Got this email from David's. Can you help me navigate?

[Friendlyadvice2]

In the other thread on this matter, the Owner
was NOT paid the 30% as promised even though it was in writing and promised.

Do you have a link for this so I can review the details for the particular reservation? I find it highly unlikely that since the DVC resorts opened back up and if the owner has not compromised the reservation in any way, that the owners are not being paid the final 30%. In fact, I've communicated with several that have been paid as expected. I'd certainly like to review the details of any member that has not been paid since the resorts reopened.

 

[Best Aunt]

Do you have a link for this so I can review the details for the particular reservation? I find it highly unlikely that since the DVC resorts opened back up and if the owner has not compromised the reservation in any way, that the owners are not being paid the final 30%. In fact, I've communicated with several that have been paid as expected. I'd certainly like to review the details of any member that has not been paid since the resorts reopened.

Here is the link to the big thread:
https://www.disboards.com/threads/davids-dvc-rental-reimbursement-or-rescheduling.3796922/
If you read the early posts, the company was not treating owners well. That may have changed over time but was certainly the early tone.

 

[Friendlyadvice2]

Here is the link to the big thread:
https://www.disboards.com/threads/davids-dvc-rental-reimbursement-or-rescheduling.3796922/
If you read the early posts, the company was not treating owners well. That may have changed over time but was certainly the early tone.

Thanks, I'm quite familiar with that thread. However, now that the DVC resorts are open, I have not read of anyone not getting paid their 30% when their guests check in and that is what I want to review and understand, if it in fact has occurred.

 

[Yinn]

I recently got the email below from David's. I had kind of stopped reading the posts about what was going on once I knew WDW was reopening and I knew my guests would have a place to stay. Now it seems they don't want to come.

Can you please take a look at the email and let me know the pros and cons to doing this for them? My UY is September and these are 2019 points, so it would need to be for a reservation for the same dates, correct? I did ask them if it would be for the same dates and if I would be required to sign a new contract. I just want to make sure that I know everything I can before I agree to doing this. Here is the email:

The XXXXX family has contacted us in reference to the Animal Kingdom reservation (#XXXXXXX for the dates of August 17-22, 2020). Regrettably due to concerns over COVID-19, the guests are unable to travel come August 17, 2020

As you’re aware, we have a no cancellation policy, but given the situation we wanted to reach out and see if you would consider making an exception and be willing to change the names on the reservation to a new family?

If you are willing to make the modification, our office will handle searching for a new family to take the Animal Kingdom: 2-bedroom Standard View reservation as it is currently booked. Once we have a new family for the stay, it would require a phone call from you into Member Services to update the guest list on this reservation.

Please note that the choice to make the modification, or to not make the modification, does not affect your final payment. You will still receive the final 30% on the date that these guests are scheduled to check in. However, if we can find another family to take over this reservation and you are successful in modifying the guest list, David would like to pass along a sign of appreciation by paying you another $2.00 per point to thank you for your assistance ($360.00)

At your convenience, please let me know if you would be willing to make this exception and modify the XXXXX families reservation. If you have any questions, please let us know.

We look forward to hearing from you!
Sincerely,
Nicholas Robbins
David’s Vacation Club Rentals
Toll Free: (800) 610-5791
http://www.dvcrequest.com
www.facebook.com/dvcRentals
https://www.pinterest.com/dvcrentals/
#dvcrentals

Careful, I got a similar one and turned it down.

They required me to hold the reservation through - meaning I had to lose the points in order to get the remaining 30%. Didn't matter that the renter wasn't going to go. If you don't hold the reservation through, they'll ask you to return the 70% as you won't be fulfilling the contract. Even though the contract states that cancellations are in your favor and this would clearly be a cancellation.

Basically they want to pressure you into renting it again. If you hold it through check in - and nobody checks in. They'll pay you the 30% but you'll lose the points. If you're going to lose the points anyway, you might as well re-rent it for an additional $2/pt.

 

[Friendlyadvice2]

Careful, I got a similar one and turned it down.

They required me to hold the reservation through - meaning I had to lose the points in order to get the remaining 30%. Didn't matter that the renter wasn't going to go. If you don't hold the reservation through, they'll ask you to return the 70% as you won't be fulfilling the contract. Even though the contract states that cancellations are in your favor and this would clearly be a cancellation.

Basically they want to pressure you into renting it again. If you hold it through check in - and nobody checks in. They'll pay you the 30% but you'll lose the points. If you're going to lose the points anyway, you might as well re-rent it for an additional $2/pt.

Maybe I'm misreading, but I don't understand your logic here. The moment you agreed to the rental contract in the first place with the initial renter and accepted the 70%, you essentially agree to "lose the points". Of course you have to keep the reservation active to get the remaining 30%; the reservation belongs to the renters, not you! I don't see them pressuring anybody into renting again. The choice is clearly yours; leave the reservation as is and get your 30% pursuant to what you agreed to or change the names on the reservation and get the additional $/pt for doing so. Either way, the points are gone.

