What do you think school will be like in the fall? UPDATE page 29 for Mass.

[HeatherC]

Well, first, it depends what the coronavirus does.

And here they are still trying to get distance learning working here. It "officially" started in Sac City Unified 3 weeks ago, but they are still trying to get computers to kids. And they are dispatching city buses set up as Mobile WiFi hot spots because they were shocked to discover how many people .....both students and teachers.....have no internet at home. The Digital Divide. And all this is happening despite the fact that the teachers union hasn't signed off yet on any of the distance learning, so some teachers are refusing to take part.

They are floated the idea of starting school here a month early in July, and some parents and teacher say they will not allow that to happen.

Bottom line, like I said, it depends on the virus, and at least here in California, it may take the Governor making a tough choice and issuing and executive order. And order that no matter what it is, won't be popular with a lot of people

How are CA teacher contracts set up? Here, co tracts usually run through most of August so I’m not sure how they could even make teachers go back early since their contracts haven’t even expired by then. Will be interesting for sure.

 

[Lumpy1106]

Oh boy, wading into this again.
My son will be Senior next year and I want him to have as normal a Senior year as possible. Not a virtual prom, a REAL prom. Not a cancelled lacrosse season, a REAL lacrosse season, not a drive-by-everyone-honks-and-waves-banners commencement, a REAL commencement. Maybe that commencement or those lacrosse games happen without a soul in the stadium, and maybe there are at-risk teachers or even students that still do some sort of virtual classroom - that's not ideal, but that beats the snot out of what is happening now. I doubt you'd find a single person, at-risk or otherwise who would disagree with that.

It is at this point where I know there are some who have already dismissed what I have to say. It's not worth risking the lives of their grandparents, or the teachers. OK, then don't. Yes, there are teachers who are at risk, or who don't want to take the risk, that will be out of the classroom - they are out of the classroom now, what is the difference? My kids probably won't see their grandparents until herd immunity or a vaccine is found. They can't visit their grandparents now, what is the difference? The fact is, and yes, it is a fact, not conjecture, not-at-risk kids are not experiencing the really bad symptoms, are not ending up in hospitals, and again a proven fact, kids under 10 don't even transmit the disease to older parents and grandparents. Keeping kids out of school is a decision based on fear and fear alone. Heck, we're pretty sure this thing already rolled through my kids school back in December. There were lots of absences but nobody was all that alarmed. In other words, a normal response to a natural occurrence - a far cry from what is going on now.

How important is this to us? If CA decides to stay "virtual classroom" (an near total failure in our experience, YMMV), we are moving to a state that does not. Yes, it is that important. To those who say that HS experience was not that important to them or their kids, I truly feel sorry for you. The guys I played soccer with, the people in the marching band, heck, even the students in my Chemistry and Math classes, these are STILL the best friends I have. I wouldn't trade a second I spent with any of them for the world. THAT is what I want my kids to have - and we are trading it away for nothing. This has to end.

 

[MrsCobraBubbles]

My kids are doing great with distance learning, although I don't think my middle school-aged son is given enough work to do. I give him extra "assignments" to do, but they're "fun" assignments. We have a little book club where we both read the same book and then discuss it, I've had him write letters to family and friends (which they've loved receiving!), and I've been teaching him a little about financial matters--I gave him a pretend salary and he had to budget pretend expenses, etc. My high school daughter seems to be doing more or less what she was doing before, just from home.

If things aren't back to something resembling normal by fall I may just enroll them in e-school. I would actually be perfectly happy with this except for the social component. My kids are maintaining friendships via social media but it isn't the same.

I realize that my situation is not typical and I do think it's vital for the majority of children to be back in classrooms as quickly as possible. It must be a terrible struggle for parents of very young children, especially if the parents are working, and special needs and disadvantaged children are not getting what they need right now. This hurts us all in the long run.

