To recline or not to recline...

[disykat]

Speaking of other people's comfort - that IS something I think about. Since someone reclining an inch or two into my space doesn't affect my comfort - not even a blip on my radar - I assume me doing the same won't affect the comfort of those behind me. Why should I sit uncomfortably upright with my head tilted forward for an entire flight on the off chance I'll have someone seated behind me that gets weird about my 1 inch recline? (I swear the headrests always tilt forward - do people really sit like that? I have the same problem in cars.) I certainly don't expect the person in front of me to be uncomfortably leaned forward to protect me from some imagined discomfort. As me and others have said many times, I've never run into seats that recline enough to be an issue. (though I do remember seats that reclined further back in the 60's,70's, and 80's - when there was more space and tv's were up near the ceiling) It'll be interesting to see if my perspective changes if I ever run into these crazy reclining seats many here seem to see. I doubt it will ever stop me from easing my seat back an inch to be comfortable.

 

[sam_gordon]

Your airfare includes the space under the seat in front of you, he spaces between the back of the seat in front of you (so tv screen and tray table) to the back of your seat, the area between the arm rests, and the open area aboe your seat to the bottom of the overhead bin.

And the space your seat takes up when it reclines. If it didn't, the seats wouldn't recline at all.

 

[Boopuff]

I blame the airlines - they're the ones who took away the generous "pitch" between seats. 33" in the past, now down to 23"!!! on some el-cheapo carriers. So would you rather pay more overall for a flight, or pay less and be crammed in like cattle? Once the pitch gets too small the seats shouldn't recline. (IMO)

 

[LAB81018]

Are we going to talk about her statement that the flight attendant reprimanded her and offered him more alcohol? Because it seems like exactly what this guy needs....alcohol.

 

[Jennasis]

Is it also then rude to fall asleep on an aircraft? Because doing so may impede your row-mate's ability to get up and use the lavatory. Conversely, is it rude to get up to use the lavatory if you are sitting in the middle or window seat as you may have to wake the person next to you or disturb them to get up?

Maybe we just do like they did in the Stephen King short story "The Jaunt" and knock every passenger out with gas for the duration of the flight so we all leave each other alone.

 

[SaintsManiac]

Is it also then rude to fall asleep on an aircraft? Because doing so may impede your row-mate's ability to get up and use the lavatory. Conversely, is it rude to get up to use the lavatory if you are sitting in the middle or window seat as you may have to wake the person next to you or disturb them to get up?

Maybe we just do like they did in the Stephen King short story "The Jaunt" and knock every passenger out with gas for the duration of the flight so we all leave each other alone.

I’m just wondering if the people who refuse to let a family sit together are also reclining people? Or do they get mad at reclining people?

 

[skyblue17]

If you are a family and you need to sit together, book seats together. Families that expect people to move from seats they purchased are def recliners! ;-P

 

[ronandannette]

For about a year I was consistently flying a particular Delta route that often used older CRJ-700s (this was maybe 5-6 years ago?), and while saying the person's head was in your lap would be some of an overstatement, it wasn't far from reality. They started using newly refurbished regional jets for that route (I think they were Embraer 175s?) and it was much more reasonable on the amount of available recline. It really depends on the type and age of plane they're using, but if you start regularly traveling on a particular route that uses planes with way too much recline, you'll start to feel the frustration. I've found it can also vary from seat-to-seat or row-to-row (likely seats that were used to replace broken seats).

I think the airlines are wising up to this, and are limiting the recline to something reasonable.

That is interesting information and I believe it, although if I've ever flown on a plane with similar seats it was so long ago I honestly don't remember. For this reason I think some of us are talking to each other about apples and oranges. For those who have flown aircraft like the ones you describe and not in more modern models, they may not understand the recline on the seats is much, much less significant - 3" on average. Maybe that's why some of us can't fathom the fuss, especially the "laying on my lap" comments.

I haven't read through the entire thread but I'm in the "please do not recline" camp, at least the majority of the time.

On our trip to London, the woman in front of DH (who is 6'3) reclined her seat fully the ENTIRE time. A flight attendant finally had to ask her to un-recline it during meals and she got very huffy with them. And not only did that cause a lack of room for him, it pushed the seat back TV back enough to where he couldn't see it unless he slouched a certain way. Combination of the TV position and his height I think.

I will say we never punched her chair, but neither were we very smooth or gracious when moving around or walking behind/past her seat for any reason.

I was so thankful I got premium economy on the return flight home. We decided paying a little more for the extra room would always be worth it for us in the future!

What model of aircraft was it? We've got an over-night to London in May and I'd like to know what to expect.

Good on you for not stooping that low to resorting to punching the chair..but then why not be smooth or gracious when moving around? Why be spiteful at that point? At that point y'all weren't being courteous passengers either.

Did you not read the recently resurrected "Aggression v.s Passive Aggression" thread?

