DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[connie254]

That sounds like to me they were confusing pre-registration with how long the approval lasts once someone is approved at least the way you worded the comment here.

It must be quite difficult to keep all of it down with the differing days and the qualifiers (length of ticket or X number of days).

It wasn't someone associated with TouringPlans, And I paused the YouTube video and replayed that section. He definitely said the phone call could be made 120 days instead of the current 2-30 day window.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

Maxpass worked way better than Fastpass+ too. I remember returning to WDW right after using Maxpass at Disneyland and thinking, wow this is way worse lol

Genie+ IS Maxpass— it works terribly because way, way more people are using DAS so much (perhaps a majority?) of each return slot is allocated to DAS users, which pushes even more people who used to use FP into DAS — not because they won’t pay, but because G+ doesn’t work. I would also add G+ works better to this day at DLR because there are many more good rides and it works in both parks AND you have to be in the parks to start selections so things don’t sell out by 7:05AM. Also, if you don’t believe that DAS slots being reserved is a BIG part of why Genie+ is terrible, consider that ILL for the newest, hottest VQ rides goes much more slowly than Slinky Dog Dash and Test Track most days.

 

[Kerr84]

It wasn't someone associated with TouringPlans, And I paused the YouTube video and replayed that section. He definitely said the phone call could be made 120 days instead of the current 2-30 day window.

I am pretty sure that is wrong. The 120 is referring to how long the DAS MAY be available once used in the park. I have seen lots of misinformation from different vloggers.

 

[Angel Ariel]

The trick is to stop caring what other people think. They aren't going to help you adapt or be happy in your life so who cares what they think about how you do it? I know it is easier said than done but it is critical.

I don't care how other individuals rhink. I care about society as a whole however because a minimally speaking child like mine is facing so much systemic ableism and impediments, that in order for her to "live a life like mine" (taking the quote from The Arc), many of those systemic barriers need to come down and that doesn't happen as long as she's seen as less of a human being (and yes, society in general sees her as less. This is not up for debate. This is a population of people for whom it is still legal to pay them less than minimum wage).

 

[Angel Ariel]

I think everyone wants to go in a circle and not zigzag but when your only asset is Genie+, you inevitably have to zigzag.

Even if we were denied DAS we would not be able to zigzag. Genie+ or not. It's not a "want to tour this way", it's a need.

 

[TCRAIG]

DH and I had a trip in October 2021 just before Genie+ came out. At that time, there was a lot of discussion online whether the parks still needed Fastpass+, or if we could just continue to have only standby lines, because Fastpass slowed down the standby queues. (The Fastpass (now LL) lines were used a little during that time, which I know now was DAS, as well as VIP and guest recovery.)

The standby queues during that trip were awful, with CM's with the sign to where the line started pretty far from the entrance to some attractions. And this is a time when social distancing had pretty much been eliminated from the queues, so that wasn't artificially making the standby lines look longer.

So, I knew then that standby only was not feasible as the parks increased capacity. Genie+ came out a few weeks after our trip.

I was there Oct of 21 as well and - although some lines were long - wait times seemed to me to be better because you were always moving…it was the first time I was able to do Pan and Pirates and Buzz without needing my husband to push me in a wheelchair…

 

[sarahk0204]

A lot of people wanted MP to go to WDW and I was like "no you don't" lol

It's a bit different now but DLR didn't have every attraction with a FP lane. Pirates for example does now with Genie+ at DLR but didn't have a FP lane at DLR. I've seen the comments about Pirates now going painfully slow now that only one side is standby. I'm sure it's not always that way but I felt it ran fairly smooth being standby only.

And this was the argument for leaving all queues standby only as they were post Covid and pre Genie+. The problem was the standby lines got way too long, and they needed to do something. Was Genie+ the right something? A fair amount of people say that it wasn't.

 

[OurBigTrip]

It wasn't someone associated with TouringPlans, And I paused the YouTube video and replayed that section. He definitely said the phone call could be made 120 days instead of the current 2-30 day window.

