Severely need advice

[Miffy]

OP: If I didn't drink and didn't want to be with someone who does drink, then my ability to tolerate it would definitely decrease with time. I know from past experience that things one tolerates and pretends to accept in one's spouse-even though you don't really like it--can become a serious relationship breaker. Because tolerating something is the very opposite of acceptance. You don't have to tolerate something that you either like or that doesn't bother you. It's fine. Neutral. But as soon as your efforts are thrown in the direction of toleration, you (not your DH--he has his own problems) are headed for trouble. Because you're denying how you really feel--to yourself. I know this from personal, direct experience.

I guess I'm saying that the most important thing for you is to be 100% honest with yourself. If you don't like something, don't pretend to like it. And you don't have to explain to a bunch of strangers on the DISboard your reasons for it. To yourself? Yes. Although I have to say that it's possible that you just don't like whatever it is that you don't like. Proceed from there, a place of utter honesty with yourself.

I wish you the best and hope that everything works out for you. I was very happy to see that you and your DH talked about this. Keep talking. It's vital.

 

[RamblingMad]

People who feel beholden to a set of rules just because someone else wants to live their life a certain way are doomed to covet what they cannot have.

This is what I mean by weaker willed.

What you say about Mormons is what I see with all religions. No one is perfect. But I have seen far better adherence to no drinking with Mormons in general. My point is that the request by the OP is not super extreme. It’s doable. As for alcoholism, I posted a link to a proper definition.

If it’s extreme, then I should totally become weak willed and have a harem. I should have a woman for each day of the week. I need variety. It’s only 7. That’s not extreme. Maybe if I had 30 then that would be a problem.

 

[morgan98]

This is what I mean by weaker willed.

What you say about Mormons is what I see with all religions. No one is perfect. But I have seen far better adherence to no drinking with Mormons in general. My point is that the request by the OP is not super extreme. It’s doable. As for alcoholism, I posted a link to a proper definition.

If it’s extreme, then I should totally become weak willed and have a harem. I should have a woman for each day of the week. I need variety. It’s only 7. That’s not extreme. Maybe if I had 30 then that would be a problem.

This is what I mean by weaker willed.

What you say about Mormons is what I see with all religions. No one is perfect. But I have seen far better adherence to no drinking with Mormons in general. My point is that the request by the OP is not super extreme. It’s doable. As for alcoholism, I posted a link to a proper definition.

If it’s extreme, then I should totally become weak willed and have a harem. I should have a woman for each day of the week. I need variety. It’s only 7. That’s not extreme. Maybe if I had 30 then that would be a problem.

Well, if you are not going to drink like a Mormon, I guess you can have multiple wives as that is acceptable - they did accept polygamy.

Well, I am a recovering Catholic. Catholics have never claimed to be against alcohol, so you would see far less adherence to no drinking with them than with Mormons who hold that to be a fundamental belief/behavior.

 

[TipsyTraveler]

This is what I mean by weaker willed.

What you say about Mormons is what I see with all religions. No one is perfect. But I have seen far better adherence to no drinking with Mormons in general. My point is that the request by the OP is not super extreme. It’s doable. As for alcoholism, I posted a link to a proper definition.

If it’s extreme, then I should totally become weak willed and have a harem. I should have a woman for each day of the week. I need variety. It’s only 7. That’s not extreme. Maybe if I had 30 then that would be a problem.

Just because it’s doable doesn’t mean he’s interested in doing it.

And if you wanted to have a harem of seven women you certainly could, assuming you could find seven women to go along with that. What you couldn’t do is unilaterally make that decision and tell your wife you’re going to be bringing six other women into the relationship. That would surely set up your marriage for failure.

 

[RamblingMad]

Just because it’s doable doesn’t mean he’s interested in doing it.

And if you wanted to have a harem of seven women you certainly could, assuming you could find seven women to go along with that. What you couldn’t do is unilaterally make that decision and tell your wife you’re going to be bringing six other women into the relationship. That would surely set up your marriage for failure.

Yeah. That would be kinda like committing to not drinking and then drinking behind her back. Maybe if I only had 2-3 and kept them in a separate house.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

This is what I mean by weaker willed.

What you say about Mormons is what I see with all religions. No one is perfect. But I have seen far better adherence to no drinking with Mormons in general. My point is that the request by the OP is not super extreme. It’s doable. As for alcoholism, I posted a link to a proper definition.