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Did you not read the recently resurrected "Aggression v.s Passive Aggression" thread?

lol no but now I'm off to read it sounds entertaining

 

[luvsJack]

I once sat in the middle of 2 people for over 4 hour flight with my arms in an uncomfortable position because both were using the arm rests too much. I chose to let them be more comfortable over mine own comfort. Would I do that for every flight? No but I opted to for that flight.

Too much in-depth thought here on the recline here and space and whatever. I'm saying whether it affects you or not you can opt to let them have their own comfort as a means of consideration towards other people. I guess I disagreed that the only method to giving someone consideration is towards one group and one group only which is the subtle and at times not subtle thing being said. And like I said I rarely recline myself I just see it in different ways--that and I'm already used to SWA where space..what space haha.

I actually don't think there's a huge difference. Claiming so means you're sticking your feet in the mud, no room for any consideration..on your part..for someone else because at that point you're saying "yeah I don't care you're in my biz so to speak (by virtue of reclining) who cares about you I care about me". It's just a different way to spin it is all.

Why? Why would you put yourself in a completely uncomfortable place to “be considerate”. That’s way beyond being considerate. Almost to be being a martyr.

If what one person is doing has 0 effect on another person and what the other one does has even 10% effect on the other—then that makes a big difference in who should be considerate of the other. It just does.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Why? Why would you put yourself in a completely uncomfortable place to “be considerate”. That’s way beyond being considerate. Almost to be being a martyr.

If what one person is doing has 0 effect on another person and what the other one does has even 10% effect on the other—then that makes a big difference in who should be considerate of the other. It just does.

Didn't feel like putting up a stink about it, in the grand scheme traveling just sucks most of the time. Sometimes I'm just willing to take one for the team I guess. I figure there have been times where I inadvertently have my elbow in such a position that makes another person uncomfortable (and I'm not meaning to) and they've toughed it out (though hopefully they aren't resentful )

Not a martyr psh please That word gets thrown around way too carelessly these days.

For someone spouting having consideration of others you're shockingly resistent to the idea of being..considerate to others..and much more firm in the "my comfort outweighs yours" when it comes down to it--you just may not see it the way I do. Not just you though just bouncing off your comments.

 

[luvsJack]

Didn't feel like putting up a stink about it, in the grand scheme traveling just sucks most of the time. Sometimes I'm just willing to take one for the team I guess. I figure there have been times where I inadvertently have my elbow in such a position that makes another person uncomfortable (and I'm not meaning to) and they've toughed it out (though hopefully they aren't resentful )

Not a martyr psh please That word gets thrown around way too carelessly these days.

For someone spouting having consideration of others you're shockingly resistent to the idea of being..considerate to others..and much more firm in the "my comfort outweighs yours" when it comes down to it--you just may not see it the way I do. Not just you though just bouncing off your comments.

No, I never said my comfort outweighs anyone’s. It doesn’t. And if I was in a seat and going to recline, I would make sure it wasn’t going to bother anyone before I did it. That’s consideration.

But again, sitting in your seat isn’t going to effect anyone. Like at all. So that person isn’t doing anything to stop or change the comfort of the other one.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

No, I never said my comfort outweighs anyone’s. It doesn’t.

Then don't keep bringing up who is more deserving of consideration and who is more affected, etc. If your comfort doesn't outweigh someone else then that's a moot point because it wouldn't actually matter.

And if I was in a seat and going to recline, I would make sure it wasn’t going to bother anyone before I did it. That’s consideration.

Consideration according to everyone against reclining is to not recline in the first place. Some have mentioned not reclining a whole lot and I'm convinced that majority of us already fly on airlines and aircrafts that don't recline much anyways.

Calling it consideration whilst silently fuming or resentful because the person recline doesn't do anyone good. Besides if someone asks you if you're cool with reclining you're put on the spot (much like can you switch seats question) and that can end poorly too.

Plus if a person really does need to recline but they asked out of sheer politeness but the passenger behind them said no..no win for both because if they don't recline then they are uncomfortable and if they do recline then they are labeled a jerk (though saying no can also be grounds for being labeled a jerk by social media depending on one's situation). I think it's a nice sentiment if folks ask but I don't see it as a cure all for the root issue.

But again, sitting in your seat isn’t going to effect anyone. Like at all. So that person isn’t doing anything to stop or change the comfort of the other one.

Eh you already know I disagree with that. But whatevs-I say that because I've already mentioned the ways I don't see that as the case

 

[sam_gordon]

If you are a family and you need to sit together, book seats together. Families that expect people to move from seats they purchased are def recliners! ;-P

If you don't want the person in front of you to recline, pick seats where the row in front of you CAN'T recline.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Or put your children in the seats directly ahead and tell them they can't rec!ine.

 

[Moliphino]

Is it also then rude to fall asleep on an aircraft? Because doing so may impede your row-mate's ability to get up and use the lavatory. Conversely, is it rude to get up to use the lavatory if you are sitting in the middle or window seat as you may have to wake the person next to you or disturb them to get up?

If you book aisle or middle you should do so with the expectation that you may need to get up to let your seatmates out, especially on longer flights. If you don't want to be disturbed book a window seat. Neither falling asleep or having to get up are rude, but neither is waking up the sleeping person on the aisle because you need to get by them.

