DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[smartlabelprint]

No, the CM was correct and that is the current policy. I am certain that disability rider swap will need to be pre-approved as part of the DAS interview, and it will be not like random groups approaching the CM at the ride saying "my friend has IBS, we need a rider swap".

It’s already in place at Disneyland. This is from the current disability access guide. So I’m not sure how the designation may be.

 

[lanejudy]

If Disney disallowed DAS users from going on other rides but kept literally all other parts of the program the same I would wager that standby wait times would go down.

My understanding of Disney's goal is not the standby wait times. It's the length of (and longer waits in) the LL queue they are trying to fix. Putting everyone into LL doesn't help. Having fewer guests be eligible for LL helps. That may mean standby waits go up, but time in the LL goes down making for shorter waits -- which is the goal of LL in general (whether DAS, G+ or ILL$).

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Thought I’d add to this as I got to Tokyo Disney a few times a year (and haven’t been to the US parks since my disability worsened), the guidance used to be, I believe, that you basically had to sit and wait for that time but has more recently said you can use it to shop/get food. They don’t monitor it explicitly though and I’ve heard some cast members say that people have been abusing this (but obviously far harder to do when you need medical proof).

It’s also worth noting given the discussions before about how some people used to be able to manage their condition with fastpass without needing further accommodations, that Tokyo is great for this. Their paid premier access pass gets you on the ride almost immediately and there’s also free fast passes atm which do similar. I know the parks there well and this lets me manage my day in a way that means I’m never standing for long periods and don’t need to get the disability pass (despite numerous cast members trying to get me to get one). Think they’re less good with some mobility issues though, you get asked at every mountain if you can safely evacuate without help and that you must be able to to ride.

It doesn't mentioned food or shopping just experiencing another attraction (which was the contention part of some posters about how the U.S. parks make mention of this) so I would take that to mean you would be fine doing those other things. Disney in the U.S. for instance would probably be fine if people were shopping or dining as it is guests spending money. Thanks for adding in your experience and it's so great to hear you navigate them well

We plan on getting the Premier Pass ourselves but of course that is an additional cost which has been part of the back and forth discussion towards Genie+ and ILL for DAS users. The free 40th Anniversary passes is currently still done but subject to an ending date of which they have not determined yet. Secretly I hope they are still available when we go in October but that's pushing it I think.

It's kinda interesting thinking about the 40th anniversary passes as it's basically like how DLR (U.S. one) was with having complimentary paper FP (although Tokyo is mobile but you know what I mean) along side MaxPass (paid service) when DLR had that. I know it can really feel like being between a rock and a hard place no longer having any complimentary way available and from many comments that leap from included in park ticket to paid (and especially the way it was done with removing a lot of flexibility FP+ had) adjusted how they used DAS.

 

[way2tyred]

You were asked for a source and you linked to another forum post? But I didn't see a source from that post either, so I'm still wondering where these numbers ORIGINALLY came from and if they can be trusted?

The spirit of DAS is that you ARE a standby guest. When FoP was 5 hours recently, if you were using DAS for it you had to wait FIVE HOURS before you were granted access to the lightning lane to ride. It's not as if you get to entirely skip the line and selfishly grab capacity from non-disabled guests! Capacity on rides for DAS is first come, first serve just like everybody else in line.

The problem though is that DAS users are allowed to go on other rides via standby for those 5 hours (or to shows and other activities) while people physically waiting those five hours in line were doing nothing more than waiting in line. I think that's the part of DAS that makes it most appealing to any potential fakers out there, and is the part Disney should reconsider and limit or get rid of entirely.

Many if not most of us can wait we just can't wait in line.

It looks like these numbers are an extrapolation from the 2020 lawsuit, as quoted on a popular podcast with a host that is known to be reliable with his info

 

[smartlabelprint]

There's a big difference between a few minutes for one or two riderswitch waits and over an hour of time gone. I'm nog saying DAS is the only solution. Disney's data suggests that using DAS alone vastly increases the number of rides possible in a day.

A fact of the matter is that from a purely equal perspective, Disney could advance equality by blocking DAS users and the other members of their party from entering a second ride queue until after they'd waited the time it takes to go through the standby queue (minus 10 minutes), and allow entrance only to the selected ride or allowing the abandonment of the wait, in the same manner anyone can leave the queue of sn attraction. This approach reduces the overall load on the lightning lanes. It does not enable individuals to repeat rides with very short gaps. That's not possible for the general guest so may not actually require accommodation.

