Yelling - is it child abuse?

[pahoben]

Duct tape works pretty well as a mute button.

Right they’re not adults & should be treated with even more kindness & patience. If a child “only responds” to yelling that’s a learned behavior. Again, I’m not saying I don’t ever yell when I get frustrated, but it’s not a method of parenting rather my lack of self control and/or effective skills.

Actually all children are born with certain personality characteristics. Again some are fearful and some not, some are strong willed and some not, some are fearful and some not, etc. As much as some people would like to believe they are not a blank slate that a parent writes virtues on. For goodness sake my twins have been together from the womb on and very different personalities (both are girls). One is very strong willed and one not. One is more fearful then the other.
What data do you have that shows never raising your voice to your children results in better adults. You don’t because there is no data that shows that-it is a belief. Different kids benefit from different strategies in rearing.

 

[amberpi]

I don't think yelling is child abuse in all instances, but of course it can be. I will say that by not doing it often if I have to yell "don't climb the banister" it does get attention. I'm sure that yelling, like any other tool, diminishes the more often it's used. Mostly, in personal experience, the kids know I mean business is I say LAST NAME children. They'll both stop knowing they're caught in whatever mischief they weren't supposed to be in. No need to raise a voice at all

 

[amberpi]

Actually all children are born with certain personality characteristics. Again some are fearful and some not, some are strong willed and some not, some are fearful and some not, etc. As much as some people would like to believe they are not a blank slate that a parent writes virtues on. For goodness sake my twins have been together from the womb on and very different personalities (both are girls). One is very strong willed and one not. One is more fearful then the other.
What data do you have that shows never raising your voice to your children results in better adults. You don’t because there is no data that shows that-it is a belief. Different kids benefit from different strategies in rearing.

Different kids even behave differently in different environments. Teachers get different kids than parents or grandparents, etc.

 

[Soldier's*Sweeties]

My dad was always way more effective when he got down to my level and lowered his voice than when he yelled.

 

[gotomu212]

Or is it appropriate for adults to yell at each other to get them to comply. Of course not. Safety when it’s an emergency to me seems the only appropriate use. I don’t think it’s abuse, though, (but could be), it’s just not appropriate or effective IMO. Doesn’t mean I’m perfect & don’t do it occasionally out of frustration, but I also don’t justify that it’s ok or “necessary”.

Well I’ve never had an adult get a crayon stuck in their nose, leave their legos all over the floor for me to step on, or make me late to work because they have suddenly lost their shoes.

On the other hand in my 20s when sharing group apartments occasionally you would yell at other adults about how nasty they left the bathroom or the need to turn the music down. And police yell at adults all the time to get them to comply.

 

[Floridaman999]

My dad was always way more effective when he got down to my level and lowered his voice than when he yelled.

Mine just had to give me "that look". It was all over after that. No audible communication needed.

 

[low-key]

I
When's the next Vegas trip?

mid April,thanks for asking

 

[LSUmiss]

Actually all children are born with certain personality characteristics. Again some are fearful and some not, some are strong willed and some not, some are fearful and some not, etc. As much as some people would like to believe they are not a blank slate that a parent writes virtues on. For goodness sake my twins have been together from the womb on and very different personalities (both are girls). One is very strong willed and one not. One is more fearful then the other.
What data do you have that shows never raising your voice to your children results in better adults. You don’t because there is no data that shows that-it is a belief. Different kids benefit from different strategies in rearing.

I wouldn’t call yelling a child rearing strategy. And that is also your opinion that children are born a certain way. As far as I know, that’s still a classic debate. My opinion is it’s both. I also think we think we treat our kids equally, but there can be subtle differences that shape who they are that makes it appear that they were born like that. Birth order related personality traits can be evidence of that. I do think different kids require different strategies but disagree that yelling or corporal punishment is a strategy.

 

[nd5056]

... And police yell at adults all the time to get them to comply...

It's more like a scare tactic. I guess we scream since either we want to scare them or we're terrified ourselves.

 

[LSUmiss]

Well I’ve never had an adult get a crayon stuck in their nose, leave their legos all over the floor for me to step on, or make me late to work because they have suddenly lost their shoes.

On the other hand in my 20s when sharing group apartments occasionally you would yell at other adults about how nasty they left the bathroom or the need to turn the music down. And police yell at adults all the time to get them to comply.

Crayon in the nose I’d say goes to the level of safety that ppl have already agreed is an appropriate time for yelling. But the other examples you gave, to me, still sound like instances of yelling out of frustration (understandably). Did the yelling help the kid find his/her shoes faster? My guess is probably not. I doubt anyone has ever brought their kid in for behavior therapy to be told by a therapist “have you tried yelling?” ...b/c it’s not an appropriate or effective strategy.

As far as police yelling to get ppl to comply, that goes back to safety & if it’s not for safety, then it’s not appropriate for them either. I didn’t say other adults don’t y’all at each other. I’m saying it’s not appropriate & probably even less effective than yelling at kids.

 

[wenrob]

Mine just had to give me "that look". It was all over after that. No audible communication needed.

Several people have mentioned “the look” or lowering their voice to get their point across. I use both and in fact used “the look” yesterday on another adult. She was sweet as pie our very next interaction. My point being, the look, a lowered voice, yelling are all used to accomplish the same thing; compliance. One is not better than the others IMO.

