DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[2tinkerbell]

My sister has Crohn’s. She travels with us a lot. It is just the 3 of us - sister, DD and myself. The reality of the situation is when she has a flare or thinks she is going to have a flare, she will not go with us, but will stay in the hotel. If she is out and has a flare, she will tell us to go ahead and will be in the restroom. If it is something she really really wants to do, we either get out of line with her or we go again later. Sometimes we go back to the hotel. Yes she sometimes misses out and yes, it isn’t convenient, but that is what we deal with. It is the same with my neurodivergent DD. We miss out on many things. If she begins to get overstimulated, anxious, or overwhelmed, we get out of line, or don’t even get in line and go somewhere quiet. If that doesn’t work, we go back to the hotel. I look at it as just something we deal with in the best way possible. My brother has T1 diabetes since he was a young child. He is almost 60 now and is in perfect condition and is well controlled. He travels all the time for work and pleasure. We have never really gone out of our way to accommodate him. He does his own thing. We never say, “Oh we have to (blank) because he has to (blank).” We just met for lunch and he just nonchalantly took care of what he needed to. He did it quietly and he ordered what he wanted/needed off the menu. When it came to dessert, he knew that I wanted a particular dessert item and ordered it for me. No big deal. I have my own disabilities (PTSD and physical limitations).

I guess my point of all this is we accommodate ourselves whenever we can. If we miss out, oh well. We get to do a lot of things and are grateful. And yes, we pay the same amount of $$$$ as everyone else - airfare, tickets, hotel, ground transpiration, food, etc.

Stuff happens. Things don’t always go the way you planned or would like them to. It is hard sometimes, believe me I know. We have had to cut a vacation short. We have had my sister in v-tach and in the hospital, transported to Boston from the Cape and had a ventricular ablation all while on vacation. We have had to make changes in plans the last minute. It isn’t easy or fun. We make the best of things and laugh at some of the things that happen.

 

[Grim Grinning Ghostie]

would these changes make you happy:

Deluxe resort get G+ as part of their stay?

On site guests can book two G+ return times per day at their 30 day from first park day window? Those are bonus rides, G+ would then work as normal - first pick at 7am yadda yadda yadda.

G+ users can select rides as many times as they want (perhaps with some exceptions)?

DAS pass then stays the relatively the same, maybe with a few minor modifications (no pre selection when registering, 10 minute delay between booking)

Would this make G+ more attractive to those who DONT need DAS (the true fakers - to maybe cut down abuse?), and make it a better alternative to those who needed DAS but maybe might not qualify any longer (which we hope is not the case)

Sorry - just kind of thinking out loud here.

No. Making the "Pay to Win" aspect of Disney even worse is only going to exacerbate DAS abuse and is going to tank the vacation experience even further for the average family.

 

[Nikkimouse44]

No of course not. Many many many people who need DAS can not afford to stay at a deluxe resort, and having lots of money should not be a requirement for accommodations.

FP worked as a reasonable replacement for DAS because it was available to ALL guests, on site, off site, value resort, deluxe resort.

My suggestion was not as an accommodation. It was to try to find a solution for DAS abuse.

I hear what you’re saying about FP however, gone are the times of free things like FP to the general public. All theme parks have paid services for shorter line - THIS IS NOT DAS - but what I am saying is that if Disney went to a way to made G+ more appealing to the general public, that hopefully would cut down on the number of DAS abuse/fakers.

G+ is not an accommodation for disability, I know that. I’ve stated that many times in this thread.

But I think Disney has to make their paid service more attractive because it’s not attractive at all. “Pay $15-$40 a day per person to ride maybe 3 rides with short lines. May the odds be ever in your favor.” - that’s basically their marketing slogan for G+

Universal - their express pass is included in their deluxe resorts. And it’s also way more expensive per day. Not to compare the two companies, but I would not put it past Disney if they try to be competitive or comparable and include G+ with deluxe resort stays as well.

 

[Smugpugmug]

would these changes make you happy:

Deluxe resort get G+ as part of their stay?

On site guests can book two G+ return times per day at their 30 day from first park day window? Those are bonus rides, G+ would then work as normal - first pick at 7am yadda yadda yadda.

G+ users can select rides as many times as they want (perhaps with some exceptions)?

