Are you sending your kids to school next month?

[momz]

After one school district had 300 teachers bring in doctor's notes for either remote positions or a year of leave, all other districts started started getting incredibly picky. I'm back in my old position because the district denied the person who they moved over from another school a remote position or leave. He is in the highest risk category if he were to get COVID. His doctor said absolutely no in-person teaching for him. He had to retire 2 years early.

Other districts are doing the same. Type 1 diabetic, too bad. High blood pressure? Too bad. Under going chemo right now? Too bad.

It's sickening.

This was a problem for the hospital system I work for. Initially everything shut down. But as clinics started to open back up, people were coming out of the woodwork with every excuse as to why they are the exception and should be able to stay home while still getting paid. The hospital nipped that in the bud by requiring people to file paperwork for disability accommodations. 98% of people claiming they couldn't work were unable to stand behind their claim. Now, and employee has to prove they are immunocompromised. There is a very short list of medications that qualify an employee for accommodations, and even with that, the employee must continue to work, just in a modified situation to mitigate their risk. For example, an at risk employee may be reassigned to a lower risk unit. That's about it.

In your example, Type 1 diabetes and high blood pressure...you're working. On chemo, well, it depends on the type, but generally you will be reassigned.

If you don't work, you don't get paid.

But, in my experience, most people who actually qualify for accommodations are thrilled that they can work somewhere. They were not the ones expecting to be paid to stay home. When they called, they were asking "where can I work?", they were not saying "I can't work".

 

[Hikergirl]

Just speaking to this part: I'm also "certified" through the college to teach some classes, and really, it isn't always as impressive as it sounds. It just means that I took a two-hour refresher class from them once a year (that I get paid to attend), they pre-arrange a lesson time to come watch me teach it once every five years or so, I submit a copy of one of my assessments for them to have on file, and I agree to cover all the content that they want me to cover (which since I have a whole year to cover their quarter's worth of content isn't really that hard). I know that mileage may vary a bit from college to college, but honestly, almost all of our teachers end up getting that "certification," because it's relatively easy to do, and it's profitable for the colleges to hand them out.

Well to be fair I wasn't really impressed by the fact that she is certified, I meant it more that the college has allowed her to teach that class, which I assume means she has to follow some criteria they set and the curriculum they follow and make sure the students have completed the necessary work to receive their 3 credits for the class.
With the shortened class times and one less day a week I do worry about the ramifications of spending too much time on grade-school like projects. These kids are expected to move to English 2 next semester, just like the college kids, and I fear they will be behind and unprepared for the real college classes they will be taking next year.

I noticed today that my ds turned down the volume on the computer so I couldn't hear, I'm thinking he doesn't want me making waves

ETA I am happy to update that today he was given an actual writing assignment today.

 

[godisney14]

If you don't work, you don't get paid.

But, in my experience, most people who actually qualify for accommodations are thrilled that they can work somewhere. They were not the ones expecting to be paid to stay home. When they called, they were asking "where can I work?", they were not saying "I can't work".

Okay...
I don’t think anyone here was talking about someone wanting to be paid to do nothing at home.
Obviously, no work = no pay??

 

[momz]

So my school district opened and this past week had their first full week. 2 kids tested positive in kindergarten and second grade. DH is high risk so my kids are doing the virtual school which is good because I had a second grader! One of the parents got a letter saying that their child “Bella” had been a close contact to the positive testing student. The school says that Bella has to quarantine for two weeks. The kicker is that school said that Bella’s brother should go to school while Bella is quarantines! Bella’s mom is an aide in another school in the district and they said that she must keep working while Bella quarantines! There’s no way this is okay.

Of course it's ok. Bella was exposed but is not sick. She could not have made brother or mother sick. Brother and mother were not the ones exposed.

Now, if Bella were sick, THEN mother and brother are exposed.

 

[chrispgross]

No, our kids are in virtual schooling for the near future. I am pondering a DVC trip in October, but can't decide if it is worth the risk.

 

[wombat_5606]

Of course it's ok. Bella was exposed but is not sick. She could not have made brother or mother sick. Brother and mother were not the ones exposed.

Now, if Bella were sick, THEN mother and brother are exposed.

But, Bella can make her brother and mother sick before Bella knows she is positive.

 

[SamFaniam]

Of course it's ok. Bella was exposed but is not sick. She could not have made brother or mother sick. Brother and mother were not the ones exposed.

Now, if Bella were sick, THEN mother and brother are exposed.

