An actual Rumor! (EPCOT)

[Bstanley]

I've only got one 'mole' at WDW - at Epcot - and lo and behold she has related that there will be big doin's at 'The Outpost' and the rumor is a 'Soarin' attraction.

Has anyone with more connections heard this?

 

[HorizonsFan]

Any idea what we'll be Soarin' over?

 

[Peter Pirate]

I'd like it, but I really had Austrailia (with Soarin') at AK penciled in for...

This would really pull guest traffic to that back corner of the park, wouldn't it? I'd expect the TT, Norway, Soarin' corridor to become quite busy, but it could be lonely over by Canada & GB...

 

[DisneyKidds]

WOW! Two rumors in one day. Cool. Come on AV - lets have it.

 

[Galahad]

but it could be lonely over by Canada & GB...

Or blissfully quiet....for that pint of bitters and the British Invasion all to yourself........

 

[DisneyKidds]

Scoop - you do realize that the Black and Tan is what the women drink across the pond. Bring on the Guiness uncut I say .

(Only Kidding, of course - I have been known to partake of a B&T now and again. )

 

[HauntedMansionFan]

I heard this rumor also, but I read that if they did go though with it it would be put over in between The Land and The Living Seas, to draw more traffic to that half of Future World.

 

[Dizneynut]

I would just love to see a Soarin' attraction built anywhere at Epcot, since this is my favorite park Lets hope that they do it and do it soon. I had read about the possibility of a weather themed Soarin ride by the Living Seas, and I think that would be a wonderful idea.

 

[daannzzz]

The Soarin" ride is really, really pleasent and fun. In my opinion it is only a D-ticket. A really good D-ticket but definatley not and E.
It would work really good for any current country in World Showcase or any country the choose to add. HOWEVER...I think that World Showcase needs more fullblown ride throughs NOT another film based attraction! Film based attractions will almost never get a E-ticket out of me, though Star Tours did at first.
Future World doesn't need any more film based attractions either and I think that World Showcase needs the next E-ticket at Epcot.
While a Soarin ride would be nice at AK too I still wonder how it will be themed to any animal or animal encounter. But of the "rides/ big shows" at AK, one is already a 3D movie. AK needs more "rides" before another movie.
Disney needs to just suck it up and put Soaring in where thery want but also include some more Non thrill (Space/ or coaster) and non film rides! I would be happy with some C-ticket dark rides in addition to some of the larger plans they have now.

 

[Another Voice]

As the saying goes, don’t start shouting until you see the whites of the bulldoze driver’s eyes.

Everyone in a responsible position at any of the parks wants new attractions. It adds excitement to a place and is a guaranteed way of keeping the guests coming. Ideally, each of the parks would like a new addition every year. And the few people left at WDI want to work on projects as well. They are creative types that want to keep busy, and on a more practical matter, they are clinging to anything that will provide a hint of job security for another week.

Inside The Company there was a dynamic of the parks always wanting new stuff and designers always coming up with new stuff. Ideas would always be flying around and everyone would always be talking about “the next big project”. Good ideas would take on a life of their own and the trick was to get enough people convinced of the project’s merits to proceed.

Well, at least that’s the way things used to work.

There are three ways to get a project moving at Disney these days: find someone else to pay for it (Innoventions, ‘Mission: Space’), play off the egos of the executives (Paradise Pier, Phillimagic) or fill a marketing need on the cheap (‘Aladdin’, Dino-Rama). It doesn’t really matter what the project is any more (it’s very much the same way in which movies get made). Certainly no one believes that the concept behind Dino-Rama was so stunning that it was begging to be built; it was simply the best they could do with the resources and skills available to check off the “there’s not enough for kids to do” bullet point on the marketing survey presentation. And people would really like to see the complete Space Pavilion, but Compaq only would pay for the thrill ride portion so that’s what got built. It’s an era of minimal expectations.

When California Adventure opened, the only hit attraction in the entire park was ‘Soaring Over California’. Everyone in all the other parks took immediate notice. First, the thing had the “cheap” part of the equation down. The engineering had already been done and the attraction is rather minimal to begin with. And it was film based which thrilled both the new head of WDI and the head of Attractions. To them, film means cheap to build and cheap to update (although they have never approved a cheap update any film using Disney’s own dime). And certainly being “the hit” of DCA would make the project easy to sell. Pencils all in Orlando and Glendale began scratching.

