Beginning to think I dodged the DVC bullet :(

[CanadaDisney05]

I am not sure why I seem to have ruffled your feathers, but this will be the last I respond to you.

1) Note the title of my thread "I think ..." There is no way for me to know for certain that DVC would not have been a fit for me, because I never actually bought in. Therefore, I can only use the "real-life experience" that I have.

2) The numerous times I have attempted to secure a rental at the DVC resorts that I want to stay in, for the unit type I want, and the travel dates I want, at the exact 11-month mark, have NEVER been available. These attempts have been made through various brokers and eBay. I understand totally that renting is a completely different animal than being an owner. I do not have the capability of seeing availability. But, I assume that the people who are checking availability for me are not lying because they want a sale. Just seems logical to me.

3) I can only assume that the numerous threads on this forum regarding walking, wait listing, piecing together reservations, etc., regardless of how long the poster has owned, are valid. I can also only conclude that because of these threads there are several owners who need to be flexible, to go with the flow, or whatever you want to call it. But then again, maybe these people just make that stuff up.

4) I am NOT trying to state that owning a DVC is a bad thing. Obviously, the good must far outweigh the bad or people would not be still buying in until this day. The vast majority of owners, yourself included, must be happy with their decision, which is the way it should be. If most of you weren't happy, Disney sure wouldn't keep building DVC resorts.

5) I am simply making a point that the experiences I have had, coupled with multiple threads from multiple owners on this forum, strongly indicate that for me PERSONALLY it likely would have been a disappointment.

Readers of this thread should take my humble "opinion" and draw their own conclusions, even if it doesn't compare to your holier than thou decades of real-life experience.

What I am about to say is mostly a repeat of what others have posted.

1) Using your rental experience as a barometer of actual availability for owners is a flawed premise which has been pointed out several times. To find a rental requires several very key components to work out. 1) Must be a renter who has the perfect amount of points to rent (not too many, not too little), 2) Renter must own at the resort you want, 3) There must be full availability for the exact dates you requested, and the exact room type you requested. That's a lot to ask for.

2) I haven't been a member long, but through my research, and my experience checking out the Availability Tool regularly, I think the limited availability is really overblown. You can get a studio at most resorts, during most times of the year at 7 months, with some exceptions. You may not be able to secure that BLT Standard, AKL Value, BWV Standard, or AKL Concierge, BCV Studio, or VGC studio. But, most of the year you can snag an AKL standard/savannah view, BWV Garden View or BLT Lake View. Food & Wine, December, and Run Disney seem to be specific one-offs where availability may be limited at 7 months. For the most part, you should be able to snag something at the 11 month window though.

3) Even after all that, if you have some flexibility in your schedule or are willing to split stay, you can probably piece something together.

Of course DVC is not for everyone, and it is not my job to sell the product. I just thought I'd reiterate that your conclusion may or may not be wrong, but your premise seems to be untrue for the most part.

 

[Bing Showei]

I am not sure why I seem to have ruffled your feathers, but this will be the last I respond to you.

1) Note the title of my thread "I think ..." There is no way for me to know for certain that DVC would not have been a fit for me, because I never actually bought in. Therefore, I can only use the "real-life experience" that I have.

2) The numerous times I have attempted to secure a rental at the DVC resorts that I want to stay in, for the unit type I want, and the travel dates I want, at the exact 11-month mark, have NEVER been available. These attempts have been made through various brokers and eBay. I understand totally that renting is a completely different animal than being an owner. I do not have the capability of seeing availability. But, I assume that the people who are checking availability for me are not lying because they want a sale. Just seems logical to me.

3) I can only assume that the numerous threads on this forum regarding walking, wait listing, piecing together reservations, etc., regardless of how long the poster has owned, are valid. I can also only conclude that because of these threads there are several owners who need to be flexible, to go with the flow, or whatever you want to call it. But then again, maybe these people just make that stuff up.

