Experienced Dog Owners: I Need Advice

[jrmasm]

We had guinea pigs and a rat terrier with no issue using a cage like this with a cover:

http://www.guineapigcages.com/howto.htm

Once the terrier realized she couldn't get to them, she ignored them.

 

[mousefan73]

Another story...

My coworker has two cats and a few years ago introduced a retriever puppy to the mix. The puppy was very curious with the cats and bugged them and one day the cats just basically beat him up. The dog learned to respect them and the dog and the cats now live in harmony. But, about a month ago, my coworker's son's girlfriend (if you can believe this) decided to "gift" her boyfriend (who still lives at home after getting out of the military) with a German Shepherd rescue. This dog is a mess. The cats went fleeing and actually ran upstairs and lost control of their bowels over this dog. The cats have remained terrified for a month and have been sequestered upstairs. It's a bad situation and my coworker, who is very nice and IMO being taken advantage of is putting up with this. I couldn't manage it.

This story is just a sad example of how people are simply idiots when it comes to getting dogs. I’m sick of hearing stories of people who work full-time and are out of the 13 hours a day decide to get a shelter dogs who needs attention or an active dog that needs to be walked often. It’s almost selfish. Being out of the house the entire day I’m talking a long day. For those few hours of joy for you in the evening your dog puts up with a whole day of nothing. I am not against people who work having dogs but I’ve heard so many stories. Sure it works ifYou have a large fenced in yard where the dog can hang out in all day or you got a walker. But just simply leaving a dog in a cage for 13 hours in a cage is abuse. Or people who bring another pet with stetchy backgrounds into a house full of other pets. Especially a German Shepherd. It’s a great breed but you have to know what you’re doing. I see in these cases that simple common sense just does not exist

 

[Christine]

This story is just a sad example of how people are simply idiots when it comes to getting dogs. I’m sick of hearing stories of people who work full-time and are out of the 13 hours a day decide to get a shelter dogs who needs attention or an active dog that needs to be walked often. It’s almost selfish. Being out of the house the entire day I’m talking a long day. For those few hours of joy for you in the evening your dog puts up with a whole day of nothing. I am not against people who work having dogs but I’ve heard so many stories. Sure it works ifYou have a large fenced in yard where the dog can hang out in all day or you got a walker. But just simply leaving a dog in a cage for 13 hours in a cage is abuse. Or people who bring another pet with stetchy backgrounds into a house full of other pets. Especially a German Shepherd. It’s a great breed but you have to know what you’re doing. I see in these cases that simple common sense just does not exist

Yes, I agree. Fortunately my coworker is doing all that he can to mitigate the German Shepherd/cat issue while his son still lives there (he is moving out in 6 months). Apparently the shepherd is nice but needs to be an only dog.

As to your point about people working all day, I generally agree. However, if it's a choice between a dog being euthanized at a shelter or going to a home of a working couple, I'll vote for the working couple. That's what we did with our last dog and it was fine. In my current situation, these dogs that I'm looking at that are with the rescue will never be euthanized by them. They have two dogs there now that they've had for 4.5 years. I agree that they can probably find a better owner than me for most of their young dogs.

 

[LSUmiss]

Yes, I agree. Fortunately my coworker is doing all that he can to mitigate the German Shepherd/cat issue while his son still lives there (he is moving out in 6 months). Apparently the shepherd is nice but needs to be an only dog.

As to your point about people working all day, I generally agree. However, if it's a choice between a dog being euthanized at a shelter or going to a home of a working couple, I'll vote for the working couple. That's what we did with our last dog and it was fine. In my current situation, these dogs that I'm looking at that are with the rescue will never be euthanized by them. They have two dogs there now that they've had for 4.5 years. I agree that they can probably find a better owner than me for most of their young dogs.

I don’t work 13 hours. But, my dogs are in the kennel about 9 hours a day on week days, but I’ve stayed home with them & they literally do the same thing whether I’m there or not...sleep all day! The only reason I put them in the kennel at all is for their own safety.

 

[mousefan73]

I don’t work 13 hours. But, my dogs are in the kennel about 9 hours a day on week days, but I’ve stayed home with them & they literally do the same thing whether I’m there or not...sleep all day! The only reason I put them in the kennel at all is for their own safety.

Curious what breed you have. It depends on the dog. Some breeds would go crazy and need more action. My friend’s dog sleeps in her bed ALL DAY long. Burrows and is gone. Whippet mix

 

[LSUmiss]

Curious what breed you have. It depends on the dog. Some breeds would go crazy and need more action. My friend’s dog sleeps in her bed ALL DAY long. Burrows and is gone. Whippet mix

No I agree. I almost added that. I have a dachshund & a golden. The Golden is the laziest dog I’ve ever had. You would think he’s 10 by the way he acts, but he’s not even 2! He’s always been laid back even as a puppy. I have had dachshunds for almost 20 years now & they all seem to sleep most of the time. They both like to play, but sleep for about 18 hours a day.

