School districts punishing parents for taking kids out for Disney!

[perdidochas]

May I say what a lark?? OUr school district is CLOSED for the first day of hunting!! Now isn't that grand? We don't have a bully program and our district is rated very badly in the math program. SO why not spend 1/2 million on beautifying the grounds instead, sure makes sense here!!!

I don't think you want my answer to penalizing my child for a vacation, thank goodness we have a hunting program now thats important. No, we have no hockey or lacrosse but by golly we sure got us some rifles!!! Woo hoo!

OK now I am done with my rant, sorry you may now return to your regulalry scheduled program.

A school day closed doesnt' cost the district too much extra money. Students have 180 days a year of school. A "hunting" day isn't going to lessen that.

 

[perdidochas]

Should the parents get $$ for the teacher planning days that they have to pay someone to take care of their kids?

Those are just days they miss out of paying in the summer. Students attend 180 days of school a year. Teacher work days don't lessen those 180 days.

 

[NY Disney fan]

What punishment? Basically, it was voluntary, as there is no legal basis for it. Please be more specific in thread titles. A more accurate one would be "School districts asking for money from parents taking kids out for Disney." I didn't see one word about punishment in that article.

That is YOUR interpretation of the article. I posted MY interpretation (my opnion) in the title of this thread. Whether or not it was voluntary, I see it as a punishment for the parents for the school to even suggest it.

 

[perdidochas]

I just think it's rediculous and there is no way I would pay them a dime. Just think of all the money they are wasting sending out those requests. You know since "it's just a request" like the article states, most parents are going to throw them away. How is that for the system at work?

Well, it said that the first two weeks brought in about $2000 dollars. They probably made up all the money for the mailings for the whole year and then some, during that time period.

 

[perdidochas]

Hats off to the above poster. Finally a school district that admits it IS all about the money!!! Couldn't agree more. I actually feel sorry for the teachers who really care about the kids and are concerned with their future, as the "system" is geared to just push them through. Janice

A school is an enterprise that runs like anything else--on money. Teachers and principals and custodians don't work for free (nor should they). Schools have utility costs just like households. All of that takes money.

 

[perdidochas]

Well, as long as it is only your kids that matter...

We homeschool, but I don't resent doing all that is possible for the local educational system. I do resent paying $150,000 for the superintendent.

Not sure the size of your system, but I do know our superintendent, who is paid about that same salary, is underpaid. If you compare his salary to the salary of a business executive that is responsible for that size budget/number of workers, he is way underpaid. He supervises 72 schools, and close to 2000 teachers.

 

[Georgia]

Just for the record...I think social workers (policemen and firefighters) are very unpaid. I can't speak to their specific problems, as I can teachers, so I didn't mention them in my post.

Also, I didn't "volunteer" to coach cheerleading...after the principal was turned down by the first three people she asked she made an appeal at a faculty meeting. If I hadn't coached we wouldn't have had a team.

I think we all know teachers or for that matter people in any job who are doing as little as possible. It seems the public use those teachers to point at and say "see, that's why teachers don't need more money." This is really a very small percentage of teachers and it is very situational. This year, I'm teaching U.S. history for the 6th year...I don't have to work as hard on plans as I did 3 or 4 years ago. But next year, my principal could give me a different teaching assignment and I'd be back to square one.

Also, I agree your district has too many superint. and they are too highly paid. That doesn't excuse assuming that teachers don't deserve better. It is still a parent's responsibility to have a back up plan for days when school is out whether you agree with the reason or not.

 

[perdidochas]

A couple of my best friends are elem. school teachers, and they admit to "passing" a child that is not ready for the next grade, because holding back is discouraged within the school system. So, in this case, it does come back to MONEY. I do feel sorry for our teachers, as they, in good conscious, do not like doing this. We live in Pa., so maybe it's different in other states. I hire for a local hotel, and would love to hire some young adults for summer employment. They come in eager to work, BUT, they can't count back change without a calculator, figure local, state taxes, and have a hard time relating to the public. What happened to Sir and Mam, etc..? Before I get attacked, this is not every child, but it does pertain to quite a few. One thing I've learned from this. Don't count on our local school system to teach the basics. They are to busy teaching foreign languages to students who have yet to master English. And math, please, trig. to a child who can't count change for a twenty?? We will not allow our children to use a calculator until they can count back change, and understand basic consumer math. Janice

System by system. In the system my kids attend, due to high stakes testing, they are encouraged to retain students that aren't ready. Also, counting change back takes all of 15 minutes to teach. That's all it took for me to teach that to my 2nd grader.....