4) I am NOT trying to state that owning a DVC is a bad thing. Obviously, the good must far outweigh the bad or people would not be still buying in until this day. The vast majority of owners, yourself included, must be happy with their decision, which is the way it should be. If most of you weren't happy, Disney sure wouldn't keep building DVC resorts.

5) I am simply making a point that the experiences I have had, coupled with multiple threads from multiple owners on this forum, strongly indicate that for me PERSONALLY it likely would have been a disappointment.

Readers of this thread should take my humble "opinion" and draw their own conclusions, even if it doesn't compare to your holier than thou decades of real-life experience.

I think the challenging piece for a lot of owners to relate to/empathize with, and that we feel may give potential owners a false sense of reality, is that you seem to draw the conclusion of having "dodged a bullet" around owning base mostly on your rental experience and anecdotal evidence found on these boards. The internet is a great place to complain, but is probably an inaccurate tool to use to measure satisfaction. The reality is that as owner there wouldn't have been the kinds of bullets you're dealing with as a renter.

I know you're talking about the "exact 11-month mark" but unless you're asking an owner to look at a future date, even on the 11-month date, that owner has lost several hours and if you're looking at a Standard View studio at VGF, BWV, etc., it's the difference between getting what you want and not.

Owners looking for studio-only stays will be more challenged most times of the year, so it's certainly not the flexibility that guides may sell you on, but most owners are able to work around the inherent challenges of a very popular point-based timeshare.

 

[luvthatmouseinohio]

I think the challenging piece for a lot of owners to relate to/empathize with, and that we feel may give potential owners a false sense of reality, is that you seem to draw the conclusion of having "dodged a bullet" around owning base mostly on your rental experience and anecdotal evidence found on these boards. The internet is a great place to complain, but is probably an inaccurate tool to use to measure satisfaction. The reality is that as owner there wouldn't have been the kinds of bullets you're dealing with as a renter.

I know you're talking about the "exact 11-month mark" but unless you're asking an owner to look at a future date, even on the 11-month date, that owner has lost several hours and if you're looking at a Standard View studio at VGF, BWV, etc., it's the difference between getting what you want and not.

Owners looking for studio-only stays will be more challenged most times of the year, so it's certainly not the flexibility that guides may sell you on, but most owners are able to work around the inherent challenges of a very popular point-based timeshare.

Perhaps the “bullet” analogy came across as offensive and was a poor choice of words on my part. I assure you it was never my intention to offend current DVC owners. The intent was to give potential buyers something to think about. If I had it to do over again I would not make the post at all.

 

[Louis morrell]

Only my experience. We purchased resale Saratoga in October 17, added on direct in June 19. We have already been on 4 trips, have another coming up in July. We have never stayed at Saratoga. We have been in a standard studio at Kadani, a 1br at Boardwalk, a great standard (one of the std with savanna view) at Jambo, a studio at Old Key West and coming up a studio at Boardwalk. The first time We will be staying at Saratoga is Thanksgiving this year and only because we have a studio and a 2br for a family reunion Disney style. I think there is a lot of avalibility most times. Most of the complaints I see here are categories with very limited numbers of rooms, very popular dates or just couldn't get exactly what they wanted and did not want to take advantage of other options. My only goal with DVC was to get a room at Walt Disney World period. So i guess I boughtvwhere I wanted to stay.

My only regret is that we did not buy in on 2 decades sooner.

 

[Spark65]

I am not sure why I seem to have ruffled your feathers, but this will be the last I respond to you.

2) The numerous times I have attempted to secure a rental at the DVC resorts that I want to stay in, for the unit type I want, and the travel dates I want, at the exact 11-month mark, have NEVER been available.

Never ever quit I hate when people do that especially in a debate I'd rather lose than quit a debate.

Renting is not the same as owning as has been pointed out I think if you bought in you'd have a much different perspective. Unless you're willing to buy you will never really know.

 

[kedskit5]

In my current planning for purchasing DVC this is message I read time & time again from current DVC members.

Totally agree! I'm also planning to purchase, however I cannot decide where I want to buy in. So many pros and cons to each resort. I think I've narrowed it down to AKL, SS, or OKW 2057. I'm really trying to stay away from 2042 resorts as we are a younger family.