 

[jsmith]

The pet overpopulation situation in our country is a national disgrace.

The bad guy here isn't the well-intended person trying to rescue a dog! It's the person who was responsible for this young homeless dog in the first place!

I see many shelters and rescues raising LOTS of money to help dogs who find themselves in HORRENDOUS living conditions and suffering neglect and abuse. But we, as a nation, really need to be pushing things like spaying and neutering, education in the proper care of pets, regular veterinary care and help for those who can't afford it, reporting neglect and abuse, etc. Right now it's just a free-for-all and too many pets are suffering and being euthanized daily due to lack of a home and to make more room in shelters. It's sickening.

I agree with the above poster that not all dogs, and not all rescues, are stable dogs. I understand the desire to save and help them. But if they show themselves to be unstable, it may be a kindness to give them a humane death, because these are the types of dogs that are either going to wind up in abuse situations again, or doing damage to other pets or humans. I hate that this is the case, and wish every dog born could be stable AND have a loving home. But it is a difficult issue because everyone has their own ideas about pet ownership and you simply can't force others to be good pet parents.

Oops posted the quote and then didn't type my message. Neglect and abuse are definitely a thing. Pet over population however is not really the issue it seems. Definitely a problem in some areas however according to the USDA we as a country imported, from other nations in 2015 350,000 estray dogs-and that's just the ones that got reported. Colorado imported 17500 in 2017. If we have such a hugeeeeeeeeeeee issue in this country why the giant number of imports? and there are "rescues" that are now paying breeders to produce mixed breed puppies for rescue. and Retail rescue is a HUGE money pit. address those issues is as important as fixing neglect and abuse partly because it feeds the puppy mill issues.
We need to be extremely careful about how we legislate things like mandantory spay and neuter laws. While there are many many dogs that should be sexually altered and not allowed to reproduce legislating it reachs out to all dogs. If we sexually alter all dogs at somepoint they become extinct. Punishing all because of the wrongs done by some is not the answer. Teaching responsible pet ownership its very important and assisting with vet care for those who can not afford it is as well. Its a delicate balancing act but legisilation is not the answer because most legislation is too broad.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Oops posted the quote and then didn't type my message. Neglect and abuse are definitely a thing. Pet over population however is not really the issue it seems. Definitely a problem in some areas however according to the USDA we as a country imported, from other nations in 2015 350,000 estray dogs-and that's just the ones that got reported. Colorado imported 17500 in 2017. If we have such a hugeeeeeeeeeeee issue in this country why the giant number of imports? and there are "rescues" that are now paying breeders to produce mixed breed puppies for rescue. and Retail rescue is a HUGE money pit. address those issues is as important as fixing neglect and abuse partly because it feeds the puppy mill issues.
We need to be extremely careful about how we legislate things like mandantory spay and neuter laws. While there are many many dogs that should be sexually altered and not allowed to reproduce legislating it reachs out to all dogs. If we sexually alter all dogs at somepoint they become extinct. Punishing all because of the wrongs done by some is not the answer. Teaching responsible pet ownership its very important and assisting with vet care for those who can not afford it is as well. Its a delicate balancing act but legisilation is not the answer because most legislation is too broad.

I never said anything about mandatory spaying and neutering laws; that wasn't what I meant. I meant it as educational - in your face educational. The vast majority of dogs should be spayed and neutered. What I see is that many people don't do that, then dogs that should not be procreating, are. I do not believe that well-bred purebred dogs should become extinct.

I do think that there are a lot of people out there now who want to help somehow with the horrendous conditions they see in other countries so they are working to import dogs and find them homes here. Or trying to rehabilitate unstable dogs and putting them out in the community. This is part of what I was saying when I said free-for-all.

I would like to see some links for your numbers in the first part of your post, as those seem like an awful lot.

The numbers I would really like to see are how many pets are euthanized DAILY in the U.S. simply because they do not have homes. I absolutely believe we have a pet overpopulation problem, and that it's shameful. There is also a lot of ignorance about pet ownership with people leaving their pets in cruel conditions and not feeding them properly or getting them medical care, etc. Individual states have laws about how pets must be humanely kept, but few know what their laws actually state.

I don't think pets are the same as children, but I know I care for mine in a pretty similar way. I also know that it's the law in my state to provide food, shelter, medical care, and humane living conditions to pets. Sometimes there are gray areas when pets are kept outside alone with little care, feeding and shelter. I'm not really sure why anyone would want a pet who's kept that way, it can't be very fulfilling. Dogs crave being part of a pack and are at their best when part of a group.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

From the ASPCA:

Each year, approximately 1.5 million shelter animals are euthanized (670,000 dogs and 860,000 cats). [I suspect these numbers might actually be higher.]

