A modest proposal

[PKS44]

FACTS:
1) AK attendence falls every year with nothing on the near horizon to draw more people to this park

2)MK attendence, while down, is the strongest of the WDW parks and a new Mickey's Philharmagic may boost attendence in 2003

3)Epcot attendence is way down-hope is on Space to bring in new crowds in 2003

Impressions-AK has its highlights and its fans, but many feel that the good that is there is not good enough to make the effort to go just for a few attractions-the addition of C level Dino rides area has not been embraced nor delivered the boost.

PLAN-Move Tiki Birds, Country Bears and Jungle Cruise to AK-thematically all the "animal' based rides should be in this Animal theme park anyway. Plan to move the animals from Living Seas over as well for a better underwater life exhibit...this latter move will require some investment in new Imagineering. A Mermaid attraction could also be added... The absence of Tiki, Bears and JC in MK will hurt MK slightly if at all AND will be accepted since the longterm plan will be to build either a Journey to the Center of the Earth or 20,000 leagues ride or Indiana Jones ride (as in DL) in the WDW Adventureland space currently occupied by JC-(Imagineering already done at Tokyo DisneySeas or DL for those attractions)--The Living Seas in Epcot site could be replaced by a Stormrider attraction-again stolen/borrowed from Tokyo without the need for new Imagineering-

Why this might work--First of all, it is good show, stays true to the themes in the parks...secondly, WDW needs to look to the the next 10 to 20 years to attracting teens and twentysomethings as they are now the second largest bubble in the population (after the 50 + boomers) The addition of 3 new "thrill" rides )Space plus Stormrider + whatever takes JC's place should help. The AK instead of trying to be a small animal/thrill park can position itself more as fuller animal/younger kid/family park- an animal themed complement to the MK-spreading the guests out and in so doing enhancing the experience on property to the point where more guests will come as well...(recent trip reports comment on the huge crowds at MK but fewer guests at other parks)--would AK satisfaction be better with a Living Seas, a JC, Tiki, country Bears and Mermaid addition? MGM and Epcot would continue to appeal to the older kids and adults.

What would it cost? I don't know...but I think it could bring the new business at a cost lower than any other plan I have seen including the proposal to just add a BK coaster to AK (or a unicorn and a coaster)-both of which will require new Imagineering...something they have drastically reduced staff and budget for already...so to make more money they need to attract more guests---
or they can try to make more money by just cutting more expenses and see where that gets them...I wonder which they are planning?

Paul

 

[YoHo]

I agree with living Seas, but Disagree with the Rest. Country Bears has little or nothing to do with Animals. Tiki and Jungle cruise likewise are about the Human Adventure to exotic Locales, not about the Animals themselves.

Its a Catch 22 for AK, but the Theme had issues to begin with.

 

[All Aboard]

Scrap the Living Seas at Epcot, build much better attraction(s) at AK. Don't move the classic MK attractions to AK. At first I thought you were joking, but I guess not.

 

[raidermatt]

No need to scrap the Living Seas, just re-do it. Wonderful things can be done with underwater environments, as evidenced by the Monterey Bay Aquarium (I think AV pointed this out on another thread). I do agree, however, that this would be a great fit in AK, better than FW. Unless it were made into a true futuristic attraction that featured underwater living environments for humans, for example.

The only thing I'll say about AK attendance is that the 2001 drop was in-line percentage-wise with the drops at the other parks (except Epcot, which was larger). So it maybe it has leveled off. And while the general consensus on this board is that DR is a sham, that doesn't mean that it and the parade that was added won't have a positive affect on attendance. I'm not saying that makes DR good, only that if the AK detrators are going to use attendance as their proof that AK falls short, they will need to be prepared to reverse field if attendance rises.

 

[DC7800]

PLAN-Move Tiki Birds, Country Bears and Jungle Cruise to AK-thematically all the "animal' based rides should be in this Animal theme park anyway. Plan to move the animals from Living Seas over as well for a better underwater life exhibit...this latter move will require some investment in new Imagineering.

The biggest thing I really don't like about this idea is that it would pretty much gut half of Adventureland. Besides, we all know Disney's track record with closed but never replaced attractions. AK does need its own river/boat attraction on the level of the Jungle Cruise. Actually, so far as I'm concerned, Maharajah and Pangani Forest should have been rides anyway - and a boat would have been ideal (with a "Behind the Seeds" style walking tour to let guests go at their own pace).