I have to say that I'm glad you understand how hard it can be for families with some learning difficulties. Both my kids have special education needs (my son is diagnosed with Asperger's and my daughter is diagnosed with ADHD) and school has been absolute HE*L for us most days! I've got 2 kiddos with a large age gap (my son is a junior in high school, my daughter is in elementary) who need very different educational support and I feel like I need to clone myself! I literally can't be there providing what each kid needs at the same time. When I'm helping my son with something I can't also be standing over my daughter and keeping her focussed, and vice-versa. Since I have to help one and then the other there are some days we don't finish school until 8:00 PM!!!!! Back before schools closed I worked in a classroom for low-functioning kids with autism. I am highly trained to help kiddos like mine but in order to provide the proper level of assistance that my kids need I am running myself ragged most days and there's no way any of the kids I normally work with at school are getting this level of assistance and education that I am fortunate to be able to provide to my own children, which makes me very sad for them and their parents. I am feeling mentally exhausted and beat down right now (and my kids are feeling pretty bad most days too, what with the stress of changing routines and not seeing their friends and teachers) and one of us breaks down in tears every single day (I don't cry around my kids though, I do my best to maintain the facade that everything is awesome and happy fun times, but I have had to excuse myself to let out the tears and stress at times) and I will be so happy when this school year finally ends!!! I'm praying for a miracle for next school year, that there will be some incredible scientific breakthrough over the summer that allows us all to go back to normal life. Or that our school district will lower expectations for kids with special needs for the next school year, so that I don't have to be so stressed about distance learning!

 

[HeatherC]

You are scared and that's okay.

I really think now the news needs to start reporting ALL of the statistics, not just deaths and new cases.

If people can actually see the numbers of positives that did not need hospitalization, the number of positives vs the number of tests, the number of those hospitalized that were discharged - then people wouldn't be as scared anymore.

Every new virus has a surge of deaths in the beginning. Not to say we shouldn't have done what we did, still wear masks, still social distance be looking for vaccines, treatments etc., but it's also time to start looking to open up life again. And not waiting for a vaccine or successful treatment.

Can we try to just keep the discussion about schools on this thread? These threads have a way of getting off track very fast.

 

[Nox]

Sorry for the off-topic, but I need to voice my thoughts and should be free to the same as everyone else was.

Seriously, life is not more important? Ask anyone grieving a loved one who has died. 70, 000 people are dead and more to come.
I'm baffled, but I guess if this virus doesn't affect you or your loved one directly, you can say that.
I don't want to flame anyone, but we are seeing death daily, is that ok?

Death happens daily regardless, whether or not you see it or the death toll gets posted on the nightly news.

Watching two very dear people to me bury their loved ones, who died alone causes me to want things to stay closed a bit longer.

People die alone all the time. They're found dead in their kitchen floor after having a heart attack when no one was home to save them. They die before family can get in to see them. They die on the operating table with only doctors and nurses around them. None of this is new, and all of it will continue to happen for the rest of human existence.

My dad died March 4th, only 67 years old, long before his time. I am grieving a loved one who has died. But death comes for everyone. Every one of us will die, and so will every person we love. Maybe fifty years from now. Maybe tomorrow. Maybe from old age. But also maybe from an accident, or cancer, or the flu, or COVID. That isn't changing.

And as upsetting as my dad's death was, you know what else is upsetting? Watching my husband's business, that he poured his heart and soul into for years, that he sold every personal belonging he had to fund, crumble. Worrying about whether or not we will be able to pay rent next month. Listening to our friend who is likely going to have to file bankruptcy because his business is sunk. Buying groceries for a friend after he confessed that he, his wife, and his two children had each been eating half a peanut butter sandwich a day for several weeks because neither he nor his wife have worked since the beginning of March, they got whatever they could from the food pantry, and their two children aren't school-going age so the programs to still give kids school lunch wasn't extended to them. Having a friend institutionalized on suicide watch after she lost everything from months of not working. You have your concerns, I have mine.

I have an autoimmune disease. My mom is in her 70s. My best friend is immunocompromised. And yet we are all in agreement that life cannot continue this way. We can't go months with tens of millions of people unable to provide for themselves.

No malice meant here and I hope everyone stays safe and well.

And back on the subject of school: virtual school is definitely not ideal. I worry about the development of children staring at computer screens. I worry about kids going without human interaction outside of their families. I worry about the intellectual divides that are inevitable, because not all parents are cut out to teach their kids, and not all have the resources to do so effectively. I worry about children with special needs. The purpose of public school was to give kids as level a playing field as possible, and that has now been totally upended. That's very bad.

