CDC Notifies States, Large Cities To Prepare For Vaccine Distribution As Soon As Late October

[Jonfw2]

Well, if you want to list all the mild, moderate, and severe possible reactions and ask people whether they're ok with them or not, feel free.

If you'd like, I can post the entire list the testing site gave us for the trial.

 

[Jonfw2]

Hyperbole works sometimes. Not always.

The example she referenced in "post 48" was her personal story of taking a medication for 12 years before having an adverse reaction. That is specifically why I used that number.

 

[sam_gordon]

If you'd like, I can post the entire list the testing site gave us for the trial.

That's totally up to you. Speaking for me personally,, I'm not worried about short term mild side effects. I'm worried about long term issues. Does that mean I'm going to wait years or decades to get a vaccine. No. But I do want to see how more people react to it.

 

[cabanafrau]

OPINION: at this point, the argument against taking the vaccine is striking me very much like arguments against wearing seatbelts:

"They are hard to get off if the car is on fire". "You can get hurt when they hit your chest". "I have a friend who got hurt by a seatbelt".

All absolutely true statements...but the statistics are still overwhelmingly in favor of their use contributing dramatically to your safety.

This will be the case with Covid vaccines. Someone will get sick from it. Someone will still get Covid after it's out. Somebody will know somebody who had a bad reaction.

But it will still ultimately be overwhelmingly beneficial in stopping Covid.

That viewpoint might have some ground to stand on if and when there is a vaccine ready to go with widespread approval from the medical community, like other vaccines people routinely seek out to provide the benefits of said vaccine. Unfortunately we're not there yet. It will be fantastic when we are, but that time is not today.

 

[Jonfw2]

That viewpoint might have some ground to stand on if and when there is a vaccine ready to go with widespread approval from the medical community, like other vaccines people routinely seek out to provide the benefits of said vaccine. Unfortunately we're not there yet. It will be fantastic when we are, but that time is not today.

Very fair. But it's close enough to today that it requires discussion. Pfizer reiterated the other day that they will have enough data to seek emergency authorization by the end of October.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Well, if you want to list all the mild, moderate, and severe possible reactions and ask people whether they're ok with them or not, feel free.

I feel like I was fairly impartial there and being practical using an observation from multiple threads and perhaps even bringing up something people may not have thought about.

Someone may not think tenderness at the injection site as something they are even worried about participants in a study or eventual vaccine would have. Even yours which said "make sure OTHERS (in a disproportionate amount) DON'T have the reaction." without knowing what reaction your waiting for others to disproportionately not have. I don't know if you're waiting for others to not have a disproportionate reaction like tenderness at the injection site because for you that's too much or if you're waiting for others to not have a disproportion reaction towards something much more than that or if you're simply saying any reaction period that affects a disproportionate amount of people.

It's no skin off my back if you or anyone else don't want to go into detail nor was I specifically asking people to do so, it can help the dialogue and discussion however IMO.

My first comment to this thread I mentioned that the AstraZeneca study in Phase 1 had shown "only mild side effects of "mostly headaches, body aches and fatigue reported." No serious side effects reported with the first phase." What I was trying to convey in my comment to you (which was a generalized comment based off of observation) is often when discussing reactions and side effects mild is used to discuss a wide berth of reactions. You may not even have a moderate level in there; hence my discussion.

Regardless I gave 6 reactions, my first comment about AstraZeneca gave 2 additional ones. If you wish to go looking for a ton more go for it (those my 6 reactions were from other vaccines) but I honestly and without snark don't think that was really what you wanted me to do (listing all the side effects).

 

[cabanafrau]

Very fair. But it's close enough to today that it requires discussion. Pfizer reiterated the other day that they will have enough data to seek emergency authorization by the end of October.

There's still quite a bit of road between here and the end of October. I've said it before and I'll say it again, Pfizer is a for profit company. A company making an announcement about something like this is more than likely meant to address the ears of Wall Street than it is the population at large. Companies make statements all the time in an effort to shape the opinion of Wall Street to suit the company's business interests. It's simply another function of how a business operates. Disney has and is part of that same practice, including recently when wide swathes of their operations have been seriously hampered by the pandemic.

Good on Pfizer or any other company(ies) that manages to find something to put this virus at least somewhat in check with a vaccine that does what it's intended to do without causing harm in ways it wasn't intended to. IMO it's early days in terms of vaccine development. Hopefully at least somewhere around the globe scientists and medical researchers are a good ways into the process of actually beating this virus back. Judging by past experience I'm wary and not willing to simply accept the word of corporations who undeniably have more than one priority when it comes to business interests and vaccine development.

 

[Colleen27]

There’s no rule that says that “waiting” is going to exempt any one person from having a reaction to the vaccine, no matter when they get it. You can let the gunine pigs go first, and get yours later, but still have a reaction. Or vice-versa, you can be one of the first to get it and not have a reaction. It’s a crapshoot. Most common reaction is local irritation after shot. There will always be a minuscule risk of a more serious reaction with any vaccine, whenever it’s given.

No, of course it doesn't. But it should give us a better picture of what the more severe reactions are, how prevalent they are, what conditions make them more or less likely, etc. Yes, that is what the trials are for... but trials are size-limited and self-selecting, and therefore have limited ability to represent the full range of age and heath conditions that exist in the population at large. As the vaccine is administered to larger and larger groups, it comes closer and closer to doing so.

I agree that there should be no obligation legally for anyone to get vaccinated, but (if, of course, the vaccine proves safe), I would not be at all surprised if places of employment, sporting and concert venues, airlines, our beloved Disney, required a vaccine for admission. And I support their right to do that as much as I support anyone's right not to get vaccinated.

