Cruising closing down again?

[tvguy]

Yes but FL "won" their case against the Federal Government and FL will never shut down cruising. The whole hold up was the CDC overstepping their legal right to restrain business in a specific state.

So you now have the State not wanting to shut down cruising, the business not wanting to shut it down, and passengers still showing up.

The US also has a temporary policy in place to even bypass law requiring a foreign port (only Alaska right now but I suspect some would support for elsewhere if the Caribbean shutdown).

Florida did NOT win it's case, it is still in court. But really doesn't matter because what Florida wants means nothing if the ports the cruise ships go to shutdown.

 

[kathi]

I'm wondering if adjustments will be made for upcoming cruises. Either change of ports/port requirements or on-board measures. We sail 12/19 and 12/26 and I'm starting to feel anxious. We will still be sailing with a high percentage of unvaccinated kids (it's the holidays) and it would be terrible if we had an outbreak (for so very many reasons). Clearly we need to wait to hear what the current testing indicates about how well the current vaccines work against the new variant. Fingers crossed.

 

[sethschroeder]

Florida did NOT win it's case, it is still in court. But really doesn't matter because what Florida wants means nothing if the ports the cruise ships go to shutdown.

Florida won the ruling by the 11th district panel, the CDC requested a stay, which also was overturned within a week by the same 11th district appeals that initially put the stay in place.

So yes the CDC could always bring more legal action but lots of things could happen in all things in life. Nothing further has come from it since the appeal court ruled with FL that the CDC didn't bring enough evidence to keep the stay in place.

Did I miss something new? Is there a new push for the CDC to try and overturn the ruling?

 

[tvguy]

Florida won the ruling by the 11th district panel, the CDC requested a stay, which also was overturned within a week by the same 11th district appeals that initially put the stay in place.

So yes the CDC could always bring more legal action but lots of things could happen in all things in life. Nothing further has come from it since the appeal court ruled with FL that the CDC didn't bring enough evidence to keep the stay in place.

Did I miss something new? Is there a new push for the CDC to try and overturn the ruling?

Yes. The next hearing is December 8th in the 11th District. HOWEVER, like I said, if the ports that ships sailing from Florida impose restrictions, what happens with that lawsuit if totally meaningless.

 

[fsjking]

Yes. The next hearing is December 8th in the 11th District. HOWEVER, like I said, if the ports that ships sailing from Florida impose restrictions, what happens with that lawsuit if totally meaningless.

A lot of these ports have had their economies completely wrecked by the cruise ships not coming. Unless we see a variant that starts killing a much higher percentage of the population, there will be ports that take all the ships they can get.

 

[tvguy]

A lot of these ports have had their economies completely wrecked by the cruise ships not coming. Unless we see a variant that starts killing a much higher percentage of the population, there will be ports that take all the ships they can get.

Certainly possible .

 

[TestingH2O]

Isn't the deal that there are two lawsuits swirling around in Florida? There's the CDC one that says cruise ships need to follow particular health and safety protocols before they can do business.

Then there's the one where Florida sued the cruise lines because they are requiring vaccines. This one is still very much in play since it impacts the cruise lines' ability to do business in other countries.

 

[Sykes]

Isn't the deal that there are two lawsuits swirling around in Florida? There's the CDC one that says cruise ships need to follow particular health and safety protocols before they can do business.

Then there's the one where Florida sued the cruise lines because they are requiring vaccines. This one is still very much in play since it impacts the cruise lines' ability to do business in other countries.

Yes. On the Florida vs. CDC lawsuit, Florida won a preliminary injunction, but because every cruise line has agreed to voluntarily follow the CSO anyway the CDC is seriously slow-rolling the appeal since the issue is mostly moot anyway and they don't seem to want to waste time on it (there's still a hearing scheduled briefing due on the appeal for 2/1/2022, but every time we get close to a hearing the CDC and Florida both agree to a delay). The original case is still proceeding as well (there's a briefing due there on 12/15), but neither the CDC nor Florida is in a hurry.

Norwegian won a preliminary injunction against Florida in the other case and is allowed to ask for vaccine documentation. Even though that ruling technically only applies to NCL, every other cruise line has followed suit and is asking for documentation as well.