I think the question here might be that since Bella was exposed, she could be positive and exposing her family even if she is not showing symptoms.

 

[barkley]

well, it's going to be interesting to see what happens around us over the next week or so. we have districts that just started last week, are due to start today, some next week. we have others that started distance or hybrid and were scheduled to shift this week to hybrid or f/t face to face. thing is-they are now dealing in the short term (fingers crossed) with the horrible smoke and hazardous air quality from all the wildfires so the local news reports resemble winter w/ lists of school closures. long term.......??? we are seeing massive upticks in diagnosed cases in areas where colleges have started back up (despite some being entirely on-line their student population has returned in massive numbers, wants to socialize and are proactively violating and mocking public health regulations). schools in those areas that planned to start distance and move into at least hybrid can't even consider it at this point

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

But, Bella can make her brother and mother sick before Bella knows she is positive.

I think the question here might be that since Bella was exposed, she could be positive and exposing her family even if she is not showing symptoms.

I would imagine the school is going off of close contact here. The family and the brother were not close contacts with the student like the girl was. They aren't asking the whole school to quarantine as they were not close contacts either. You're not wrong that she can end up with her family sick but I would imagine that knowledge into the virus is playing a larger role here. Before we didn't necessarily have this idea of close contact (more than 15min exposure, etc) so everyone default quarantined. Then it became more precise on time, then it was mask wearing done or not as well as inside/outside, etc.

I don't think the message being sent is that there is NO possibility of the girl passing it to her family but given xyz there's not a requirement to have the entire household quarantine like would have been the going thing early on in the pandemic.

 

[wombat_5606]

I would imagine the school is going off of close contact here. The family and the brother were not close contacts with the student like the girl was. They aren't asking the whole school to quarantine as they were not close contacts either. You're not wrong that she can end up with her family sick but I would imagine that knowledge into the virus is playing a larger role here. Before we didn't necessarily have this idea of close contact (more than 15min exposure, etc) so everyone default quarantined. Then it became more precise on time, then it was mask wearing done or not as well as inside/outside, etc.

I don't think the message being sent is that there is NO possibility of the girl passing it to her family but given xyz there's not a requirement to have the entire household quarantine like would have been the going thing early on in the pandemic.

But, if Bella's school is assuming she spent more than 15 minutes in close contact with the positive student (were they masked? OP doesn't say.), then Bella's mother and brother are just as likely to have more than 15 minutes in close contact with Bella. So, until it is definitively determined that Bella is not a positive, they should be QT. Because if Bella did get infected, she is going to be able to infect her mother and brother before and if she ever shows any symptoms.

If you wait to find out that Bella is infected, it's too late for Bella's mother and brother, thus too late for their close contacts at their schools.

Most spread is occurring at home with family members and extended family members.

Now if Bella lived alone and stopped at the grocery store on her way home, then the cashier does not need to be QTd.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

But, if Bella's school is assuming she spent more than 15 minutes in close contact with the positive student (were they masked? OP doesn't say.), then Bella's mother and brother are just as likely to have more than 15 minutes in close contact with Bella. So, until it is definitively determined that Bella is not a positive, they should be QT. Because if Bella did get infected, she is going to be able to infect her mother and brother before and if she ever shows any symptoms.

If you wait to find out that Bella is infected, it's too late for Bella's mother and brother, thus too late for their close contacts at their schools.

Most spread is occurring at home with family members and extended family members.

Now if Bella lived alone and stopped at the grocery store on her way home, then the cashier does not need to be QTd.

Bella is the close contact, her family isn't. That's just the way it is. By close contact we're going by actual definitions.

"Close contact is defined by CDC as someone who was within 6 feet of an infected person for at least 15 minutes starting from 2 days before illness onset (or, for asymptomatic clients, 2 days prior to positive specimen collection) until the time the patient is isolated."

So just remove from your mind that you consider Bella's family as a close contact they are NOT a close contact to the person who is positive at the school only Bella is. That is what is likely driving most of the policies these days as we know more about the virus which is what I was trying to say likely explains why Bella's family is not required to quarantine.

And I feel I need to be clear here. I'm not debating whatever you're saying as I said neither one of you are wrong on Bella potentially getting her family ill (I was quite clear on that). I was just giving a reason why I could see why the entire family is not required to quarantine like what would have been the case early on in the pandemic when we didn't know much about the virus.

 

[wombat_5606]

Bella is the close contact, her family isn't. That's just the way it is. By close contact we're going by actual definitions.