If it’s extreme, then I should totally become weak willed and have a harem. I should have a woman for each day of the weak. I need variety. It’s only 7. That’s not extreme. Maybe if I had 30 then that would be a problem.

You can have a request/demand (depending on the tone and wording) that is doable in the sense that someone can physically opt to do it and yet be extreme.

For the husband, who would like to drink every now and then, suddenly not drinking period can be seen as an extreme thing and perhaps moreso because the OP and the husband used to drink.

If my husband suddenly said "I don't want you to drink ever again" you bet your butt I'd call it extreme.

 

[RamblingMad]

You can have a request/demand (depending on the tone and wording) that is doable in the sense that someone can physically opt to do it and yet be extreme.

For the husband, who would like to drink every now and then, suddenly not drinking period can be seen as an extreme thing and perhaps moreso because the OP and the husband used to drink.

If my husband suddenly said "I don't want you to drink ever again" you bet your butt I'd call it extreme.

This is because of social norms.

I don’t think not drinking is any different from not drinking soda. It’s no big deal.

What would you do if he told you that?

 

[4Mickeys]

Based on this, I think some people are really jumping to conclusions here. How often is he having 3-4 beers?

Not conclusions - OP is sharing information in bits and pieces at times and possibly altering what/how she shares as she wants it to work. Which is ok that is just where she is emotionally but she did say she found A LOT of bottles - so info is a little inconsistent.

Like I said I know plenty of Mormon that don’t drink that are doing just fine. It’s not extreme. However, drinking standards are different throughout the country. I see more excessive drinking in the south than any other region in the country.

I saw a documentary said that region had a really high rate of prescription drug use because that is more acceptable - which was linked to their non-use of other stimulants (not just alcohol, coffee in my understanding too - I know a couple of people who are Mormon).

 

[TipsyTraveler]

Man, if years into our relationship my husband came to me and said he’d decided I couldn’t eat french fries anymore... Whew, I can’t decide if I’d divorce him on the spot or go off the rails and gain a hundred pounds from the secret stash of fried potatoes I kept hidden around the house just so I could feel like I still had some control over my own choices.

 

[RamblingMad]

I saw a documentary said that region had a really high rate of prescription drug use because that is more acceptable - which was linked to their non-use of other stimulants (not just alcohol, coffee in my understanding too - I know a couple of people who are Mormon).

I think, this whole discussion is about social norms. If she’s in an area, where casual drinking is highly acceptable, then she is going to come across as extreme in her demand. And her husband is going to have a social net that will support his position.

The reality is that I get different reactions to not drinking in different parts of the country. They’re all not equal.

If she doesn’t have an environment to support her position, then this demand is going to be really tough. She’ll have her friends telling her that she’s extreme. Eventually she’ll cave in to social pressures.

Her best bet is to find people like her or move.

 

[morgan98]

This is because of social norms.

I don’t think not drinking is any different from not drinking soda. It’s no big deal.

What would you do if he told you that?

Interestingly enough the Mormon I know best, a pretty good friend of mine, does not drink alcohol or coffee. That is true. However, he admits that he has basically an addiction to Dr. Pepper. He specifically requests it at meetings and had it installed in the office soda fountain and has a glass of it all.the.time. Believe me, it is worse for his health than my glasses of wine here and there.

I do not drink soda, so that is not big deal for me. But if did drink soda and liked it, I would not want someone prohibiting me from that either.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

This is because of social norms.

I don’t think not drinking is any different from not drinking soda. It’s no big deal.

What would you do if he told you that?

You're saying drinking is because of social norms? Some people do but don't conflate it to a generalization.

I doubt I would agree to it-nothing about alcohol itself but it would be very uncharacteristic of my husband to make that sort of statement as if I'm not allowed to make a decision; I'd start to wonder are there other things shifting in the relationship.

Like if he said "I hate coffee, you need to stop drinking coffee and never drink it again" same story. Or in respects to my love of reading if he said "reading, why do you need to read you need to stop reading and never read again" (FTR my husband doesn't have an issue with me reading but I have actually met people who think leisure reading is dumb thing and there's no point).

Telling me "we're going to stop drinking" would be extreme for my husband and I. If he decided to stop drinking or I decided to stop drinking different scenario. When you make the decision for someone else like that you change the dynamics.