 

[HeatherC]

Yep. I've shared this info before, but my company makes products sold in every Home Depot and Lowe's. Sales are up 84% now over last year. That's not a typo. People never stopped going to stores, and in fact, went out more. Foot traffic in stores is WAAAAAY up, I'm talking millions of additional people. Cases and deaths don't correlate. Stores aren't having staffing problems. The virus took us by surprise. We've got more info now. It's time to move on, and yes, I'm one of those that thinks mandatory masks are silly. Not every place is NYC. Not everyone is 80+ years old. I'm okay with the heat of flames.

Please let’s just keep this about schools in the fall? Truly, I understand the philosophical discussions we are all involved in now. But THIS thread is about what you think will happen to schools for fall.

 

[wilbret]

Please let’s just keep this about schools in the fall? Truly, I understand the philosophical discussions we are all involved in now. But THIS thread is about what you think will happen to schools for fall.

Sure. My post just above that one was specific to school. I think this is the type of response you'll get for a while... sorry.

 

[Farro]

Can we try to just keep the discussion about schools on this thread? These threads have a way of getting off track very fast.

It's all related. That's part of the issue, some people don't seem to understand everything affects everything.

But sure.

 

[Dole_whip_doll]

What state are you in? If you don’t mind sharing.

Texas

 

[tvguy]

How are CA teacher contracts set up? Here, co tracts usually run through most of August so I’m not sure how they could even make teachers go back early since their contracts haven’t even expired by then. Will be interesting for sure.

Good question. I think every district is different.
The union contracts run several years. The school year calendars are usually out 3 years in advance. I think the teachers individual employment agreements run until school is out in June. School year normally starts in August so the previous employment agreement would have to have expired before then.

 

[Lumpy1106]

And back on the subject of school: virtual school is definitely not ideal. I worry about the development of children staring at computer screens. I worry about kids going without human interaction outside of their families. I worry about the intellectual divides that are inevitable, because not all parents are cut out to teach their kids, and not all have the resources to do so effectively. I worry about children with special needs. The purpose of public school was to give kids as level a playing field as possible, and that has now been totally upended. That's very bad.

Yeah, about that...
Both my wife and I are working full time from home. The failure in virtual education is not ours though. We get the kids onto their Zoom classroom lessons, follow up with the homework, IOW, my kids are keeping up...with what is being assigned. In a few cases, the teachers are doing the best with what they have. Lessons make sense, they are making themselves available for outside-of-Zoom-class phone calls or Zoom sessions - GREAT, no complaints. But for every one of those teachers, there are twice as many teachers who are floundering, who are not getting students to attend the Zoom lessons and are giving up, who are (and I wish I was making this up) assigning Khan academy lessons instead of their own - WTH!?! The school is no better, going with pass-fail instead of grades. Excuse me, there are kids in your school who NEED the grades they earned and are counting on the AP class bump in their GPA to get into the college of their choice. Why are you taking that away from them?

 

[Dole_whip_doll]

Yeah, about that...
Both my wife and I are working full time from home. The failure in virtual education is not our though. We get the kids onto their Zoom classroom lessons, follow up with the homework, IOW, my kids are keeping up...with what is being assigned. In a few cases, the teachers are doing the best with what they have. Lessons make sense, they are making themselves available for outside-of-Zoom-class phone calls or Zoom sessions - GREAT, no complaints. But for every one of those teachers, there are twice as many teachers who are floundering, who are not getting students to attend the Zoom lessons and are giving up, who are (and I wish I was making this up) are assigning Khan academy lessons instead of their own - WTH!?! The school is no better, going with pass-fail instead of grades. Excuse me, there are kids in your school who NEED the grades they earned and are counting on the AP class bump in their GPA to get into the college of their choice. Why are you taking that away from them?

Do you know how long programs like Khan had to plan, create, rehearse, record, dub, etc? It’s a huge company that might as well be like a movie production company and they are homogenizing everything. We teachers may teach the same thing year to year but how we teach it and what we say changes by the minute based on student response. We weren’t told on March 13 that school would be out for the rest of the year so start planning and recording now. We are told practically week by week. “Hey you need a lesson next week” “hey you need a zoom call” “hey you need an assessment”. So we are doing the best week can given the time we have.

