Las Vegas Shooting

Discussion in 'Community Board' started by Mizzoufan, Oct 2, 2017.

  1. wenrob

    wenrob DIS Veteran

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    They have stated several times that the funds will go to medical expenses and funeral costs. There were 22,000 people there, 58 people killed and nearly 500 injured. It’s going to take a minute to figure out how it’s going to be distributed. This happened ONE week ago. What is it that people think they’re going to with those funds with the entire country watching?
     
  2. robinb

    robinb DIS Veteran

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    I just read last night that a security guard was shot in the leg 6 minutes before the terrorist started firing on the concertgoers. I have not been following the story very carefully for the last couple of days but I thought part of the original narrative was that the police didn't quite know where he was and that's why it took them so long to get up to the room. The previous story went that he stopped shooting after the guard was shot. Now it seems that he didn't even start shooting until 6 minutes after the guard was shot through the door.

    My question is why didn't the guard call that he was shot? Was he unconscious?
     
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  4. morgan98

    morgan98 DIS Veteran

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    I posted the link to the new article about this a few posts above yours as I found this interesting as well. It really raises a whole other set of questions.

    Now it sounds like he shot the guard. Stopped shooting for a few minutes and then started shooting at the crowd. Supposedly, the guard was on the shooters floor because of some alarm that sounded for an open door.
     
  5. robinb

    robinb DIS Veteran

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    So you did! I'm sorry I skimmed the last page and it was lost in talk about assets.
     
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  6. NYCgrrl

    NYCgrrl Mouseketeer

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    I agree that the "alleged" ( I'm saying alleged simply because no legal entity has ruled him the killer at this point) shooter had a good handle on how estates worked so there is a strong possibility that wonder whisper is going in the right direction regarding safeguarding his estate. Further he frequently listed various family members as owning property with him so that is something to consider as well.

    Unless something new comes up I would not be surprised if that person choose to NOT leave any reasons as to why he caused so much grief and pain on purpose. In his mind might just make him more infamous than any of other modern day serial killer. Oh, and I'm not naming him on purpose any more. If my theory is correct...he wanted to be an enigma and so he shall remain to me as well as a non entity.
     
  7. wonder whisper

    wonder whisper Mouseketeer

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    Having been a trustee who has worked on managing assets that are in large irrevocable trusts, I have exposure to the top --and I mean top - seasoned trust attorneys in that field (google Goodwin Procter) who have dealt with all sorts of damage claims made to access said assets after the death of the owner and all were stopped cold.

    But I digress. The real financial bottom line here is the massive civil litigation that will stem from this disaster. And given the fact the authorities in Vegas are now changing their stories on the critical question of when the police were actually notified about the shooting, it is becoming increasingly clear that Paddock's comped room is going to end up costing Mandalay Bay/MGM an unfathomable fortune, probably thousands of times over what he spent there gambling.
     
  8. wonder whisper

    wonder whisper Mouseketeer

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    Sorry to hear about her and there is still no word from the organizers of the "go fund me" initiative in LV about how they are going to distribute the donations. IMHO, if people want an idea of how long that could drag on, google "9/11 victim compensation fund."
     
  9. ronandannette

    ronandannette I gave myself this tag and I "Like" myself too!

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    I'd wager that very few Canadians who jaunt off to Vegas for a quick trip (very, very common here) bother to purchase travel medical insurance. And the awareness of the cost of healthcare is virtually non-existent until an incident affects one personally. Not that it's the primary concern by any means, but I think the substantial financial impact of a tragedy like this is seldom considered. My hearts go out to all those survivors whose lives have been changed forever, both physically and in other ways.
     
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  10. cabanafrau

    cabanafrau DIS Veteran

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    You said some very key words -- assets that are IN large, irrevocable trusts. A, there is no indication whatsoever he had a trust, irrevocable or revocable. (There's no reason to suggest if he had a trust it was definitely irrevocable.) B, you're making the assumption he left a trust with assets IN it.

    Quite often trusts are created and never funded -- many settlors never realize that is a step they must take. Happens even with very large estates all the time.

    Based on what little info. can be gleaned from the news articles I'd suggest it's highly unlikely his real property(real estate holdings) are titled to the trusts. I say that because the guy moved every few years over quite a span of time. Moving properties into and out of trusts on a steady basis isn't easy, may not be possible depending on trust language, and wouldn't be cheap. If those properties are only in his name they would now become the property of the estate, not the trust, at least not initially. IF he had a trust, the estate plan via a pourover will may instruct the properties outright, or the proceeds from the sale of, shall be transferred to the trust. Nothing will be transferred out of the estate until the debts of the estate are paid. Creditors are given an amount of time in which they must present claims for payment to the estate. Lawsuits have already been filed against the estate. Any real estate holdings or financial interests not titled directly to any trust at the time of his death are subject to payment of his debts, of which there will most assuredly be much more than even a few million dollars which his estate might possibly total. Anything not already funded into a trust won't be available to the trust once the liabilities are paid.
     