 

[npatellye]

I’ve been following this thread and have remained silent. I appreciate that DVC is not for you. However, as new DVC members (purchased in December 2019 and closed January 2020), we have so far not had any issues booking standard studios. Granted, we aren’t booking Boardwalk but I was able to log on quite a few hours after the 8 am time on the 11 month mark and book a standard studio at Riviera for Thanksgiving week. I was also able to log a few on days after the 11 month mark to book two studios (one standard and one preferred) at Riviera from just before Christmas to the beginning of marathon weekend.

I had no trouble adding days as needed to span the entire trip. I didn’t walk any of the reservations because I don’t have the time or the patience for that. Will I try to switch both reservations at 7 months? Absolutely but only because my kids want to stay at OKW or SSR for Thanksgiving and we are hoping to switch to a 2 bedroom for December/January.

DVC isn’t for everyone and I respect that. But it’s also not as impossible to get reservations as you think. Just my two cents as a DVC newbie.

 

[RAL710]

We bought into DVC in 2016 and then bought another contract in 2017. I've booked 8 trips since then and never really had an issue with availability of a desirable resort. Most of the time we are booking a 1 Br and not studios, so that may be part of the issue. The only time it has really been a "problem" is when we booked a last minute trip and could "only" get SSR, which honestly worked out fine.

I am sure that it's been said thousands of times before, but DVC is probably not for you if...

you have to finance,
you don't plan your vacations more than 11 months in advance,
you don't seeing yourself being able to stay in multiple different resorts,
you don't see yourself still going to Disney on a regular basis 10 years from now,
you only go during popular times and aren't flexible with where you stay.

AND there's nothing wrong with any of these things.

 

[sethschroeder]

Perhaps the “bullet” analogy came across as offensive and was a poor choice of words on my part. I assure you it was never my intention to offend current DVC owners. The intent was to give potential buyers something to think about. If I had it to do over again I would not make the post at all. ☹

I don't really see the posts of people who just bought and regret it outside those who bought on a cruise/trip at RIV and did no research outside what Disney told them.

Maybe I just miss it but it's very rare especially when you look at the ROFR thread and how many are going through monthly.

I think the low turnover rate in general of contracts also points to a general happiness.

Its not like normal timeshares where you can't sell them so that's why there isn't more turnover.

 

[E2ME2]

Can you rent DVC for $200/Night, regardless of where you want to stay, and what room size you need?? The reason I ask is that, based on my DVC cost-tracking spreadsheet that I update every year to reflect the changes in MFs and to account for any add-onitis experienced , I get to an averaged cost of $200/Night by year #20 (YMMV). & we have stayed in Studios/1BR/2BR/and most recently a 3BR GV, across SSR/OKW/BWV/AKL/HHI. (YMMV)
So it really is my curiosity to know if a renter can achieve that price point for a sustained period of time. I don't know where I could stay, on-property, with the on-property perks, plus the DVC perks, for anywhere close to $200/Night.

 

[npatellye]

Can you rent DVC for $200/Night, regardless of where you want to stay, and what room size you need?? The reason I ask is that, based on my DVC cost-tracking spreadsheet that I update every year to reflect the changes in MFs and to account for any add-onitis experienced , I get to an averaged cost of $200/Night by year #20 (YMMV). & we have stayed in Studios/1BR/2BR/and most recently a 3BR GV, across SSR/OKW/BWV/AKL/HHI. (YMMV)
So it really is my curiosity to know if a renter can achieve that price point for a sustained period of time. I don't know where I could stay, on-property, with the on-property perks, plus the DVC perks, for anywhere close to $200/Night.

I just don’t see $200/night to rent DVC being possible over an extended period of time. We had booked CBR for this May and that ran us about $250/night (room only); that’s when we decided it was ridiculous to keep paying for hotels instead of buying in to DVC.