There's also sometimes where people get into things and don't realize necessarily how they come off to their partner. My best friend was in a 4yr relationship with someone who around year 3 decided to do the Paleo diet when it was just starting to become big. She applauded him for his efforts...until he started making snide remarks, constant jabs, and what he viewed as constructive criticism about what she ate. Got to a point where never a meal went by that he wasn't saying "oh should should eat this instead, or you're going to eat that, why do you want to eat that". He was on the diet and was giving her essentially no choice in the matter. That was a main contributor to her breaking up with him--wasn't the only thing but was a main one.

 

[RamblingMad]

Interestingly enough the Mormon I know best, a pretty good friend of mine, does not drink alcohol or coffee. That is true. However, he admits that he has basically an addiction to Dr. Pepper. He specifically requests it at meetings and had it installed in the office soda fountain and has a glass of it all.the.time. Believe me, it is worse for his health than my glasses of wine here and there.

I do not drink soda, so that is not big deal for me. But if did drink soda and liked it, I would not want someone prohibiting me from that either.

What would you give up for a relationship? That’s the big underlying question here.

 

[jrmasm]

I did the same thing. My reason: healthy living. You prematurely age when you consume alcohol. I don’t want to be with someone that needs alcohol to cope with life’s ups and downs. And I know plenty of Mormon that do just fine without alcohol in their lives.

The problem is that she got married to someone that should have just said no. They’re obviously too weak willed to handle this one simple request that their not worth it. What other future promises will he let her down on in the future?

And it will much easier to find someone new in her 30s than her 40s.

It wasn’t a request. It was an order, a unilateral decision. The OP decided for them according to her own words. That is not normal behavior.

 

[morgan98]

What would you give up for a relationship? That’s the big underlying question here.

Well, I don't know. I have been in a not so good marriage that ended with cheating and am now happily married. And of course relationships come with some compromises. But honestly, I would hope to not have to give up simple pleasures that I enjoy to be in a relationship. No, I would not give up drinking alcohol. Now, if something happened to one of us health wise or something like that, that is a different story. I would generally not give up listening to music I like, eating a diet I enjoy, traveling to places I like, drinking very strong coffee, buying purses (I have a small collection)etc. I generally would not give up what I consider to be simple, harmless pleasures for a relationship. Part of a relationship for me would be making sure that most of my biggest likes/dislikes would fit in with my relationship partner.

***For the record, if there was serious illness or some other factor involved, I could definitely be flexible. But that would be my choice.

I really have little tolerance for being told what I can or cannot do, eat, drink, spend, etc. And I am generally a conservative rule follower, so I really do nothing that extreme - but the point is I am an adult perfectly capable of making my own decisions and setting my own limits.

 

[marcyleecorgan]

We just had a talk again and he agreed we could go to couples therapy but he is very frustrated. He feels like I’m attacking him and is convinced we could get through these issues on our own. He is complaining about the cost of therapy and I told him our happiness is worth a lot more than money.

I do think we have a lot of underlying issues that are much bigger than the alcohol. It may sound like I’m making excuses for him but I’m being realistic about my side of things. He owned up to the hiding of things and said it was 100% his fault. He said it was irresponsible and not right for him to blame that on me. I’ve been very strict on alcohol and I can’t give a great reason why that is. I kind of decided for the both of us that we wouldn’t drink anymore and that wasn’t right for me to do. It’s not a religious thing. I just don’t like alcohol and see it as pointless and that’s because I don’t personally use it. It’s hard for me to change my view point but I think I have a very unhealthy view of alcohol. It’s very possible for someone (my parents and entire family) to drink casually without it being a problem. Dh sees my family behaving this way but all he hears from me is how much I hate it. I’m not sure I take enough time to listen to how he feels about things.

The acting loopy doesn’t happen when he’s been drinking. I tried explaining that but I’m not sure if it came across correctly. He only acts that way after he has been asleep for an hour and gets woken up. He doesn’t act this way before going to bed. He gets slightly annoying but I think that is something common for people who have been drinking.

I don’t know. I’m sure it sounds like I’m making excuses and maybe I am but I’m not ready to just give up on him. I’m 100% willing to stick it through this with him but he has to put in the work too.

Therapy/counselling is so that he also feels like he has someone on his side, too. You are going to need support to get through this together, IF he is committed to change. find someone who jives well with the both of you without feeling like they've picked a side.