 

[sethschroeder]

there's still a hearing scheduled on the appeal for 2/1/2022

So not December 8th like mentioned. I will stick with status quo then which is the CDC doesn't control FL ports regarding shutting down until something to the contrary occurs.

 

[Cheburashka]

every time we get close to a hearing the CDC and Florida both agree to a delay

Seems pretty clear that both the CDC and Florida are quietly content with the status quo. The resumption of cruising hasn't led to mass outbreaks, so the CDC is likely satisfied, and Florida gets to be against mandates on the record while quietly allowing cruising to continue with their own mandates that keep cruising from being shut down again. Win win.

 

[Cheburashka]

Sailing on the dream for a B2B in January. No way I am getting another shot for a cruise. I will be cancelling if a booster is required.

Vaccine inflation. Disney will be sailing mostly empty if they require booster shots this winter. And the countries they sail to in winter aren't requiring them- most of their own citizens aren't even vaccinated yet. Just don't see it happening.

 

[WebmasterKathy]

Please review the rules on COVID topics pinned at the top of this page.

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[WebmasterDoc]

Please review the rules on COVID topics pinned at the top of this page.

Announced policies, actual personal experiences, helpful tips or FACTUAL information related to travel are okay.

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[sethschroeder]

Your opinions or predictions about COVID, the politics or science or statistics related to it, or any sort of debate are NOT permitted.

Well should we not close this thread then? The whole premise of the thread is gathering data, gathering relevant points from government intervention, and providing a final conclusion if cruising will close down again.

I am just confused because it seemed like this was being allowed but then not being allowed.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Well should we not close this thread then? The whole premise of the thread is gathering data, gathering relevant points from government intervention, and providing a final conclusion if cruising will close down again.

I am just confused because it seemed like this was being allowed but then not being allowed.

Much of what was being deleted was not topical to cruising. You may not have seen some of it before deletion, but I can see what I saw and now do not see.

 

[MomOTwins]

Well should we not close this thread then? The whole premise of the thread is gathering data, gathering relevant points from government intervention, and providing a final conclusion if cruising will close down again.

I am just confused because it seemed like this was being allowed but then not being allowed.

I had the same thought. We all know Disney has not suspended cruises or announced anything else on what changes they may make due to the recent variant, so anything we say on topic for this post is necessarily opinion / speculation / prediction, which isn’t allowed. It makes me sad because I have literally been losing sleep at night because I am so worried sick about how this might affect my cruise in a few months, and I would have loved to hear other people’s thoughts on what they think will happen to not feel so adrift, but I do acknowledge that is against policy here so I won’t be responding further to this thread in keeping with the moderator’s instructions.

 

[tvguy]

Well should we not close this thread then? The whole premise of the thread is gathering data, gathering relevant points from government intervention, and providing a final conclusion if cruising will close down again.

I am just confused because it seemed like this was being allowed but then not being allowed.

It is a terribly difficult line to draw for the moderators. A rule that doesn't allow us to discuss the cause of the issue in the thread probably should be reviewed.

 

[Freeman867]

DCL is doing all they can to mitigate the risk of COVID outbreaks on their ships. Fully vaccinated requirement, testing at the dock, etc. And this seems to be working. I haven't heard of any outbreaks. As long as DCL is doing all they can to mitigate the risk, which they definitely are, and they keep avoiding any outbreaks on the ships, I don't see the CDC caring enough to suspend cruising.

 

[tvguy]

DCL is doing all they can to mitigate the risk of COVID outbreaks on their ships. Fully vaccinated requirement, testing at the dock, etc. And this seems to be working. I haven't heard of any outbreaks. As long as DCL is doing all they can to mitigate the risk, which they definitely are, and they keep avoiding any outbreaks on the ships, I don't see the CDC caring enough to suspend cruising.

It is interesting on where you look. Certainly no outbreaks, as in large numbers of cases, but one vlog I follow says there has been cases reported on every cruise and the containment efforts are working.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

only way that will happen, at least in the US, is if the scientists determine that Omicron causes more severe disease and evades the vaccines. if the perfect storm doesn't happen, they will stick with testing and vaccination requirements.