DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

Not sure allergies are really the analogy you want here. While we have had fantastic experiences with many restaurants at WDW and DLR, we've also paid $30+ for DD to eat at the Plaza Inn and have her only be able to eat sausage and fresh fruit. No waffles (they didn't have the gluten free ones that day), no eggs, no muffins or pastries. That was a miserable experience with a hungry child, and I'm so happy we were told we could stop the restrictions that caused that. The other DLR restaurants were much more accommodating on that trip, Plaza was a mess though.

Yes, being one, allergy folks are usually highly restricted on menus and occassionally can't even eat certain courses. But you still pay the same price if it's prix fixe, buffet, or character meal. No discount for the lack of usage.
 
So, anyone who decides they want to use RS in the future will just have to request it?

I am skeptical on that based on how strict they are now (pre-changes) with regard to having a child who doesn't meet the height requirement.
We have only used RS if we are traveling with my sister or our second son and we want to ride FOP or similar larger attraction. Our disabled son is an adult and cannot ride any bigger ride, but I've never had a CM question our need for an RS. We used it one time in December and once the previous February. Usually its just the three of us that travel together, so we only ride attractions that he is able to do.
 
Technically, the announcement (or the website because I'm not sure I've seen an official WDW announcement) only indicates DAS is for developmental disabilities like autism or similar. It doesn't state no accommodations for physical disabilities. I absolutely agree the lack of details is a major fail on Disney's part.
I am one of the people in limbo (and evaluating what the other options there are for my non-developmental disability medical condition), but I really think Disney is strategically not making details publicly available because it will simply start the next cycle of dishonest people reviewing boards like this, determining which conditions have the exact accommodations they like best, and then making notes about how to interview to qualify. Unfortunately, it looks like that may happen no matter what, not giving info now is only going to slow down the process by a few days/weeks/months.

Separately, I’m concerned that some of these new rider switch categories have the potential to create new categories of abuse — but we will see. Disney has a lot of challenges as society changes in ways that put a heavier burden on theme park operators and they have careful, expert lawyers looking at the problem, but if there isn’t enough capacity to keep waits short for everyone who is legally entitled to short waits, they will start raising prices to reduce demand or they will try to exclude more groups from benefits (or both)— I am going to keep an open mind and if things get much harder for our family we will visit less.
 
Yes! Refreshing to hear from someone who uses the accommodation in this way. If the queue is problematic, get a DAS return time. If it isn’t, get in the standby.

This is basically what we do. From trial and error, we basically know what our son's limit is. So we know what length waits he can handle and which queues seem to be most difficult for him. So we don't need to use DAS for every single ride. Especially at Disneyland compared to WDW. Of course, we also know what when we see a LL totally backed up (like RSR), we can't use our DAS at that time.
 
This is basically what we do. From trial and error, we basically know what our son's limit is. So we know what length waits he can handle and which queues seem to be most difficult for him. So we don't need to use DAS for every single ride. Especially at Disneyland compared to WDW. Of course, we also know what when we see a LL totally backed up (like RSR), we can't use our DAS at that time.
This is us, too. At DL we regularly get out of line at Radiator, Indy and Soaring. Soaring is probably the worst. We've had to leave that line many times, including on our most recent trip the it was soaring over CA and crazy busy. We never ended up on Indy (which isn't a huge deal as it isn't DS's favorite) as every time we walked by the LL was ridiculous. One change that has taken some adjusting to is that since the introduction of Genie+ is that many of the never-have-a-line rides now have long waits. This has been hard on DS as it has limited some of this favorites like Little Mermaid, Small World and Monsters, which we used to be able to walk-on over and over (maybe that's not so bad after all, LOL).
 
Still reading, and still learning.
Can I ask a, perhaps, stupid question?

Now that Disney is charging to use the Lightning Lane, do they need to be cognizant of fair pricing amongst all of their able-bodied guests? In other words, would an able-bodied person who paid for Genie+ have any right to say “Hey, Disney, no fair to charge me for using the lightning lane but you didn’t charge that other able-bodied guy”?

Imagine they did something similar at the Empire State Building where the stairs were free but they charged $100 to use the elevator. Obviously I’d expect the elevator to be free for a wheelchair bound guest. But, I could envision that an able-bodied guest (who paid $100 to use the elevator) might complain about fairness if he was riding with 5 other able-bodied guests who got to ride for free because they knew the wheelchair bound guest.