You are being too strict with the forbidding of alchohol, and he is making excuses and elaborate stories about why he is doing it behind your back. Don't forbid it. test if he has the self-control to NOT drink, or be honest with himself that he really, really just wants to crash on the couch with a 6-pack without hearing his wife's comments. If he can't quit cold turkey, then he needs support that is not necessarily you, as you've let him know where you stand.

He might also have sleep apnea - that messes with the body's ability to wake up properly and function! If he is absolutely dead-set against therapy, get him to consider that it might just be that his airways are collapsing at night and he's not getting oxygen or REM state....

 

[AllyReggie]

Interestingly enough the Mormon I know best, a pretty good friend of mine, does not drink alcohol or coffee. That is true. However, he admits that he has basically an addiction to Dr. Pepper. He specifically requests it at meetings and had it installed in the office soda fountain and has a glass of it all.the.time. Believe me, it is worse for his health than my glasses of wine here and there.

I do not drink soda, so that is not big deal for me. But if did drink soda and liked it, I would not want someone prohibiting me from that either.

And that is the point - someone else prohibiting you from doing something is the harm and the process for failure here.

Don't want to drink? Don't.
Don't want to drive? Don't.
Don't want to have only one spouse? Cool beans, good luck with your open relationship/polyamorous lifestyle, there is a whole community out there who make that work in a really positive way for them.

But it has to be your choice, or you are setting yourself up to fail.

OPs husband was wrong to accept a situation where he had to "try" to live the lifestyle his wife wanted and now they both have to deal with the consequences of being connected to someone who cannot live the way they want to live.

 

[RamblingMad]

Maybe the OP wants to drink, but because she’s pregnant, she can’t, so she just doesn’t want him drinking in front of her or excessively.

 

[PollyannaMom]

I'm really not sure what to say to this one. My reactions as I read through the thread ran the gamut, sort of like:

Is this fake? Is someone bored?

Oh my gosh, why didn't she get out before there was a kid?

Don't let him shift the blame to you!!!!

Yikes, now everyone's blaming her!!

Wait, is he actually drunk, or is she blowing the signs out of proportion because she's against alcohol all together?

Oh no, now it's working on me!

Wait, is this fake? Is someone manipulating us?

I wonder why she all of a sudden decided to give up alcohol? Did something horrible happen to her??


OP, if this is real, definitely see the counselor. Work on developing a realistic picture of what's normal drinking and what's alcoholic drinking. Insist on honesty from your DH! Once he's not hiding the drinking, you will be able to tell whether he can have what he means to and stop. If he can't stop drinking once he starts, then he's an alcoholic. Don't let him blame you.

Give little weight to his words and more weight to his actions. --- And this is important, if he ever turns violent, or threatens to, get out immediately!! Set aside some money for this purpose, just in case.

 

[AllyReggie]

Well, I don't know. I have been in a not so good marriage that ended with cheating and am now happily married. And of course relationships come with some compromises. But honestly, I would hope to not have to give up simple pleasures that I enjoy to be in a relationship. No, I would not give up drinking alcohol. Now, if something happened to one of us health wise or something like that, that is a different story. I would generally not give up listening to music I like, eating a diet I enjoy, traveling to places I like, drinking very strong coffee, buying purses (I have a small collection)etc. I generally would not give up what I consider to be simple, harmless pleasures for a relationship. Part of a relationship for me would be making sure that most of my biggest likes/dislikes would fit in with my relationship partner.

***For the record, if there was serious illness or some other factor involved, I could definitely be flexible. But that would be my choice.

I really have little tolerance for being told what I can or cannot do, eat, drink, spend, etc. And I am generally a conservative rule follower, so I really do nothing that extreme - but the point is I am an adult perfectly capable of making my own decisions and setting my own limits.

Relationships should NOT be about what you are willing to give up. That is not a healthy way to live life. Relationships should be about what you can do together and what can be gained from being in them.

If you are considering your relationship a "sacrifice" you will ultimately resent the person you are sacrificing for. Never go into a relationship with a "compromise". Relationships shouldn't be about settling or making do with what you have.

I can guarantee you that my husband and I did not settle and we have never had to ask the other to give up, sacrifice or end any sort of practice, activity or lifestyle. We got into our relationship and solidified it after going through every permeation of our likes and dislikes that we could think of and confirming that they other person would be happy living with that life.

I personally dislike the idea that relationships are "about compromise". Because the kind of compromise they are talking about is always where one person has to give up there standards for another persons comfort. That sucks, you shouldn't have to do that, ever.