The Intersection of FIRE and Disney

[RamblingMad]

This is super interesting.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...dowment-manager-beat-harvard-with-index-funds

 

[Mome Rath]

FIRE is a little closer for some because Disney stock is so happy today after details of Disney+ emerge; that's a good intersection of FIRE and Disney. lol

 

[amalone1013]

I feel like you guys will understand... so can I take a minute to say people, stop telling me I did better than you because our refund is bigger than yours! We were on track for a minimal refund as planned, except we were expecting some of DHs commissions to pay out in Nov/Dec and they didn't until Feb this year. Now instead of it being 2017/2018 similar incomes, and 2019 slightly higher, it's going to be 2018 was a decent amount lower than 2017, and 2019 is going to be crazy high. I'm really annoyed by this and I did not want $900 back! Now I have DH complaining to me because his friend is complaining that he is getting screwed over by the tax changes because he owes this year. Of course I don't have a 100% transparent view of his finances, but I can't come up with a scenario where he truly owes more, I think he just under withheld... I think really he's just hung up on thinking he was going to get a first time homebuyer credit... but that's gone, right? He just bought last year.

I just don't understand why is it so hard for people, I don't care if you want to aim for a refund or not, you don't want to do the math, whatever, but it has nothing to do with what you owed the government! It's just whether you over or underpaid during the year...

Ok I'm done. It's been a long Friday already.

 

[WVMomof3]

I feel like you guys will understand... so can I take a minute to say people, stop telling me I did better than you because our refund is bigger than yours! We were on track for a minimal refund as planned, except we were expecting some of DHs commissions to pay out in Nov/Dec and they didn't until Feb this year. Now instead of it being 2017/2018 similar incomes, and 2019 slightly higher, it's going to be 2018 was a decent amount lower than 2017, and 2019 is going to be crazy high. I'm really annoyed by this and I did not want $900 back! Now I have DH complaining to me because his friend is complaining that he is getting screwed over by the tax changes because he owes this year. Of course I don't have a 100% transparent view of his finances, but I can't come up with a scenario where he truly owes more, I think he just under withheld... I think really he's just hung up on thinking he was going to get a first time homebuyer credit... but that's gone, right? He just bought last year.

I just don't understand why is it so hard for people, I don't care if you want to aim for a refund or not, you don't want to do the math, whatever, but it has nothing to do with what you owed the government! It's just whether you over or underpaid during the year...

Ok I'm done. It's been a long Friday already.

It drives me bonkers when people talk about how much they owed or their refund. It took me awhile to explain this to a friend recently. I don't get why looking at total taxes paid is so hard for people to understand.

 

[RamblingMad]

It drives me bonkers when people talk about how much they owed or their refund. It took me awhile to explain this to a friend recently. I don't get why looking at total taxes paid is so hard for people to understand.

I ended up worse off in aggregate because of the SALT cap. It more than offset my monthly increase due to the rate change. I compare effective tax rates year over year.

 

[RamblingMad]

FIRE is a little closer for some because Disney stock is so happy today after details of Disney+ emerge; that's a good intersection of FIRE and Disney. lol

I’m feeling good about it. Makes me wish I had more Disney stock.

 

[morgan98]

It drives me bonkers when people talk about how much they owed or their refund. It took me awhile to explain this to a friend recently. I don't get why looking at total taxes paid is so hard for people to understand.

As a career CPA, this makes me crazy. Total tax and effective rate is what matters, not how much you have withheld from your check.

I just think it goes to prove that there are MANY people who are really un or under educated in the area of personal finance. No one is saying everyone needs to memorize the tax code, but some basic understanding should not be too difficult.

 

[BridgetBordeaux]

The root problem is that many people are not good at math and really and truly don't examine their pay statements to understand what is being deducted and why.

 

[SouthFayetteFan]

Just catching up here today but my goodness do I HATE when people do not understand their actual taxes due. It makes my blood boil and my skin crawl when people complain about "the size of their refund." I don't care what you know or how smart you think you are, if you can't understand the simple principle of "taxes paid" vs. "tax refund" I start to question your intelligence,

My favorite story on this was a conversation with a friend last year. Our actual taxes paid last year was (negative) $-530. (Yes...I literally got paid money back to live in the grand old USA last year...due to a refundable child tax credit). At any rate, a friend was asking me about savings and taxes and what I do (because I had told them I actually have a tax strategy each year) and so I was telling them that I was able to reduce my taxes to $0 and actually get $530 back.

