What's the deal with all of the scooters?

[roomthreeseventeen]

There must be a cut off line somewhere. I know not all scooters have that large of party with them but with the amount of scooters now present in the parks it's not hard to imagine a situation of three or even four scooters waiting for the same bus (specially for those resort that share buses). The waiting time can be easily triplified if a scooter plus six family members must be loaded first each and every time. Enforcing policy is a must in these cases.

There is a cutoff. The cutoff is 6 people per party. You can't fit more than 2 ECV's on a bus anyway.

 

[TDC Nala]

There is a cutoff line. 6 passengers with the disabled passenger. (Yes, sometimes the drivers don't enforce that.) and the most scooters you can get onto a bus at any one time is three (with the newer buses and there are not many of those). Three scooters plus six people is about 21 persons assuming each disabled passenger boards with a group of six. That won't fill an empty bus, not at all. Plus...if the bus is already full, the driver will not tell passengers already on the bus that they have to leave the bus to accommodate the scooter (if it's not terribly full the driver might ask them to get up from the seats where the scooter area is, but then their "entourage" doesn't get those seats either). So the scooter user waits for a bus that isn't full.

 

[BayouMickey]

Like I said, I've done it before and I've had split up my party just because a bus was full, believe me, don't believe me, I don't really care.

Honestly? I don't.. Human nature, you don't split up the pack.

 

[LucyBC80]

There is a cutoff. The cutoff is 6 people per party. You can't fit more than 2 ECV's on a bus anyway.

Then enforce said policy. I'm not talking about EVC's, I'm talking about the rest of the party. Have them stand off to the side, let those waiting to board board and have a chance to find a seat and then the rest of the party may enter the bus.

Call me selfish all you want but if I'm waiting for the bus and I purposely decide to wait for the next one so I can have a chance to seat (not really me, all I care is for a seat for my mom) yes, I'll be ticked if a scooter party that just arrived at the bus stop fills all available seats. Will Disney care that I'm mad? Nope, but that doesn't take my right to be.

 

[bumbershoot]

It IS a safety issue for those who are unfamiliar with operating them, OR do not follow the rules. Last year I was run DOWN by a scooter driven by a lady with a kid on her lap. I'm talking she hit me full force, I didn't see it coming, and I was flat to the ground with my ankle caught under her scooter! I had to tell her to GET OFF MY FOOT!
I was left with serious bruising and cuts from that incident. Not to mention a crowd of rubberneckers.
I get it if you NEED one, but learn how to use the things!

Since she couldn't drive it, it was likely a rental. Since it was a rental, she was also likely breaking the rules of her rental by having someone on her lap. She was definitely not driving safely!

And OUCH. That must have hurt.

I have to add with regard to driving ability....my mother requires an evc without it we couldn't go to disney. She's conquered a stroke and 3 different cancers. So her ability to drive is not so great.....and while you complain about a bad driver.....my mom goes off and cries bc she feels so bad about it and the person would NOT accept her apology.

I have no problem with people using scooters. However, I think they should have to wait in line for the buses just like everyone else. It's not air they get front of the line with a group of people, while others have been waiting as well.

There is no perfect solution.

Their own bus = "separate but equal", which America ENDED decades ago and thank goodness.

Their own line = they still have to be loaded first so they don't run over everyone.

Stay in the normal line = they can't always be seen, so the bus might be mainly full and then the person is there, and if the bus is too full for that person, they need to be full for everyone (b/c otherwise you are discriminating against them)

There's no perfect way.

I have no problems with scooters! I'm so happy that people of all abilities can enjoy Disney parks!

But I hate being run into by stuff; stroller or otherwise. I think that if you can't drive in a manner that will keep you from hitting people, a traditional wheelchair may be a better option.

I hate being run into, too.

But with a wheelchair, you're in a situation like a stroller. A person not used to a wheelchair is NOT going to have the strength to push themselves all day. So someone else will have to. And if you think being hit by a stroller that weighs maybe 100 lbs depending on how big and how big the kid/kids is/are hurts, can you imagine how badly it would hurt to have leg/wheelchair impact????


What I wish is that there was a place for scooter renters to practice. I think that would be very cool.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

Than enforce said policy. I'm not talking about EVC's, I'm talking about the rest of the party. Have then stand off to the side, let those waiting to board board and have a chance to find a seat and then the rest of the party may enter the bus.