IMO, if the initial renters don't want to go and they worked out a fair deal with David's if they can re-rent it, then I will absolutely do anything I can to to help them get out of the reservation, even if that means me adding new names to the existing reservation.

 

[Yinn]

Maybe I'm misreading, but I don't understand your logic here. The moment you agreed to the rental contract in the first place with the initial renter and accepted the 70%, you essentially agree to "lose the points". Of course you have to keep the reservation active to get the remaining 30%; the reservation belongs to the renters, not you! I don't see them pressuring anybody into renting again. The choice is clearly yours; leave the reservation as is and get your 30% pursuant to what you agreed to or change the names on the reservation and get the additional $/pt for doing so. Either way, the points are gone.

IMO, if the initial renters don't want to go and they worked out a fair deal with David's if they can re-rent it, then I will absolutely do anything I can to to help them get out of the reservation, even if that means me adding new names to the existing reservation.

I was promised 100% of what I'm owed even if the renter cancels. Quite frankly as a renter, I'd probably hold it just in case something changes it since I don't get money either way. The renter in this case is making an advanced request to cancel the reservation. Not to hold the reservation and they're a no show. They're requesting to go to member services and request to cancel it. Thereby forfeiting the reservation and as a result the points get returned.

As an owner, I would be grateful for such an act as I now have points to use instead of being wasted. So grateful in fact that I might be inclined (and have) asked David's to refund the renter as I now have my points. Separate story and reservation, but David's does NOT refund the renter the money despite me paying David's the money back to return.

That out of the way. The logic I then move on to is the same as David's. I didn't rent a reservation to David. I made a reservation to my renter. If those points "belonged" to the original renter and it was to hold it to the end, it should end there. (Although then we get into the whole - I should be refunded because I booked a reservation not points argument from park closures). But it doesn't end there, David's wants to use those points elsewhere. So then we're acknowledging the points DONT belong to the renter and that a reservation CAN be cancelled. More importantly, are eligible to be reallocated to another reservation. A brand new reservation that is paying an additional $19/pt. But instead of being paid a brand new reservation fee of $14.50/pt, I get....$2/pt.

Now, back to the paragraph before. IF, David's was doing this so they can make the original renter whole; fine. But my experience has not been the case. One of my renters never saw the money and they're in chargeback dispute as we speak. So if David's is going to double dip, no I don't want my points going to them to enable them to do so. If I did want to double dip, then I would want more than 10% of the pie.

 

[fancymouse]

But instead of being paid a brand new reservation fee of $14.50/pt, I get....$2/pt.

Now, back to the paragraph before. IF, David's was doing this so they can make the original renter whole; fine. But my experience has not been the case. One of my renters never saw the money and they're in chargeback dispute as we speak. So if David's is going to double dip, no I don't want my points going to them to enable them to do so. If I did want to double dip, then I would want more than 10% of the pie.

From what I can figure they aren't really double dipping as something has to pay for the voucher they are giving the renter who is cancelling. Considering this particular situation, the renter really has no option for a chargeback, so a voucher is more than they could hope for. The question is what money is backing the voucher they'll get?

I'm assuming money from the new rental is furnishing this in some way (maybe not directly, but in the general sense). I mean the crazy long David's thread speculated that they would go broke and there was no way they could survive paying their owners, paying for chargebacks, and supplying vouchers. To me it sounds like most people were in agreement that David's wasn't swimming in cash.

IMO I think they are still just trying to float funds around to cover what needs to be covered. Under normal circumstances I agree that it definitely looks like David's is making money twice on the same points, but I have a feeling that right now they have a lot more outstanding debts than they have new money coming in. Maybe I'm wrong

That being said, most recently I've seen reports that owners have been paid remaining balances when agreeing to re-rent and some people have already claimed their vouchers. Whether directly or indirectly, by agreeing to re-rent you are helping making renters whole while also getting the initial funds (and possibly more).

 

[Yinn]

From what I can figure they aren't really double dipping as something has to pay for the voucher they are giving the renter who is cancelling. Considering this particular situation, the renter really has no option for a chargeback, so a voucher is more than they could hope for. The question is what money is backing the voucher they'll get?

I'm assuming money from the new rental is furnishing this in some way (maybe not directly, but in the general sense). I mean the crazy long David's thread speculated that they would go broke and there was no way they could survive paying their owners, paying for chargebacks, and supplying vouchers. To me it sounds like most people were in agreement that David's wasn't swimming in cash.

IMO I think they are still just trying to float funds around to cover what needs to be covered. Under normal circumstances I agree that it definitely looks like David's is making money twice on the same points, but I have a feeling that right now they have a lot more outstanding debts than they have new money coming in. Maybe I'm wrong

That being said, most recently I've seen reports that owners have been paid remaining balances when agreeing to re-rent and some people have already claimed their vouchers. Whether directly or indirectly, by agreeing to re-rent you are helping making renters whole while also getting the initial funds (and possibly more).