I have heard of over a dozen serious “Soaring” clones and no doubt that are a hundred more in desks. There was even a concept to for an exact clone with the California film for both Disney/MGM Studios and Disney Studios Paris (both parks are that desperate for something new). And I’ve heard of three companies that were approached for sponsorship deals as well.

At Epcot, there has always been a strong criticism that World Showcase really isn’t representative of the world. I heard it once described as “only places where Starbucks has reached a critical mass”. And it is rather hard to describe the place as being about world cultures when nothing on the globe south of Cancun’s latitude is represented – nothing from India and southern Asia, nothing from Africa, nothing from South America. Even the old ‘If You Had Wings’ ride was move inclusive of destinations than WS seems to be.

Someone very quickly came up with the ‘Soaring over the World’ concept as a way to “fill in the blanks” from WS. Guest reaction to the old Millennium tent was generally good and most guests really liked to true diversity of cultures there. I mean on a global scale there’s not a whole lot different between Norway and Germany in the “regular” World Showcase. Being able to go from an African presentation to Sweden was much more interesting (although we all probably would have a much different take on the Saudi area these days; another problem that World Show has).

But, the “Soaring” ride system works just about anywhere on the globe. And while being representative of all people is a nice thought – people bearing representations of Benjamin Franklin on lots and lots of $100 bills would be even nicer. A “Soaring” clone would be an easy and profitable addition to any existing pavilion (especially one without an attraction), a pavilion that needs to have a worn out attraction replace (which is just about all of them), or even a whole new country.

In the end, what gets built is not going to be the call of Epcot, WDW or even Attractions. A much higher authority is going to make the final decision. Just because it’s been “approved in the budget” doesn’t mean anything these days. About the only sure bet for approval – “Soaring over ABC’s New Fall Lineup”. That one would be built in a week.

 

[d-r]

Originally posted by thedscoop
...not to be nitpicky but your geography has gone a little "South". ....(snip)

Every continent expect Antarctica and Australia are represented. Plus, three of the largest and most extensive pavilions (China, Mexico, and Morocco) are not European or, maybe arguably, Westernized.

There is no country from South America at world showcase- and I'm not sure what Mexico could be if not "Western?"

the countries in world showcase represent 1. the biggest tourist draws, and 2. countries willing to pay to be added (Norway & Morocco)-

DT

 

[Another Voice]

“My only point is that WS does a fine job of balancing political stability/diplomatic reality with a theme park context”

As in you have no problems with China but you think present day South Africa and Israel aren’t “balanced” enough. Interesting.

This is exactly the kind of criticism that World Showcase has received from the beginning – it’s a pleasant, non-threatening, non-real kind of “community of approved nations”. If Mexico can represent all of Latin American, why are there so many pavilions filled with pasty white Europeans? Africa is banished to another park, and South Asia not represented at all – but England, France, Italy, Germany, and Norway all get a showcase (Spain and Switzerland came close too) and that’s “balanced”? And if Africa would be repetitive because of Animal Kingdom, let’s save some money by closing The American Adventure – WDW already has Main Street U.S.A. after all.

The people at Epcot have longed wanted to expand representation in World Showcase. They’ve been stopped many times in the past, but the old Millennium Pavilion was a good try. Hopefully there will be another go at it soon so we can see all the sights not included in the existing “balanced” view of the world – like the Great Barrier Reef, Victoria Falls, the Pyramids, the Andes, the Taj Mahal, the Velt, Ankor Wat,…

So Mr. Scoop – you seem to be implying that Morocco is representative of African culture because of its location and that Mexico is a strange and exotic locale. That’s okay. I too went to a high school where the football coach taught geography.

 

[Planogirl]

the countries in world showcase represent 1. the biggest tourist draws, and 2. countries willing to pay to be added (Norway & Morocco)-

Is Norway actually paying to be there? I had heard that Morocco had done a lot to build their own pavilion but I didn't know about Norway.

I think that AV summed it up nicely. I agree that Mexico can hardly be representative of the whole continent of South America not only because of the diversity of South America but Mexico is certainly not even in that part of the world. Besides Mexican culture is not particularly exotic to us in Texas.