DAS pass then stays the relatively the same, maybe with a few minor modifications (no pre selection when registering, 10 minute delay between booking)

Would this make G+ more attractive to those who DONT need DAS (the true fakers - to maybe cut down abuse?), and make it a better alternative to those who needed DAS but maybe might not qualify any longer (which we hope is not the case)

Sorry - just kind of thinking out loud here.

There is not enough attraction capacity to give every deluxe resort guest free Genie+ especially given just how many deluxe resorts WDW has.

 

[Calee]

Universal is significantly smaller, with less deluxe resorts, and shorter visits. There are many reasons it is not a good comparison, and not going to help anything. But I think there are other threads to debate the merits of genie or to compare universal and Disney. This isn’t it.

 

[Liquidice]

would these changes make you happy:

Deluxe resort get G+ as part of their stay?

On site guests can book two G+ return times per day at their 30 day from first park day window? Those are bonus rides, G+ would then work as normal - first pick at 7am yadda yadda yadda.

G+ users can select rides as many times as they want (perhaps with some exceptions)?

DAS pass then stays the relatively the same, maybe with a few minor modifications (no pre selection when registering, 10 minute delay between booking)

Would this make G+ more attractive to those who DONT need DAS (the true fakers - to maybe cut down abuse?), and make it a better alternative to those who needed DAS but maybe might not qualify any longer (which we hope is not the case)

Sorry - just kind of thinking out loud here.

Maybe combine the G+ users can select rides as many times as they want with the idea earlier of tiered rides (from the old FP+ days) where maybe re-rides cannot occur on "Tier 1" rides but "Tier 2" rides could allow for re-rides?

To be honest, the idea of tiering might be something they could do for both Genie+ and DAS.

I assume if they go to some kind of pre-select option with Genie+ like they had with FP+ they will tier the rides again.

For DAS and Genie+ maybe they could have something like you can only do 1 Tier 1 Lightning Lane for every 2 Tier 2 Lightning Lanes.

Just adding to your brainstorming to see if there would be ways to help balance the system a bit.

I do think one of the major problems Disney is dealing with is of their own making - there is not enough ride capacity in most of the parks to handle the number of guests they are allowing into the parks.

Look at Animal Kingdom right now, how many rides are there?
1. FOP, 2. Na'vi River, 3. Everest, 4. Dinosaur, 5. Kali River Rapids, 6. TriceraTop Spin, 7. Kilimanjaro Safari, 8 if you count the train ride to Rafiki's Planet Watch I guess

Hollywood Studios has 9, Epcot has 11, Magic Kingdom has the most with 24

Disney needs to add more attractions and could probably benefit from adding a 5th gate.

Just for comparison, Disneyland Park in California has 49 rides, DCA has 19

I think most of the problems seem to occur in the parks with the least number of rides.

Note, I am not counting shows or character meet and greets that Disney may categorize as attractions and while some of them do have Lightning Lane they aren't what you would normally consider as rides.

 

[Nikkimouse44]

Universal is significantly smaller, with less deluxe resorts, and shorter visits. There are many reasons it is not a good comparison, and not going to help anything. But I think there are other threads to debate the merits of genie or to compare universal and Disney. This isn’t it.

Fair enough. I have never used G+ so I don’t know the merits of it (or lack of them). I will be using it for the first time next month. My children are DAS users, and we greatly benefit from the service. However, we are going on an adult only trip next month and will be using G+ because we obviously do not have the need for DAS without our children.

Again, like I said I was thinking out loud.

Like many here, if the service changes, I could be affected by it and it scares me. I don’t know how these changes will affect our future vacations, my children, our family - and it seems like many of us here.. we need more information from Disney.

 

[Grim Grinning Ghostie]

There is not enough attraction capacity to give every deluxe resort guest free Genie+ especially given just how many deluxe resorts WDW has.

Bingo. There wouldn't be anything left for anyone else come day-of, ha.

 

[Nikkimouse44]

No. Making the "Pay to Win" aspect of Disney even worse is only going to exacerbate DAS abuse and is going to tank the vacation experience even further for the average family.

So then take out the deluxe part… and keep everything else I stated. None of that would make G+ more attractive to the general public?

However - every other theme park has a paid service to have shorter line (again not for disability purposes) so Disney is in line with their competitors having a paid service.