According to the ASPCA’s National Rehoming Survey, pet problems are the most common reason that owners rehome their pet, accounting for 47% of rehomed dogs and 42% of rehomed cats. Pet problems were defined as problematic behaviors, aggressive behaviors, grew larger than expected, or health problems owner couldn’t handle.

https://www.aspca.org/animal-homelessness/shelter-intake-and-surrender/pet-statistics.

I think comprehensive educational programs for spay and neuter and how to avoid problem behavior would go a long way to reducing some of these numbers.

 

[MrsCobraBubbles]

Thanks. I think I'm done for a while.

This rescue does seem good. They seem to do very well with vetting out the older dogs. They've been very upfront about the various issues of the older dogs; hence, why I haven't been able to find one in weeks. For the puppies, they know less. All I know is that this one was a stray, picked up in rural southern Virginia just last week. No one claimed her and she was sent up here. So no history and she had not yet been fostered. A lot of the older puppies do end up getting pulled into foster and maybe someone will do that with her.

Right now, though, I feel like the worst person ever. I hope I'm being overly dramatic but all I can think about is how I must have confused that poor dog.

You are a wonderful person for wanting to give a rescue a chance! I know it's hard to give the dog back but it sounds like you did the right thing.

Aside from a personal protection dog that we had when I was a kid, I have only ever owned rescue/adopted dogs. I used to work for a dog trainer (so I have experience with training pet dogs, show dogs, and police dogs) and in my experience, rescuing/adopting an adult dog is often just taking on someone else's problem. I absolutely loved the 2 adult rescue dogs that I have owned in my adult life, but they were a mess! Both had severe separation anxiety, were improperly trained and rather set in their ways so it was much harder to get them trained, one of them had significant health problems that weren't disclosed at the time of adoption and required us to make lifestyle changes and shell out a lot of money to properly manage his health.

Adopting is great and I do hope you decide to try again once your heart has healed from this, but maybe next you could try adopting a puppy? That way the little guy can grow up with your guinea pig and maybe learn to see him as a friend. I prefer adult dogs to puppies, but with your special circumstances it sounds like a puppy would be better for you. I agree with others that doing research into breed traits is important but prey drive is often subjective to the animal--my last dog was a beagle with zero prey drive. I swear he made friends with the mole that used to sneak in through our sun room and steal dog food from his bowl, they used to touch noses and sniff each other and my dog never once tried to attack it, darn him. The only things my adorable little dummy would attack was snakes, which actually don't bother me as long as they stay outside of the house, but he ignored the hordes of rabbits, squirrels, chipmunks, groundhogs, and moles that tried to destroy my garden! So anyway, keep trying, I know you'll find a wonderful dog that fits in your family!

 

[Dancind]

Will add one thing. We have a house in another state that we plan to move to eventually. Daughter lives in the basement, renters on the main floor. Had a bit of trouble finding someone willing to share space (it is separated) so agreed to rent to a couple with a 60 pound rescue dog, a mix with some pit in it. Not really well trained. Anyway, turns out they both work two jobs so dog is alone 12 hours a day and barks incessantly. Daughter puts up with it but our poor neighbors! It's been a PITA.

 

[Christine]

We had guinea pigs and a rat terrier with no issue using a cage like this with a cover:

http://www.guineapigcages.com/howto.htm

Once the terrier realized she couldn't get to them, she ignored them.

Isn't a rat terrier really small? I have a similar cage set up as in your link. It's a playpen style, sitting up on an elevated table and is kind of in an octagon shape, 3 feet or more across. This dog could literally push the sides in/over just buy her weight/force. I have a much sturdier, lock style cage but it is pretty small.

 

[Christine]

Curious what breed you have. It depends on the dog. Some breeds would go crazy and need more action. My friend’s dog sleeps in her bed ALL DAY long. Burrows and is gone. Whippet mix

Oh, I've heard they are super lazy (whippets). Greyhounds also which is why they were on my list.

 

[mousefan73]

Oh, I've heard they are super lazy (whippets). Greyhounds also which is why they were on my list.

she post all the time her dog.. EVERY picture he's either on the couch sleeping, in bed sleeping, or tucked in like a human in bed. I think he chases squirrels though. might need to look into that.