"Close contact is defined by CDC as someone who was within 6 feet of an infected person for at least 15 minutes starting from 2 days before illness onset (or, for asymptomatic clients, 2 days prior to positive specimen collection) until the time the patient is isolated."

So just remove from your mind that you consider Bella's family as a close contact they are NOT a close contact to the person who is positive at the school only Bella is. That is what is likely driving most of the policies these days as we know more about the virus which is what I was trying to say likely explains why Bella's family is not required to quarantine.

And I feel I need to be clear here. I'm not debating whatever you're saying as I said neither one of you are wrong on Bella potentially getting her family ill (I was quite clear on that). I was just giving a reason why I could see why the entire family is not required to quarantine like what would have been the case early on in the pandemic when we didn't know much about the virus.

I can understand why the school doesn't think it's necessary. I also can understand why the school isn't thinking about the safety of Bella's mom and brother and further, the ones they come in contact with.

Because Bella has been exposed, she must maintain a 6 ft. distance from her mother and brother until such time as it's determined that she has not been infected. I can almost guarantee that isn't going to happen. Therefore, now the mother and brother are potential viral hosts, too. Because until Bella is proved to be a negative, you have to assume she is positive, if you want to slow the spread of Covid.

Asymptomatic spread is one of the most prevalent forms of transmission. So if Bella develops symptoms on the 4th day home from preschool, gets tested and finds out she's positive, now brother and mother will have to QT, yet the will also have to go to their schools and say they have been in contact with a positive and send a huge number of people home to QT. Wouldn't it make more sense for mother and brother to QT and now the number of potential cases is down to 2. Meanwhile those who didn't have close contact with Bella, her mother and her brother can continue going to school and work.

 

[lanejudy]

Because Bella has been exposed, she must maintain a 6 ft. distance from her mother and brother until such time as it's determined that she has not been infected. I can almost guarantee that isn't going to happen.

This is correct -- technically, a person who is "in quarantine" must remain separated from anyone else even within the home. Ideally she stays in her bedroom with meals delivered to her there, and uses a separate bathroom. If the family chooses not to quarantine in that manner, that's a decision the family chooses. The school isn't mandating close contacts of close contacts must quarantine -- that will end up with entire schools closed and be a nightmare to contact-trace. I suspect if Bella's parent choses to stay home with a quarantined child who is not restricted to her bedroom for the period of quarantine, then the parent will need to use paid or unpaid time off. And by extension, if the family is not having the child truly quarantine away from family members, then they should have the whole family stay home for the period of quarantine.

It's really tricky when the person in quarantine is a child, especially a young child, because most parents are not going to leave a 2nd grader home alone or lock them in their bedroom alone for 2 weeks. A high school or college kid could manage (not pleasant but manage). But that is a family decision and not the school's decision.

 

[monsterkitty]

This was a problem for the hospital system I work for. Initially everything shut down. But as clinics started to open back up, people were coming out of the woodwork with every excuse as to why they are the exception and should be able to stay home while still getting paid. The hospital nipped that in the bud by requiring people to file paperwork for disability accommodations. 98% of people claiming they couldn't work were unable to stand behind their claim. Now, and employee has to prove they are immunocompromised. There is a very short list of medications that qualify an employee for accommodations, and even with that, the employee must continue to work, just in a modified situation to mitigate their risk. For example, an at risk employee may be reassigned to a lower risk unit. That's about it.

In your example, Type 1 diabetes and high blood pressure...you're working. On chemo, well, it depends on the type, but generally you will be reassigned.

If you don't work, you don't get paid.

But, in my experience, most people who actually qualify for accommodations are thrilled that they can work somewhere. They were not the ones expecting to be paid to stay home. When they called, they were asking "where can I work?", they were not saying "I can't work".

The person I am taking over for has complications from his Type 1 diabetes. Trust me, he would rather work. His doctor had contacted him last spring before we went remote and told him that he needed to take a leave if schools did not close.

They did not reassign people who wanted to go to remote teaching. Instead, they just moved people into the positions without asking, which they can do by contract.

You can't really mitigate a person's risks when they teach in a building that is 60 years old and has crappy ventilation.

 

[DisneyOma]

Gwinnett County Public Schools, Georgia.

http://publish.gwinnett.k12.ga.us/g...return-to-learning-hub/covid19-info-by-school

Wow, the pdf report I checked had over 1000 students/staff tagged as either positive, close contact, or suspected. Good luck!