 

[elaine amj]

I blame the airlines - they're the ones who took away the generous "pitch" between seats. 33" in the past, now down to 23"!!! on some el-cheapo carriers. So would you rather pay more overall for a flight, or pay less and be crammed in like cattle? Once the pitch gets too small the seats shouldn't recline. (IMO)

I blame passengers - who vote with their wallets and book flights on airlines and in the economy sections where the pitch is tight enough that the recliner "lays in your lap" .

I personally avoided Spirit for many years because I find the pitch so tight that even my super short legs were cramped and uncomfortable.

I did book a Spirit flight for March because the price was cheap enough for me to accept being uncomfortable for 2.5 hours. That was my choice and I am well aware of how tight their planes are.

If my comfort was more important, I would have paid more to fly any other airline (like I have done in the past). For example, my friend knows her husband would be thoroughly uncomfortable in regular economy seats. So she only looks for flights with economy comfort or business/first class.

If passengers were willing to pay more for economy comfort or only booked tickets on airlines with wider pitch between seats, then that is what more airlines will provide.

If passengers who care about how tight the space is (enough that they grumble about fellow passengers using the provided reclining feature) continue to choose to pay for flights with tight pitches AND the recline feature...personally I think that they only have themselves to blame. (One choice is Frontier which has a non-adjustable recline)

My family doesn't care that much so we book whatever airline - although I dislike Spirit so avoid it (except for this trip when their price is low enough for me to deal with it).

 

[kdonnel]

I blame the airlines - they're the ones who took away the generous "pitch" between seats. 33" in the past, now down to 23"!!! on some el-cheapo carriers. So would you rather pay more overall for a flight, or pay less and be crammed in like cattle? Once the pitch gets too small the seats shouldn't recline. (IMO)

I think that 23" might be a typo.

I think 28" is the current shortest seat pitch.

 

[luvsJack]

Then don't keep bringing up who is more deserving of consideration and who is more affected, etc. If your comfort doesn't outweigh someone else then that's a moot point because it wouldn't actually matter.

Consideration according to everyone against reclining is to not recline in the first place. Some have mentioned not reclining a whole lot and I'm convinced that majority of us already fly on airlines and aircrafts that don't recline much anyways.

Calling it consideration whilst silently fuming or resentful because the person recline doesn't do anyone good. Besides if someone asks you if you're cool with reclining you're put on the spot (much like can you switch seats question) and that can end poorly too.

Plus if a person really does need to recline but they asked out of sheer politeness but the passenger behind them said no..no win for both because if they don't recline then they are uncomfortable and if they do recline then they are labeled a jerk (though saying no can also be grounds for being labeled a jerk by social media depending on one's situation). I think it's a nice sentiment if folks ask but I don't see it as a cure all for the root issue.


Eh you already know I disagree with that. But whatevs-I say that because I've already mentioned the ways I don't see that as the case

For that last statement, you keep referring to people around you that would NOT even be the case for someone in front/behind you. Using an example of people in the seats beside you does NOT mean the person behind you will effect you.

I did not say anyone was more "deserving" of consideration. I said, one should not have to sit in discomfort for someone else's comfort. That is inconsideration from the one putting them in discomfort. I am really unsure how that is hard to understand. And again, the person behind is just sitting there. They aren't being inconsiderate. But now, according to you, they shouldn't even be asked if it will bother them.

As for "asking", I meant more of "alerting". Like "hey, i need to recline this seat a little, its putting a cramp in my neck. Just wanted to make sure it wasn't going to hurt anything". That is consideration. If the reclined seat isn't going to make any more difference than everyone is saying, then there shouldn't be a problem if done in that way.

But, hey, if you choose to be "considerate" of others by twisting up like a pretzel to make sure those on either side of you have all the room they need, more power to you. Just understand that you are allowing them to continue to be inconsiderate of you.



So, I wanted to see with my own eyes what reclining will do to the passenger behind you. So I googled. There are literally thousands of articles on this subject! Wow! Did not know there was this whole controversy out there! Lots of etiquette lists that say when to recline and when not to. Most are about what is being said here. None saying "well its only 3 inches it doesn't hurt anything", but agreeing with some of the complaints against reclining and why one should be mindful of the person behind them in those cases. They aren't saying don't, just be careful when. Seems like a good compromise to the whole thing.

 

[igrsod]

Sometimes I recline, sometimes I don't. I always look behind before I do to be sure I won't be disturbing food or laptop etc. I also recline very slowly. I usually recline when the person in front of me reclines, or if I'm super tired. Some flights I stay upright the whole time. I don't see the big deal to be honest. I've never been upset with the person in front of me reclining. I know it's a possibility. If I want lots of room, I could book first class.
The only people that I get frustrated with reclining are the ones who insist on reclining on take off and landing. One "gentleman" kept being told to pull his seat up, only to recline as soon as the attendant moved past him... multiple times. In the end he landed with his seat reclined. That bothered me as it is a safety issue in case people need to evacuate quickly.