Call me selfish all I want but if I'm waiting for the bus and I purposely decide to wait for the next one so I can have a chance to seat (not really me, all I care is for a seat for my mom) yes, I'll be ticked if a scooter party that just arrived at the bus stop fills all available seats. Will Disney care that I'm mad? Nope, but that doesn't take my right to be.

Yes, sorry, that's selfish.

 

[BayouMickey]

Than enforce said policy. I'm not talking about EVC's, I'm talking about the rest of the party. Have then stand off to the side, let those waiting to board board and have a chance to find a seat and then the rest of the party may enter the bus.

Call me selfish all I want but if I'm waiting for the bus and I purposely decide to wait for the next one so I can have a chance to seat (not really me, all I care is for a seat for my mom) yes, I'll be ticked if a scooter party that just arrived at the bus stop fills all available seats. Will Disney care that I'm mad? Nope, but that doesn't take my right to be.

Doesn't matter, the policy isn't going to change.. So +1 for the ECV team!

 

[LucyBC80]

Yes, sorry, that's selfish.

No need to be sorry, we're all selfish at some point. Some are just afraid to say they feel the same way.

Doesn't matter, the policy isn't going to change.. So +1 for the ECV team!

Didn't know you're keeping scores, so, uhm, yay for you?

 

[bookgirl]

The generation that grew up on the Mickey Mouse Club, the original fans are seniors as people age they are more likely to need mobility help.

I think that's a lot of it. Plus as more people use them, people who before would have been 'embarressed' to use one are just part of the whole and they do not stand out anymore, so they are willing to get one.

Scooters, strollers, small kids on wheelies they are just part of the landscape. Until they run into me I don't care. A stroller ran over my mom last trip, I did not see it till after the fact. Mom was slightly behind me and we were just walking up the entrance plaza to Fantasmic. Mom said they hit her then just moved on with out saying anything. I find that rude, no matter who should have been looking out for who, if you collide then both sides need to acknowledge and if you're at fault you apologize.

 

[bumbershoot]

And even if I were JUST an overweight person looking to get through Disney without pain, what's it to you or anyone else?

That's a wonderful, beautiful point!




Sometimes, being overweight *causes* problems. In the last year and a half I lost 85 pounds. It was a Disneyland/UniversalOrlando trip that finally got me to realize that at that point I was just about hitting a place that could be called somewhat disabled. My feet felt like someone was hammering the bones. One leg swelled up more than the other. Both ankles were messed up. I *had to* use epsom salts in a bath EVERY night in order to be close to feeling OK the next morning. I fantasized about using a scooter.

When we got home, I turned the TV on at the right time and saw Jennifer Hudson in a WW commercial. Decided to really try it again (I had "kinda" done WW in the past and it "kinda" worked, until I would quit) and go from there.

And here we are. I discovered that MY problems were *because* of the extra weight.

And so if I had used that scooter because of my problems? Doesn't alter anyone else's life, unless I managed to run over someone of course. My REASON for wanting to use one wouldn't change anything.

I was lucky that my problems were fixed (for now, at least...looking at family history I don't know how long my knees and hips will be healthy) by the weight loss. I am lucky that I've been able to be active as the weight came off, which made my muscles and joints stronger. It doesn't work that way for everyone.


If time and genetics catch up with me and I end up in a scooter because of my joints, now that I'm thin, it doesn't change anything for anyone else (unless, again, I run into someone). It's no different for other people than if I had decided to use one 2 years ago when I was heavier and in pain all the time.

 

[BayouMickey]

No need to be sorry, we're all selfish at some point. Some are just afraid to say they feel the same way.


Didn't know you're keeping scores, so, uhm, yay for you?

Not me I don't need one.. But I'm humane enough to have understanding ..

 

[peachygreen]

Are there more ECV's in the park now than there were 5 years ago? Likely. Is it because people are using them because people are "lazy" or "faking"? Doubtful.

My guess is you see more ECV's in the park because 1) they are easier to rent now than they were 5 years ago and 2) we have a large population of aging baby boomers who want to remain active and do things like Disney with or without their extended family. With the access to ECV's more people are able to be more independant than they could be in a wheelchair at a park and are therefore more likely to attempt to go and spend that time with their family.

It took some convincing but I convinced my mom she needed an ECV last year for our trip to Disney World. She agreed after the fact that there is no way she would have made it through the trip without it. She was going through a cancer relaspe and on chemo again which drains her of energy and makes walking extended distances difficult. Even with the ECV she had issues but she was able to make the best of it.

