did not know WHAT would happen when the cops showed up. As a black man, he knew he had to stay calm at risk of his life. To me, this is the same as making black man doff their hats when a white person walks by like in the bad old days, and it's sickening.

This incident is the exception that proves the rule.

None of us know what he was thinking, but to me, he didn't handle the situation like he was afraid. Not at all.

It seems to me that he was more amused at her silliness than anything else. He was like, I gotta video this because people are not going to believe this woman! And in fact, when she made her stupid threat to call the police, he told her to go ahead and call them!

She was wrong. She is a racist. She's a bad person. But she is not important.

To compare this minor incident to the murder of Ahmaud Arbery and the death of George Floyd is really a total loss of perspective.

Some little princess running her mouth doesn't begin to compare with shooting Arbery 3 times with a shotgun. And to make that comparison, IMHO, trivializes Mr. Arbery's murder and weakens any argument about racism.

 

[BlueStarryHat]

To compare this minor incident to the murder of Ahmaud Arbery and the death of George Floyd is really a total loss of perspective.

When did I do that? And my personal perspective is that it seems like every time I turn on the news there is another murder of a black man by either police *or* white people who have no business sticking their noses into a situation. Mr. Cooper *sounded* calm, yes. Was he? We'll probably never know.

 

[DuskKodesh]

You're probably right. You know the old saying: "Live by the social media; die by the social media!"

I assume this answer was intended to be comedic but considering the most the law could get would be a false report charge whereas many people have been killed by nutballs getting their personal information through doxxing then showing up at their house.


I am in zero way excusing what she did, but if I had the choice of getting a misdemeanor charge in court or having all of an angry internet know my family, location, post office, employment then just waiting to see if something happens? I'll take the misdemeanor every time.

 

[daisy2013]

I don't know where you get your opinions, but they sure do not match my experience, or the way our criminal courts function.

Prosecutors review every case prior to formally filing the case with the courts. Any case that doesn't meet prosecutorial standards (not arresting officer standards) is nol prossed immediately. If an officer made a weak arrest, the case is going away quickly.

Each case is then reviewed by a judge to determine whether a trial should be held -- and judges have many options to resolve cases without a trial. So the kind of hardship you keep bringing up only happens when there is a legitimate case against the defendant...in the opinion of both a prosecutor and a judge.

The defendant is innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but there has to be a pretty compelling case for it to make it to the courtroom.

And while this is all happening, if they can't make bail or aren't offered bail, the person is sitting in jail for days if not weeks awaiting a determination. This may cost them their paycheck, job, relationships etc. Heck there was even a teenager who was in Rykers Island for 3 years without a trial for a crime he was innocent of, who ended up committing suicide shortly after he was released.
You see it all over - white crowds downtown nyc are handed masks and told to be safe. Uptown NYC the police arrest people for being outside their house without a mask. The treatment of black and whites in our criminal justice system is so different, they are essentially two different systems.

 

[JimMIA]

When did I do that? And my personal perspective is that it seems like every time I turn on the news there is another murder of a black man by either police *or* white people who have no business sticking their noses into a situation. Mr. Cooper *sounded* calm, yes. Was he? We'll probably never know.

You didn't. Your post replied to my stating exactly that, but addressed completely different concepts. It's hard to explain coherently (lol), but we were talking apples and oranges.

 

[JimMIA]

I assume this answer was intended to be comedic but considering the most the law could get would be a false report charge whereas many people have been killed by nutballs getting their personal information through doxxing then showing up at their house.

I haven't seen any cases like that. I don't doubt that it's happened, but I've never seen those news stories.

 

[sk!mom]

Yes, this very minor Central Park dispute was totally unimportant.

The George Floyd case in Minneapolis and the Arbery case in Georgia are both legitimate big deals.

To compare this entitled little princess' outburst to either of those situations is really a slight to Mr. Floyd and Mr. Arbery.

Unimportant and minor to you. Could it have been much worse? Absolutely, we were reminded of that in a horrifying way on the same day. But unimportant, no.

You go ahead and keep trying to normalize it. That's exactly why it is still prevalent in 2020.

 

[JimMIA]

And while this is all happening, if they can't make bail or aren't offered bail, the person is sitting in jail for days if not weeks awaiting a determination.

I don't know where you live, but that's sure not the way it works in most places.

Keep in mind that the purpose of bond (bail) is to ensure that the defendant shows up for their court appearances. Nothing else. For most minor crimes, pay $1 and show your voter's registration and you are out.

If you don't get out that way from the police station, you go to the county jail and go to a bond hearing. Sometimes the bond hearings are the same day, but usually the defendant is in jail overnight and has a bond hearing the next morning.