I'll completely agree about the need for more attractions, and it might indeed be possible to move or clone certain attractions from other parks (Soarin, or even the StormRider simulator). But please, not Adventureland.

 

[YoHo]

I agree with DC7800,
Those walking Path's should have been rides.

 

[WDWHound]

I think the question of whether the walking paths should have been rides demonstates the issues that are facing this park. These attractions are walking paths for a reason. The idea was to allow you enough time to not only view the animals, but also to emerse yourself in their environment. This would be difficult to do with a ride.

My wife loves AK. She literally spends hours on those walking paths looking at the Gorillas, Tigers and other wildlife. She also likes the safari, but complains that you don't get to spend enough time looking at the animals. I think that most of AK was built for people like her. She would be very upset if the walk through experiences were ever made into rides. She doesn't want a ride, she wants to be able to view the animals at her own pace. Me, I'm a ride kind of guy. I love AK, but I tire of it after 5 or 6 hours. I want more rides, but this park wasn't built with me in mind.

I think Disney built this park thinking there were a lot more people like my wife out there, or that people like me could be brought around. They took a chance, it might have even worked had they actually built Beastly Kingdom. As it turns out, they built a park that some people love, and most people find only so so.

So, how do they fix it? Simple, add more new things to do. (note, I said NEW things, not things people have already experienced in other parks). These new things do not all have to be rides. They could add more trails and animal exhibits as well. The problem isn't that the park is lacking rides, it's that there are not enough attractions of any kind to fill the day for those of us who only spend 10 - 15 minutes on any given walk through. Unless you take that park at VERY leisurely pace, you run out of things to do well before the park closes.

I actually have high hopes for AK. If the Beastly Kingdom rumors are true, we might get a couple of new attractions in the next few years, including a genuine e-ticket (The Dragon Coaster). Add to that a couple more walk throughs of the caliber of the ones they have now, and this park could offer full days entertainment for most people. The danger, of course, is that Eisner will find out that this all costs money and we will end up with couple of cheap carnival rides surrounded bv plywood animals (but they would never do that, would they? )

 

[YoHo]

Well, The Safari is a bit of a Thrill ride in the sense that it moves fast. I was thinking more along the lines of Pirates or Storybookland where you are given the time to expireance things and maybe a guid to tell you about them.

 

[WDWHound]

I too would enjoy such a ride, but unless the ride featured the ability to tie the boat up to a dock and sit in one scene for 20 minutes or so, it would be too fast for my wife.

 

[PKS44]

Originally posted by YoHo
I agree with living Seas, but Disagree with the Rest. Country Bears has little or nothing to do with Animals. Tiki and Jungle cruise likewise are about the Human Adventure to exotic Locales, not about the Animals themselves.

Its a Catch 22 for AK, but the Theme had issues to begin with.

Well that leaves me wondering what the whole Camp MinnieMickey area has to do with animals, not to mention Tarzan Rocks...it is Disney's Animal Kingdom and should be able to encompass real animals, extinct animals, mythical animals, and imaginary animals of our modern times....

 

[YoHo]

Camp Minnie Mickey Was a rush Job to replace the Axed Beastly kingdom. Tarzan Rocks was a show looking for a Theme park.


Like I said, the adventureland rides are about People, not animals.

 

[PKS44]

I know that Camp MinnieMickey was a cheap way out of actually building a more complete park...my point is that the Adventureland rides would certainly be no worse of a fit...and while I share the general feeling that it would be better if Disney would just invest in doing things right in the first place like OLC did in Tokyo that would be best....but that is never going to happen with the current management, thus my "modest" proposal.

 

[YoHo]

but your modest performance is expensive and would destroy half of the magic kingdom in the process.

 

[abitjaded]

I agree with WDWhound's wife. More trails, more animals. Sure the rides are fun but the park could be so much more animal-wise. What ever happened to the river boats, all that water space with nothing to show for it. How 'bout a lazy ride past more animal environments? Or do something about the train ride. Oh the views! (views, what views?) Leave Adventureland as it is and leave AK to the animals that were or are. Then add Beastly Kingdom for the animals that never were without gutting the other parks.