It was Len Testa, who is the president of Touring Plans.

 

[Evita_W]

Genie+ IS Maxpass— it works terribly because way, way more people are using DAS so much (perhaps a majority?) of each return slot is allocated to DAS users, which pushes even more people who used to use FP into DAS — not because they won’t pay, but because G+ doesn’t work. I would also add G+ works better to this day at DLR because there are many more good rides and it works in both parks AND you have to be in the parks to start selections so things don’t sell out by 7:05AM. Also, if you don’t believe that DAS slots being reserved is a BIG part of why Genie+ is terrible, consider that ILL for the newest, hottest VQ rides goes much more slowly than Slinky Dog Dash and Test Track most days.

Nope, not Max Pass, Max pass did have individual rides with an extra upcharge and Max pass could be used on the same attraction more than once. Those are the two major issues DH has with it over using a DAS.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

so that wasn't artificially making the standby lines look longer.

And this was the argument for leaving all queues standby only as they were post Covid and pre Genie+. The problem was the standby lines got way too long, and they needed to do something. Was Genie+ the right something? A fair amount of people say that it wasn't.

Over at Universal (we'll see what they do with Epic Universe) they do not add Express Pass to their attractions until a certain time later. I usually use the example that Forbidden Journey did not have Express pass for something like 6 1/2 years. It was standby only. Hagrid's is the attraction at the moment that does not have Express Pass. The strategy that Universal seems to employ is holding off until the wait time of the attraction reaches whatever level they want, then they add on Express Pass because once that gets added Standby line typically gets longer and longer in wait. VelociCoaster, the most recent addition to EP, is like that presently with waits typically being longer now that EP was added to it. VelociCoaster went from June 2021 to Feb 2023 with only having Standby. Hagrid's has been opened since June 2019 as just Standby.

And before anyone says "well Universal doesn't have the same attendance as WDW" that's not quite true since Disney went to a park reservation system. But it's also besides the point because the strategies are different between the parks, one says everyone is going to wait in line until we determined they can have another way (this is excluding their version of DAS) the other typically says we're going to start an attraction off of that including preventing standby entirely as a policy by using VQs exclusively.

I think talking about it such that you and others have in the past is because you're comparing it to FP, as in you're comparing to what you could get with a get ahead of the line pass. You really can't compare the two because of course you're going to realistically be able to get onto an attraction faster if you have a get ahead of the line pass on an attraction experiencing demand at that moment, that's what it exists for. But that does not mean having a standby line only attraction means you'll wait longer. It really doesn't seem to be how it pans out over at Universal either.

Disney didn't pay attention to how long the lines were in the time period when they reopened and when they launched Genie+. They were already heading towards a paid service pre-pandemic and already had one at DLR. Rumors swirled of a paid service at WDW once MP started at DLR and most people assumed even if they didn't feel it was right that a complimentary service for WDW had their days numbered.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

Nope, not Max Pass, Max pass did have individual rides with an extra upcharge and Max pass could be used on the same attraction more than once. Those are the two major issues DH has with it over using a DAS.

I forgot the distinction that you could ride multiple times with MaxPass (and agree is an important distinction), but I don’t think the handful of ILL rides makes Genie+ different than MaxPass, though it does slightly reduce capacity for the system (though there are still more G+ rides than there used to be MaxPass rides).

My point was that switching systems to allow more “marginal” DAS users to cope effectively without it won’t help unless they have adequate capacity (and making them free would probably help also—but I think if Disney makes some LL “free” they will get it back by making ticket prices higher).

 

[Disturbia]

Genie+ IS Maxpass— it works terribly because way, way more people are using DAS so much (perhaps a majority?) of each return slot is allocated to DAS users, which pushes even more people who used to use FP into DAS — not because they won’t pay, but because G+ doesn’t work. I would also add G+ works better to this day at DLR because there are many more good rides and it works in both parks AND you have to be in the parks to start selections so things don’t sell out by 7:05AM. Also, if you don’t believe that DAS slots being reserved is a BIG part of why Genie+ is terrible, consider that ILL for the newest, hottest VQ rides goes much more slowly than Slinky Dog Dash and Test Track most days.