Trust me on this from what I can see there is no advantage for an able bodied person in an ECV. You have to wait for elevators instead of using the escalators/stairs. On rides that they send you through on the ECV you have to navigate sometimes very tight turns in line, often wait longer than you would if you were walking and get split up from the rest of the party. As my mom said you also become invisible to people walking. They don't look down, so they cross directly infront of you without warning and so you have to constantly be vigaliant in crowds. My dad would frequently stear for my mom and play crowd control to help her move through the crowds. He did this because he was up higher and people would see him and not walk into him. You also see the park at a very different perspective. You spend a lot of time looking at kneecaps and rear ends when you are sitting in an ECV.

My mom was very greatful to have the ability to rent an ECV and enjoy our family trip together but it was a challenge at times.

I will say that the CM's were great with my mom and were very helpful to my mom and dad showing them where to park the ECV, asking if she could transfer, showing her the best options (transfering or riding), and just being friendly to the lady in the sparkly hat. Other guests at times were not as great.

We drove so we didn't deal with the bus issues so I can't address those. I'm not a huge bus fan to begin with so I rent a car and drive at the parks (busses stress me out so are not the best way to have a relaxing vacation). We found it easier to not use the trams in the parking lots so we always attempted to be there before rope drop so we could park in the near parking lots where we could avoid the trams and walk to the entrance. Even if we were a bit out it was still easier to walk extra with the ECV and the stroller than it would be to fold the stroller and try to use the Trams.

 

[lustergirl]

Two years ago I tore my ACL and was on a scooter.. I hit quite a few people, because they decided "hey lets cut in front of a moving vehicle". So maybe people should also learn about inertia and propulsion...

I am using a scooter right now at work because of a torn meninscus.

 

[jimmysmom74]

Oh I'm SO sorry. My mom died at 55, too, it's just a brutal age to have moms taken from you. In my case I had just turned 30, my life was finally turning around out of my silly 20s, I was looking forward to the rest, and wham. No mom. Brutal. I'm so sorry.

Thanks and I am sorry for your loss as well. I really loved my MIL and it was a huge loss for my nephews and son. I always told her "to just rent one of those scooter thingies"...and she was like "I'm too young for that".

I think it was ppl like some of those that have made rude, unkind remarks in this thread that kept her from just going with us and renting the ECV that would have made it possible for her to come with us the fall before her death. I wish ppl could step in someone's shoes once in a while to see their difficulties.

I have waited for buses when someone comes up with a scooter before, but much like I can't tell if a child has an invisible disability, I also can't tell the reason someone is on a scooter. I always assume that they HAVE a disability and although I wish I was getting on the bus, I understand that their disabilities don't disappear when they leave WDW. It's everyday, I can wait for another bus, no biggie!

 

[bastos]

Stop.

You have NO idea what any person sitting is going through. You have NO idea if they are rude, blind, have balance problems, just had hip surgery, are dealing with an asthma attack and just trying to get back to the room, etc. No have no idea about anything.

And I, when pregnant, HATED sitting. Sitting hurt. Getting down to sit hurt. Getting up from sitting hurt. I liked to stand. If I had known what a Disney fan I would become later on and had gone to Disney, I would NOT have sat down.

On buses I got to deal with people INSISTING I sit down, and being ridiculous when I said "no thank you I prefer to stand". Like people continuing to stand, like I'm a feeble stupid woman who doesn't know what I need/want. Just being ridiculous.

When DS arrived and I wore him everywhere, he HATED being in the sling/Ergo when I was sitting. So much hatred for sitting, LOL. So we stood, again. And again, people wanted to insist that we follow their program, and again did silly things when I refused to sit simply because they wanted to be gallant. Your gallant agenda doesn't change my own wishes and needs.

So one, don't insist on someone sitting just because you THINK they should sit. Live your life, sit in that seat, don't be ridiculous. And two, don't assume from the outside appearances that a person CAN stand to relieve someone else.


ETA: we rent a condo in a building that is mostly very senior citizens. Our next door neighbor is in his late 90s. He is vital and amazing, and I cannot imagine him EVER sitting on a bus. So just because you're elderly doesn't mean you WANT to sit, either.

Whereas my MIL was old before she was 40. By the time I met her (she was just over 60, I believe) she had had two heart attacks. Now she's had at least 2 more and at least 6 "mini" strokes. She LOOKS healthy. She's not. She doesn't look anywhere near 75, either. You might think she's able to stand, but she really should not do so when on a bus.