 

[Georgia]

meandtheguys--

Are you saying a Masters in Education isn't a real masters degree? Then WTH happened to my checkbook when I had to pay for all those classes in order to keep my job? It sure felt real.

 

[perdidochas]

not trying to be a jerk about it, but they do work 9 months out of the year vs other folks who work 12 months out of the year such as above poster doing social work for 12 months out of the year getting paid less....I dont feel sorry for teachers claiming XXX amount of salary they need to factor in 9 months out of the year.

Teachers have a contract that says they work 190 days a year. That's 38 work weeks or 9 1/2 months. The average white collar worker has two weeks of vacation a year, and 10 federal holidays. That's 48 weeks. The accurate comparison would be 38 weeks to 48 weeks. In some areas, teachers are not paid in the summer. In others, they get paid for their 9 1/2 months of work over 12 months. Teachers are paid about right in most districts, though. The problem is that we want to attract good people to become teachers. how can we attract somebody, when we are telling them that we will only pay them 80% of what they should be worth for a full year. It's hard to get a p/t job for the school holidays only.

 

[perdidochas]

The other thing to think about is that the schools are technically not losing money for the days missed. It should read they only receive funding for when the child is present. Some will say "Lose", but schools also do not receive funding when a child is home sick. If you are going to send a "bill" home for missed days, it should be to everyone missing, not just those on vacation.

1) A school's expenses don't lessen considerably for a student that is absent. Therefore a loss of funding does cost the school system money. They have the same expenses, yet aren't getting the same reimbursement. You can't just lay off one teacher out of the 40 in your school for a day or two while you have high absenteeism.

2) A vacation is an optional missing of school. It is not a necessity like a sick day. I do agree, however, that the parents of students that are suspended or cutting school should be fined.

So I find it wrong to "charge" parents who have to take a family vacation during the school year. Some families have no choice! I know if I was still working at the bank, I would have no choice but to take my vacation during the school year. It was based on a Senority system, the person with the highest senority had first dibs on vacation time (and some had 5-6 weeks of vacation!).

Also, everybody here is making a mountain out of a molehill. There is no consequence for parents not paying the $36 a day.....

 

[perdidochas]

I complained and I have been to school board meetings, I have done the door to door thing to get a needed tax levy passed, I have donated my time, supplies and money. I save the school money by taking a vacation day when my sons class goes on a field trip because he is special needs they would have to get a bus just for him, pay an aide's way on the trip and get a substitue aide for his classroom. So yes I think this gives me the right to complain.

When they forcasted snow for late in the day so they called of school and we got nothing not one flake, that is needless how about calling it when we actually get snow. A grade day what the heck is that I thought it was for the teachers to get ready for parent teacher conferences but no it's just a day off.

I have 5 friends who teach in our district and one family member and believe me they are all very well paid. One makes $55,000 and he leaves 15 minutes after the kids do and gets there 15 minutes before school starts. So if you stretch it out to 8 hours a day and there is no way he works 8 hours a day he makes $38.19 an hour if he works 180 days I believe our district is in school 174 days so that is adding on 6 extra days and giving an hour a day for planning and stuff. He doesn't bring work home with him at night so he gets everything done at school. They all also see how ridiculous some of these days off are but they aren't going to complain because they are the ones that benefit.

He's not typical. When I taught, I got to school 45 minutes before the kids got there, left about an hour and a half after they left. My wife teaches, gets to school at 0745 and leaves around 5 most afternoons, then goes home and grades papers. She spends at least a few hours on Sunday afternoon either planning or learning something new (she learned how to use a new presentation program to use with her laptop/projector that she got from a grant last Sunday). Her contract days are 190.
I guess you live in a very unionized area....

It may not be daycare but when I budget so much for expenses and am hit with an extra day of daycare or taking the day off without pay I think it gives me the right to complain if my school thought I should pay them when I take my child on vacation. Especially when our district has so many "Superintendent's"... straight from the district website,

Superintendent
Associate Superintendent, Special Services
Assistant Superintendent, Elementary Education
Assistant Superintendent, Secondary Education
Assistant Superintendent, School Services
Assistant Superintendent, Finance
Assistant Superintendent, Curriculum & Instruction
Assistant Superintendent for Technology
Director of Safety & Security

All of these people make over $100,000 that is $900,000-$1,000,000 just in these 9 positions. Do we not see any waste here and see why I think it would be ridiculous for them to expect me to pay them to take my child on vacation.

If your system is the size of my wife's system (72 schools) that isn't unreasonable. A company that size would have comparable people making much more money to supervise the same number of employees.