Or…does Disney, being a private company, get to do whatever they want in regards to pricing? Kind of like how private colleges can charge certain students less via institutional grants?

I always enjoy when the legal minds around here chime in. Does Disney need to charge all able-bodied guests equitably?

I really really hope my question isn’t disrespectful. I hope that Disney can figure out a way to accommodate everybody in a way that makes them comfortable.
 


Not sure allergies are really the analogy you want here. While we have had fantastic experiences with many restaurants at WDW and DLR, we've also paid $30+ for DD to eat at the Plaza Inn and have her only be able to eat sausage and fresh fruit. No waffles (they didn't have the gluten free ones that day), no eggs, no muffins or pastries. That was a miserable experience with a hungry child, and I'm so happy we were told we could stop the restrictions that caused that. The other DLR restaurants were much more accommodating on that trip, Plaza was a mess though.
Sometimes an analogy is just an anology and is meant to represent a simple generalization. Just like a generalization is just a generalization and not meant to represent very specific circumstances and/or possible exceptions.

In the same vein, Disney can't start listing exceptions because then abusers will just use those.

I am glad your child is able to move away from that restriction though, it sounds very rough for everyone involved.
 
I always enjoy when the legal minds around here chime in. Does Disney need to charge all able-bodied guests equitably?
Genie+ is not the only way to enter the Lightning Lane. There is ILL$ (which may cost more than G+ and is only 1 ride), DAS, Club 33, guest recovery passes or whatever they are called now, etc. So there are a variety of people utilizing the LL who may have paid different amounts to be allowed into that queue.

If Disney were giving G+ for free to those with disabilities, that becomes a problem if they don't require some form of proof. And it would make the disability program ripe for abuse.
 
Limit as in if people are cheating or they are concerned for capacity they make the wait time double or triple the queue. They already changed it from zero under GAC to the listed wait time, so legal.

Is it? The announcement makes no mention of alternative accommodations only that physical disabilities no longer qualify for DAS.

Is it? Then why not just say so and what those options may be so that people don't have to freak out.

What they have said is that I no longer qualify under the reason I have for the last 10 years and not said what, if anything, will be done. Changing policy of this magnitude without guidance is just wrong. If the accomodation is I get DAS because I qualify for medical reasons then fine. If it is something else that does not work for my family then I will never visit WDW again. I was willing to risk it when I had non expiring tickets or had consistent experience with the policy, but not now.
Changing the wait time from zero to standby time is bringing the wait time closer into line with what non-disabled guest wait. Doubling it is purposefully making it much worse than confidantes have, which is most likely not legal.

The announcement also says that more info is coming, so to assume no accommodate for guests with physical disabilities is a stretch. No DAS doesn’t equate to no accommodation.

I agree that Disney has done a terrible job of announcing this - there should have been much more clarity about what the non-DAS accommodations would look like.
 
This is us, too. At DL we regularly get out of line at Radiator, Indy and Soaring. Soaring is probably the worst. We've had to leave that line many times, including on our most recent trip the it was soaring over CA and crazy busy. We never ended up on Indy (which isn't a huge deal as it isn't DS's favorite) as every time we walked by the LL was ridiculous. One change that has taken some adjusting to is that since the introduction of Genie+ is that many of the never-have-a-line rides now have long waits. This has been hard on DS as it has limited some of this favorites like Little Mermaid, Small World and Monsters, which we used to be able to walk-on over and over (maybe that's not so bad after all, LOL).

We haven't been there since they added it to the Little Mermaid but I've heard it's made standby quite long. Too long for us, probably. If RSR is backed up so far it's in the street, we know to avoid it. Last time Indiana Jones was closed. Since the queue is mostly indoors, I'm not sure how to tell if that one will be too long for us or not. Thankfully, at most spots, it's fairly easy to step out of line to leave, if needed.

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So I've seen people mention queues triggering PTSD. I'm not being snarky, I'm genuinely curious...how does a queue in the parks trigger it?
 