Plus there is so much to Asia that those nations represented barely scratch the surface. Australia is left out and how Morocco can cover all of Africa is beyond me. There are certainly problems in the Middle East but Egypt seems relatively quiet along with Jordan and Kuwait (now) and others. And even as overly European as World Showcase is now, I wouldn't mind seeing a few more nations added to better represent Eastern and Southern Europe.

The World Showcase is far from complete IMO.

 

[manning]

The last thing I want to think about, when at WDW, is the real world!!!

 

[Planogirl]

Hey I would never make fun of Mexico! But I hardly consider it particularly foreign or exotic. But that's just me.

I don't think everywhere needs to be represented (as nice as that would be) but saying that World Showcase is complete in the context of a World's Fair is hardly correct. And that was the original premise if I'm not mistaken. I was simply pointing a few wonderful cultures that are sadly lacking at World Showcase in my opinion.

I look at the world through a traveler's eyes. I consider so much of the world to be fascinating and well worth learning about and I'm excited to do so. There's great beauty in much of the world and in the world's people and learning about that is, I believe, the point of a World's Fair.

Perhaps World Showcase is not truly representative of a World's Fair then. If so what is the purpose of it?

Please take this in the spirit it is intended. I LOVE World Showcase. I just wish that it could be expanded and truly show us the beauty of our world.

 

[CarolynK]

...criticism that World Showcase has received from the beginning – it’s a pleasant, non-threatening, non-real kind of “community of approved nations”.

Who was it that criticized that? That is exactly what Disney is all about.

 

[Another Voice]

No one said anything about turning World Showcase into Ted Turner’s playground. Mr. Scoop made a statement that World Showcase is wonderfully representative of the world. It isn’t. Disney’s known that from the beginning and has tried on several occasions to improve the situation. Hopefully one of the “Soaring” concepts will work.

There are a lot of people – inside and out of the Company – that think World Showcase feels like “international day” at the school’s cafeteria. A choice between tacos, spaghetti, hot dogs and egg rolls is nice – but it doesn’t really display the true variety of the world’s food. Is there anything so wrong with adding some curry dishes to the mix?

None of that has any kind of political objective. And it was recognized early on that defining pavilions strictly on “nations” wouldn’t work. That’s why the Equatorial African pavilion wasn’t tied to a single country. And even Norway came real close to being “Scandinavia”.

Epcot is supposed to be educational and filled with wonders. Its goal is to demonstrate, to teach and to expose different things people. I think there are plenty of interesting and wonderful sights and cultures that can be – and should be – included. There’s a whole big world out there beyond the “ethnic” places at your mall’s food court. Again, I hope Disney has found a way to show this.

For fantasy, I’ll go on ‘It’s A Small World’.

 

[AKemel]

...Epcot is supposed to be educational and filled with wonders...

I think it should be "Epcot is entertaining and filled with wonders", which it is.

 

[Bstanley]

HEY - this is my thread - and who told you that you could turn it into another argument?

Oh, ok, let's argue....I mean debate, yeah, debate...

This is exactly the kind of criticism that World Showcase has received from the beginning – it’s a pleasant, non-threatening, non-real kind of “community of approved nations”.

Sounds perfect to me. When I'm paying $50 a ticket let's make sure that the entertainment comes first and the education comes woven within the story.

Having seen a far amount of the rest of the world ... alas the views of the most exotic 'third world' locale I was exposed to were obscured by the sights on my CAR-15 ... I may sound politially incorrect here, but frankly I don't want World Showcase to be representative of 'The World', I agree with Mr. Manning. I want it to entertain me and my family.

 

[DisneyKidds]

One thing coach most definitely said was 'keep your eye on the ball'.

We are talking a WDW theme park folks, not an institution of higher learning. Yes, the idea is to expose WDW guests to cultures of other nations. It is all sanitized and unreal. Very nice puff pieces that accentuate the positive. Know what? That is what people want on their vacation. That is what brings in the people. That is what sells. Furthermore, you can't blame that on a new philosophy of money over the experience either. Remember, according to many Epcot is the last of the great parks done the right way under the old philosophey. Even as such, they had to make it appealing and uncontroversial to the masses.

OK, maybe Scoop shouldn't have said it does a good job of representing THE world. It does, however, do a good job of representing the world that most people want to see on their vacation to WDW. Sure, some of us more adventurous types might like to see something a bit more edgy and off the beaten path, but we are in the minority, and any theme park, even Disney, has to sell to the majority.