Disney Skyliner Accident

[pahoben]

Wow.

Keeping up with this thread takes a while.

I’m even more glad after reading the first hand accounts here that this happened at night. I do hope that the accounts by people stuck in the gondolas are getting to accident investigators first and foremost.

Hearing about power issues while stuck, lack of response to potential medical issues in air maybe due to confusion/inexperience of CM, slowness of FD evac, general disorganization during evac are all troubling.

The last ones should have all been handled with a proper, comprehensive, detailed emergency plan. This is literally what Safety Risk Assessment Agencies do for work. The Federal Transit Administration (FTA) provides samples of Safety Risk Assessment Matrices on their website. I imagine Disney will be under scrutiny for the procedures and training - both SOP and emergency- that they have in place for the Skyliner.

The Skyliner is a transportation system open to the public with enough daily capacity to be considered city sized.

Besides the gaps in the emergency response, these reports of system power issues - first potentially in the blue gondola that started the crushing event, and then the gondola speakers/power issues in 3hr+ stopped gondolas - are troubling.

If the power issues are potentially why there was a 3hr+ delay in evac, meaning the emergency evac procedure in the books for this type of incident listed a swift evac of the line by running all gondolas quickly back to another operating hub, and this didn’t occur - that’s a big problem.

Disney execs should be grateful this didn’t occur at noon during 90/100 degree temps. This incident replayed during the daytime is a mind boggling, dangerous scenario.

I would expect a long down time until there is assurance that better procedures are in place and potential power issues have been corrected and tested before re opening to the public.

I don’t think anyone could reasonably suggest that Disney didn’t conduct a safety risk assessment prior to use of the Gondola system. Of course a formal safety risk assessment prior to use of the Gondolas. As far as the evac period it was similar to other Evac periods for Gondolas in similar use.

WDW is one of the safest places on earth for visitors with incredibly low accident rates especially considering the physical and mental health of many of those visitors. They are astoundingly low. To suggest this system was used without formal risk assessment is not reasonable at all.

 

[pahoben]

It’s funny that if you read through Gondola evacuations on ski lifts that maybe were done by helicopter with a night spent bivouacked at a remote location the evacuees compliment the company as job well done. At Disney with a three hour evac with no injuries on a new system many people not even on the Gondola rant about evil Disney. Quite a contrast in attitudes.

 

[mshanson3121]

What's the point of even having the speakers and two-way communication if they don't actually use them to communicate?

I think the compensation seems more than fair for most people, but people who called in that they were having a real medical event and were ignored probably have a real case against Disney on this.

This.

Also, some have commented earlier - why aren't we hearing from more people that had panic attacks, that went to the hospital, if people soiled themselves.

My guess? Could be they've been told to stay quiet in case they pursue action.

 

[cakebaker]

Also, some have commented earlier - why aren't we hearing from more people that had panic attacks, that went to the hospital, if people soiled themselves.

Could be it didn't happen. I haven't heard a single first person report other that of one who let their small child pee while waiting. I've read lots of I know someone who, or I saw someone who...but no reports from anyone who actually had it happen to them. Odd, but I don't lay it on future litigation. People will sue over anything these days, but I seriously doubt we'll ever see a case go to court. Disney only fights a case they think they can win. They were in the wrong here, regardless of how valid the claim of actual damage is. They'll settle quickly and quietly, as well they should.

 

[mamaofsix]

With regard to the monorail, I think Disney had 2 options prior to this. Replace with updated monorails or scrap the monorail systems and replace with a Skyliner. I think after this, the expansion of the Skyliner to replace the monorail is unlikely.

I would put a bet that Disney is going to have new monorails for the 50th anniversary.

There is a 3rd option: build new mass transportation that is ground-based instead of in the sky. I realize that monorails and the skyliner offer an amazing view, but wonder why Disney hasn't explored more ground-based options besides busing? Electric powered commuter trains, for example, would be a lot cheaper. And you could evacuate them so easily if needed. Or, think how many people would get a kick out enclosed, Jetson-style moving sidewalks between the resorts. They have them in airports, why not at Disney?

I know ground-based modes aren't fail safe, either, but they're cheaper to build and easier for people to be rescued when things go wrong...

 

[pahoben]

Could be it didn't happen. I haven't heard a single first person report other that of one who let their small child pee while waiting. I've read lots of I know someone who, or I saw someone who...but no reports from anyone who actually had it happen to them. Odd, but I don't lay it on future litigation. People will sue over anything these days, but I seriously doubt we'll ever see a case go to court. Disney only fights a case they think they can win. They were in the wrong here, regardless of how valid the claim of actual damage is. They'll settle quickly and quietly, as well they should.

If their attitudes continue to spread in society all that will be left for everyone to do is to stay at home and watch PC sanitized serials on television. Shut down with law suits anything with risk no matter how reasonable the risk and force no matter what the cost equal access for each individual no matter how severe their mental or physical problems. I hope it doesn’t continue but the trend doesn’t look good.

 

[Jax1023]

If their attitudes continue to spread in society all that will be left for everyone to do is to stay at home and watch PC sanitized serials on television. Shut down with law suits anything with risk no matter how reasonable the risk and force no matter what the cost equal access for each individual no matter how severe their mental or physical problems. In addition with the watered down educations Millenials have received the quality of services will slide as they further populate the workforce. I hope it doesn’t continue but the trend doesn’t look good.