 

[Grim Grinning Ghostie]

Fair enough. I have never used G+ so I don’t know the merits of it (or lack of them). I will be using it for the first time next month. My children are DAS users, and we greatly benefit from the service. However, we are going on an adult only trip next month and will be using G+ because we obviously do not have the need for DAS without our children.

Again, like I said I was thinking out loud.

Like many here, if the service changes, I could be affected by it and it scares me. I don’t know how these changes will affect our future vacations, my children, our family - and it seems like many of us here.. we need more information from Disney.

I hope it turns out that we were all just catastrophizing and that Disney will continue to accommodate various needs in ways that are appropriate & genuinely helpful.

I hope as well that you and your family still have an incredible vacation! Enjoy those kiddo-free days, as well. From what I understand, those little breaks do wonders for the mental health.

 

[dreamer17555]

Some things I think we can (mostly) agree on.

1. The Disney Press Release was poorly written and I am honestly baffled that they released that. I am sure it was not a first draft either which is even more disheartening.

2. It is natural that with so many unknowns that guests who rely heavily on DAS to make their Disney vacations feasible are nervous. I think the constant comments that echo the idea that Disney will work with everyone when no one actually knows what the new system will be like offer little comfort and at times can feel downright hollow. It is okay to personally believe that Disney is going to continue providing DAS to parties that need it but Disney’s own statement somewhat contradicts that so it is normal for guests to be worried.

3. DAS Abuse is a real thing. However, I am not sure this will fix it. Guests who lie to gain DAS will continue to lie and the internet offers vast abilities to research to know what to “say” to get a pass.

4. It is hard to pin the rise of usage of DAS simply on abuse only. There has been a significant rise in disabilities in the US, especially developmental disabilities. Also many families were making do with FP+. Genie + and the new DAS changes rolling out almost at the same time really muddies the water.

5. None of us know if limiting DAS will improve overall guest experience. Logic says less people in the LL the better the wait times will be… however we do not know if Disney will use fewer DAS user to justify selling more Genie+ and LL spots (I personally think this change is coming right before Tiana’s opens so they feel ok selling as many LL as possible)

6. It is hard to know what others are going through and so easy to judge. I, myself, was watching a live stream yesterday about DAS and found myself constantly wondering how the streamer qualified with the disorder she shared when she was able to do x, y, & z. And I KNOW better.

I have a son with autism. On a really good day, besides speaking almost only in movie quotes, most people would not realize his diagnosis. However, trust me on a not so good day? Everyone around us would quickly understand. But even with knowing how things ebb and flow it is hard not to judge others. Which is what is happening on this thread a lot. I know it is hard but I think admitting we really don’t know what others are dealing with is a big part of starting to understand each other

7. Fighting over what may or may not work for each individual user is pointless. We honestly do not know where Disney is going to draw the line in the sand and at that point everyone can decide if a Disney vacation is still a fit for them or their friends and family.

8. No one seems to mind getting rid of the preselects. Nor the extra 10 minutes wait time after scanning in.

9. It would be lovely if Disney let you know if you qualify for DAS before purchasing tickets or a package but with the 30 day window that seems unlikely.

10. I don’t actually have a ten but ending on nine seems wrong somehow

 

[Lugan]

I’m confused why so my people are on this thread bragging how they don’t need DAS. Why are you here? Why are you poking and antagonizing those with disabilities? Telling us what we deserve and how we feel. How sad that you are in the Disabilities group picking fights with people. What does that say about you?
I encourage everyone to stop engaging with these people and just hit the ignore button next to their profile so they no longer get the attention they so desperately want.

I just assumed it was the group of people that monitored this board to pick up tips and tricks for getting illegitimate DAS passes in the past. They are now expressing their sour grapes attitude on those of us that legitimately need accomodations.

 

[Nikkimouse44]

I hope it turns out that we were all just catastrophizing and that Disney will continue to accommodate various needs in ways that are appropriate & genuinely helpful.

I hope as well that you and your family still have an incredible vacation! Enjoy those kiddo-free days, as well. From what I understand, those little breaks do wonders for the mental health.

Thank you! I hope we are all making a big deal over nothing and it all turns out fine for us all!

Also my last reply to you - it was a genuine question - not being combative (which reading it back I think it sounded) - I haven’t used G+ ever and I’m now watching YouTube videos to learn for next month so I’m like wait what can make this better?

I only have experience with FP and DAS.