Add to that many teachers weren’t allowed to go back to their classrooms or don’t have laptops or webcams or whatever to use. So we are doing the best we can given the technology we personally have available.

Add to that how our classrooms have manipulative, books, supplements, etc that we can’t send home or don’t have access to. So we are doing the best work can given what tools we have on hand.

We aren’t being lazy using Khan academy. We are trying everything we can to best replicate what we do.

 

[Dole_whip_doll]

By the way, do any of y’all with complaints about how your school, teachers, classswork, etc even realize it’s Teacher Appreciation Week? Yesterday was teacher appreciation day.

 

[billlaurie]

My daughter is a 1st grade teacher and she is struggling with her students getting something out of this online learning process and is getting grief from some parents. My other daughter and husband are fortunate to be working from home thru this, but they are now the primary teacher, playmate, etc, for their two early elementary-aged kids, all while juggling their full-time jobs. Teachers and parents who are now teachers are all stressed. I don't know what is going to happen but I hope for the sake of education and mental health the kids go back to school in the fall and we move to a model that isolates the most vulnerable amongst us while allowing the rest of society to function as it is intended.

 

[mom2rtk]

Some sort of hybrid in person/online method, by which either alternating days or alternating classes are either in person or online.

Colleges, I imagine a system whereby general (e.g. 'core') courses are provided online and major-specific or lab-related courses are done in person, possibly on a staggered schedule where there is 50% capacity in the classrooms/labs.

That's kind of what I'm expecting at DD's college.

 

[mom2rtk]

Yep. I've shared this info before, but my company makes products sold in every Home Depot and Lowe's. Sales are up 84% now over last year. That's not a typo. People never stopped going to stores, and in fact, went out more. Foot traffic in stores is WAAAAAY up, I'm talking millions of additional people. Cases and deaths don't correlate. Stores aren't having staffing problems. The virus took us by surprise. We've got more info now. It's time to move on, and yes, I'm one of those that thinks mandatory masks are silly. Not every place is NYC. Not everyone is 80+ years old. I'm okay with the heat of flames.

That's because Home Depot was designated as one of the winners in this.

 

[mom2rtk]

Sorry for the off-topic, but I need to voice my thoughts and should be free to the same as everyone else was.


Death happens daily regardless, whether or not you see it or the death toll gets posted on the nightly news.


People die alone all the time. They're found dead in their kitchen floor after having a heart attack when no one was home to save them. They die before family can get in to see them. They die on the operating table with only doctors and nurses around them. None of this is new, and all of it will continue to happen for the rest of human existence.

My dad died March 4th, only 67 years old, long before his time. I am grieving a loved one who has died. But death comes for everyone. Every one of us will die, and so will every person we love. Maybe fifty years from now. Maybe tomorrow. Maybe from old age. But also maybe from an accident, or cancer, or the flu, or COVID. That isn't changing.

And as upsetting as my dad's death was, you know what else is upsetting? Watching my husband's business, that he poured his heart and soul into for years, that he sold every personal belonging he had to fund, crumble. Worrying about whether or not we will be able to pay rent next month. Listening to our friend who is likely going to have to file bankruptcy because his business is sunk. Buying groceries for a friend after he confessed that he, his wife, and his two children had each been eating half a peanut butter sandwich a day for several weeks because neither he nor his wife have worked since the beginning of March, they got whatever they could from the food pantry, and their two children aren't school-going age so the programs to still give kids school lunch wasn't extended to them. Having a friend institutionalized on suicide watch after she lost everything from months of not working. You have your concerns, I have mine.

I have an autoimmune disease. My mom is in her 70s. My best friend is immunocompromised. And yet we are all in agreement that life cannot continue this way. We can't go months with tens of millions of people unable to provide for themselves.

No malice meant here and I hope everyone stays safe and well.

And back on the subject of school: virtual school is definitely not ideal. I worry about the development of children staring at computer screens. I worry about kids going without human interaction outside of their families. I worry about the intellectual divides that are inevitable, because not all parents are cut out to teach their kids, and not all have the resources to do so effectively. I worry about children with special needs. The purpose of public school was to give kids as level a playing field as possible, and that has now been totally upended. That's very bad.

I'm glad you said your piece.

I'm so very sorry for your loss.