20 years younger than my neighbor, but a universe of difference in health between them.



Oh I'm SO sorry. My mom died at 55, too, it's just a brutal age to have moms taken from you. In my case I had just turned 30, my life was finally turning around out of my silly 20s, I was looking forward to the rest, and wham. No mom. Brutal. I'm so sorry.

Perhaps I was too curt. Or not explanatory enough. When I see a person standing in front of others - a full bus of others - I guess I expect a seat to be offered. When I offer the seat on the other side of the bus and the standing person accepts - that person needed a seat. Riding on as many buses as I was on - I thought someone else - other than my wife and I would offer the seat.

Can I know any other person's pain? Absolutely not. However, I can't believe that on every ride we were on that the wife and I stood that every other seated person was less able than the two of us. Would I say something? Probably not. But do I think it? Yes.

 

[pbrim]

You know, I keep hearing about all these scooters with 10, 15, 20 people with them (it keeps getting higher every time we have one of these threads), but I've never seen one. It's amazing how they only appear when there is someone already disgruntled about ECV users.

But if we are going to use anectdotes for data, what ticks me off is the hitch hikers. Twice when I have been travelling solo, families of walkers have crowded in next to me in the ECV line, trying to act as if they are with me to board the bus early!

Speaking of ECV's boarding first -- have you ever tried to parallel park in a tight space? Kind of nerve-wracking wasn't it? Maybe it took you a couple of tries. Now imagine trying to do it with a whole bunch of pedestrians surrounding your car, complete with little kids and babies! There is a reason for ECVs boarding first and exiting last. Believe me, you wouldn't like it any other way! (Unless, of course, you are one of those who think all us icky imperfectly mobile people should just stay home behind closed doors, so you don't have to be inconvienced by us.)

 

[Merida226]

It IS a safety issue for those who are unfamiliar with operating them, OR do not follow the rules. Last year I was run DOWN by a scooter driven by a lady with a kid on her lap. I'm talking she hit me full force, I didn't see it coming, and I was flat to the ground with my ankle caught under her scooter! I had to tell her to GET OFF MY FOOT!
I was left with serious bruising and cuts from that incident. Not to mention a crowd of rubberneckers.
I get it if you NEED one, but learn how to use the things!

Exactly!!!

SAFETY for everyone is an issue. I didn't feel like mentioning this specifically in my first post, because it was so traumatizing for us. We are still driving back home from taking our 4 year old for for his first time. He was two steps infront of my husband walking to the stroller parking when a nearly 300 lb woman started to back over my son. He was knocked down and his legs were under the scooter. My husband acted fast and shoved her and the scooter off him. The wheels didn't go over him, we don't think, as there was a small space between the wheels. It was our first day at the parks and was extremely traumatizing for us, and scary to think what else she could have done to our precious son. We are bitter. Saw lots of crazy/annoying drivers he whole trip. Nearly running us down. We drove and didn't have to deal with them and buses- thank god. We plenty of "gangs" of scooters or single riders that appeared not to be with anyone else. Those were the most annoying and frustrating. If a whole family was with one, they seemed like they were trying to direct them. We were lucky to get past it, and it didn't ruin our whole trip, or send my son to the hospital.

We saw a middle aged woman with some sort of ankle problem walking through the park with her family. If that lady could do it with her disability, sure seems like a large portion of scooter riders could do it.

 

[rebeccam31]

If you have problems standing, wait for the next bus. Don't expect someone to get up for you.

Seriously? I hope this is a joke but I'm thinking it likely is not.

 

[ZoZo]

And even if I were JUST an overweight person looking to get through Disney without pain, what's it to you or anyone else? Quite frankly, as long as I'm not pushing an elderly person off her scooter and speeding through crowds and plowing down folks to avoid security, I don't see how it's anyone's business how I get around the parks.

Excellent point.

 

[peachygreen]

You know, I keep hearing about all these scooters with 10, 15, 20 people with them (it keeps getting higher every time we have one of these threads), but I've never seen one. It's amazing how they only appear when there is someone already disgruntled about ECV users.

Well technically we were a party of 14 with our ECV user (plus 2 double strollers) but we were rarerly together as a party of 14 and typically if my mom needed the ECV/wheel chair entrance only she and my dad went that way. So the large party does exist. As I said you would never have seen us on a bus though.