Retheme Splash Mountain?

[Lumpy1106]

I ran across this idea while browsing Google News - should Splash Mountain be re-themed? At first I thought it was a knee-jerk response to current events, but then I read the article and looked at the graphics the Fredric Chambers has pain-painstakingly put together. This is not a new idea - he's been working on it for years.

Here's the article - please read before you vote;
Cinema Blend Article - should Splash Mountain be re-themed?

 

[rteetz]

Moved because not news or rumors.

That said I don’t agree with a new theme. Yes it’s based around the controversial song of the south film however that film is not available and hasn’t been for some time. Many people of color have even wanted it to be released as a teaching film. I know Whoopi Goldberg has been vocal about that.

The ride it self to my knowledge doesn’t have any scenes that are problematic. If there are I’d welcome some info on that. This period is all about learning and listening.

On twitter there have been discussions that other attractions could/should see changes before splash. Peter pan and the natives scene for example or Jungle Cruise.

 

[PrincessNelly]

Bring on the Frog! (atleast in disneyland since its close enough the new orleans square to fit the theme)

I don't get anyone's obsession with Song of the South. Disney modified POTC to be more in line with today's world view, therefore its long overdue to move on from SOTS.

 

[Lumpy1106]

Apologies - didn't really know where to put it.
Like I said, I initially thought it was just a reaction to what is going on in the world, but you can't argue with the fact that Princess and the Frog is a much better film to cross-promote. In DL it would be a fantastic fit - the exit to the haunted mansion is right next to the (really extended) cue for Splash. Mr. Chambers makes an argument that you can transition to Bear Country on the other side - that I am less sure of. DL Pooh is by far the worst of the versions so if you had to move that ride (why is it not in Fantasy Land anyway?) and re-theme all the way down to the entrance to GE it would not be much of a loss. I say let's give it to the Imagineers and see what they can do with it.

 

[sjones88]

I disagree with it not being news? CNN reported on this today and It's at least relevant to lots of the news that's happening today. https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/disney-splash-mountain-theme-racist-trnd/index.html

Regardless , I also agree....bring on the Frog!

 

[Lumpy1106]

The ride it self to my knowledge doesn’t have any scenes that are problematic. If there are I’d welcome some info on that. This period is all about learning and listening.

No scenes are problematic - unless you know the story. Braer Rabbit is captured by Braer Fox in the "tar baby" story. Braer Rabbit gets mad at the tar baby that Brae Fox tricks him with because it is not being respectful as he says hello to it as he walks down the road. When he starts to assault the tar baby, he gets stuck. Braer Fox catches him. Braer Rabbit pleads with him to "not toss him in the brier patch", which is the drop for the ride. This is a trick of course, Braer Rabbit grew up in the brier patch, and that is how he escapes. The Tar Baby is replaced by Honey, but the story is otherwise the same. You can see how the tar baby is ...err... not very PC, to say the least.

 

[rteetz]

No scenes are problematic - unless you know the story. Braer Rabbit is captured by Braer Fox in the "tar baby" story. Braer Rabbit gets mad at the tar baby that Brae Fox tricks him with because it is not being respectful as he says hello to it as he walks down the road. When he starts to assault the tar baby, he gets stuck. Braer Fox catches him. Braer Rabbit pleads with him to "not toss him in the brier patch", which is the drop for the ride. This is a trick of course, Braer Rabbit grew up in the brier patch, and that is how he escapes. The Tar Baby is replaced by Honey, but the story is otherwise the same. You can see how the tar baby is ...err... not very PC, to say the least.

Which is why he’s not in the ride. I think disney is relatively good about removing problematic things. They’ve done it several times to pirates. I guess I’ve just never heard many complaints about Splash.

 

[rteetz]

I disagree with it not being news? CNN reported on this today and It's at least relevant to lots of the news that's happening today. https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/disney-splash-mountain-theme-racist-trnd/index.html

Regardless , I also agree....bring on the Frog!

It’s not news because it’s a discussion. Right now disney hasn’t commented and hasn’t announced any changes.

 

[Lumpy1106]

Which is why he’s not in the ride. I think disney is relatively good about removing problematic things. They’ve done it several times to pirates. I guess I’ve just never heard many complaints about Splash.

Except - have you read Wind in the Willows, and why would you do that? Oh yeah, Mr. Toad's Wild ride is loosely based on it. So if a kid now rides Splash Mountain and wants to know the story, do you want them reading the Tar Baby story?

BTW - that's how I know the story. My in-laws kept the book they used to read to my wife when she was a pre-schooler. It's a collection of short stories that will never see the light of day in a print shop again with Tar Baby included, I am sure. Oh...did I mention the story is worded in the narrative voice of Uncle Reamus?

Don't get me wrong, I love the ride - never miss it, but if protesters wanted it changed I would understand.

 

[rteetz]

Except - have you read Wind in the Willows, and why would you do that? Oh yeah, Mr. Toad's Wild ride is loosely based on it. So if a kid now rides Splash Mountain and wants to know the story, do you want them reading the Tar Baby story?

BTW - that's how I know the story. My in-laws kept the book they used to read to my wife when she was a pre-schooler. It's a collection of short stories that will never see the light of day in a print shop again with Tar Baby included, I am sure. Oh...did I mention the story is worded in the narrative voice of Uncle Reamus?

Don't get me wrong, I love the ride - never miss it, but if protesters wanted it changed I would understand.

That’s fair. It’s hard to really find the appropriate solution. Another thread brought up Port Orleans resort for references to controversial history. We know we can’t erase history.

I would love to hear arguments for releasing song of the south for one. I need to do some digging but as I mentioned Whoopi Goldberg wanted it released at least at one point.