Maybe this is some of the reasoning to allow park hopping so you can book rides in multiple parks - more options, but hurts guests with park reservations on pm availability and crowing (MK super crowded Nov 4, 2023 (unlimited park hopping) last year - hub at standstill 20 mins past fireworks vs NYE 2022 only guests with park reservations were allowed).

Personally we’ve never used park hoppers (use the extra time on AK day to do resort activities) with Genie+, although did help friends recently navigate it.

 

[Grim Grinning Ghostie]

Genie+ IS Maxpass— it works terribly because way, way more people are using DAS so much (perhaps a majority?) of each return slot is allocated to DAS users, which pushes even more people who used to use FP into DAS — not because they won’t pay, but because G+ doesn’t work. I would also add G+ works better to this day at DLR because there are many more good rides and it works in both parks AND you have to be in the parks to start selections so things don’t sell out by 7:05AM. Also, if you don’t believe that DAS slots being reserved is a BIG part of why Genie+ is terrible, consider that ILL for the newest, hottest VQ rides goes much more slowly than Slinky Dog Dash and Test Track most days.

Maybe so, but that isn't really a fair metric either - ILLs also sell more slowly because they are an additional $17-$20-something dollars per person for the singular ride, whereas Genie+ is 1 fee to ride every other ride in the parks.

I do believe that DAS users and their parties take up a large portion of LL & standby lines, though, and am happy they're capping the max number of people that can accompany a DAS user.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

Maybe so, but that isn't really a fair metric either - ILLs also sell more slowly because they are an additional $17-$20-something dollars per person for the singular ride, whereas Genie+ is 1 fee to ride every other ride in the parks.

I do believe that DAS users and their parties take up a large portion of LL & standby lines, though, and am happy they're capping the max number of people that can accompany a DAS user.

Pricing varies (and certainly many purchasers are not that discriminating), but often you are only getting 1-2 rides with long lines (at every park other than MK) for G+ and it can be more than 2x as expensive as a LL depending on the ride. What would be interesting is to compare the ILLs that DAS can access (BTMRR, FOP, are there others?) with the ILL that they can’t and see difference in sellout times.

 

[JLTraveling]

This could have just been a perfect storm of AAP users coming all at once, time of day, etc,. Any time I've used my AAP at Hagrid's, I have been the only one requesting it at the moment, generally between 9-11am mornings in August. I have done it 4 times, so a small sample size.

This. A couple of tips for those new to using AAP (or even FOTL if you're staying at a hotel that provides it) at Universal:

Plan your day. You don't need spreadsheets and detailed guides like you do for Disney, but figure that the biggest rides (Hagrid's and Velocicoaster especially) will have the biggest waits midday. If you're able, knock them out first thing in the morning or late in the afternoon/evening.

Avoid show dumps. Just like at Disney, when a show lets out, people automatically gravitate towards the nearest ride (or bathroom or snack stand). Most shows are 20-30 minutes long, so you can look at the show schedule and plan NOT to ride something just as a show next door is letting out.

If there's a crowd, come back. Occasionally AAPs just end up clustered together for absolutely no discernible reason. If it's NYE, maybe the park really is that crowded. But on a normal day, just figure out which way the crowd is going and go the other way, and you'll find that a ride or two away, there's almost no AAPs around. Or better yet, slip into a show and let them pass you by.

Overall it's SO much easier than Disney, but there is a bit of learning curve when you're new.

 

[greeneyedchick]

They could also increase hours. If they were open 8am-2am like they used to be, people with older kids or problems with heat could go later. It would spread out the crowds and open up more slots in genie for rides. People wouldn't feel so rushed. They could also commit to designing more high capacity rides. That doesn't seem to be a priority in their

Honestly? Not convinced this will change very much, even with their ability to control things.

I wonder how much of this is on DAS and how much of this is on 'Disney wants to sell more Genie+ than anything else.'