My method depends on the kid. There’s a huge difference between someone who screams all day (that’s someone who has no idea how to steer or control a situation) and someone who raises their voice on occasion to get their point across. As a parent my end game is that they understand. I always go back and talk to my kids and explain to them why XYZ had me upset or is such a big deal. I never got any kind of explanation when I was a kid, so I was in trouble but a lot times really had no idea why. The Look or The Lowered Voice aren't any more superior if you’re not also giving the kid a reason for it.

 

[pahoben]

After this thread I believe I have more understanding how “snowflake” young adults are reared by their parents.

 

[pahoben]

I wouldn’t call yelling a child rearing strategy. And that is also your opinion that children are born a certain way. As far as I know, that’s still a classic debate. My opinion is it’s both. I also think we think we treat our kids equally, but there can be subtle differences that shape who they are that makes it appear that they were born like that. Birth order related personality traits can be evidence of that. I do think different kids require different strategies but disagree that yelling or corporal punishment is a strategy.

It was a classic debate because some ideologies rested on the claim that genetics have no impact. Sorry but that is just not true and the latest data actually ties certain personality traits to specific gene locations. The following is an example of that-

“Extraversion, according to the "big 5" model,denotes people who are talkative, energetic, and assertive. And the San Diego scientists tracked it to variants in the gene WSCD2 and near gene PCDH15. Neuroticism, by contrast, is all about emotional shifts, moodiness, and anxiety, and it showed up in variants on chromosome 8p23.1 and gene L3MBTL2.”

Children are different when they are born. Optimum rearing practices should be based on these natural differences between children rather than assuming they are all the same and forcing a one size fits all approach.

 

[LSUmiss]

It was a classic debate because some ideologies rested on the claim that genetics have no impact. Sorry but that is just not true and the latest data actually ties certain personality traits to specific gene locations. The following is an example of that-

“Extraversion, according to the "big 5" model,denotes people who are talkative, energetic, and assertive. And the San Diego scientists tracked it to variants in the gene WSCD2 and near gene PCDH15. Neuroticism, by contrast, is all about emotional shifts, moodiness, and anxiety, and it showed up in variants on chromosome 8p23.1 and gene L3MBTL2.”

Children are different when they are born. Optimum rearing practices should be based on these natural differences between children rather than assuming they are all the same and forcing a one size fits all approach.

Agree there is no one size fits all but again yelling is not a strategy.

 

[Mermaid02]

Depends on what you're saying when you yell.

 

[Skywalker]

Or is it appropriate for adults to yell at each other to get them to comply. Of course not. Safety when it’s an emergency to me seems the only appropriate use. I don’t think it’s abuse, though, (but could be), it’s just not appropriate or effective IMO. Doesn’t mean I’m perfect & don’t do it occasionally out of frustration, but I also don’t justify that it’s ok or “necessary”.

I never get his line of argument, to be honest. No, it is not acceptable to yell at another adult to get them to comply. Raising kids is a different situation. If we held them to the same standard as another adult there would be NO acceptable way of disciplining them - we can't send another adult to their room, ground them from going out with their friends, withhold their money, give them a time out, refuse to let them have dessert, or I mean whatever it is how we treat other adults have no bearing. The fact is discipline is a part of raising kids.

I think yelling in and of itself is of course not abuse. Sure it can be stressful to be yelled at, but then, no discipline is supposed to be pleasant. (And I am not a "yeller" myself so don't think I am just trying to defend my own actions lol)

 

[cabanafrau]

Applying it usually isn't the problem - removing can tend to cause issues

Wait, you should remove it?

One of us is doing it wrong.

 

[luvsJack]

There is a difference in yelling “to” a kid and yelling “at” a kid. We yell to them when we raise our voices to be heard down the hall or when we see them doing something dangerous. Yelling at them is yelling in anger. But I don’t think either one is automatically abuse.

When you see that kid crying and flinching at words, that’s abuse. And it’s heartbreaking.

Where that level is may depend on the kid, may depend on the words being said, may depend on who the person is doing the yelling. But a child should not be cowering and flinching.

 

[Turn the Page]

I never get his line of argument, to be honest. No, it is not acceptable to yell at another adult to get them to comply. Raising kids is a different situation. If we held them to the same standard as another adult there would be NO acceptable way of disciplining them - we can't send another adult to their room, ground them from going out with their friends, withhold their money, give them a time out, refuse to let them have dessert, or I mean whatever it is how we treat other adults have no bearing. The fact is discipline is a part of raising kids.

I think yelling in and of itself is of course not abuse. Sure it can be stressful to be yelled at, but then, no discipline is supposed to be pleasant. (And I am not a "yeller" myself so don't think I am just trying to defend my own actions lol)

We can't? Don't tell my husband that I send him to his room all the time when he's annoying me lol.

 

[tex1989]

Predictably this topic as any other topic on sensitive subjects do has people coming out with their opinions on the do's and don'ts and that then leads to some disagreement. Yelling is not good, okay I will conceed that but I will leave it there. Whenever this sort of topic comes up I am always reminded of Kenau Reeves character in the original Parenthood movie when he is describing his father. "You gotta have a license to get married, heck you even gotta have a license to own a dog, but any butthole can have a kid".

Finally, while I am not or do not claim to be a child rearing expert, I have a son (33) and a daughter(29) who are both married to very wonderful partners and both working and being productive members of society so I am thankful for that. I did not screw them up too bad. But this is what I do worry about, I have seen articles and interviews with "experts" in the field and they scare me. One was telling parents in England that from birth you should seek consent from your child before changing their diaper. Really? Another saying that the proper way to raise a child is completely gender neutral and let them choose the direction they want to go. I am so glad my kids are where they are because I could not deal with today's "experts"