Help! DCL says my plans violate Pass Vessel act

[Disneypeach]

I’ve booked b2b Wonder 5 night San Diego to Vancouver followed by first Hawaii cruise.
I’m no expert on this law but I don’t understand how the combo could violate the passanger vessel act. The first cruise ends in a foreign in port and the second starts in a foreign port.
DCL let me book them but have told my TA that I can’t do it this way.
What am I missing here?
thanks

 

[bcwife76]

Because technically you begin and end in a US port. On paper your cruise is San Diego to Honolulu, which is not allowed.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

I’ve booked b2b Wonder 5 night San Diego to Vancouver followed by first Hawaii cruise.
I’m no expert on this law but I don’t understand how the combo could violate the passanger vessel act. The first cruise ends in a foreign in port and the second starts in a foreign port.
DCL let me book them but have told my TA that I can’t do it this way.
What am I missing here?
thanks

As noted, the PVSA says that a foreign-flagged ship cannot transport passengers from one US port to a different US port without a stop in a DISTANT foreign port. A distant foreign port is, basically, any port NOT in North America.

While each of those cruises is legal by itself, combining them makes your cruise from San Diego to Honolulu. And no distant foreign port is visited during either cruise. So it's illegal.

Now, if you were to get off the ship in Vancouver and get on a different ship to Hawaii, that would be legal.

 

[Disneypeach]

Thanks all.
I thought since it “Stopped” in Vancouver it would be thought of as separate things.
DCL rep just explained to me that if I had called in instead of booking online they would have been able to tell me immediately that it wouldn’t work but the online system doesn’t know.
oh well, I cancelled the 5 night to keep my Hawaii cruise.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

Thanks all.
I thought since it “Stopped” in Vancouver it would be thought of as separate things.
DCL rep just explained to me that if I had called in instead of booking online they would have been able to tell me immediately that it wouldn’t work but the online system doesn’t know.
oh well, I cancelled the 5 night to keep my Hawaii cruise.

That was the issue before when DCL did the Hawaii cruise following her Seattle/Vancouver repo several years ago. That's when DCL learned that the PVSA doesn't allow such cruises.

The law only looks at where a passenger got on a ship and where that passenger got off that same ship, regardless if it's sold as separate cruises.

 

[MotherKnowsBest]

So could you do San Diego to Vancouver, and then both Hawaiian cruises? Or is that still not allowed?

 

[Sakura1017]

If your on the hawaii Facebook groups, it has been mentioned many times that you cannot book a san diego cruise before going on the Hawaii. This was also the issue with the 2020 cruises and that was also heavily discussed. I know it's more convenient if you live in San Diego, and was hoping to avoid airfare, but unfortunately Disney won't let that happen.

 

[Sakura1017]

So could you do San Diego to Vancouver, and then both Hawaiian cruises? Or is that still not allowed?

You can do San Diego to Vancouver by itself. You cannot do San Diego to Vancouver and then Van Couver to Hawaii.
But you can do Van Couver to Hawaii then Hawaii back to Vancouver.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

So could you do San Diego to Vancouver, and then both Hawaiian cruises? Or is that still not allowed?

Yes, it would be legal to do B2B2B SD/Vancouver; Vancouver/Hawaii; Hawaii/Vancouver.

DCL didn't allow that last time, but I think it was an overabundance of caution on their part. They got burned with the repo/Hawaii cruise PVSA deal in 2020 and they just decided that adding the next Hawaii (back to Vancouver) would still be illegal.

Whether they would do it now or not, no one knows until someone tries.

 

[Disneypeach]

So could you do San Diego to Vancouver, and then both Hawaiian cruises? Or is that still not allowed?

This is what I tried to do....b2b Hawaii with the 5 night in front of it but they said no to my plan. So I guess they are still super cautious...

 

[lilsonicfan]

This is what I tried to do....b2b Hawaii with the 5 night in front of it but they said no to my plan. So I guess they are still super cautious...

I guess they are concerned that someone in that position might cancel the last leg (the 2nd part of the B2B Hawaii) and thus be in violation of the Act. So in that case, better to err on the side of caution and not allow the first part at all.

 

[Disneypeach]

I guess they are concerned that someone in that position might cancel the last leg (the 2nd part of the B2B Hawaii) and thus be in violation of the Act. So in that case, better to err on the side of caution and not allow the first part at all.

I think you are exactly right...they don’t want the headache of trying to keep up with that aspect.
Oh well, more money for excursions.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

never mind. Mis-read post.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

I guess they are concerned that someone in that position might cancel the last leg (the 2nd part of the B2B Hawaii) and thus be in violation of the Act. So in that case, better to err on the side of caution and not allow the first part at all.

It is legal to book all 3 cruises. But whether DCL will do it - that's their call. If someone booked all 3, then canceled the 3rd cruise (Hawaii/Vancouver) at a later date, the system should flag the remaining cruises as illegal. But, it appears that booking the repo with the Hawaii cruise following is not bookable online, you must do so on the phone (with a real person). So maybe, the DCL computer system hasn't been set up to automatically flag those types of B2Bs.

 

[MotherKnowsBest]

This is what I tried to do....b2b Hawaii with the 5 night in front of it but they said no to my plan. So I guess they are still super cautious...

Oh I didn't realize you had booked the three cruises in a row. I was just curious as to whether that was allowed or not.

 

[LoveMickey]

BTW - it is called the Jones Law or the Jones Act. Was enacted after WW 1

 

[lanejudy]

The Jones Act (or Section 27 of the Merchant Marine Act of 1920) pertains to cargo vessels.
The Passenger Vessel Services Act of 1886 (or PVSA) pertains to passenger vessels (cruise ships).

 

[PrincessShmoo]

The Jones Act (or Section 27 of the Merchant Marine Act of 1920) pertains to cargo vessels.
The Passenger Vessel Services Act of 1886 (or PVSA) pertains to passenger vessels (cruise ships).

 

[mousefan73]

Because technically you begin and end in a US port. On paper your cruise is San Diego to Honolulu, which is not allowed.

See this is not what I get.. Technically they are two separate reservations.. you check in and check out.. AND check back in.. You are disembarking in YVR.. So you re techincally starting a cruise in a foreign port??

edit: saw the thing about the "distant" thing... I really see no point in this "law" its not like its affecting any market balances.

 

[Disneypeach]

See this is not what I get.. Technically they are two separate reservations.. you check in and check out.. AND check back in.. You are disembarking in YVR.. So you re techincally starting a cruise in a foreign port??

Yes, but I guess there’s a chance that I’ll disembark in Hawaii without going back to Vancouver and DCL would be on the hook for a “potential“ violation so they choose to not allow it...