It's mind-boggingly how even when paying for such an experience, the overall system is just worse than FastPass+. Were there times that a lot of FP+ people got to go ahead of others? Yeah most definitely!

But it also wasn't at this level. And I think that's on Disney more than anything for being bad at balancing.

A lot of the backups have to do with rides breaking down. Disney needs to spend more money on ride maintenance.

 

[greeneyedchick]

I am not talking adding a single ride. I am talking adding 7+ additional rides, increasing the park footprint and most importantly NOT increasing overall park capacity.

It is a supply and demand issue. There is not enough ride capacity for all the people in the park. The only way to fix it is increase ride capacity, but not let the demand increase. This is a VERY expensive option for Disney. The only advantage is gives them is higher overall guest satisfaction. Since stockholders cannot measure that in $$$, it doesn't register on the balance sheets.

Or increase park hours and ensure that all rides are oeprating at full capacity. They used to be open much later.

 

[Grim Grinning Ghostie]

A lot of the backups have to do with rides breaking down. Disney needs to spend more money on ride maintenance.

That, too. We went this weekend and had Space Mountain (both times), Guardians, Remy, *and* Test Track break down as we approached. The only ride we tried to go on that didn't break down was Tron.

 

[JLTraveling]

I have severe trauma induced arthritis in my back, left arm and wrist. In fact I am considered as having a physical disability. I was a concert pianist - Juilliard trained. I also have a total knee replacement and scheduled for another one. My DD and I love to ski. My DD is a fantastic skier. Had she not gone to Riverview School in MA, she would have qualified to be on the US Para Olympic Ski Team. Skiing is something we do. Frequently I would come home from work and we would drive to Park City for a couple of runs. We lived to ski. My DD needs accommodations. She either has to have the snow painted on the side of the run or someone needs to ski there so she doesn’t ski off the side of the mountain or cliff. However, I am no longer physically able to ski. I can no longer hold a pole in my left hand. I can’t handle the pain in my back. No amount of accommodation could make it possible for me to ski. The National Ability Center has tried everything with me as they know our love for skiing.

This is my point. Sometimes we need to make the very difficult decision that no matter how much we want to do something, no matter how others (Disney in this case) try to accommodate our particular needs, we simply can no longer do the thing we love. Does it suck? Yes, totally!!!

I think people need to make a decision, given the new parameters of accommodations Disney is able to do. If the accommodations still are able to work for you and your situation, great! If not, I can certainly feel for you and I have empathy but it is a fact that Disney can no longer sustain the amount of DAS users.

Disney is saying that the amount of individuals needing a DAS is interrupting their business. It is horrible when you wait in a virtual queue for 45 minutes to an hour, go to the attraction when it is your turn and then have to wait an additional 30 minutes in the LL. It is frustrating when you purchase the LL or ILL and then end up waiting 30 to 45 minutes. Clearly something has to be done for their every day operations to function.

Disney is drawing a new line in the sand. That is reality. Everyone needs to figure out if it will work or not. Everyone needs to figure out a different way or decide that going to the parks is no longer possible and find something else to enjoy.

I am truly sorry that you can no longer engage in skiing. I get it. My dad was a community theater actor who got cast in virtually every show he auditioned for. Eventually his back and other conditions got bad enough that he can no longer do it.

But I feel like your analogy is off a bit. You said "The National Ability Center has tried everything with me." What if there was an accommodation that you had been using for years at your favorite ski resort. It worked well for you then and it still works now. But they said no, we're still giving that accommodation to other people, but you no longer qualify. Sorry you can't ski anymore!

Would you really be okay with that?

 

[smartlabelprint]

Not asking as we approach a ride, I mean several weeks before trip.

Right. But when someone does their disability call and are told ‘no, you don’t qualify for das, try rider switch’. They could say, “but it’s just me, I have no one to switch with” to get full DAS approval. Then later go add people. So as someone mentioned hopefully they’ll have an appropriate accommodation for groups of 1-2 that don’t qualify for full das other than rider switch.