 

[jsmith]

Curious what breed you have. It depends on the dog. Some breeds would go crazy and need more action. My friend’s dog sleeps in her bed ALL DAY long. Burrows and is gone. Whippet mix

It depends not just on the dog but also what they do when you are home-sitting on the couch loving on a dog that was crated all day doesn't usually work well. I do crate my dogs when I am not home-but we go home for a hour every day at lunch so they spend about 4 hours crate time then get an hour of training/exercise depending on the weather and what we are prepping for-that can be anything from tossing a ball to cavaletti work and jogging with a bike or playing in the snow. 4 more hours crated then we are home. week night classes can include a hour and a half of agility training, or obedience, rally or scentwork. So they get plenty of mental stimulation and are lean and fit despite the fact that I work outside the home full time. I realize this schedule would not work for everyone but there are still ways to manage a mentally fit and healthy dog while crating them for safety when they are unsupervised.

I never said anything about mandatory spaying and neutering laws; that wasn't what I meant. I meant it as educational - in your face educational. The vast majority of dogs should be spayed and neutered. What I see is that many people don't do that, then dogs that should not be procreating, are. I do not believe that well-bred purebred dogs should become extinct.

I do think that there are a lot of people out there now who want to help somehow with the horrendous conditions they see in other countries so they are working to import dogs and find them homes here. Or trying to rehabilitate unstable dogs and putting them out in the community. This is part of what I was saying when I said free-for-all.

I would like to see some links for your numbers in the first part of your post, as those seem like an awful lot.

The numbers I would really like to see are how many pets are euthanized DAILY in the U.S. simply because they do not have homes. I absolutely believe we have a pet overpopulation problem, and that it's shameful. There is also a lot of ignorance about pet ownership with people leaving their pets in cruel conditions and not feeding them properly or getting them medical care, etc. Individual states have laws about how pets must be humanely kept, but few know what their laws actually state.

I don't think pets are the same as children, but I know I care for mine in a pretty similar way. I also know that it's the law in my state to provide food, shelter, medical care, and humane living conditions to pets. Sometimes there are gray areas when pets are kept outside alone with little care, feeding and shelter. I'm not really sure why anyone would want a pet who's kept that way, it can't be very fulfilling. Dogs crave being part of a pack and are at their best when part of a group.

The computer I am currently using doesn't allow posting links but I did some additional research since you thought I was high-actually its possible that those numbers are low. I saw an article-link to come-quoting a large shelter in the northeast that put that number at over a million, mostly smaller dogs while larger breed dogs in the US are euthanized. The figure for the number of Dogs imported to Colorado came from meeting minutes from a Kennel Club federation meeting.
I agree with you about the free for all-between retail rescue and the AR groups ( PETA, HSUS, and to some lesser extent ASPCA) who euthanize dogs and cats simply because it fits their agenda I don't really think we have any kind of a good handle on either then numbers of rescue's imported or the number of actually homeless dogs that are put down simply because kill shelters get full.
Owning a 'rescue' is also kind of a statement that has nothing to do with anything except it is becoming the thing do to. There is a a promenant weather personality at one of the Denver TV stations who has been known to brag about her 'rescued' Bernese. It was 'rescued' from a responsible breeder who places her puppies with great care, and who was devastated by the suggestion the dog needed to be 'rescued"

 

[jrmasm]

Isn't a rat terrier really small? I have a similar cage set up as in your link. It's a playpen style, sitting up on an elevated table and is kind of in an octagon shape, 3 feet or more across. This dog could literally push the sides in/over just buy her weight/force. I have a much sturdier, lock style cage but it is pretty small.

Yes, small but bred to kill vermin. And very high prey drive. Terriers also have attitudes much larger than their physical size.

 

[Christine]

Yes, small but bred to kill vermin. And very high prey drive. Terriers also have attitudes much larger than their physical size.

You're not kidding! I had a JRT that was just full of attitude (12 lbs).

 

[portocall]

I had a bird and two indoor cats. The bird was not something I wanted at all but my 2 year old son went to Grandma's house and came home with it so we kept it. In a bathroom by itself to protect it from the cats. Then one day we came home to find someone forgot to close the door and the cage was on the floor without the bird and feathers everywhere. We thought they killed her but we found her under the entertainment center when we had two cats suddenly very interested in watching television. We ended up hanging the bird from the ceiling and everything settled down.

Now I know your post was about dogs and we have a beagle who is about to have two hampsters. I didn't consider his prey instinct when I okayed having two hampsters but our beagle is 12. His best friend was a cat until she died a few months ago so he has successfully dealt with other species so you have me thinking. Where can we hide away our hampters so they don't feel isolated but don't get eaten. I'll figure it out but I am glad you posted this because I didn't give it the consideration it deserved.

I'm sorry you are hearbroken. Don't give up though. I'm sure the perfect dog is out there for you.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

^ Here is our ferocious terrier - who was bred to kill vermin - with our hamster.

We had all we could do to keep him from attacking!

 

[Pea-n-Me]

We are a little sad tonight after just discovering our little friend has a tumor.
It's too bad they have such a short lifespan. (Around two years.)
He is a shy, but good little guy.