Official 2017 D23 Expo Thread

MaxRebo - I think you are restating one of the fallacies people often repeat regarding businesses like Disney (well, business in general). Businesses don't have to keep increasing profits. Businesses really just have to break even, in theory, to stay in business. Of course people will argue that publicly traded companies have to serve the interests of the share holders (at the direction of the board/CEO), but there is no one way in which they need to serve these interests. This logic is often used for "well, the money for improvements needs to come from somewhere, and so prices need to go up". The implication of this is that the money can't come from existing revenues / profits. It absolutely can. There is no reason a company like Disney, who is making billions off its parks (esp North American Parks), needs to increase prices to pay for improvements. And the fact that we fall into that trap of thinking, that this is the dominant discourse surrounding such improvements and prices in general (that prices always go up) only allows companies like disney to continually increase prices.

As for the "Extras" and Hard ticket events - its great to say we are ok with them as long as they are extras, and don't detract from our experience, is all well and good in principle, but we need to be a little more detailed in examining exactly what they do. Many of those "extras" DO actually effect our vacations. Something as simple as the Christmas/Halloween parties - while they don't seem to affect us on the surface (don't want to pay for them, just don't go) Lets remember that they close the park to other people, people who are paying the same amount for their days tickets as others do all year. Essentially those parties detract from the value of everyone else's tickets. Same with the extra morning / evening hours. On the surface, no impact, but I know that this past year if you compare the number of extra Magic hours and total park hours open, to the park hours open without paying for the hard ticket opening, the total park hours were down significantly. Not nearly as many extra magic hours as previous years. Desert parties, again seem not to impact others, but in reality those paying customers get prime viewing locations for events that everyone used to have access to, now you need to pay for them. Other offerings, like the express transport for instance, again on the surface - no impact, but we don't really know what the overall impact. In the long run does disney run fewer buses to the other routes ? Do they direct the newer / nicer buses to the express service? (Obviously the overall impacts of the express buses are impossible to know from an outside perspective, but they seem like the one that would LEAST effect others, just pointing out that even they might do so). The overall point, a lot of the "extras" that people pay for actually DO take away from the value of the tickets others have paid for, weather its potential time in the parks, access to prime areas, or the assignment of personnel / resources from general guests to paying guests.

That would be true if Disney just wanted to stay in business - but their #1 priority is to properly serve their stockholders who don't just want the company to stay in business but want profits to increase and dividends to keep coming and the stock price to go up

Now Disney is a little different in that there is value in the Brand and if they strayed turning off families and stuff that could impact the value of the brand and thus the stock - but that is a long term issue and the vast majority of the stock is owned by institutions which care a lot more about next quarter's earnings than they do about the ratings 10 or 20 years from now

And I agree about the extras that take away from the "baseline" experience - but I think those have been in the minority and usually can be planned around (there are 3 other parks to go to on party nights for example)
 
Which page/post on the thread is the photo/artists rendering of Epcot that's been mentioned. I'd look through all the pages but my computer has been really slow and crashing a lot past couple days so looking through 81 pages isn't easy at the moment.

Of the rendering of the overview of Future World? It's this one (which was referred to as "blue sky" concept art - so who knows how realistic it is)

IMG_5014.JPG
 
MaxRebo - I think you are restating one of the fallacies people often repeat regarding businesses like Disney (well, business in general). Businesses don't have to keep increasing profits. Businesses really just have to break even, in theory, to stay in business. Of course people will argue that publicly traded companies have to serve the interests of the share holders (at the direction of the board/CEO), but there is no one way in which they need to serve these interests. This logic is often used for "well, the money for improvements needs to come from somewhere, and so prices need to go up". The implication of this is that the money can't come from existing revenues / profits. It absolutely can. There is no reason a company like Disney, who is making billions off its parks (esp North American Parks), needs to increase prices to pay for improvements. And the fact that we fall into that trap of thinking, that this is the dominant discourse surrounding such improvements and prices in general (that prices always go up) only allows companies like disney to continually increase prices.