 

[Wakey]

DVC is great- at the right price. The right price for me was SSR resale. I have never looked back, I bought twice the points for 1 beds and never have problems booking with a few expectations. So in the past 2 years for example, I have stayed Boardwalk Standard view (in summer) Kidani standard, Beach Club at Christmas and BLT at New Year (that last one was a bit lucky). I have just booked a Copper Creek Studio for August (I am not looking forward to the studio but looking to save points) and a Grand Californian 1 bed for July. I am currently waiting to book Boardwalk at Christmas- I would not expect standard view but I am certain I will get a pool or garden view. Basically I stay roughly where I want, when I want, and love my DVC. And I come from the UK and I can only come in UK school vacation time. So the oft shouted 'Buy where you want to stay' advice is not too great for me and my mainly 1 bed DVC lifestyle, but it becomes more important if you need studios all the time or have very specific requirements (for example, Wilderness Lodge in December). But you probably did not dodge a bullet, you may just not have done enough research- but it is not suitable for everyone. We love it.
Your points renter not only has to be available, and have the points, but would have to be lined up and motivated enough to be logging on to book on the 7 month mark. That latter aspect is quite unlikely. The one time I rented, it was not time critical- Davids emailed me and asked me to book that day which was about 6 months out for Poly and the same for AKV.

 

[quandrea]

Totally agree! I'm also planning to purchase, however I cannot decide where I want to buy in. So many pros and cons to each resort. I think I've narrowed it down to AKL, SS, or OKW 2057. I'm really trying to stay away from 2042 resorts as we are a younger family.

All great choices in terms of value. I don’t own at OKW, but wish I did!

 

[crisi]

I don't really see the posts of people who just bought and regret it outside those who bought on a cruise/trip at RIV and did no research outside what Disney told them.

Maybe I just miss it but it's very rare especially when you look at the ROFR thread and how many are going through monthly.

I think the low turnover rate in general of contracts also points to a general happiness.

Its not like normal timeshares where you can't sell them so that's why there isn't more turnover.

I think there are plenty of people who bought and regret it. The people who buy and regret it don't tend to post here. People don't tend to want to publicly admit their mistakes and DVC is definitely not for everyone. Had the OP bought, they might have indeed regretted it - if they for instance thought they'd get a BWV standard view studio at Food and Wine or a VAKL Conceirge room every year - even at eleven months. Or if they wanted to sleep around in studios in near park resorts without flexibility in dates or without flexibility of which resort for which trip. Since she really hasn't posted about how she intended to use DVC, I really don't know if it would have been a poor fit or not - only that measuring rental availability against member availability isn't a great way to decide - and that given the date of this post, she seems to have started browsing the boards when availability becomes the biggest concern - eleven months out from Fall Frenzy.

 

[bookswin]

I just booked a Little Mermaid room at Art of Animation for $136. There is no DVC booking that will match that value.

This is highly dependent on resort and time of year. Right now Pop Century December 7-11, 9 months out, is $170 a night plus tax. A Moderate is around $350 plus tax. Compare that to an OKW studio at 10 points, which would rent for about $160. And 29 of 31 December studio nights at OKW are bookable right now.

 

[sethschroeder]

I think there are plenty of people who bought and regret it. The people who buy and regret it don't tend to post here. People don't tend to want to publicly admit their mistakes

I will just point to resale being just 20% of 25 year old resorts as being proof.

That includes the fact that pretty much anyone to purchase 10 years ago is breaking even at worse on points plus having vacations that were on MFs. Not to even add in those who purchased resale who could turn around after a year or two and break even.

I would say if you dodged a bullet it's more than just an inconvenience. It would mean to me you are insta selling your contract if you can get your money back.

 

[E2ME2]

I will just point to resale being just 20% of 25 year old resorts as being proof.

That includes the fact that pretty much anyone to purchase 10 years ago is breaking even at worse on points plus having vacations that were on MFs. Not to even add in those who purchased resale who could turn around after a year or two and break even.

I would say if you dodged a bullet it's more than just an inconvenience. It would mean to me you are insta selling your contract if you can get your money back.