As for repeating rides, my then toddler with DD was struggling, they didn’t even ask us to go through the queue again. They offered a 3rd re-ride which we declined.

 

[Kerr84]

You can use the Search feature in the upper right-hand corner:
View attachment 851938

Set it to search "This Thread" and enter your username:
View attachment 851941


We will open another thread with details once known, and ask for experiences. At this point closing and restarting a new thread will just result in more of the same. Some posters may have missed the initial announcement last week and are only hearing about it now, may be coming to vent just like others did last week.

But if someone quoted your post, isn't still on their post?

 

[NumberOneDime]

My understanding of Disney's goal is not the standby wait times. It's the length of (and longer waits in) the LL queue they are trying to fix. Putting everyone into LL doesn't help. Having fewer guests be eligible for LL helps. That may mean standby waits go up, but time in the LL goes down making for shorter waits -- which is the goal of LL in general (whether DAS, G+ or ILL$).

Curious to hear the experiences of other DAS users. I am a local with an AP and I go to WDW about once or twice a month. I don't feel the lightning lane lines are long at all. Cast members tend to hold the standby lines up to make sure the lightning lane keeps moving, as they should.

DAS users aren't adding to that standby line being longer because they a part of it, they waited in it and now it's their turn. The lightning lane seems pretty lightning fast to me already. Cast members can always make them even faster by further holding up the standby line (which will result in a longer return time for DAS users, thereby keeping those people away from the lightning lane).

I once again argue the only possible negative for other guests is DAS users making standby lines longer when and ONLY when they are in two standby lines at once.

 

[lanejudy]

Cast members tend to hold the standby lines up to make sure the lightning lane keeps moving, as they should.

Yes, but with fewer guests in the LL there would be less need to hold the standby queue for as long. Everyone moves along faster.

 

[lanejudy]

But if someone quoted your post, isn't still on their post?

Yes. If you have a concern you may report a post and I'll look at it.

 

[Marrila]

Deleted, already answered.

 

[ClaraOswald]

This is what they’re using for this type of thing at Disneyland. This attachment is from the Disneyland disability guide. View attachment 851978

Are those bullet points recently added?

It sounds like they really will try to get people to use rider swap. Does the party who rides 2nd go through the LL then when it's their turn?

 

[TwoMisfits]

Are those bullet points recently added?

It sounds like they really will try to get people to use rider swap. Does the party who rides 2nd go through the LL then when it's their turn?

Yes.

 

[Lugan]

This makes a lot of sense to me. If DAS users are clogging up any lines....it's not for the attraction they are "virtually" in the standby line for. It's not the lightning lanes either. It's for when they join ANOTHER standby line while simultaneously in line "virtually" for their DAS attraction. Now they are in TWO standby lines at once, a clear advantage.

If Disney disallowed DAS users from going on other rides but kept literally all other parts of the program the same I would wager that standby wait times would go down.

It must be said that there are some who say they need the accommodation of getting through the parks faster due to a disability and DAS helps them do this. But that is a separate conversation.

While this may be true, the flip side of this is that most often posted ride times are significantly inflated vs. the actual wait time being experienced by standby guests.

Disney has a conflict of interest in posting accurate standby wait times:
1) The economic incentive to post higher standby wait times = driving more sales of Genie+ and ILL. It's a cost/benefit analysis that everybody performs whether they explicitly do some math, or just weigh whether they are willing to pay the amount or not.
2) Guest happiness / satisfaction = if the posted time is 30 minutes, and you wait 15 or 20 minutes for the ride, you are happier. If the posted wait time is 30 minutes and you wait 45 minutes, you are upset that you ended up waiting longer.
3) Maintenance / Ride break down margin. This also falls into #2, but by erring on the side of over-estimating a wait time, it allows for a delay in operations without failing to meet the wait time.

While DAS is supposed to take into account the LL wait time when scheduling your return time, in my experience often the return time I receive is the current time plus the posted standby wait time. Or the LL wait time is significantly longer than the adjustment granted.

I grumble about it a bit with my family, but know that being able to go to a shop, or go to a walk-on ride while waiting helps to offset the impact of these things. If Disney removed the ability to do any other experience while waiting, then I would expect them to get greater scrutiny over their posted wait times.