 

[Lumpy1106]

Do you know how long programs like Khan had to plan, create, rehearse, record, dub, etc? It’s a huge company that might as well be like a movie production company and they are homogenizing everything. We teachers may teach the same thing year to year but how we teach it and what we say changes by the minute based on student response. We weren’t told on March 13 that school would be out for the rest of the year so start planning and recording now. We are told practically week by week. “Hey you need a lesson next week” “hey you need a zoom call” “hey you need an assessment”. So we are doing the best week can given the time we have.

Add to that many teachers weren’t allowed to go back to their classrooms or don’t have laptops or webcams or whatever to use. So we are doing the best we can given the technology we personally have available.

Add to that how our classrooms have manipulative, books, supplements, etc that we can’t send home or don’t have access to. So we are doing the best work can given what tools we have on hand.

We aren’t being lazy using Khan academy. We are trying everything we can to best replicate what we do.

I know Khan academy is a great TOOL. Heck, every time my kids say they don't understand something, the first thing I say is, "did you check Khan academy?". But there is a HUGE difference between preparing and presenting your own lesson plan and just saying , meh, go watch this video on Khan academy. What you are doing may be more complex than this (and to that BRAVO!), but that is what we are experiencing. Oh, and BTW, the challenge teachers face is no different than the challenge presented, and met, by Engineers, Architects, etc. We were tossed in the deep end too. It's different, sure, but I have presented, and answered comments from groups numbering in the dozens, modifying the presentation on the fly. It can be done, and yes, other teachers are doing it too.

 

[Heather07438]

Oh boy, wading into this again.
My son will be Senior next year and I want him to have as normal a Senior year as possible. Not a virtual prom, a REAL prom. Not a cancelled lacrosse season, a REAL lacrosse season, not a drive-by-everyone-honks-and-waves-banners commencement, a REAL commencement. Maybe that commencement or those lacrosse games happen without a soul in the stadium, and maybe there are at-risk teachers or even students that still do some sort of virtual classroom - that's not ideal, but that beats the snot out of what is happening now. I doubt you'd find a single person, at-risk or otherwise who would disagree with that.

It is at this point where I know there are some who have already dismissed what I have to say. It's not worth risking the lives of their grandparents, or the teachers. OK, then don't. Yes, there are teachers who are at risk, or who don't want to take the risk, that will be out of the classroom - they are out of the classroom now, what is the difference? My kids probably won't see their grandparents until herd immunity or a vaccine is found. They can't visit their grandparents now, what is the difference? The fact is, and yes, it is a fact, not conjecture, not-at-risk kids are not experiencing the really bad symptoms, are not ending up in hospitals, and again a proven fact, kids under 10 don't even transmit the disease to older parents and grandparents. Keeping kids out of school is a decision based on fear and fear alone. Heck, we're pretty sure this thing already rolled through my kids school back in December. There were lots of absences but nobody was all that alarmed. In other words, a normal response to a natural occurrence - a far cry from what is going on now.

How important is this to us? If CA decides to stay "virtual classroom" (an near total failure in our experience, YMMV), we are moving to a state that does not. Yes, it is that important. To those who say that HS experience was not that important to them or their kids, I truly feel sorry for you. The guys I played soccer with, the people in the marching band, heck, even the students in my Chemistry and Math classes, these are STILL the best friends I have. I wouldn't trade a second I spent with any of them for the world. THAT is what I want my kids to have - and we are trading it away for nothing. This has to end.

But then the student graduates with an unfamiliar class. It's a difficult choice. Give up the bonds the student had with his old class? My son is a senior this year and trust me it sucks but one of the things he does have is another layer of bonding with the class he grew up with. They're all experiencing this from a very similar perspective. It will be a very unique bond as the years go by because nobody else can understand it quite the same way they will.

 

[barkley]

Buying groceries for a friend after he confessed that he, his wife, and his two children had each been eating half a peanut butter sandwich a day for several weeks because neither he nor his wife have worked since the beginning of March, they got whatever they could from the food pantry, and their two children aren't school-going age so the programs to still give kids school lunch wasn't extended to them.

please encourage your friends to apply for both snap (food stamps) and wic (women, infants and children). wic in particular if any of the kiddos are under the age of 5. some of the previous regulations have been tweaked due to current circumstances so more of those in need of these programs but previously ineligible can now be served.