  11. Mackenzie Click-Mickelson

    Mackenzie Click-Mickelson DIS Veteran

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    I was following your earlier comments but this one I'm not. Comped or not comped doesn't matter. He could have stayed in the room regardless of gambling at that specific hotel or any MGM property (which there are numerous ones on the Strip owned by MGM). He booked other places prior to Mandalay Bay without being comped or gambling.
     
  12. cabanafrau

    cabanafrau DIS Veteran

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    I think it references the fact that he was comped the Mandalay room based on past play, with the idea that he would in turn gamble there -- allowing the casino the chance to recoup more than the cost of the hotel stay in gambling losses. Now that he used the room as the venue to stage his assault lawsuits have and will be filed against MGM, attempting to make them liable for what happened.
     
  13. Mackenzie Click-Mickelson

    Mackenzie Click-Mickelson DIS Veteran

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    Ahhhh ok that helps me understand more of what was being said. Thanks :)
     
  14. wonder whisper

    wonder whisper Mouseketeer

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    No one including me has said they definitely were. My point was that Paddock was financially savvy, so people shouldn't presume he didn't do proper estate planning (which could include a funded a trust).

    Given the number of victims, I think we can agree that anyone who thinks there is enough money in his estate to fund the needs of all of them is living in a fantasy world. In addition, with all the competing lawsuits that are being filed, how on earth are those proceeds going to get distributed equitably?

    Bottom line: the lawyers are all lining up as expected, but get ready for an absolute mess of competing litigation which will result in most victims not getting proceeds from his estate - or at best getting sums that are nothing close to what they actually need.
     
  15. cabanafrau

    cabanafrau DIS Veteran

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    I think if you look back in the thread where I initially addressed your trust comments you will see that I said there will be nowhere near enough in his estate to compensate the victims, nowhere near. Hence the rush to enjoin MGM, Live Nation, Bump Stock manufacturers, etc. in the hope of extracting cash from much larger pockets.

    The fact that he was financially savvy wouldn't necessarily equate to his feeling any particular need to do estate planning. He was a single man with no children. All indications seem to point to not much of an emotional attachment with anyone. I would be surprised if he had much more than minimal estate planning in place, if that. I'm definitely not expecting to hear a peep about any type of trust existing, particularly given we've heard reports he recently transferred 100k to his girlfriend and her family in the Philippines.
     
  16. wonder whisper

    wonder whisper Mouseketeer

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    Why did the organizers state that distribution plans (not just "uh, yeah, it will be for medical and funeral expenses") were going to be announced last week and not follow through? Some people seem to think the gofundme is flawless. Well, then read the below:

    https://www.facebook.com/GoFundMeGoFraudMe/

    https://gizmodo.com/gofundme-is-a-great-way-to-scam-people-1681401839

    https://theoutline.com/post/1776/the-woman-who-spends-her-free-time-hunting-down-gofundme-fraud
     
  17. kimblebee

    kimblebee now my thoughts will be worth 5 cents

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    I have been taught that you should NEVER go down south without travel insurance..even if you’re just crossing the border to pick up a package. You could get into a car accident, break a few bones and be stuck in a hospital for months.

    I believe it’s $18-$20 a day for insurance..an expense that is well worth it.
     
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  18. cruiser21

    cruiser21 DIS Veteran

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    I live in Phoenix. We have a lot of Canadians that come here for surgery's and procedures they can't get in a timely manner with their universal health care. Long wait lists? I've even had patients that had their hotels and flights paid for by Canadian insurance. I'm not an insurance expert this is just what I've seen. We also have a lot of Canadian snowbirds that end up in the hospital. I've never heard them complain about their healthcare not being covered. I don't know maybe some Canadians can chime in on this matter.
     
  19. dish rag

    dish rag DIS Veteran

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    Wife gets it through her Visa card, there are stay limits I forget what they are and I think it's at no cost to her. Her mother buys a years worth at a time through I think it's called carp. That has stay limits too but not too bad and it's very reasonable priced. I would call it cheap.
     
  20. kimblebee

    kimblebee now my thoughts will be worth 5 cents

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    I guess it depends on what is considered a timely matter. I saw my neurologist last week and already have an MRI appointment for November. It’s just for my semi annual brain scan. My dad had an awful problem with his knee and his MRI isn’t until January. I’m actually going to look and see if we can switch appointments since I think his need is greater than mine. Oct-Jan may seem like a long time for some, but, his need isn’t ‘urgent’. Plus, we don’t have to pay a penny for it.

    As for the snowbirds not complaining, pretty sure they will have blue cross or private insurance that pays the bills for them. My mom was in the States about 6-7 years ago and ended up in the hospital for a few days and had her gall bladder taken out in surgery. She was very happy to have the $30K bill handled by insurance.

    When we buy our insurance it is based on days away and I don’t think there’s a limit. I’ve never gone anywhere long enough to find out lol
     
  21. cruiser21

    cruiser21 DIS Veteran

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    i could go to my dr in the morning and have an MRI done in the afternoon.. I wouldnt have to wait a day much less a month. Things get done quickly here. 30k is a small hospital bill in the US. Insurance will cover most of it, but we do pay a premium for good healthcare.
     

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