Carla

 

[doubletrouble_vb]

I think if they give up on the notion that its Nahtazu then they could look at some of the more interesting zoos around the world and pick up on those ideas...

One very simple idea would be a nocturnal exhibit. It would be possible to combine both a ride and exhibits in one...you start out with a trail (indoors)...transition to a ride and end up in another trail.

The failure to make use of the river around Discovery Island is truly annoying. There has got to be a way to combine the boat with exhibits. Architecture or...something along the lines of "Anaconda". Of course the river is in Asia...so maybe Indiana Jones is called for.

 

[PKS44]

Originally posted by YoHo
but your modest performance is expensive and would destroy half of the magic kingdom in the process.

Hey, I am not married to the ideas and I really appreciate everybody's take- but come on- Tiki, JC, and Country Bears are hardly HALF the Magic Kingdom...plus you would get a new E-ticket in exchange in the MK (Indy, or Journey to Center of the Earth)-- They are already rumored to be closing JC --and Tiki and Bears are run-off attractions, that is they are not destination attractions, but stuff to do for the crowds that run-off the more popular things...AK needs more big stuff and more little stuff and I don't agree that moving these animal themed rides from one park to another would be that expensive...Maybe the JC would be on the pricey side, but the rest is pretty cheap- right in line with the current Disney philosophy--

-The Animal Kingdom is the biggest park, so it has room for all of the approaches, naturalist, fantasy, etc...and a more varied experience might improve overall guest satisfaction, as many guests, my family included, found the park to be only so-so...is it a better experience than the average zoo? Sure. Better than the top zoos? In many ways, yes...But was it so much better that it warranted an admission more than 4 x the cost of the top zoos? Uh, no. Not as it is. I would be interested in hearing how the opinion on AK in general varies depending on whether one is an AP holder or not...My guess is that AP holders generally like the park as a nice diversion, and that nonAP holders find it lacking in value...or that at least there is a discrepency in the number of positive feelings about the park based on what it "costs" people to get in....

Paul

 

[YoHo]

I would submit to you that one e-Ticket, mind you an E-ticket that is a duplicate of one found in other parks is not a sufficent replacement for 3 rides in MK. and According to Safari Steve who actually runs the Ride, Jungel cruise's numbers are higher then before. Its only problem is the potential for contaminated water. a Potential that exists at AK too.

 

[PKS44]

Originally posted by YoHo
I would submit to you that one e-Ticket, mind you an E-ticket that is a duplicate of one found in other parks is not a sufficent replacement for 3 rides in MK.

I agree- but it beats what they will probably do-which is eliminate JC altogether for "health" reasons and replace with an Aladdin character meet/greet to complement the new spinner/marketplace...look at the replacements that have been put in place for 20K, the skyway, etc...I would not be the least surprised if the comments around the boardroom about such things don't go something like this-

Exec: There are too many things for people to do at the MK, anyway! Plus folks love those characters, so why are we worrying about expensive retrofits to keep the water clean? If they want to see animals we got the AK! We closed 20K and replaced it with Ariel-which allows synergies with merchandise sales as 20K never did. We closed Timekeeper and Carousel of Progress much of the year and it has not hurt attendence levels at all...like those attractions, Jungle Cruise does little to nothing to help merchandise sales, we need Aladdin in there or better yet maybe Emperor's New Groove sales to be pushed up..build a little Emperor's place or better yet, and cheaper, one of those peasant huts and staff it for meet/greets with a plush shop next door...(the exec would not know the character's names are Kuzco and Pascha-actually he might not even know enough about the movie to even get this far!)

I have to stop now as I am making myself ill.

Paul

 

[YoHo]

Actually, despite the movie's poor performance, and ENG attraction or themed area would work both in the Adventureland area and if they created a South American Land in AK.

 

[PKS44]

Originally posted by YoHo
Actually, despite the movie's poor performance, and ENG attraction or themed area would work both in the Adventureland area and if they created a South American Land in AK.

I don't doubt it-I really like ENG and think it's "failure" was a failure caused by bad marketing including the title...but another meet and greet?!!? NOOOOOOOO!!!