Davids DVC: Rental reimbursement or rescheduling?

[Marionnette]

Does anyone know how David is currently handling immediate reservations at Aulani for owners? I know there was a variety of procedures when DVC first shut down, but did he finally settle on one? Also, what procedures are in place at DVC for expiring points used at a closed resort? My advice to @johnkerryP depends on the answer to these questions. Thanks!

DVC made minor exceptions for expiring points used at closed resorts.

For instance, for specific UYs, any banked points used for making a reservation during the closures at WDW were extended until Nov. 30, 2020. So, those 2 banked points from my Sept. UY that were used for a May reservation will be useable for a reservation that ends on or before the night of 11/30/2020. But the kicker is that they have to expire first. They remain in my 2019 UY until they expire on 9/1/2020. Then DVC has to add them back in. I cannot use them to make a reservation that occurs after 8/31/2020 until they actually expire and DVC does its magic.

DVC is not offering any grace when it comes to banking deadlines. So if the reservation gets cancelled 7 months or more beyond the start of your UY, your points cannot be banked forward and have a limited remaining life.

Borrowed points are being returned to their original UY if a reservation is cancelled. This is true whether the owner or Disney cancels the reservation. This courtesy could end at any time but has been the rule for several months now.

Unfortunately, @johnkerryP would have no idea what UY the owner has, nor whether the points used were banked, current or borrowed. To my knowledge, David’s is not sharing that information with renters even though they collect that information when an owner signs up with them. I believe that their procedure for handling closures vs cancellations by renters are being handled differently. If the resort was closed by Disney, then the renter is being offered a voucher.

 

[WDWEPCOT]

He never offered me one for my Aulani rental when the resort was closed and I believe other Aulani renters have posted the same - as with David he is not consistent in how he handles things

 

[connorlevismom]

I had successfully used Davids in the past, back in 2015. I rented points for an Aulani trip for October. There has been basically no communication at this point yet, but there is just aboslutely no way the resort will open that soon. I feel for the owners, because we are all stuck. This whole thing has really put a bad taste in my mouth. I understand this is a very odd situation we're all in, and no one could've predicted it - however his reaction toward this process just strikes me as very poor business. I guess I just want to apologize as a renter, to the owners experiencing this - it shouldn't be this way. I worry this "credit" situation is just a giant ponzi scheme - but i also don't want the people i rented from to be impacted if i utilize my credit card to dispute the contract. Any insight into this? In a perfect world, I would just ask the owners directly if i could move it to another time that works for both of us - but I know that isn't feasible given this mediator in the middle. What the best option that leaves the owner and renter in the best available financial situation to walk away?

As an owner, I would absolutely encourage you 100% to do a chargeback. Under NO circumstance would I tell you take a voucher from this company. I appreciate your concern for the owner, but you have to look out for yourself and like I said, I would NOT take that voucher. Seeing what he did to owners that offered to change the name on reservations to try and help, it is very clear to me that he will lie (in writing no-less) without any regard to anyone but himself.

IMO - it is only a matter of time before this guy goes out of business (or gets sued by someone) and everyone who accepted the voucher will be left with zero.

 

[The X Man]

So I had to cancel a trip do I wound up with about 90 points that have to be used by 11/30. I figured for this amount I try them again. 3 weeks ago signed the contract to rent the points but haven't heard anything from them I'll try myself to rent them.

 

[RachStu]

Does anyone know how David is currently handling immediate reservations at Aulani for owners? I know there was a variety of procedures when DVC first shut down, but did he finally settle on one? Also, what procedures are in place at DVC for expiring points used at a closed resort? My advice to @johnkerryP depends on the answer to these questions. Thanks!

This is the text of the email that I received from David's:

"We are reaching out to you today in regards to the XXXX reservation.
As you are aware, COVID-19 has become a pandemic, and Aulani has remained closed. As such The Disney Vacation Club should have canceled the XXXX reservation, and began the process of returning the points to your account.
If the reservation does appear active please do not cancel, as DVC will auto cancel the reservation (ensuring the points don't go into holding).
As a result we are reaching out to inquire if you would be open to helping the XXXX family during this difficult time.
Reservation # XXXX
Check in Date: August 26, 2020
We are asking if you would be willing to return the 70% for the reservation. The funds that are returned will go towards a Travel Credit for this family. This Travel Credit will be in the total amount that the xxxx family paid for their reservation including our commission.
If refunding the money is not feasible, would you be willing to re-rent your returned points? By re-renting your returned points the funds from the new guest will go towards the Travel Credit.
We understand that this is a big request and a situation that we have never encountered. We are hoping that we can all work together to find a viable solution.
Please let us know if you are willing to assist. If you have any questions please don’t hesitate to reach out.
We look forward to hearing from you!
Sincerely,

 

[Bearval]

Why is he not offering to refund the money instead of giving a travel credit?