Hopefully, with enacting these changes, the LL wait times go down, and are more in line with the adjustment to return times given. But, I think that any conversation about the benefits of DAS needs to be tempered with the drawbacks.

 

[NumberOneDime]

Yes, but with fewer guests in the LL there would be less need to hold the standby queue for as long. Everyone moves along faster.

But do you agree with me that even though a DAS user is using the lightning lane they are actually in the standby line, virtually? So if the cast member is holding up the standby line to let a DAS user through they are actually, in practice, NOT holding up the standby line. Even though it may not seem like it, the standby line is moving because DAS users ARE standby line users and it's their turn.

DAS users don't add to standby line times by using the lightning lanes because there is nothing lightning about DAS. They wait the full standby time. They only add to standby times by being in two standby lines at once.

 

[OurBigTrip]

But do you agree with me that even though a DAS user is using the lightning lane they are actually in the standby line, virtually? So if the cast member is holding up the standby line to let a DAS user through they are actually, in practice, NOT holding up the standby line. Even though it may not seem like it, the standby line is moving because DAS users ARE standby line users and it's their turn.

DAS don't add to standby line times by using the lightning lanes because there is nothing lightning about DAS. They wait the full standby time. They only add to standby times by being in two standby lines at once.

DAA users add to the standby wait time when they return, not when they are waiting .

 

[lanejudy]

Even though it may not seem like it, the standby line is moving because DAS users ARE standby line users and it's their turn.

No, I disagree with this. They are standby while waiting outside the queue doing other things. Once the DAS party enters the LL they are the LL lane, mixed with all others in the LL who are there for various reasons (all unrelated to standby).

Disney's focus appears to be reducing the number of bodies in the LL, and by that it will reduce the length of time spent in that queue. There is nothing "short" about a 30 minute wait in the LL, especially by your own statement those folks have already waited the posted standby.

When the LL moves faster, the standby will move faster because it won't need to be stopped as often or for as long.

 

[PrincessV]

It has you running one end to the other and prioritizes scattering crowds vs minimizing wait times for the guest.

The first time I used it it wanted us to go to POC which was a 45 min wait vs Buzz (right next to where we were waiting) which had a shorter line even though we had both rides on our list. This was close to the afternoon and it calculated most people going right after the hub.

We had purchased Genie+ and continued to ignore its suggestions. Now we don’t even bother selecting or setting it up and we get less interruptions from its suggestions.

I’ve run Genie a time or two for pure entertainment value - it’s TREMENDOUSLY bad if your goal is to reduce your time in lines! Like, hysterically, unapologetically in Disney’s favor, BAD!

That somewhat lines up with Len Testa's claim that the majority of DAS abusers are Disney employees, which shocked me when I first read that.

I’m friends with a number of CMs and parents of CMs and this topic has come up in conversation over the years - there are two things to this: 1. A large number of CMs are disabled and absolutely qualify for DAS, and 2. Yes, there are absolutely CMs abusing their DAS status, whether they have it with a true disability or not. It really is a thing.

Thanks for posting….it was eye opening to say the least. This was a good quote from the transcript:

“The other thing I wanna mention is Disney has thousands of cast members who are either disabled or who have family members that are disabled. And if you told me this new policy went through 25 rounds of internal review and testing before we even heard about it, I would believe that. And the end result is going to be that the people who truly need accommodation are going to wait less in line when all of this is done.
So that's the good thing.
No, no, I agree. I agree. The notion is Disney isn't going after your child with autism.
This is an entirely different target in mind here.
Yeah, let me just say this. And I'm not saying that this was told to me or anything. If you think that the best way to get a DAS pass is to show up at a park by yourself with no doctor's note, but a script that you printed off the internet that says, words to use to skip the lines at Disney World for free.
And you're reading from that paper to the person at guest relations. You might want to rethink your strategy. That's all I'm going[…]”

From The Jim Hill Media Podcast Network: DD Ep 475: Re-opened 1900 Park Fare serves up a superior character meal, Apr 15, 2024
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...-fare-serves-up-a/id452620851?i=1000652447127
This material may be protected by copyright.

I’m not the only one now wondering what’s on that script, right?! Like, if the script is good, isn’t it going to repeat the actual things someone not faking would say? How’s a CM to know what’s real and what’s not? Or was Len literally referencing a piece of paper in hand?