Truly I have no answers, and my suggestion’s clearly aren’t great lol, maybe after using the service next month I’ll be more knowledgeable to talk about G+ to compare to DAS.

 

[TLinden16]

I am very concerned about these changes because it sounds like I will no longer be eligible and the accommodations won’t work for me. I have multiple reasons why I am eligible for DAS under the current program.

I do not think renting a scooter is a viable solution for me. I am physically able to walk from point a to point B. I could easily walk a mile. However, I am not able to stand a walk in a slow moving line for more than 10 or 15 minutes. I know Disney will say the solution is to get a scooter, but I don’t think my condition warrants a scooter or a wheelchair. The last thing Disney needs is more scooters and wheelchairs in the parks.

I also have multiple conditions that could require me to hit the restroom unexpectedly if I had to wait in an hour long line. I have concerns about this return to line pass. As others have said, I travel solo sometimes so how would I know where to return to the line? The return to Line Pass is only going to extend my wait time and make me have to put more physical effort into leaving the queue, going to the restroom, and going back.

I would be happily willing to pay for something like Genie + but the current version does not allow the flexibility that people with disabilities need. Most days I need to take a break during the middle of the day back at the resort. Without the flexibility to choose the times I want or need, genie+ isn’t going to work for my needs.

It is unfortunate that there is so much abuse of the system by people who will lie to get an accommodation they don’t truly need. These people ruin it for those who truly need the accommodation. I wish they could walk a day in my shoes to see the challenges I face on a daily basis. I wouldn’t wish what I am going through on anyone.

I have a condition that made me eligible for DAS for two years before I actually started using it. I felt like I could handle the parks without it so I chose not to get it. Two years later additional conditions popped up that made it necessary for me to request the pass. I didn’t want to get it, but I knew there was no way for me to enjoy the parks without it.

 

[Ariel1014]

I've used DAS on my last few trips as a solo traveler. I did not always need to use it all day, every day. There were times I had a ride booked but due to my issues, was not able to ride. Based on what is being given for info, I will no longer qualify. I am ok with that. I am awaiting how they will handle a solo traveler who may need to get out of line for one of my issues and get me back to where I was (as no one is there to hold my spot). I am also ok purchasing Genie+ (as I have done many times). However I would need a return time that doesn't expire. There are times I am having an issue but then in 2 hours am ok. My last trip 2 weeks ago only allowed me to ride 4 rides one day with my DAS as some of the lines were still long and I needed to leave the line. That's my issue and the way my life functions currently.

 

[ryang25]

I believe "The Walt Disney Travel Company" is a different division from "Disney Parks" -- essentially, different businesses even though the same parent company. And the international may even be different yet from the domestic. We all have a tendency to think "Disney" is one and the same, but there are so many different businesses under the parent umbrella name.

The US-based parks must abide by the ADA and provide accommodations. To my knowledge there is absolutely no requirement to follow any foreign "required" accommodation as long as the accommodation offered is considered "reasonable" in the US. Of course that may be a question eventually answered by a court case, much as the GAC/DAS issue was. Disney is well aware of the potential for litigation in this matter and I'm sure their lawyers have reviewed everything before roll-out.

My advice -- if it's causing you that much angst, I personally would cancel my near-term trip and see how things play out. I realize that is disappointing and not really the answer you want, but it's what I would do.

Yeah I hear that. I don’t think the US parks would need to abide by anything other than ADA. I think there is a very slight potential however, that companies like the Travel Company in the UK could be impacted and given they are still a part of the same parent company, that’s still an impact. An impact so small and nuanced that I doubt it really matters to them or would ever get to a court, but raising these points seems to have finally got someone to listen to me which is in itself something I am pleased about.

I actually just got a response that stated the process is not changing for international guests and they gave the old DAS statement saying it is intended for those who cannot wait in long lines. I doubt that’s the case so I have asked if they are aware of the changes.

Edit: UK verbiage has not changed yet on their website either. https://www.disneyworld.co.uk/faq/guests-with-disabilities/attraction-access/

 

[GoingSince1990]

Based upon this screenshot from the Disneyland disability guide (which was posted in the DAS discussion in the Disneyland forum) it looks as though Disney is moving towards rider switch as opposed to DAS for conditions requiring frequent restroom use. For example, a party of 4, one of whom has IBS, could do a rider switch with two members of the party (who don’t have IBS) riding standby, following which the other two (including the person with IBS) could ride with LL. Such a system would obviously make it much less attractive for a party of (for example) six healthy young people to lie about one of them having IBS, as even if approved, four of them would still have to go through the standby line at each ride. Obviously there would be special cases like solo travelers, or parties of two where one person has the condition and needs the other person’s assistance to use the restroom, for which rider switch would not work, in which case the existing system could still be used.