 

[CraigInPA]

Why is he not offering to refund the money instead of giving a travel credit?

Because he spent the money that was his part of the commission to run his business and buy a yacht. So, 25% of the total rental price is already gone. I think it is pretty doubtful that he has a sufficient cash reserve to come up with the already spent funds in order to issue full refunds.

You'll note that he's asking the owner to issue a refund of all funds they received, regardless of the status of the points. He doesn't say when that 30% will be paid in the event of a new reservation, or what happens if you agree to let him try to re-rent the points and he can't.

 

[RachStu]

Why is he not offering to refund the money instead of giving a travel credit?

I don't know. I'm thoroughly sick of the guy. I told him I expected to be paid the 30% due on check in day as per the terms of the agreement . You can imagine the response that I got.

 

[RoseGold]

I'm pretty disgusted by this whole thread. I guess I know where I won't be renting out my points.

 

[Sandisw]

Woohoo! Got the 30% i was owed today and now this deal is done! Reservation still showing so I just assume the renters didn’t check in yet today. But, glad payment came without issue.

 

[kelly622]

I have a reservation in November, it is currently listed in their confirmed reservations as my husband and I are unable to attend. He is in a high-risk category. Seems unlikely it will be re-rented as there are so many listings. I put it on my Chase Sapphire reserve card thinking it would be covered at the time, who knew they don’t cover pandemics! Are there any other avenues to go here? Total is close to $2k

 

[Dracula]

Woohoo! Got the 30% i was owed today and now this deal is done! Reservation still showing so I just assume the renters didn’t check in yet today. But, glad payment came without issue.

I had the same thing, the reservation showed on the Dashboard until check-out date, but got paid the 30%. It was a newish reservation, made just three weeks before with re-rented points, so I assume the renters checked in.

 

[Marionnette]

I have a reservation in November, it is currently listed in their confirmed reservations as my husband and I are unable to attend. He is in a high-risk category. Seems unlikely it will be re-rented as there are so many listings. I put it on my Chase Sapphire reserve card thinking it would be covered at the time, who knew they don’t cover pandemics! Are there any other avenues to go here? Total is close to $2k

The credit cards are going to view your situation differently than someone who couldn’t go because the resort wasn’t even open. So, I’m not confident that a chargeback or travel insurance claim will work. Technically, David’s is meeting the terms of the contract. They are actually showing flexibility by giving you the opportunity to recover what you paid by trying to rent the reservation out again.

Unfortunately, you’re learning that there’s a risk that comes with the bargain price of a DVC rental. I hope that the reservation rents out. Don’t be averse to dropping the price per point on the rental if David’s gives you that option. Getting some of your money back is better than nothing.

 

[Dracula]

I have a reservation in November, it is currently listed in their confirmed reservations as my husband and I are unable to attend. He is in a high-risk category. Seems unlikely it will be re-rented as there are so many listings. I put it on my Chase Sapphire reserve card thinking it would be covered at the time, who knew they don’t cover pandemics! Are there any other avenues to go here? Total is close to $2k

Other avenues to go would include your CSR travel insurance for conditions that are covered - like an illness developed before the trip, or even a doctor's letter advising your husband to not leave the immediate area due to his health condition, without even mentioning the pandemic. Or, ask your owner to switch you to a low-stress, non-WDW location like Vero Beach or Hilton Head, and enjoy a relaxed vacation there!

 

[starry_solo]

I have a reservation in November, it is currently listed in their confirmed reservations as my husband and I are unable to attend. He is in a high-risk category. Seems unlikely it will be re-rented as there are so many listings. I put it on my Chase Sapphire reserve card thinking it would be covered at the time, who knew they don’t cover pandemics! Are there any other avenues to go here? Total is close to $2k

tell David’s that you will take less back per point, even less than the $3 restocking fee. Friend had to go down to $14/point (so she recovers $11/point) before one of her three reservations booked through David’s was re-rented

 

[momincolorado]

It has not been legally challenged, and based on specific contract langue that did not exist, the unclear part was the owners part or responsibilty to David’s.