I won't get into it but "social emotional" education is just a form of indoctrination.

I double dog dare you to get into it

SEL, if done well, is a great program to help kids get in touch with how they are feeling, why they are feeling it, and how to deal with it. For all those kids who have lousy parents, or are in sub-par foster care, sub-par group homes, etc, it can help them develop into more functioning adults, which benefits us all. (Note - I know there are awesome foster care places out there, and not so awesome ones)

 

[HeatherC]

Here in Mass. we just had two districts have to switch to remote only before school even opened due to kids having large house parties. Unreal. One had over 100 kids.

 

[Hikergirl]

Wow, the pdf report I checked had over 1000 students/staff tagged as either positive, close contact, or suspected. Good luck!


I double dog dare you to get into it

SEL, if done well, is a great program to help kids get in touch with how they are feeling, why they are feeling it, and how to deal with it. For all those kids who have lousy parents, or are in sub-par foster care, sub-par group homes, etc, it can help them develop into more functioning adults, which benefits us all. (Note - I know there are awesome foster care places out there, and not so awesome ones)

Nope not taking that dare

I don't disagree with what you say here, but at some point a student's education needs to focus on academics, and any kind of emotional/social needs should be done on an individual basis if a student is in need of it.
It isn't fair to those students who are trying to prepare for the rigors of academic life in college to be sidelined by unneeded social education all because some government entity decides we need to make sure all students are capable of understanding their feelings.
High school students should be academically prepared for the next phase of their lives, if they need emotional and social rearing by then, as almost adults, then that is a personal issue and should be handled in a personal way whether through their family or counseling (could even be in the school).
To mandate that schools must 'teach' it at all grade levels goes beyond education and does border on indoctrination IMO.

 

[momz]

The person I am taking over for has complications from his Type 1 diabetes. Trust me, he would rather work. His doctor had contacted him last spring before we went remote and told him that he needed to take a leave if schools did not close.

They did not reassign people who wanted to go to remote teaching. Instead, they just moved people into the positions without asking, which they can do by contract.

You can't really mitigate a person's risks when they teach in a building that is 60 years old and has crappy ventilation.

Americans with Disabilities Act requires employers to provide reasonable accommodations. If he is unable to perform his job responsibilities, he can contact the human resource department and inquire how to apply for an accommodation. This is the right way to go about it. If his doctors agree that he is at risk by being in the school, he should do this. Maybe he doesn't know. Consider suggesting this to him. He may reject this as an option, but at least he will be aware. It's much better than taking a leave of absence. Not many people can do that and still make ends meet.

 

[lifesavacation]

This is correct -- technically, a person who is "in quarantine" must remain separated from anyone else even within the home. Ideally she stays in her bedroom with meals delivered to her there, and uses a separate bathroom. If the family chooses not to quarantine in that manner, that's a decision the family chooses. The school isn't mandating close contacts of close contacts must quarantine -- that will end up with entire schools closed and be a nightmare to contact-trace. I suspect if Bella's parent choses to stay home with a quarantined child who is not restricted to her bedroom for the period of quarantine, then the parent will need to use paid or unpaid time off. And by extension, if the family is not having the child truly quarantine away from family members, then they should have the whole family stay home for the period of quarantine.

It's really tricky when the person in quarantine is a child, especially a young child, because most parents are not going to leave a 2nd grader home alone or lock them in their bedroom alone for 2 weeks. A high school or college kid could manage (not pleasant but manage). But that is a family decision and not the school's decision.

My sister just went through something similar with her 2nd grader. They live in Orange County, CA and my nephew started back in-person school about 3 weeks ago. He was sick with a fever and sore throat last week. So he was obviously sent home from school, but there was no way my sister was going to quarantine him alone in his room when he was feeling yucky. He spent a lot of time cuddled up on the couch next to his mom. His COVID test came back negative, which was such a relief to my sister because she knew she would catch it from him if he had it.

 

[DisneyOma]

.
High school students should be academically prepared for the next phase of their lives, if they need emotional and social rearing by then, as almost adults, then that is a personal issue and should be handled in a personal way whether through their family or counseling (could even be in the school).
To mandate that schools must 'teach' it at all grade levels goes beyond education and does border on indoctrination IMO.

It shouldn't be done to the point that academics are suffering, that's for sure. But I've seen it done well at the high school level, and it's helped a lot of kids understand how to handle stress before it gets overwhelming. We all feel stressed at some point, so it's pretty useful info, IMO. Especially over the past few seasons!