The purpose of the bond hearing is to get people OUT of jail, not keep them in jail -- because it's not necessary except for major violent crimes, and the jails are already crowded. There are representatives of many community organizations at the bond hearings, and if the defendant has community ties they are usually released to one of those organizations -- with zero cost. To reiterate, the judges are pushing hard to get people OUT of jail.

After review by prosecutors, the case is filed formally with the court system.

The next step is a preliminary hearing, during which three major things happen:

• The court determines whether the defendant is represented by an attorney. If not, and if the defendant can't afford an attorney, a public defender is appointed to provide legal representation.
• The judge reviews the charging documents and rules on whether there is sufficient legal cause to go forward with prosecution. If not, the case is dismissed.
• The defendant enters a plea. Quite often in minor cases, the prosecutor and defense attorney have already reached an agreement and the case is disposed of right there with no jail time. MOST minor cases are resolved that way.
• Absent any plea deal, the case is scheduled for trial. The defendant remains free, and it free to work, travel, etc.

 

[JimMIA]

You go ahead and keep trying to normalize it. That's exactly why it is still prevalent in 2020.

I'm not trying to normalize racism, and you know that.

Nobody who has posted to this thread is trying to normalize racism. Every one of us is against racism.

 

[lilypgirl]

She is awful!

 

[bcla]

I haven't seen any cases like that. I don't doubt that it's happened, but I've never seen those news stories.

I haven't heard of too many cases where someone was killed. However, harassment is pretty common where someone's private info was released.

 

[sk!mom]

I'm not trying to normalize racism, and you know that.

Nobody who has posted to this thread is trying to normalize racism. Every one of us is against racism.

If you're against it, then why try to trivialize a blatant example of it?

 

[NYCgrrl]

None of us know what he was thinking, but to me, he didn't handle the situation like he was afraid. Not at all.

It seems to me that he was more amused at her silliness than anything else. He was like, I gotta video this because people are not going to believe this woman! And in fact, when she made her stupid threat to call the police, he told her to go ahead and call them!

She was wrong. She is a racist. She's a bad person. But she is not important.

To compare this minor incident to the murder of Ahmaud Arbery and the death of George Floyd is really a total loss of perspective.

Some little princess running her mouth doesn't begin to compare with shooting Arbery 3 times with a shotgun. And to make that comparison, IMHO, trivializes Mr. Arbery's murder and weakens any argument about racism.

On the 1 minute and 9 second video Mr. Cooper barely spoke, leaving the verbal range of emotions to Ms. Cooper. At most he spoke for approximately 5.0 seconds of the entire time; I missed any note of amusement in his tone of voice that you think you heard. He seemed to be somewhat alarmed (the pitch of his voice rose)when he said "Please tell them whatever you like" the third time.

I think you should listen to the video again so you can re-set your "spidey" sense.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1265038244934225920

 

[JimMIA]

If you're against it, then why try to trivialize a blatant example of it?

I'm not trying to trivialize the Central Park case at all.

What I am saying is that, if you equate or even compare, the obvious racism of Amy Cooper with the shotgun KILLING of Ahmaud Arbery, you are diminishing the importance of Arbery's murder.

Both are wrong. Both are bad. I am against both.

But don't diminish the importance of a murder by equating it with some stupid loudmouth woman in New York.

 

[DuskKodesh]

I haven't heard of too many cases where someone was killed. However, harassment is pretty common where someone's private info was released.

One of the first big legal battles involving doxxing was the “Nuremberg Files” website. A site that published 200 healthcare workers places of work and home addresses (The reason they were listed I'm leaving out because it was political.) Eight doctors lost their lives along with four law enforcement officers. It triggered a suit and eventually the court found that the site's content was not protected free speech. It's a fascinating case.

More recently there were a rash of swattings (Doxxing where a false threat is called into police causing them to arrive with a SWAT team at the victim's home address) one of which April last year became national headlines when a man was innocently killed. It was in the headlines here often because the convicted doxxer was from Ohio. It stemmed from an argument on Call of Duty.

It's extremely uncommon but it exists and even when nothing happen there is always the looming threat that something 'might' happen. Also note: I'm a doof with hyperspecific interests and a sociology degree. I find human behavior fascinating. Please stop me from rambling on. Head-pats usually work.

Again, not trivializing it. She did something terrible. Truly terrible, but again this media barrage is far worse than a simple misdemeanor charge.

Edit: Forgot some punctuation

 

[CarolAnn856]

But nothing is being swept under the rug. There was nothing the police could do.

Her crazy actions are out there for all the world to see and everyone can see her racism. BUT the pp is right, to compare this incident to the one in Minneapolis or in Georgia is lessening the tragedy of what happened to those two men.

Thank you, I guess, for proving my point. Although I really would have preferred that you step back and see exactly why this incident is, indeed, important.