Maybe a ride story tweak would be better? I would rather have Princess and the Frog get their own ride that fits that story whether it’s on fantasyland or whatever.

 

[Happyinwonerland]

This is a tough one. The ride is a classic, and since nobody knows the story behind it without a little digging, it is hard for me to associate it with a negative racial undertone.

However, I can see where it would be a sore spot for anyone who may have been the vicitim of racial injustice, and defending it because it is classic feels much like defending other relics that we now know are racist. So if they change it, while I'll be sad to see a classic go, I would understand it.

 

[rteetz]

That’s fair. It’s hard to really find the appropriate solution. Another thread brought up Port Orleans resort for references to controversial history. We know we can’t erase history.

I would love to hear arguments for releasing song of the south for one. I need to do some digging but as I mentioned Whoopi Goldberg wanted it released at least at one point.

Maybe a ride story tweak would be better? I would rather have Princess and the Frog get their own ride that fits that story whether it’s on fantasyland or whatever.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/disney-plus-song-of-the-south-whoopi-goldberg-183146687.html

 

[AggieDizzer]

I like Splash Mountain but have to admit I've always been a little uncomfortable about the fact that they have a major attraction themed to a film considered by many to be racist and that has been relegated to the Disney vault. (I should qualify that by saying I have never seen the movie, I'm just basing that on what I have heard about it. Full disclosure and all.) For that matter, Splash is a little dated anyway and IMO could use an overhaul. And Princess and the Frog has the potential to be a lot of fun.

 

[Helvetica]

I think a retheme is inevitable. I just don’t think it’s possible to separate the ride from its source material. It’s probably due for an extended refurb soon anyway.

Princess and the Frog could be fun, but I hope they don’t use the same movie for all 3 versions of the ride.

 

[afan]

The movie is out there if you really want to watch it. While we have it on VHS that my mom bought prior to DVDs and I think from the UK, I bought it on dvd a few years ago.

 

[Lumpy1106]

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/disney-plus-song-of-the-south-whoopi-goldberg-183146687.html

That's really interesting, and I don't disagree with Whoopi at all. Art is art and tells a story of the time in which it existed. I don't think it need to be re-released on the big screen, but available? Absolutely! This is the line I think Disney should be drawing too though. If you aren't even going to re-release it on Disney+, then you aren't going to use it to cross-promote. Seems like there are better themes for the ride then.

Keep in mind, one of the reasons Splash Mountain is themed that way is because Disney had a whole building full of America Sings animatronics that they were about to remove. It's pretty clever how they were able to re-purpose the animatonics, but maybe a bit short-sighted in the grand scheme of things.

 

[GoingSince1990]

If the ride included an audio-animatronic Uncle Remus explaining why slavery is really not that bad, I would say yes, change it. But it doesn't. It's an animatronic bunny escaping from an animatronic fox with no social commentary at all. Anyone who demands that Splash be re-themed because they see it as somehow sympathetic towards slavery should probably, to be consistent, also demand that POTC be changed due to its sympathetic attitude towards piracy. I would say leave Splash alone.

 

[FatBambi]

None of the average people/fans of the parks that I know even know it's based off of a movie and they're always skeptical when I tell them. I think it's fine.

 

[andyman8]

This is a tough one. The ride is a classic, and since nobody knows the story behind it without a little digging, it is hard for me to associate it with a negative racial undertone.

However, I can see where it would be a sore spot for anyone who may have been the vicitim of racial injustice, and defending it because it is classic feels much like defending other relics that we now know are racist. So if they change it, while I'll be sad to see a classic go, I would understand it.

I agree with this. I also think part of it is perspective. It’s easy for me as a white dude with a certain emotional attachment to it to say “Ah it’s fine. What’s the big deal?” but a black person might have a very different interpretation of it, especially if it’s their first time on it. Yes, most people don’t know, but on a topic as sensitive and important as this, if it makes a even a small group of guests feel uncomfortable, it might be best to err on the side of caution. Should the film be erased? I personally don’t think so. I agree with Whoopi Goldberg: put it out for people to see with a clear explanation about why this film misrepresents or trivializes the horror of slavery. Maybe even donate the profits to the NAACP or a similar cause. Disney loves doing that stuff. We can’t erase history; we must learn from it.

But to have a ride celebrating that film? I don’t know. I could go either way, so I’d really have to defer to someone who’s perspective is more salient on the matter. I think that’s been my bigger takeaway from a lot of recent events: I need to more carefully consider my perspective (and the blindspots from that perspective) before I so quickly or defensively dismiss a certain critique or criticism. All of our perspectives are limited and I worry far too many people refuse to acknowledge the limits of their world view.

Even though I know this probably wouldn’t happen in the IP-focused TWDC of today, I’d love to see them do something original with it. Come up with a new story with new characters with a similar setting. Probably cheaper than a full re-theme and the other two mountains are original stories, why not all three?

 

[lovethesun12]

My first time in WDW I was just over 30, a few years ago and I have to say I was really shocked at the POTC auction scene. Disney was always marketed to me (in Canada) as a magical place for kids, mickey/minnie mouse, yada yada and I just really was not expecting that or having to explain it to kids. I wasn't really offended, I didn't complain or anything, but I definitely appreciated the refurbishment.

I sort of feel the same way about this one - a bit shocked learning about the history. I do love splash mountain, and I did not know the history of it or of the movie. The fact I was oblivious doesn't make it better - probably worse. I don't feel I really have a say in this one, other than I can understand how it would affect people, and if it does affect people negatively, Disney should change it. I would look forward to a refurb. They changed a lot in the last 50 years, and they will change just as much in the next 50.