I had not even factored the recoup of my DVC, through resale, as I guess the thought of selling has never entered my mind. The current rate for SSR on the resale market is slightly more than I paid direct in 2010.
If, in theory, I sold today at break-even, my vacations to-date would have cost me the MFs only and, based on my actual usage, averaged just under $170/Night (71 Nights total, 17-STU/40-1BR/7-2BR/7-3BR).
WOW! - STOP; You're making me want to buy more points !
ET

 

[MonkeyKnifeFight]

This is highly dependent on resort and time of year. Right now Pop Century December 7-11, 9 months out, is $170 a night plus tax. A Moderate is around $350 plus tax. Compare that to an OKW studio at 10 points, which would rent for about $160. And 29 of 31 December studio nights at OKW are bookable right now.

This is why we rented and are now buying. We were booking a room for marathon weekend last year and an art of animation family suite with tax was more than the lake view at the Polynesian on rented points. Not a lot more, but still this was a value room vs a deluxe. I know the family suite had more space, but the excellent location and being lake view made a huge difference in making the trip amazing.

 

[crisi]

I will just point to resale being just 20% of 25 year old resorts as being proof.

That includes the fact that pretty much anyone to purchase 10 years ago is breaking even at worse on points plus having vacations that were on MFs. Not to even add in those who purchased resale who could turn around after a year or two and break even.

I would say if you dodged a bullet it's more than just an inconvenience. It would mean to me you are insta selling your contract if you can get your money back.

That's still plenty of people who regret it. It isn't for everyone. And not everyone gets their money back selling their contract. After you pay closing costs and commissions, if you sell your contract without managing to take a trip - say due to sudden financial hardship - you are out money. If you buy and then the market collapses, you can be out ALOT of money - which happened to many, many people in 2008-2019 - sometimes with life altering consequences as they not only lost DVC, but lost homes and marriages. I'm not sure how you are figuring 20% turnover in the old resorts, if that is over the course of the 25 years or if its annualized.

Those of us who watched 2008-2010 happen tend to be a lot more cautious is our promises that you will recoup your costs, sell at a profit, etc. The market could turn quick, you could lose your job, marriage or health along with it. And DVC becomes a burden quickly in those circumstances. Are most people who buy happy - or at least content - sure.....but the downside is big enough that it needs to be acknowledged as a risk - especially to strangers who you have no idea where their lives are to evaluate their risks.

 

[luvthatmouseinohio]

I think there are plenty of people who bought and regret it. The people who buy and regret it don't tend to post here. People don't tend to want to publicly admit their mistakes and DVC is definitely not for everyone. Had the OP bought, they might have indeed regretted it - if they for instance thought they'd get a BWV standard view studio at Food and Wine or a VAKL Conceirge room every year - even at eleven months. Or if they wanted to sleep around in studios in near park resorts without flexibility in dates or without flexibility of which resort for which trip. Since she really hasn't posted about how she intended to use DVC, I really don't know if it would have been a poor fit or not - only that measuring rental availability against member availability isn't a great way to decide - and that given the date of this post, she seems to have started browsing the boards when availability becomes the biggest concern - eleven months out from Fall Frenzy.

You hit the nail on the head here. I was always looking at studios at the resorts near the parks, specifically Boulder Ridge and Boardwalk, which turned out to be the most popular time of year for owners to rent, October thru mid December.

There really are only a few of the DVC resorts that I’m interested in. I have issues with sun sensitivity and have to be careful of UV rays, thus most months of the year are out for me with the Florida sun. Also, I don’t need anything larger than a studio because when I’m on vacation I don’t want to spend my time cooking and doing laundry. I do that the other 51 weeks a year at home ... lol. But being able to do those things are very important to some folks. And there is no way I would pack my stuff up and move around to 2 or 3 resorts within a week to put together a reservation.

My point in making this post was simply to let others who are considering purchasing to realize that there is likely some flexibility required or they may not be happy. Clearly, for me personally, I would be challenged to get what I wanted, where I wanted, and when I wanted even as a member.