 

[bcla]

One of the first big legal battles involving doxxing was the “Nuremberg Files” website. A site that published 200 healthcare workers places of work and home addresses (The reason they were listed I'm leaving out because it was political.) Eight doctors lost their lives along with four law enforcement officers. It triggered a suit and eventually the court found that the site's content was not protected free speech. It's a fascinating case.

More recently there were a rash of swattings (Doxxing where a false threat is called into police causing them to arrive with a SWAT team at the victim's home address) one of which April last year became national headlines when a man was innocently killed. It was in the headlines here often because the convicted doxxer was from Ohio. It stemmed from an argument on Call of Duty.

It's extremely uncommon but it exists and even when nothing happen there is always the looming threat that something 'might' happen. Also note: I'm a doof with hyperspecific interests and a sociology degree. I find human behavior fascinating. Please stop me from rambling on. Head-pats usually work.

Again, not trivializing it. She did something terrible. Truly terrible, but again this media barrage is far worse than a simple misdemeanor charge.

Edit: Forgot some punctuation

Oh - I'm quite familiar with swatting, but I never associated it with doxxing. I thought doxxing was publishing someone's home or work address and maybe phone number to encourage harassment.

As for swatting, I remember that guy in Los Angeles who made an emergency call to Wichita over a video game dispute. From what I heard, he was even bragging about it after the guy was dead. Even worst the guy killed wasn't even a gamer. I think it may have been the wrong address.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/los-angeles-man-pleaded-guilty-wichita-swatting-incident/story?id=62039656
There have been some weird ones too. I've taken an interest in fake IRS or other calls - typically coming from India but using VoIP and/or a spoofed origin phone. One guy apparently didn't buy it and might have insulted the caller. Then the caller (who probably got his home phone number and address from a paid list) spoofed his home phone and called into 911 to report someone outside with a gun. The police did show up. I remember listening to the 911 call, and it set off all sorts of red flags. His accent was really thick, he was using the homeowner's real (American sounding) name, the line was scratchy, and he was using the term "negro" to describe an alleged intruder. The dispatcher even said that there "might be a language barrier" but they sent an officer anyways. The officer noticed no issue and the only person home was the homeowner's daughter.

https://gazette.com/news/colorado-s...cle_f2c9adb3-bc2e-5d31-9ee0-bc1cc79aefcf.html

 

[sk!mom]

I'm not trying to trivialize the Central Park case at all.

What I am saying is that, if you equate or even compare, the obvious racism of Amy Cooper with the shotgun KILLING of Ahmaud Arbery, you are diminishing the importance of Arbery's murder.

Both are wrong. Both are bad. I am against both.

But don't diminish the importance of a murder by equating it with some stupid loudmouth woman in New York.

I’m not sure why you emphasized you. I did not equate or compare this case to any other case. I simply called it out as racism while you called it minor. I realize that any racism is not minor and will continue to speak up.

 

[DuskKodesh]

Oh - I'm quite familiar with swatting, but I never associated it with doxxing. I thought doxxing was publishing someone's home or work address and maybe phone number to encourage harassment.

As for swatting, I remember that guy in Los Angeles who made an emergency call to Wichita over a video game dispute. From what I heard, he was even bragging about it after the guy was dead. Even worst the guy killed wasn't even a gamer. I think it may have been the wrong address.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/los-angeles-man-pleaded-guilty-wichita-swatting-incident/story?id=62039656
There have been some weird ones too. I've taken an interest in fake IRS or other calls - typically coming from India but using VoIP and/or a spoofed origin phone. One guy apparently didn't buy it and might have insulted the caller. Then the caller (who probably got his home phone number and address from a paid list) spoofed his home phone and called into 911 to report someone outside with a gun. The police did show up. I remember listening to the 911 call, and it set off all sorts of red flags. His accent was really thick, he was using the homeowner's real (American sounding) name, the line was scratchy, and he was using the term "negro" to describe an alleged intruder. The dispatcher even said that there "might be a language barrier" but they sent an officer anyways. The officer noticed no issue and the only person home was the homeowner's daughter.

https://gazette.com/news/colorado-s...cle_f2c9adb3-bc2e-5d31-9ee0-bc1cc79aefcf.html

That first case is the the exact one I mentioned. It seemed the doxxer gained a former address so he didn't live there anymore. That poor guy that died not having a clue why the SWAT team was at his address.
As for the second case that's a new one! I'll have to read that article. So glad no one was hurt there! (Thank you for sharing strange cases with me! It's fascinating!)

Swatting is closely tied to doxxing. Same with called in fake police complaints, spammed pizza deliveries, selling the residents name to advertisers, shipping hundreds of free UPS boxes (Back when you could do that). I even heard of a senator being sent tons of ... adult novelties to his home address.