As for the "Extras" and Hard ticket events - its great to say we are ok with them as long as they are extras, and don't detract from our experience, is all well and good in principle, but we need to be a little more detailed in examining exactly what they do. Many of those "extras" DO actually effect our vacations. Something as simple as the Christmas/Halloween parties - while they don't seem to affect us on the surface (don't want to pay for them, just don't go) Lets remember that they close the park to other people, people who are paying the same amount for their days tickets as others do all year. Essentially those parties detract from the value of everyone else's tickets. Same with the extra morning / evening hours. On the surface, no impact, but I know that this past year if you compare the number of extra Magic hours and total park hours open, to the park hours open without paying for the hard ticket opening, the total park hours were down significantly. Not nearly as many extra magic hours as previous years. Desert parties, again seem not to impact others, but in reality those paying customers get prime viewing locations for events that everyone used to have access to, now you need to pay for them. Other offerings, like the express transport for instance, again on the surface - no impact, but we don't really know what the overall impact. In the long run does disney run fewer buses to the other routes ? Do they direct the newer / nicer buses to the express service? (Obviously the overall impacts of the express buses are impossible to know from an outside perspective, but they seem like the one that would LEAST effect others, just pointing out that even they might do so). The overall point, a lot of the "extras" that people pay for actually DO take away from the value of the tickets others have paid for, weather its potential time in the parks, access to prime areas, or the assignment of personnel / resources from general guests to paying guests.
I have to admit that I don't understand this thinking at all. Ignores a fundamental reality of how the business world functions -- and with good reason. A profit motive is critical. Just breaking even -- how should that be a goal? I think you're describing a nonprofit.

That would be true if Disney just wanted to stay in business - but their #1 priority is to properly serve their stockholders who don't just want the company to stay in business but want profits to increase and dividends to keep coming and the stock price to go up

Now Disney is a little different in that there is value in the Brand and if they strayed turning off families and stuff that could impact the value of the brand and thus the stock - but that is a long term issue and the vast majority of the stock is owned by institutions which care a lot more about next quarter's earnings than they do about the ratings 10 or 20 years from now

And I agree about the extras that take away from the "baseline" experience - but I think those have been in the minority and usually can be planned around (there are 3 other parks to go to on party nights for example)
Agree on every point.
 
And I agree about the extras that take away from the "baseline" experience - but I think those have been in the minority and usually can be planned around (there are 3 other parks to go to on party nights for example)
With the proviso that you have already purchased the add-on extra park hopper. You could always choose to go bare bones, not pay for the park hopper, lose your evening hours at MK, and just go spend more money at Dis Springs or drown your sorrows at Trader Sam's with $25 take home souvenir cocktails. The cheap, cleaner living/less fun model is to rope drop, walk like a maniac for 9+ then collapse at 7pm. Sometimes I just do that if I don't want to give WDW even more of my $. But a few drown my sorrows splurge nights are kinda cool.
 
With the proviso that you have already purchased the add-on extra park hopper. You could always choose to go bare bones, not pay for the park hopper, lose your evening hours at MK, and just go spend more money at Dis Springs or drown your sorrows at Trader Sam's with $25 take home souvenir cocktails. The cheap, cleaner living/less fun model is to rope drop, walk like a maniac for 9+ then collapse at 7pm. Sometimes I just do that if I don't want to give WDW even more of my $. But a few drown my sorrows splurge nights are kinda cool.

Right - or just pick a different park entirely for the days there is a party - they don't have them every night

Though, I do think this is another things that makes it tough on people that don't plan - if I just showed up and didn't know about the parties and just that now the park hours were less I'd be a little annoyed - but doing WDW nowadays really does take at least some planning
 
Sorry if this was already posted but hadn't seen this - looks like August 13th is the last day for Ellen's Energy Adventure - according to MDE at least. Guess they are getting started on this quick!

View attachment 253405
It was mentioned on DPB yesterday -- bears repeating for those going soon! We're in WDW Aug 7-17, so are going to make sure to get in one last ride. It's not exactly a FAVORITE of ours, but we do ride it every trip... and have some great memories of the kids on it when they were little. :)
 
We got an amazing amount of news. Disney World's is feeling the pressure from UOR. Let's realize we are getting five new rides by the end of 2019 and three more in that time. We have lost a ton of things to get these new additions. What a time to be alive. All I can hope is that they keep investing in the Parks long term because there's so much more to work on.

