Article on WDW considering a "demand pricing plan"

[lockedoutlogic]

Park hopping is only an issue if the tiered pricing is gate specific. Even that I don't see how that is a system limitation.

I use to do a lot of this gate control stuff in a previous career. I don't miss it. Often Marketing/management want to implement a perfectly reasonable new idea, only to find that an old idea they implemented years ago, is at odds with what they want to create now. Gate control is very logic based, and marketing almost never is.

So you're suggesting they will yield the current magic kingdom offset?

Oh...they are NOT gonna like that. That's every person, every day of the year.

Still you might be right.

I had to chuckle when you compared the marketers to the operations though...I know that fight well.

 

[sachilles]

I had to chuckle when you compared the marketers to the operations though...I know that fight well.

Universal truth

 

[Eoghann]

I can honestly say that I really didn't buy anything in the parks this year. I did buy the you are here Starbucks mugs but those aren't really parks merch that's a Starbucks thing. Most of my purchases came at the runDisney expo where I think they do have some good stuff.

Which would be exactly why they are more interested in first time visitors over repeat visitors...

 

[epcotty]

Which would be exactly why they are more interested in first time visitors over repeat visitors...

I think the current management is very short-sighted. They're willing to consider something which definitely could and would lose a lot of current repeat customers and also make a lot of the first time visitors only go there once, and the rest of the first time visitors probably having nowhere near the loyalty of previous repeat customers

 

[rteetz]

I think the current management is very short-sighted. They're willing to consider something which definitely could and would lose a lot of current repeat customers and also make a lot of the first time visitors only go there once, and the rest of the first time visitors probably having nowhere near the loyalty of previous repeat customers

Again Disney has the mentality of if you leave someone else will be right behind you to take your place.

 

[Ursula's Apprentice]

Again Disney has the mentality of if you leave someone else will be right behind you to take your place.

Sad, but true.

 

[epcotty]

It easily could be a large amount of repeat customers who would leave over this and the amount of new visitors could and probably would be a lot less and then they wouldn't have the loyalty of former repeat customers probably. I say it's a potential recipe for disaster based on extreme overconfidence. They can't necessarily do anything they like just because they're Disney and expect that they'll always have as many or more people coming as before. I know that now they're popular but that could easily change with a very risky new strategy such as this

 

[rteetz]

It easily could be a large amount of repeat customers who would leave over this and the amount of new visitors could and probably would be a lot less and then they wouldn't have the loyalty of former repeat customers probably. I say it's a potential recipe for disaster based on extreme overconfidence. They can't necessarily do anything they like just because they're Disney and expect that they'll always have as many or more people coming as before. I know that now they're popular but that could easily change, especially with a very risky new strategy such as this

They are going to do what they want until people speak with their wallets.

 

[ColoradoDreamin]

It easily could be a large amount of repeat customers who would leave over this and the amount of new visitors could and probably would be a lot less and then they wouldn't have the loyalty of former repeat customers probably. I say it's a potential recipe for disaster based on extreme overconfidence. They can't necessarily do anything they like just because they're Disney and expect that they'll always have as many or more people coming as before. I know that now they're popular but that could easily change with a very risky new strategy such as this

Disney does a lot of research before they do anything. While you may feel that way, loyal customers are well...more loyal than you think. They do a lot of surveys, and even if a survey says 10% said they wouldn't come back if they did x, y or z, more often than not people in that 10% would still come back...so in actuality those percentages are always smaller. They certainly will spend a lot more time with a lot smarter people crunching the real numbers (that we do not have access to) than anybody on this board can actually boast they have. Therefore, they have a much better knowledge base to come up with a real answer on whether it is worth it or not to do any change at all.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

It easily could be a large amount of repeat customers who would leave over this and the amount of new visitors could and probably would be a lot less and then they wouldn't have the loyalty of former repeat customers probably. I say it's a potential recipe for disaster based on extreme overconfidence. They can't necessarily do anything they like just because they're Disney and expect that they'll always have as many or more people coming as before. I know that now they're popular but that could easily change with a very risky new strategy such as this

If there's anything that the frequent customers have proven at wdw in the 10 last years...it's that they have NO SPINE whatsoever.

They have paid/rolled with every shakeup Iger has decreed...and there has been quite a few.

 

[Eoghann]

I think the current management is very short-sighted. They're willing to consider something which definitely could and would lose a lot of current repeat customers and also make a lot of the first time visitors only go there once, and the rest of the first time visitors probably having nowhere near the loyalty of previous repeat customers

Should I post my weekly "public companies worry only about the quarterly earnings and are largely incapable of long term strategy..." rant?