He did keep the 30%, and it seems clear given the chargeback wins he was on the hook to renters. But, he has not gone after any renter that we know of...no info posted here at least...who didn’t return the 70% or agree to rent points again. Some did walk away.

I think that is why his new contracts tell owners they are indeed required to return the 70% if resorts close or any other issue like that.

The interesting part was that he told owners back then that DVCM closing was technically them and they owed money back...but then told renters owners were not responsible for the decision and therefore not entitled to a refund when the contract says any actions by owners results in one,

So, basically, it played it both ways which is why many owners lost faith And won’t use him again.

I actually brought this up with them at the time. I found it fascinating that on one end (owners), they were arguing contract frustration and went as far as to say that the 70% is returnable (never mind the fact that this would mean returning all parties to pre-contract position, in other words, cash going back to the renter and that’s clearly not what David’s wanted). On the other end (renter) their argument was contract is non-refundable.

I inquired about this because neither argument, whether the money is returnable or non-refundable, entitled them to keep the cash and start issuing worthless vouchers. I received a rather curt reply from one of David’s daughters ignoring my inquiry and reiterating that the voucher was their only offer (I then went on to do a chargeback, which was successful and last I heard owner, whose points were expiring, kept their 70% as they should have). There is no question that cash flow is an issue for David’s.

They must have known that both sides will compare notes, they read these boards just like everyone else, and that it will make them look completely untrustworthy to say the least, yet they put it out there anyway. It left me shaking my head, it was just such a poor management on their part. At a time when they did everything they could (incl deleting unfavorable social media comments etc) to control their image and reputation, they simultaneously managed, by sending these emails that were then shared on these boards, to make themselves look completely shady and incompetent.

 

[WDWEPCOT]

They are shady ! Not so sure in the incompetent - but they sure as heck can’t write a decent contract ! They have lost a lot of business with their handling of this situation !
I’m glad you won your chargeback !

 

[Bowen Family]

Sharing another successful chargeback outcome for a cancelled May 2020 stay at AKL. This was for a Canadian VISA.

I submitted a fairly lengthy claim. Main points were: 1) the resort closure was not mandatory but an action of the owner’s association made on behalf of its members, hence (per contract) refund owed from David’s. 2) I made numerous attempts at a negotiated settlement, including a refund but minus David’s commission OR booking a future stay under original contract terms. 3) The new contract offered higher risk terms with no guarantee of accommodations for which I’ve already paid in full; and I wouldn’t have entered into my initial contract under these new terms.

I was credited the full amount 10 days after filing, but told I may be contacted for additional info within 30 days (I never was) and that the refund may be rescinded up to 60 days from filing (that was yesterday).

Nice to put this ordeal behind me and I wish other members and renters a satisfactory outcome. Hopefully one day we’ll be able to return to WDW, and I may consider private point rentals then. But no more third party brokers for our family.

For now we are content to stay close to home and enjoy all that Ontario has to offer in the summertime!

Be well.

 

[quandrea]

What are the consequences for David’s with all these chargebacks? Is it a black mark on his business?

 

[lawboy2001]

Sharing another successful chargeback outcome for a cancelled May 2020 stay at AKL. This was for a Canadian VISA.

I submitted a fairly lengthy claim. Main points were: 1) the resort closure was not mandatory but an action of the owner’s association made on behalf of its members, hence (per contract) refund owed from David’s. 2) I made numerous attempts at a negotiated settlement, including a refund but minus David’s commission OR booking a future stay under original contract terms. 3) The new contract offered higher risk terms with no guarantee of accommodations for which I’ve already paid in full; and I wouldn’t have entered into my initial contract under these new terms.

I was credited the full amount 10 days after filing, but told I may be contacted for additional info within 30 days (I never was) and that the refund may be rescinded up to 60 days from filing (that was yesterday).

Nice to put this ordeal behind me and I wish other members and renters a satisfactory outcome. Hopefully one day we’ll be able to return to WDW, and I may consider private point rentals then. But no more third party brokers for our family.

For now we are content to stay close to home and enjoy all that Ontario has to offer in the summertime!

Be well.

I'm glad this all worked out for you! I'm sure there will be many owners (like me) who previously used David's who will now be posting points for rent on these boards, so you will have options in the future.