If everything is complete by the fiftieth, guests are getting ten new rides in five years inclusive of this year with Pandora. Universal has been giving us one per year (half the parks), but the ten laid out by Disney are ALL significantly better than Jimmy Fallon or Fast and the Furious. They better get working on Nintendo, a third park or more Potter!!!
 
If everything is complete by the fiftieth, guests are getting ten new rides in five years inclusive of this year with Pandora. Universal has been giving us one per year (half the parks), but the ten laid out by Disney are ALL significantly better than Jimmy Fallon or Fast and the Furious. They better get working on Nintendo, a third park or more Potter!!!
Funny -- DS12 and I were just talking about this... his reaction to the list of new stuff: "Man... wonder if people at Universal are worried... hunkering down in a war room today!!" So we had a nice discussion on how market competition is great for consumers! :thumbsup2
 
Yes - hot and cold on this. My vacation is in Sept. I started this week with 2 attractions down (Splash &HoP) & ended the week with 5 down (Splash, HoP, Ellen, GMR & likely MS).
Disappointing, but I'd rather they get started sooner rather than later!

Not saying that you are doing this AT ALL, but I always marvel at how some will complain that Disney isn't adding enough new stuff, and then immediately shift into complaining about a ton of construction! :rotfl:
 
For Epcot, its not a cup runneth over, its a mixed bag. Meaning, one attraction is gained in FW E&W that replaces an existing attraction for a net gain of zero and one restaurant is gained. No additional attractions filling empty spaces. And, the additional country that everyone hoped for did not appear.

Do you want two parks to be running at half of their attraction capacity at the same time? They gave a glimpse of the spine, which is a complete overhaul. I think they've heard/seen the backlash with all of the construction at Studios and know they can't do that again.
 
If everything is complete by the fiftieth, guests are getting ten new rides in five years inclusive of this year with Pandora. Universal has been giving us one per year (half the parks), but the ten laid out by Disney are ALL significantly better than Jimmy Fallon or Fast and the Furious. They better get working on Nintendo, a third park or more Potter!!!

That and the announcement that Disney isn't done yet. There is more that will be announced. In a year or a few months, who knows?
 
I would think realists at Universal see the Disney upgrades as generally good things. They still need to keep their parks "fresh," but they will likely benefit from the potential increase in visitors to Orlando (as will many other businesses).
 
I'm hoping for maybe a new nighttime parade or other entertainment offering... and I won't say no to another new attraction... ... :D

My belief is that there will definitely be a night time parade but I don't believe it will be a new one. One the Live Stream they were showing MSEP in the warehouse and saying people were missing it. So they turned the lights on. That will return. Others feel it will be a new parade so maybe I'm reading it wrong.
 
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I'm a little confused by the new theater that was announced for Magic Kingdom. Supposedly it will be on/adjacent to Main Street, but I'm confused about what that means and where it will be. I know I missed 90% of the posts today, but does anyone have info on where this will be and what it is replacing?

New theater will go backstage of sorts in where to overflow walk way is in the Magic Kingdom.

Since I'm a "hope for the best but plan for the worst" type of person... anyone worried that any of these additions are in jeopardy IF there's a change in leadership and Iger actually retires this time?

I would say no. When Eisner left projects in the works still happened under Iger.

So when they say 'in time for the 50th', what does that mean? Does the 50th celebration start at the beginning of 2021, or does it start October 2021?

The 50th celebration will likely begin before October 1st, 2021 so they can market it like the Disneyland 60th.

I'm here for the day :)

I have a lot of things I want to do. Still haven't seen the SW land model.

Have fun!

Sorry if this was already posted but hadn't seen this - looks like August 13th is the last day for Ellen's Energy Adventure - according to MDE at least. Guess they are getting started on this quick!

View attachment 253405

Yep, this was confirmed in the DPB. Both GMR and UoE will close that day.

I'm hoping for maybe a new nighttime parade or other entertainment offering... and I won't say no to another new attraction... ... :D

My guess is we won't see that announced until the next expo because the 50th is still a 4 years away.
 
Yes - hot and cold on this. My vacation is in Sept. I started this week with 2 attractions down (Splash &HoP) & ended the week with 5 down (Splash, HoP, Ellen, GMR & likely MS).

Definitely bad timing now especially for them to have Splash down (stinks to have it closed in a "hot" month)
 

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