And they said "That's nothing...I got $5,000 back..." And so I went into the whole spiel and explained the difference between taxes owed and a refund. And I told them my refund was $1,300 but I'm not talking about a refund I'm talking about the net taxes you actually paid. And then they're like "Was your refund $530 or $1,300...you only get 1 refund..." Yes, they were now judging ME as the dumb one... I gave up...

 

[DisMommyTX]

Now I have DH complaining to me because his friend is complaining that he is getting screwed over by the tax changes because he owes this year. Of course I don't have a 100% transparent view of his finances, but I can't come up with a scenario where he truly owes more, I think he just under withheld... I think really he's just hung up on thinking he was going to get a first time homebuyer credit... but that's gone, right? He just bought last year.

While he may not understand the difference between under withholding and paying more taxes, it is also possible that he truly did get screwed by the tax changes. We paid slightly less tax this year but only because our rental property went from a 6k profit to 5k loss (hurricane repairs). Adjusting for all other changes in our income and deductions this year, we would have paid almost 2k less under the previous tax code.

 

[pillow]

Thanks for all the help! But I am still clueless. lol I know how much is in the accounts, but the fees, I have no idea. How do I find that? I looked all over my log in, but I guess I don't know what I am looking for, besides the word fee. lol And I don't see that. I started out with @$40k in Jan 2006 and now have slightly more than $80k in my 401k one. I just want to say my DH is not as clueless as me, lol. But I think he said a long time ago this is my money and I should decide what to do with it. And doing nothing but status quo is what I have been doing.

This is what it says I am in, kind of confused on the 101%
MetLife Mid Cap Stock Index Portfolio (Class B) 10.0%
MetLife MSCI EAFE Index Portfolio 20.0%
MetLife Russell 2000 Index Portfolio (Class B) 10.0%
MetLife Stock Index Portfolio (Class B) 61.0%

Can you find the ticker symbol for these funds? I find the ticker and then go to Morningstar to see how they rate the funds and also to get the expense ratio. For Class B shares, you might incur a fee when you sell. However, its possible you've held it long enough so that you won't. I would find that out for sure before moving anything.

I generally think people are better off keeping funds in Fidelity or Vanguard and doing index funds on their own. I will resist ranting about the financial advisor industry. Suze Orman does this much better than me, and she is WAY funnier!

 

[Sjm9911]

While he may not understand the difference between under withholding and paying more taxes, it is also possible that he truly did get screwed by the tax changes. We paid slightly less tax this year but only because our rental property went from a 6k profit to 5k loss (hurricane repairs). Adjusting for all other changes in our income and deductions this year, we would have paid almost 2k less under the previous tax code.

Dont forget it also depends on where you live. If your in a high tax state, property taxes can be upwards of 25k. So some did get screwed. Other got a break.

 

[SouthFayetteFan]

Can you find the ticker symbol for these funds? I find the ticker and then go to Morningstar to see how they rate the funds and also to get the expense ratio. For Class B shares, you might incur a fee when you sell. However, its possible you've held it long enough so that you won't. I would find that out for sure before moving anything.

I generally think people are better off keeping funds in Fidelity or Vanguard and doing index funds on their own. I will resist ranting about the financial advisor industry. Suze Orman does this much better than me, and she is WAY funnier!

And yet Suze also seems to be vehemently opposed to the FIRE movement...just an interesting side note relevant to our topic

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/10/05/the-fire-movement/

https://www.marketwatch.com/amp/story/guid/33D12DD6-C8DA-11E8-8024-D633328AB33B

 

[RamblingMad]

And yet Suze also seems to be vehemently opposed to the FIRE movement...just an interesting side note relevant to our topic

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/10/05/the-fire-movement/

https://www.marketwatch.com/amp/story/guid/33D12DD6-C8DA-11E8-8024-D633328AB33B

She’s all about paying off debt.

However, she at least warns people off high commission annuities.