We haven't been there since they added it to the Little Mermaid but I've heard it's made standby quite long. Too long for us, probably. If RSR is backed up so far it's in the street, we know to avoid it. Last time Indiana Jones was closed. Since the queue is mostly indoors, I'm not sure how to tell if that one will be too long for us or not. Thankfully, at most spots, it's fairly easy to step out of line to leave, if needed.

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So I've seen people mention queues triggering PTSD. I'm not being snarky, I'm genuinely curious...how does a queue in the parks trigger it?
I do not have PTSD, but I would imagine it could be a number of things, including being in tight spaces, being around a lot of people, etc.
 
He wouldn’t wait alone. He can have one person with him. Then those 2 ride through LL.
He's actually not the current DAS holder, his sibling is, but it has benefited his management of his less critical needs. Since we're almost always just a party of 3, I never even considered asking for him. I just know his waiting alone won't be an option.

How do i know? We talked about the idea of trying some solo attractions on the Skyliner when we arrived about 45 minutes ago, and hes now thrown up twice - so yeah. Not an option. 😪
He wouldn’t wait alone. He can have one person with him. Then those 2 ride through LL.
 
I'm sorry if it wasn't clear but my post was specifically aiming at Genie+ (soup) being forced onto ppl like some posters are suggesting.

It is not mean to represent any other other accommodations because it's a simple analogy.

I think I've mentioned quite a few times thru the thread my thoughts on other parts of the issue.
Your post was comparing apples to oranges. That said, perhaps a better word would be coerced because people would feel pressured to buy Genie+ in order to have the same or close to the same level of accommodation they had with DAS.
 
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Still reading, and still learning.
Can I ask a, perhaps, stupid question?

Now that Disney is charging to use the Lightning Lane, do they need to be cognizant of fair pricing amongst all of their able-bodied guests? In other words, would an able-bodied person who paid for Genie+ have any right to say “Hey, Disney, no fair to charge me for using the lightning lane but you didn’t charge that other able-bodied guy”?

Imagine they did something similar at the Empire State Building where the stairs were free but they charged $100 to use the elevator. Obviously I’d expect the elevator to be free for a wheelchair bound guest. But, I could envision that an able-bodied guest (who paid $100 to use the elevator) might complain about fairness if he was riding with 5 other able-bodied guests who got to ride for free because they knew the wheelchair bound guest.

Or…does Disney, being a private company, get to do whatever they want in regards to pricing? Kind of like how private colleges can charge certain students less via institutional grants?

I always enjoy when the legal minds around here chime in. Does Disney need to charge all able-bodied guests equitably?

I really really hope my question isn’t disrespectful. I hope that Disney can figure out a way to accommodate everybody in a way that makes them comfortable.
They are very careful to keep them as separate things, even though both returns use the lightning lanes. G+ is paid, individually sold, can sell out, has time slots that fill up, shorter return time, 1 ride max for each attraction, etc. DAS is free if you qualify, applies to your whole group, can't sell out, has no max rides per time slot, has extended return time, can be used multiple times for each ride, etc. G+ is more controlled, DAS is more flexible for the guests, but can balloon out of control since there aren't strict limits, which is happening now.

A similar example would be If you go to one of their a la carte restaurants and order something different from the person next to you, you will likely pay different amounts for the meal. A table may have a custom made gluten free or allergen free dish that may have been unavailable to you, and they may share some of that dish with their family/friends. They got something you didn't and you probably paid different amounts.

So legally, I don't see any reason you could get them in trouble for either one if it was offered as part of a reasonable disability accommodation. They just seem to be paring down what they offer and to how many extra people it applies to.

Personally, some people may get angry, some not. You can be angry if you want, but it's complicated in that we hear about all the abuse and overuse that DAS has had recently, but it's hard to tell who exactly who it is. Is the standard person standing next to you in the LL a G+ person, a DAS person that doesn't have a disability that readily shows their symptoms, or a person pretending to have a disability to get DAS? Who knows? Who should you be angry at?
 
We haven't been there since they added it to the Little Mermaid but I've heard it's made standby quite long. Too long for us, probably. If RSR is backed up so far it's in the street, we know to avoid it. Last time Indiana Jones was closed. Since the queue is mostly indoors, I'm not sure how to tell if that one will be too long for us or not. Thankfully, at most spots, it's fairly easy to step out of line to leave, if needed.