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Should I post my weekly "public companies worry only about the quarterly earnings and are largely incapable of long term strategy..." rant?

Nope...the last one is still valid and completely correct

 

[beer dave]

so when they start tiered pricing, how much you want to bet the AP's go to three levels-- bronze times only, bronze and silver, and the coveted ultra gold?

 

[mshanson3121]

They are going to do what they want until people speak with their wallets.

Given the economy, they're being over confident. Look what happened after 9/11. The economy is not nearly as recovered or stable as people think it is, and could change on a dime these days. It would not be wise of Disney to try something like this, in this economy.

 

[mshanson3121]

I am curious to see if they would offer a disability discount like Shanghai is offering

 

[3DisneyFanz]

Should I post my weekly "public companies worry only about the quarterly earnings and are largely incapable of long term strategy..." rant?

You should start throwing in the corporate examples like Kodak and Kmart that thought they were too big to fail until the market proved them wrong.

 

[Eoghann]

You should start throwing in the corporate examples like Kodak and Kmart that thought they were too big to fail until the market proved them wrong.

Well there's a key difference there. In those cases either the market fundamentally shifted (digital cameras and smart phones) or someone came in and did what they were doing better. Disney is not in that position currently as far as theme parks are concerned (ESPN might be another story). And the thing is it's not necessarily corporate arrogance. It's actually extremely hard to change business models in an established public company because the market will likely punish you for the reduced earnings you experience while you shift.

 

[3DisneyFanz]

Well there's a key difference there. In those cases either the market fundamentally shifted (digital cameras and smart phones) or someone came in and did what they were doing better. Disney is not in that position currently as far as theme parks are concerned (ESPN might be another story). And the thing is it's not necessarily corporate arrogance. It's actually extremely hard to change business models in an established public company because the market will likely punish you for the reduced earnings you experience while you shift.

I think an argument could be made that another company is in fact doing theme parks better at this point. Disney still has a chance to show they are the lead dog with Star Wars and Toy Story lands but if they suffer the same budgetary decisions every other project in Florida does it's going to be very problematic. I also think that it's pretty clear Disney did change business models over the past 20+ years and not as a positive in terms of consumer focus.

 

[Eoghann]

I think an argument could be made that another company is in fact doing theme parks better at this point. Disney still has a chance to show they are the lead dog with Star Wars and Toy Story lands but if they suffer the same budgetary decisions every other project in Florida does it's going to be very problematic. I also think that it's pretty clear Disney did change business models over the past 20+ years and not as a positive in terms of consumer focus.

No not really. Universal are not significantly cheaper, they're not doing anything dramatically different and having a handful of arguably better rides and one high draw well themed land doesn't make them overall better. They are a credible competitor which is something Disney really hasn't had but it's hardly KMart vs. Walmart.

And really the changes in the last 20 years are more a case of refinements to squeeze out more money than any sort of radical shift in business model. They still make money by packing people into the parks and upselling them. That hasn't changed. But, when you're talking Wall Street you can't separate the parks out from the rest of the company. So that's not really what matters.

 

[3DisneyFanz]

No not really. Universal are not significantly cheaper, they're not doing anything dramatically different and having a handful of arguably better rides and one high draw well themed land doesn't make them overall better. They are a credible competitor which is something Disney really hasn't had but it's hardly KMart vs. Walmart.

And really the changes in the last 20 years are more a case of refinements to squeeze out more money than any sort of radical shift in business model. They still make money by packing people into the parks and upselling them. That hasn't changed. But, when you're talking Wall Street you can't separate the parks out from the rest of the company. So that's not really what matters.

I don't think anyone has to be cheaper. People rarely complain about prices when they feel they're getting their money's worth out of a product. I don't even think something has to be overall better to begin drawing away business as much as they just need to keep trending in the right direction. Consumers like bright shiny objects and shifts often occur generations later. People's parents thought they were crazy at one time for buying a Honda instead of a Chevy but now that's just seen as a completely logical decision.

I completely agree that changes have been made to maximize profits but it has been at the expense of the original plan which involved high levels of maintenance and constant plussing of one kind or another. However when you focus on the one time visitor they don't care that fish don't jump, tigger doesn't bounce and the paperboy sells to a dark alley because they don't know any better. I could be wrong but I don't think the company was founded on the ideal of giving less for more but that certainly seems to be the current philosophy and tiered ticket pricing would just be another example.