 

[pillow]

And yet Suze also seems to be vehemently opposed to the FIRE movement...just an interesting side note relevant to our topic

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/10/05/the-fire-movement/

https://www.marketwatch.com/amp/story/guid/33D12DD6-C8DA-11E8-8024-D633328AB33B

Yes this is true. She is very conservative when it comes to money. I recall her saying that folks need $5 million to retire. What???

 

[RamblingMad]

Yes this is true. She is very conservative when it comes to money. I recall her saying that folks need $5 million to retire. What???

I'm estimating right now between $3-4 million, and I save a lot. Telling someone that makes $60-70k that they'll need $5 million will have them making poor financial decisions. They'll go into very high risk investments, which will end badly for them. This is the late 90s all over again.

 

[alryan]

And yet Suze also seems to be vehemently opposed to the FIRE movement...just an interesting side note relevant to our topic

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/10/05/the-fire-movement/

https://www.marketwatch.com/amp/story/guid/33D12DD6-C8DA-11E8-8024-D633328AB33B

Didn't think I was going to make it more than 10 minutes into that interview, wow, holy ego! But actually glad I did. Despite saying she hates the FIRE movement many things she advocates are the same.

She did seem to focus mostly on the RE part of FIRE, specifically, retiring very early at 30 or 40 and then needing that 2 million dollars to last you 50-60 years and not knowing what will happen in that time. There was a lot of fear invoked, but I think there is value in listening to advice from someone who is older. But I don't see how you can have so much dislike for a movement that advocates for saving and living under your means.

 

[alryan]

Yes this is true. She is very conservative when it comes to money. I recall her saying that folks need $5 million to retire. What???

Yeah, I could never really understand her numbers.

 

[SouthFayetteFan]

Somebody on r/financialindependence asked for a summary of what it was all about...I thought this answer somebody else provided was a nice summary so figure I’d just share here

• lower your expenses as much as possible - cut out all unnecessary spending, find efficiencies wherever you can
  
  
• now that you've got your total expenses down, put them in a spreadsheet, add them all up and multiply by 25. That's your FIRE goal.
  
  
• pay off all debt above 4.5%. ASAP.
  
  
• save as much of your income as possible first through matched 401k (if available), then through ROTH IRA (if income level allows), or through regular IRA. Buy only low-cost broad-index funds like VTSAX. Pad it a little with a bond fund if you want to smooth out the ride a little.
  
  
• once you've maxed that, save as much as you can in a brokerage account. Same as above re: VTSAX.
  
  
• set up auto-investing so that a set amount of $$$ goes into those accounts every week/month, straight out of your paycheck. NEVER STOP THIS.
  
  
• do NOT panic when the market tanks, and it will. KEEP INVESTING.
  
  
• when you get within about 5-10 years of your retirement date, start gradually moving some of your investments (20-30% or more) into bond index funds. This way if the market tanks right before you retire you won't be forced to sell your stock funds at bargain basement prices (common cause of retirement failures).
  
  
• once you've hit your FIRE number, feel free to quit your job or find one you truly love - you've made it! Pull 4% out of your nest-egg every year to cover your living expenses, and as long as you spend within your limits and don't do anything stupid with your investments, your money has a 99%+ chance of lasting through to the end of your life.

 

[Navychica]

Hi all. New to this thread, but definitely not new to the FIRE concept! How do you balance Disney trips/family fun with your savings?

We're in a pretty good financial spot; debt free, cars and student loans paid off, 30/28 with a toddler and immediate plans to try for a second child. We left the military two weeks ago; I just started a new job and DH is starting to job search. He's a software engineer, and we live in an area with lots of defense contractors, so we don't anticipate him having too hard a time. We're renting our current house as we feel out the new city, but will most likely purchase something in the next two years. We recently had some larger expenses than planned as we moved and tried to buy civilian business casual wardrobes, but we're normally pretty good with living in a budget and maxing out tax-advantaged savings, as well as contributing to a few index funds.

Our last family trip (other than to visit family) was pre-baby, three years ago. We're debating when to take DD on her first Disney vacation. On the one hand, the more we save now, the better our future lives will be. On the other hand, she's only young enough to believe in magic once. I'm trying to justify a trip over Thanksgiving. Wouldn't normally go over a holiday, but with new jobs, we'll both be a bit low on vacation time. I'm not trying to make this a discussion on the best age to take kids to Disney which has been discussed ad nauseam, but how do you work the financial balance?