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So I've seen people mention queues triggering PTSD. I'm not being snarky, I'm genuinely curious...how does a queue in the parks trigger it?
Just like everything, there is a spectrum for panic attacks and PTSD. What is a trigger for one person doesn’t trigger another and so on.
 
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Imagine they did something similar at the Empire State Building where the stairs were free but they charged $100 to use the elevator. Obviously I’d expect the elevator to be free for a wheelchair bound guest. But, I could envision that an able-bodied guest (who paid $100 to use the elevator) might complain about fairness if he was riding with 5 other able-bodied guests who got to ride for free because they knew the wheelchair bound guest.
I obviously can't speak for anyone else, but I'd be more than willing to pay for Genie+ for myself and my family if it worked like DAS. Meaning: it doesn't "sell out" and if I can't make it to a ride because of my medical condition my reservation doesn't expire. It would be great if my family was no longer tied to me being able to go but we could "sync" our reservation times. If they have their Genie+ they could still go at the planned time, but say there was a hypothetical "DAS" flag on my Genie+ and I (and one family member) could go later on that ride when I was feeling up to it. It would actually be freeing in a lot of ways because I always feel like I'm slowing people down with my issues so I no longer go with groups and just with my kid and/or husband.
 
IMAGINE there is a restaurant with a wheelchair ramp that leads to a table for one. It's the only option at this restaurant that they have for customers who need a wheelchair. They'll still have "access" to all of the food on the menu but they'll be eating alone. Meanwhile your friends and family will be eating at a different table on the other side of the restaurant. If you go to the restaurant with just one other person (a partner perhaps) you'll both be eating alone.

Rider swap will split families and loved ones up. If they require rider swap for parties of just two, the above would be pretty much the experience of twosomes in which one needs DAS. I hope Disney will do the right thing and at least allow parties of 2 to stay together. I also do solo every now and then and I'm not sure how I can do rider swap with that. I'm anxiously awaiting answers.
 
I obviously can't speak for anyone else, but I'd be more than willing to pay for Genie+ for myself and my family if it worked like DAS. Meaning: it doesn't "sell out" and if I can't make it to a ride because of my medical condition my reservation doesn't expire. It would be great if my family was no longer tied to me being able to go but we could "sync" our reservation times. If they have their Genie+ they could still go at the planned time, but say there was a hypothetical "DAS" flag on my Genie+ and I (and one family member) could go later on that ride when I was feeling up to it. It would actually be freeing in a lot of ways because I always feel like I'm slowing people down with my issues so I no longer go with groups and just with my kid and/or husband.
Thinking Disney would have to rename Genie+ because a theme park cannot tell disabled people they have to pay for their accommodation(s). Editing to add, since it would still be a paid accommodation, I don't think it fly with the ADA.
I do think your idea is a good one though.
 
They are very careful to keep them as separate things, even though both returns use the lightning lanes. G+ is paid, individually sold, can sell out, has time slots that fill up, shorter return time, 1 ride max for each attraction, etc. DAS is free if you qualify, applies to your whole group, can't sell out, has no max rides per time slot, has extended return time, can be used multiple times for each ride, etc. G+ is more controlled, DAS is more flexible for the guests, but can balloon out of control since there aren't strict limits, which is happening now.

A similar example would be If you go to one of their a la carte restaurants and order something different from the person next to you, you will likely pay different amounts for the meal. A table may have a custom made gluten free or allergen free dish that may have been unavailable to you, and they may share some of that dish with their family/friends. They got something you didn't and you probably paid different amounts.

So legally, I don't see any reason you could get them in trouble for either one if it was offered as part of a reasonable disability accommodation. They just seem to be paring down what they offer and to how many extra people it applies to.

Personally, some people may get angry, some not. You can be angry if you want, but it's complicated in that we hear about all the abuse and overuse that DAS has had recently, but it's hard to tell who exactly who it is. Is the standard person standing next to you in the LL a G+ person, a DAS person that doesn't have a disability that readily shows their symptoms, or a person pretending to have a disability to get DAS? Who knows? Who should you be angry at?
Thank you for this explanation and, just to be clear, I never said I was angry. :) The entire accommodation process is incredibly complex (as I’ve come to appreciate over the course of this thread). I was honestly just wondering about the considerations when charging some people but not others. I didn’t know if it was something Disney had to account for.
 

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