Seriously why does everything turn into millennial bashing? This has absolutely nothing to do with that.

 

[pahoben]

Seriously why does everything turn into millennial bashing? This has absolutely nothing to do with that.

I just posted maybe one hundred sentences and only this reply on one sentence so I will edit out that sentence.

There you are edited out.

 

[mshanson3121]

Could be it didn't happen. I haven't heard a single first person report other that of one who let their small child pee while waiting. I've read lots of I know someone who, or I saw someone who...but no reports from anyone who actually had it happen to them. Odd, but I don't lay it on future litigation. People will sue over anything these days, but I seriously doubt we'll ever see a case go to court. Disney only fights a case they think they can win. They were in the wrong here, regardless of how valid the claim of actual damage is. They'll settle quickly and quietly, as well they should.

The toileting issues may not have happened. But there is photographic evidence as well as multiple eye witness reports of people being taken by ambulance. But I definitely agree that Disney will just quietly settle.

 

[DerEchte]

Or, think how many people would get a kick out enclosed, Jetson-style moving sidewalks between the resorts. They have them in airports, why not at Disney?

Look no further than Disneyland Paris to see how well that's working out. They have been shut down indefinitely.

 

[cakebaker]

The toileting issues may not have happened. But there is photographic evidence as well as multiple eye witness reports of people being taken by ambulance.

Yet no first hand reports from those directly affected. I don't put much stock in "eye witness" reports and we've certainly not heard of absolutely any injuries, let alone those that would require a trip by ambulance. However, if I were looking to a future lawsuit, I'd certainly want to have it on record I went to the hospital.

 

[pahoben]

There is a 3rd option: build new mass transportation that is ground-based instead of in the sky. I realize that monorails and the skyliner offer an amazing view, but wonder why Disney hasn't explored more ground-based options besides busing? Electric powered commuter trains, for example, would be a lot cheaper. And you could evacuate them so easily if needed. Or, think how many people would get a kick out enclosed, Jetson-style moving sidewalks between the resorts. They have them in airports, why not at Disney?

I know ground-based modes aren't fail safe, either, but they're cheaper to build and easier for people to be rescued when things go wrong...

I think monorail expansion is more expensive. More busses cheaper upfront but don’t know about operating costs for fuel, drivers, maintenance, accident liabilities etc. I think part of the motivation was to provide a new innovative (for Disney parks innovative) mode of transportation at WDW.

 

[Cynner]

This.

Also, some have commented earlier - why aren't we hearing from more people that had panic attacks, that went to the hospital, if people soiled themselves.

My guess? They've been told to stay quiet in case they pursue action.

Or just embarrassed!

 

[Tall Todd]

It's almost like most people are happy this happened. The "I told you so" community both here and on the blogosphere is astounding. I genuinely hope I'm never on an airplane with these people just in case they start rooting for the plane to go down.
As to those who say this is nothing like a ski resort system because it has multiple load points or turns or whatnot; Killington's gondola has a midpoint station where guests can enter or leave.

 

[Lewisc]

The toileting issues may not have happened. But there is photographic evidence as well as multiple eye witness reports of people being taken by ambulance. But I definitely agree that Disney will just quietly settle.

This.

.

My guess? They've been told to stay quiet in case they pursue action.

As long as we're guessing, my guess, they were taken to the hospital, were examined and released. As per HIPPA the hospital, and other health providers, wont be releasing any information.

 

[DisLiss]

Look no further than Disneyland Paris to see how well that's working out. They have been shut down indefinitely.

This indicates to me that there is a definite difference between transportation at a Disney park and transportation other places. I'm NOT blaming Disney guests for transportation woes by any means, I'm just saying maybe Disney needs to figure out why they see a form of transportation that works well in other public venues, but when they try to incorporate the same style transportation in their parks they have issues. I'm likewise NOT blaming Disney for the transportation issues. I'm just thinking it's something worth thinking about. Is it simply the sheer number of people, or does it have more to do with the actual location of a theme park or resort? I don't know. I just wonder.

 

[mshanson3121]

Yet no first hand reports from those directly affected. .

Which, if you went back to my original comment - I addressed that

 

[mshanson3121]

Or just embarrassed!

True. I certainly wouldn't be going around announcing I had to use the bathroom in front of other people.

 

[Lewisc]

It's almost like menu people are happy this happened. The "I told you so" community both here and on the blogosphere is astounding. I genuinely hope I'm never on an airplane with these people just in case they start rooting for the plane to go down.
As to those who say this is nothing like a ski resort system because it has multiple load points or turns or whatnot; Killington's gondola has a midpoint station where guests can enter or leave.

Agreed. The difference is with the number of scooters and strollers.

 

[cakebaker]

It's almost like menu people are happy this happened. The "I told you so" community both here and on the blogosphere is astounding. I genuinely hope I'm never on an airplane with these people just in case they start rooting for the plane to go down.
As to those who say this is nothing like a ski resort system because it has multiple load points or turns or whatnot; Killington's gondola has a midpoint station where guests can enter or leave.

Not almost like it, exactly like it. One poster here even said they were pleased that it happened.