Idea to improve DAS

[Vidia2]

I highly doubt judges in a court of law are randomly looking into this whatsoever. I was assuming you meant someone was actually checking into this legally. Before a judge even sees it someone has to gather information to present a case.

There are attorneys looking into it but judges will ultimately decide.

The law isn't based on opinion, but precedent weighs very heavily, fortunately.

These legal issues aren't really my concern but it's interesting to watch, in contrast to all of the internet "experts".

I'm happy with the new system or the old system. There will be complaints from the same people here (the anti-gac crowd) once they figure out that the new system isn't actually doing anything to shorten the standby line, unless you're listening to the accounts of some disgruntled castmembers.

It's all just talk here and has nothing to do with why there were changes made or why there will be more. It makes no difference whatsoever how many times these points get argued.

 

[Schmeck]

One precedent set by the courts in California is the Segway issue - a very strong judgement for Disney and the access they have to provide.

 

[cmwade77]

The GAC was not an accommodation. It was a tool used by CMs at the attractions so that a guest would not have to explain an issue over and over again, and the CM would not have to make a judgement call.

Please show me the link to the legal precedent? If anything, the 'unlimited FP'-like access was in violation of the ADA, because it offered a group, based on a disability, to benefit from a privilege not afforded to the general public. That's illegal, according to the ADA.

No, actually that's not illegal, but when it's a benefit not afforded to the general public, they can ask for proof, as long as there is another system in place that provides the same level of access as other guests could get.

Technically, Disney could keep the DAS in place and bring back the GAC with unlimited FPs and require proof for it. The problem is many people on all sides of the issue would find this unfair and as stated before, there will be many doctors who would simply write a note, even if the person didn't need it. Please note I am NOT in favor of doing this, nor do I think that Disney would ever consider it. I am simply pointing out that this would most likely be legal to do.

 

[Vidia2]

This discussion is pointless . The people with disabilties that feel a sense of entiltement are only looking for support to "feel good " about using their disabilty to gain an unfair advantage! The GAS is here to stay . Sorry to disappoint.

No one with a handicapped family member is expecting to find support on this forum. Many of us are happy to work within whatever system Disney presents.

 

[mistysue]

You have to carry proof to park in a handicap parking space?

It is a GIANT step to go from getting a sign to hang on your car mirror to every person with any disability carrying around papers to prove their condition all the time. Nazi Germany anyone?

Unless everybody carried around medical papers all the time then in this particular case we are also looking at people not bringing something because they don't know. How does that work when somebody paralyzed in a wheelchair can't use the accessible vehicle because they don't have a sheet of paper? Meanwhile random pediatrician writes Mrs. X a note that all of her kids can't wait in line so they get a special pass?

Disabilities (non-physical especially) are not as cut and dry as people want them to be. There are not huge lines we can draw to say something like autistic= needs assistance, not autistic = no assistance. There are many people who even get contradicting diagnoses from doctors. I had a 9 year old who couldn't say the alphabet, use a phone or have a conversation more than 2 lines long... but my pediatrician said she was fine (pediatrician shortage in the area, I'm not just a moron). It took years of trying to get her into specialists and getting brain scans to get somebody to step back and say "hey, something is going on here" I think it's fabulous that as a society we have arranged that people can work on face value of "tell me your needs, not what you have been titled."
It makes little sense to assume that every person issued a DAS needs every full accommodation, just like it makes little sense to assume every person without one is in top notch health with a perfect life and no obstacles. (sign me up for that plan!) A papers/no papers system relies on the idea that assistance would be a yes/no- rather than meeting specific needs issue.

 

[Schmeck]

No, actually that's not illegal, but when it's a benefit not afforded to the general public, they can ask for proof, as long as there is another system in place that provides the same level of access as other guests could get.

Technically, Disney could keep the DAS in place and bring back the GAC with unlimited FPs and require proof for it. The problem is many people on all sides of the issue would find this unfair and as stated before, there will be many doctors who would simply write a note, even if the person didn't need it. Please note I am NOT in favor of doing this, nor do I think that Disney would ever consider it. I am simply pointing out that this would most likely be legal to do.

I agree that one would need proof - but as it stands at Disney now, they will not ask for proof so it was illegal to offer superior access. I also think there is some requirement that the experience presents as diminished because of the disability (like a large percent of the attraction is inaccessible?) in order to require the proof. I'll try to find that part and will post a link if I find it.

 

[AndreaA]

This discussion is pointless . The people with disabilties that feel a sense of entiltement are only looking for support to "feel good " about using their disabilty to gain an unfair advantage!
The GAS is here to stay .
Sorry to disappoint.

Why are you coming into this thread late and outing this insulting nonsense? Have you even read the rest of the thread? It has been a quite pleasant discussion/debate on ways to improve the current DAS system, because it is currently not working very well.