 

[theMoreDisneytheBetter]

Unfortunately the reality is that ride capacity is limited, particularly on the Tier 1 rides, and demand well exceeds supply, and there are only so many ways to bring supply/demand back into balance.

1. increase supply = nonstarter in the near-term
2. reduce demand

Traditionally demand is reduced by increasing prices. No one wants to hear that Genie+ is actually too cheap, but the reality is that if it is selling out it probably is. VIP tours are sold out at $500-1,000/hour, and DLP sells their version of Genie+ (superior product, IMO) for hundreds, not tens, of dollars. Demand is also “reduced” by increasing wait times (because if you are standing in line for Slinky you can’t also be standing in line for Rise).

The issue with DAS is Disney cannot use the free market pricing to adjust demand. Disney also has limited ability to differentiate between those who truly need it, those who benefit but can make do without it, and those who are straight up cheating the system - hence the 3 fold increase over the past 5 years. Therefore because supply is fixed it HAS to reduce demand for it in other ways. It can do this by:
1. limiting eligibility (to the extent legally possible) - which we are seeing now
2. reducing the number of “extra” people allowed in the DAS party - which we are seeing and will likely continue to see
3. making other changes that either make the product less attractive or otherwise restrict it - new 10 minute waits after tap in could easily become 20 or 30 to “account” for the time in the ride line, going on the ride, and then virtually “walking” to the next ride; limiting the number of rides that one can access, or restricting the number of “tier 1” rides that can be used by DAS)
4. increase wait times for everyone

Does this suck? Absolutely. And I don’t think anyone is saying that the truly deserving should not be accommodated. But as the CM’s message above pointed out, demand for DAS is only increasing, supply is not changing any time soon, and at some point the whole thing will collapse under its own weight.

Best of luck to all of those who have been affected.

 

[sarahk0204]

Yes, I know I try to skim (I'm not here for the debate, just looking for actual facts which unfortunately Disney has released little of.) I'm just not sure if they're planning on basically shutting down the virtual calls from 4/20-5/20 (seems insane to me - what are ppl. who have a trip on 5/21 supposed to do?) or if the calls/process will be the same until 5/20. - So if you call 5/19 for your 6/19 trip will you be treated with the old process? The part about nothing will be discussed until their new process starts on 5/20 seems to support this, but who knows.

I don't think they will shut down the virtual calls from 4/20-5/20. Remember that currently you are allowed to "call" 30 days up to 2 days before your trip. We have a trip that starts 5/7. Although my first eligibility to call started 4/7, the first chance I had to wait on hold was 4/9 (and because that was the day all this dropped, I didn't get in). I plan on trying again tomorrow when I have time to wait and DS is available to get on the call if we get in.

There are people who will have SOME of their eligibility window for calling between 4/20 and 5/20, but have trips prior to 5/20. Disney could shift everyone to in person and overwhelm Guest services, but I don't think they would do that.

 

[ryang25]

View attachment 850857
Based upon this screenshot from the Disneyland disability guide (which was posted in the DAS discussion in the Disneyland forum) it looks as though Disney is moving towards rider switch as opposed to DAS for conditions requiring frequent restroom use. For example, a party of 4, one of whom has IBS, could do a rider switch with two members of the party (who don’t have IBS) riding standby, following which the other two (including the person with IBS) could ride with LL. Such a system would obviously make it much less attractive for a party of (for example) six healthy young people to lie about one of them having IBS, as even if approved, four of them would still have to go through the standby line at each ride. Obviously there would be special cases like solo travelers, or parties of two where one person has the condition and needs the other person’s assistance to use the restroom, for which rider switch would not work, in which case the existing system could still be used.

I think this could be the golden ticket accommodation. It still avoids the need for the person with particular needs to wait in the long standby line which is what so many have the issues with. Yes, splitting up parties sucks, but you still have the ability to go on your vacation and ride the rides - unlike the return to queue system which would prevent that for some people.

I just wonder how they will handle it for parties of 2 or solos.