Also, at least around here, I can tell you NEXT year's teacher work days based on the school district's calendar found on their website. My kids brought home a calender with teacher work days/holidays/etc. the first day of school. I do grant that weather days (around here most are hurricane days) are unexpected, and can cause some concern, but the teacher work days shouldn't be a surprise.

 

[MiniGirl]

When schools start cutting administrative cost, I might start to feel bad for them. Until then, no crying poverty.

Here. Here!!!! That letter from my school district would quickly be filed in the trash where it belongs. Around here, schools close all the time because of the threat of a hurricane (and I'm not saying they shouldn't), but we don't get our tax dollars back when that happens. It think it is absolutely absurd and beyond tacky. I can't believe anyone actually pays it.

 

[perdidochas]

Lets see... Social Workers/Case-managers with a master's degree. A real one, not an M.Ed., working for the same county that pays novice, unskilled teachers 1/3 more. No paid training...it isn't in the budget... Work year round, two weeks paid vacation. No guaranteed holidays, no paperwork days, no paid overtime, plus on-call beeper duty (also unpaid.) No special benefits, no retirement plan. If teachers didn't act like virgin sacrifices, I think people would feel more sympathetic for a job that isn't always easy. They want to be treated like professionals, but choose to belong to trade unions, and will STRIKE. They teach fads rather than facts. And they dawdle in psychology, where they hav no business.

A master's degree in Social Work is no more prestigious academically than a M.Ed. (and is possibly even less of a "real degree.") Sounds to me like the social workers need to think about unionizing......

 

[leighe]

Lets see... Social Workers/Case-managers with a master's degree. A real one, not an M.Ed., working for the same county that pays novice, unskilled teachers 1/3 more. No paid training...it isn't in the budget... Work year round, two weeks paid vacation. No guaranteed holidays, no paperwork days, no paid overtime, plus on-call beeper duty (also unpaid.) No special benefits, no retirement plan. If teachers didn't act like virgin sacrifices, I think people would feel more sympathetic for a job that isn't always easy. They want to be treated like professionals, but choose to belong to trade unions, and will STRIKE. They teach fads rather than facts. And they dawdle in psychology, where they hav no business.
QUOTE]

I'm sorry. Are you kidding me? This might be the most insulting post I have ever read in my life. I happen to have three M.A's - two "real" ones and one M.Ed. I don't recall the Masters in Edu being any easier or costing any less than the other two. I don't personally belong to a union but I can see why many teachers do and need to - attitudes like yours. All most teachers ask for is appropriate financial compensation for 1. the hours devoted and 2. the level of education required and for a little support from parents and the community.

I would go on about the "fads vs. facts" (in reality the curriculum is set by the state or district) and the 'dawdleing in psychology" but my altar is missing it's virgin.

 

[treboats]

If your system is the size of my wife's system (72 schools) that isn't unreasonable. A company that size would have comparable people making much more money to supervise the same number of employees.

There are 11 elementary schools, three middle schools and 2 high schools. All of these buildings have a principal and vice principal who make 75-100,000. I think administration costs are what kills the schools budgets just like in many companies. They never make the cuts at the top they always start at the bottom.

 

[perdidochas]

That is YOUR interpretation of the article. I posted MY interpretation (my opnion) in the title of this thread. Whether or not it was voluntary, I see it as a punishment for the parents for the school to even suggest it.

If you think requesting the money is punishment, then you are correct. I think that's a real stretch of an interpretation. I thought we were going to hear about students who weren't allowed to make up work, and end up failing. I guess when I hear punishment, I think of actual consequences that will hurt a student later on in school, not just a piece of paper that can be thrown away with no repercussions.

 

[Tiger926]

meandtheguys2 - I just removed my response to you as I'm not going to bother wasting my energy in responding to such ignorance. Not sure why you hate teachers so much - perhaps you didn't get accepted into teacher's college once upon a time?

Tiger

 

[Worfiedoodles]

Exactly!! School policies are approved by an elected group of people (whether it be the legislature or the school board).

I admit I haven't read this entire thread yet, but I just had to pipe in to say that where I live the school board is appointed, not elected. The Mayor appoints the school board, so I suppose you could say you elected the Mayor so you elected his policies, but they have been known to act independently, so it really seems that the public school system is more like the Supreme Court -- but at least they don't serve for life!

My ds attends private school, and we are seriously discouraged from taking older children (above 4th grade) out for a week for a vacation. We would never request a "refund" for the days he's absent -- we are paying for the opportunity to be there for him to learn, and for his teacher to be in place with materials, heat, electricity, and all the other things you need to operate a school.

 

[tink_about_it]

I'm a teacher and I think that it's ridiculous! Not everyone can vacation (or wants to) in the summer months. I personally would throw the letter away. It's a public school!