There has been no argument made for reverting to the GAC. The GAC has only been mentioned because someone said that legally it would have been tough for Disney to start off giving, say, immediate access if the line is less than 30min. (As opposed to the current 10) and then switch to ten minutes, while going from ten to thirty would be easy. Someone then just happened to wonder why the same legal problem didn't apply to the old GAC and whether that is the basis for the current class action lawsuit. No one has said that there should be a return to that system.

It is a GIANT step to go from getting a sign to hang on your car mirror to every person with any disability carrying around papers to prove their condition all the time. Nazi Germany anyone?

Ah, Godwin's Law rears it's head!

Other countries already follow that system as has been mentioned on this board before. I don't think we will ever go to that system here in the US, but it's hardly a throwback to Nazi Germany.

 

[richflour]

It is a GIANT step to go from getting a sign to hang on your car mirror to every person with any disability carrying around papers to prove their condition all the time. Nazi Germany anyone?

Unless everybody carried around medical papers all the time then in this particular case we are also looking at people not bringing something because they don't know. How does that work when somebody paralyzed in a wheelchair can't use the accessible vehicle because they don't have a sheet of paper? Meanwhile random pediatrician writes Mrs. X a note that all of her kids can't wait in line so they get a special pass?

Disabilities (non-physical especially) are not as cut and dry as people want them to be. There are not huge lines we can draw to say something like autistic= needs assistance, not autistic = no assistance. There are many people who even get contradicting diagnoses from doctors. I had a 9 year old who couldn't say the alphabet, use a phone or have a conversation more than 2 lines long... but my pediatrician said she was fine (pediatrician shortage in the area, I'm not just a moron). It took years of trying to get her into specialists and getting brain scans to get somebody to step back and say "hey, something is going on here" I think it's fabulous that as a society we have arranged that people can work on face value of "tell me your needs, not what you have been titled."
It makes little sense to assume that every person issued a DAS needs every full accommodation, just like it makes little sense to assume every person without one is in top notch health with a perfect life and no obstacles. (sign me up for that plan!) A papers/no papers system relies on the idea that assistance would be a yes/no- rather than meeting specific needs issue.

Im sorry but being a responsible caregiver for my son that has/is : wheelchair bound / vent and oxogen dependent / seizure disorder , hypothyroidism , gerd / spinal rod placement , club feet , cleft palet and moibius syndrome.
I Always carry around a summery of his health conditions/medication records in case of emergency.
No not nazi germany its called being responsible.

 

[Schmeck]

Why are you coming into this thread late and outing this insulting nonsense? Have you even read the rest of the thread? It has been a quite pleasant discussion/debate on ways to improve the current DAS system, because it is currently not working very well.

There has been no argument made for reverting to the GAC. The GAC has only been mentioned because someone said that legally it would have been tough for Disney to start off giving, say, immediate access if the line is less than 30min. (As opposed to the current 10) and then switch to ten minutes, while going from ten to thirty would be easy. Someone then just happened to wonder why the same legal problem didn't apply to the old GAC and whether that is the basis for the current class action lawsuit. No one has said that there should be a return to that system.

Is there a lawsuit already filed, or are you talking about the facebook mom trying to stir up support?

 

[cmwade77]

This thread has gotten way off topic. It was never about eliminating the DAS or if the change was legal or not (it is by the way).

The DAS in all reality definitely is more equal than the GAC was, but has it's own issues. This thread was about an idea on how to correct these issues.

Disney has found ways to handle most of the issues and is working on the others, between this fact and how off topic this thread has gotten, I think SueMN is right that it's about time to close this thread.

 

[AndreaA]

Is there a lawsuit already filed, or are you talking about the facebook mom trying to stir up support?

I don't think we should keep pulling this thread off topic, but I will answer. Apparently it has been filed. I really have no other information since I couldn't care less about it. I do think that whackaloon FB mom mentioned it on her page.

 

[Gracie09]

Im sorry but being a responsible caregiver for my son that has/is : wheelchair bound / vent and oxogen dependent / seizure disorder , hypothyroidism , gerd / spinal rod placement , club feet , cleft palet and moibius syndrome. I Always carry around a summery of his health conditions/medication records in case of emergency. No not nazi germany its called being responsible.

For your child's disability that is fine but there are many people with disabilities that don't need to carry medical records.


I would really love the legal cite for the case discussed above.

 

[SueM in MN]

To get the card you have to take to the dmv a letter from your physisian on what your disabilty is.

First - not everyone who gets a handicapped parking card would need a DAS.
For handicapped parking permit, the doctor has to certify to certain requirements, many of which have nothing to do with whether or not a person could wait in line at WDW.

Second - it is time to close this thread. It has gone on for several more pages, that still boils down to the same things over and over.

Closing now

Typos and autocorrect!!!