Curious to hear the experiences of other DAS users. I am a local with an AP and I go to WDW about once or twice a month. I don't feel the lightning lane lines are long at all. Cast members tend to hold the standby lines up to make sure the lightning lane keeps moving, as they should.

Same. I average around 30+ days in the parks per year and in the couple years I’ve used DAS, I’ve only ever waited longer than 15 minutes in a LL maybe 4 times, and 3 of those turned out to be because the ride went down. I’m honestly puzzled to keep seeing people say LL waits are so long because that just has not been my experience. I’m not saying it’s not happening - only that I’ve never seen it. Which feels odd.


~~~

I meant to quote the Len Testa transcript and somehow lost it. Interesting that he indicated it would be medical professionals taking the virtual calls, not CMs, when all the info people have gotten direct form Disney this week have said the opposite. I know he usually knows his stuff, but this one feels off, no?

I LOVE the idea of having a private room into which one can go to video call in the parks! I’m pretty comfortable talking about my triggers and needs, but I know it can be off-putting to anyone eavesdropping (and yes, many Guests do just that), and I’m sure uncomfortable for some who are requesting DAS. This would be a real nice change for those who want or need to do their talk in the parks.

 

[RamblinWreck]

Curious to hear the experiences of other DAS users. I am a local with an AP and I go to WDW about once or twice a month. I don't feel the lightning lane lines are long at all. Cast members tend to hold the standby lines up to make sure the lightning lane keeps moving, as they should.

DAS users aren't adding to that standby line being longer because they a part of it, they waited in it and now it's their turn. The lightning lane seems pretty lightning fast to me already. Cast members can always make them even faster by further holding up the standby line (which will result in a longer return time for DAS users, thereby keeping those people away from the lightning lane).

I once again argue the only possible negative for other guests is DAS users making standby lines longer when and ONLY when they are in two standby lines at once.

I'm sorry, but this is just not accurate.

Even if DAS users were only "waiting" in one standby line at a time (virtually), it still would cause standby lines at the e-ticket attractions to be longer. That's a necessary consequence of all lightning lane and DAS usage. It can't be avoided or mitigated.

 

[Jrb1979]

Curious to hear the experiences of other DAS users. I am a local with an AP and I go to WDW about once or twice a month. I don't feel the lightning lane lines are long at all. Cast members tend to hold the standby lines up to make sure the lightning lane keeps moving, as they should.

DAS users aren't adding to that standby line being longer because they a part of it, they waited in it and now it's their turn. The lightning lane seems pretty lightning fast to me already. Cast members can always make them even faster by further holding up the standby line (which will result in a longer return time for DAS users, thereby keeping those people away from the lightning lane).

I once again argue the only possible negative for other guests is DAS users making standby lines longer when and ONLY when they are in two standby lines at once.

While the Lightning Lane may be short and move fast like it's supposed , that's not the problem. The problem is that DAS is taking away capacity from those who buy Genie+. From the numbers Len Testa put out with DAS taking close to 70% of LL capacity, it leaves little for those who bought Genie+.

 

[PrincessDadx2]

Not in the past 14 years or so. DAS (and previously GAC) was only available at a theme park Guest Relations location. That may have been outside the theme park, but not at Downtown Disney or Disney Springs. You can purchase tickets there, get APs or other tickets validated there, but not the DAS or GAC.


The no-expiration ticket add-on option was discontinued in 2015. It has been many years now. I realize that many folks are still using up old tickets, but someone who is using them now either stocked up big time or has made very few trips over the past 8+ years.

LOL. I know I am still in a Covid time warp, but hopefully not that bad. I guess my point was that I felt better because when I originally got into the system there were more options and when the last change was made I had experience with the old system and the announcement was not that they were discontinuing specific disabilities because people were cheating. Just feels worse this time. I feel I am being singled out and since it is too expensive for Disney to make individual plans like IEP with my daughter in school that my DW ended up on the wrong side of the cost/benefit line. Can't get you what you really need, which is accommodation for outdoor/majority outdoor queue's, so F you very much.

Thanks for this thread. Think I have reached acceptance stage in my grief. Will definitely write to Disney and make my thoughts known and see if they offer any accommodations. If not, I will cancel my add on 3 nights 2 days this summer and save the $10k for the next full family vacation. Worst case that 3 days will pay for 3.5 years of our annual pass to Busch Gardens so we will introduce the grandkids to Elmo instead of Mickey.