I think that is highly unlikely, with two exceptions: I do think the vaccine is likely to be required in certain higher-risk professions (like health care and education, though I expect the latter will trigger a legal battle) and for international travel. But there is absolutely no precedent in our history for an attraction that is open to the general public to demand proof of vaccination and I don't think we're likely to see that change. There are just too many issues, from medical privacy and questions of what is an acceptable grounds & documentation for an exception to the potential liability for companies who don't train employees to recognize forged papers, and our culture is too hostile to such restrictions on personal behavior.

 

[disneychrista]

Okay. So you're not against this, we should just wait a minimum of twelve years?

I think everyone who is saying they will wait and let others go first is saying that for themselves not for others. I’m going to wait. I’m okay with taking the current precautions. If you or anyone else wants to go ahead and get it immediately go for it. I’m not telling you not to.

 

[Colleen27]

I think everyone who is saying they will wait and let others go first is saying that for themselves not for others. I’m going to wait. I’m okay with taking the current precautions. If you or anyone else wants to go ahead and get it immediately go for it. I’m not telling you not to.

Exactly. Not only am I not telling anyone else they're wrong for wanting to get it ASAP, I'm counting on the fact that a lot of people will do just that so that we do have a broader base of safety and adverse effects data than we'll have from the 30 or 40K participants in controlled trials.

 

[godisney14]

I agree that there should be no obligation legally for anyone to get vaccinated, but (if, of course, the vaccine proves safe), I would not be at all surprised if places of employment, sporting and concert venues, airlines, our beloved Disney, required a vaccine for admission. And I support their right to do that as much as I support anyone's right not to get vaccinated.

I think that is highly unlikely, with two exceptions: I do think the vaccine is likely to be required in certain higher-risk professions (like health care and education, though I expect the latter will trigger a legal battle) and for international travel. But there is absolutely no precedent in our history for an attraction that is open to the general public to demand proof of vaccination and I don't think we're likely to see that change. There are just too many issues, from medical privacy and questions of what is an acceptable grounds & documentation for an exception to the potential liability for companies who don't train employees to recognize forged papers, and our culture is too hostile to such restrictions on personal behavior.

Some people are probably unaware. But, there are employers not in health care and education that already require immunizations. So, adding this coronavirus vaccination should be no problem for those. Employees can request a medical exemption, but employers are allowed to change those employee's job function then as long as it does not have an impact to the business.

 

[Jonfw2]

I think everyone who is saying they will wait and let others go first is saying that for themselves not for others. I’m going to wait. I’m okay with taking the current precautions. If you or anyone else wants to go ahead and get it immediately go for it. I’m not telling you not to.

Understood. That comment was specifically for that poster who stated earlier that her argument for not getting this vaccine quickly was that she had an adverse side effect from another drug 12 years after she started taking it.

 

[DeniseJH]

I think everyone who is saying they will wait and let others go first is saying that for themselves not for others. I’m going to wait. I’m okay with taking the current precautions. If you or anyone else wants to go ahead and get it immediately go for it. I’m not telling you not to.

Yeah, I think it's just common sense to be a little leery of a vaccine that potentially comes out so quickly. I get that they were developing a similar vaccine which made it quicker to dive into this one, but still. While the thought of getting a vaccine that isn't "tried and true" makes me nervous, I'll be getting it because I'd like to have a life again, and it really is what's good for the overall community. There will be enough people in front of me receiving it (so sorry for the guinea pigs, so thankful for the volunteers) - and hopefully things will go well for them - that I will be comfortable when I'm up. That is as long as I feel sure that we are told the truth about how the vaccine is effecting them - something we need to hear from Drs. and scientists NOT politicians. Of course we won't know if there are going to be any long term issues, but unfortunately that's just the way it is. It is, of course, not a perfect situation.

 

[RamblingMad]

This isn't promising.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...whether-fda-can-be-trusted-on-a-covid-vaccine

 

[Pyotr]

This isn't promising.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...whether-fda-can-be-trusted-on-a-covid-vaccine

I like Bill Gates. He gives a lot to charities. However, he’s a software engineer. I couldn’t care less about his opinion of the FDA. His coronavirus model with the university of Washington was comically off.

 

[DLgal]

I like Bill Gates. He gives a lot to charities. However, he’s a software engineer. I couldn’t care less about his opinion of the FDA. His coronavirus model with the university of Washington was comically off.

Are you not aware of his very long and extensive history with helping create vaccine programs for third world countries? He has a lot of knowledge on this topic. He is far more than a software engineer. People like him aren't one trick ponies.

 

[Pyotr]

Are you not aware of his very long and extensive history with helping create vaccine programs for third world countries? He has a lot of knowledge on this topic. He is far more than a software engineer. People like him aren't one trick ponies.

I’m actually not. I will have some reading material tonight. I’m still burned from the Zune and Windows Vista.

 

[mom2rtk]

But there is absolutely no precedent in our history for an attraction that is open to the general public to demand proof of vaccination and I don't think we're likely to see that change.

Yes, but none of us has experienced a pandemic in our lifetimes either. We've surpassed a lot of "I don't think this will happen" lines in the sand already. I have no idea what to expect, but I have learned to expect the unexpected.

 

[godisney14]

I like Bill Gates. He gives a lot to charities. However, he’s a software engineer. I couldn’t care less about his opinion of the FDA. His coronavirus model with the university of Washington was comically off.

Bill Gates aside, having been in the biotech world for a while, I will say that some of the comments by the FDA (and the CDC) in the past couple months have been a little off from their norm.

 

[Jonfw2]

Bill Gates aside, having been in the biotech world for a while, I will say that some of the comments by the FDA (and the CDC) in the past couple months have been a little off from their norm.

like what?