There’s no way for me to know if a voucher is being provided to future owners. The vouchers I’ve seen on the other thread were all for closings. Unfortunately for me, between the 30% they owed me from one, and the money that I refunded and did t make it to my renters on another. I don’t have much reason to give them a benefit of the doubt on a third. That’s just my situation.

But under the assumption that they honor their end of everything, that’s certainly a valid way of looking at it. But then again if they honored everything on their end, I wouldn’t be in a position to doubt them.

Either way, my original warning wasnt about the vouchers. It’s that you might as well re-rent. The caution was that the points are gone either way. There’s no hope of using them on your own if someone was aiming for that. And if you’re losing the points anyway You might as well get the $2. It’s not much of a choice there. Perhaps I distracted from that with my initial statement

 

[cm8]

Do you have a link for this so I can review the details for the particular reservation? I find it highly unlikely that since the DVC resorts opened back up and if the owner has not compromised the reservation in any way, that the owners are not being paid the final 30%. In fact, I've communicated with several that have been paid as expected. I'd certainly like to review the details of any member that has not been paid since the resorts reopened.

Put it in the search function and it will come up.

 

[dclpluto]

If you look at the confirmed reservations for sale on his website, it is unbelievable how many there are. All renters who don’t want to make the trip to Disney and are trying to find someone to take over their reservations. Quite a few of these reservations are already discounted - hard to believe they all won’t be as the dates of checkin rapidly approach.

OP, I would say yes. If you do get new renters, you get more money. I just wouldn’t sign the new contract. But, the reality is that new renters probably won’t be found - there are just too many confirmed reservations on his website currently.

wow I just looked. Looks like a ton of people. Know some are scared, some can’t come from another country. Some from NY/NJ/CT that can’t come because of quarantine. Some lost jobs.

 

[connorlevismom]

I ended up saying I would rent to another family IF all I had to do was change the name on the reservation. I was not making a new reservation and I was NOT signing a new contract with them. They said that changing the name would be all I needed to do. We will see what happens.

I don't want to be a dink to the people who are trying to cancel their reservation, but also don't want to get screwed over either. It came down to karma for me.

So when the resorts were closed and the renters couldn't check-in, what did David's do that that 30% if it didn't give it to the owner and he also didn't return it to the renter? Did he just keep it?

 

[Sandisw]

I ended up saying I would rent to another family IF all I had to do was change the name on the reservation. I was not making a new reservation and I was NOT signing a new contract with them. They said that changing the name would be all I needed to do. We will see what happens.

I don't want to be a dink to the people who are trying to cancel their reservation, but also don't want to get screwed over either. It came down to karma for me.

So when the resorts were closed and the renters couldn't check-in, what did David's do that that 30% if it didn't give it to the owner and he also didn't return it to the renter? Did he just keep it?

He is using it to help fund his voucher system for renters.

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

So when the resorts were closed and the renters couldn't check-in, what did David's do that that 30% if it didn't give it to the owner and he also didn't return it to the renter? Did he just keep it?

 

[connorlevismom]

View attachment 509611

So he is either keeping it to fund his voucher system or he just kept it. Either way, it is not OK in my opinion. That money does not belong to him.

 

[Yinn]

So when the resorts were closed and the renters couldn't check-in, what did David's do that that 30% if it didn't give it to the owner and he also didn't return it to the renter? Did he just keep it?

Or the 70% he asked some folks return - both before and after vouchers were initiated. That didn’t go to the renter either.

There are owners who returned all monies paid. Luckily, I believe most got their points back. The renters weren’t as lucky imo. Even those who got the vouchers ended up needing to pay more for their future vacations.

 

[connorlevismom]

Or the 70% he asked some folks return - both before and after vouchers were initiated. That didn’t go to the renter either.

There are owners who returned all monies paid. Luckily, I believe most got their points back. The renters weren’t as lucky imo. Even those who got the vouchers ended up needing to pay more for their future vacations.

That is terrible and I will not be using them in the future. I cannot, in good faith, use a company that treats their customers this way.

 

[VivalaDisney]

So when the resorts were closed and the renters couldn't check-in, what did David's do that that 30% if it didn't give it to the owner and he also didn't return it to the renter? Did he just keep it?

Yes, he kept as much money as he could. For the reservation I had with him for March, the renters backed out before any closures were announced... and he kept the 30% plus his fee. He also kept the money for the reservation canceled due to closures.

 

[wishicouldgomoreofte]

Just be sure that the deal is under the terms of your original contract. The new one does not appear to be DVC owner friendly.

I read it. What is different other than the Force Majeure paragraph?

 

[wishicouldgomoreofte]

There’s another large rental agency that had almost 1500 the last time I checked.

Are you able to name the company?

 

[wishicouldgomoreofte]

I would only do it if he agreed to use the original terms from the "old" owners contract not the new one. The new terms can come back and bite you.

How? All I see is the Force Majeure paragraph. Is there something more?