Exactly WHY (oh why) isn't smoking or non-smoking a GUARANTEE?

[ReneeQ]

I don't mean to beat a dead horse here, and this is in NO WAY a smoking vs. non-smoking debate. But I am really puzzled on why smoking and non-smoking is not a guarantee at DVC resorts. Isn't it a guarantee at other Disney resorts, or am I just dreaming?

I work with a guy who joined DVC because of me. I own at BWV and VWL. He owns at BCV. He's been a member about 2 years and has only been twice so far. We were talking today about DVC vacations and the subject turned to smoking and non-smoking rooms. I was telling him about my huge family reunion trip this past Jan at VWL and how they tried to put me in a smoking 2BR villa. I booked at EXACTLY 11 months out and requested non smoking and top floor. Didn't get either. Was okay with not getting top floor, but no way could I do smoking. I am in poor to fair health at best and just can't take smoke. They did find me another room.

He was shocked, as he thought smoking and NS were a guarantee. Seems both times he's been he requested non smoking and got it both times, so he thought it was a guarantee. He said he'd rather know at the time of booking if a NS room was not available, and he would happily choose another date to book. I totally agree. Same as people wanting a smoking room. They, too, would probably like to know at booking if it was available or not, so they could chose an alternate date, if they so desired.

What I don't get is, if the Holiday Inn down the street for $59 a night CAN guarantee smoking or NS, why oh why can't DVC?

Does this annoy or bother anyone else? Do we have any rights on this as members? I'm not trying to tell you not to smoke. I'm not trying to say the whole resort needs to be non smoking. I'm just saying, I DO want to be able to know what I'm getting at the time I book.

Thanks for any input!

 

[WithDisneySpirit]

Personally, I totally agree with everything you have said, couldn't have said it better myself. My health, in part, depends on my ability to have a NS villa on our trips!!!!

 

[DisneyPhD]

I agree. I think members services should get your opinon. Really when people get what they want, eveyone wins. I can't live with a smoking room either. I know many people who want a smoking room don't refrain when their request is denyed and they are placed in a non smoking room. Either way it would bennift everyone to get what you want when you make the ressies.

It just isn't right.

 

[Chuck S]

The problems associated with DVC giving a NS guarantee, and possible reasons for it, have been discussed here for years. The consensus seems to be that many factors may play a part in this...the main ones being that theoretically (and in practice) DVC resorts have a much higher occupancy rate than regular hotels with guarantees, like Holiday Inns, who usually have spare rooms. DVC rooms may go out of service unexpectedly for fire/water or maintenance issues...and with fewer (if any) spare rooms, it would be difficult logistically. Because it is a timeshare, in theory, DVC resorts should operate at nearly 100% capacity at all times.

With 100% occupancy, if a resort has 100 smoking rooms (all booked and guaranteed) and one goes out of service unexpectedly, what should the resort do?

If NS is an absolute medical necessity for you, it should be noted as such on your ressie.

 

[DebbieB]

Keep in mind no WDW resorts have reserved smoking/non-smoking, it's not just DVC. In the 6 years I've been a member, the DVC resorts have cutback drastically on the number of smoking rooms available. OKW used to be 6 or 7 buildings, now it's only 3. I think BWV was originally all of the 2nd & 4th floors smoking optional, now it's only part of the 2nd.

 

[Caskbill]

Last year at the annual meetings this was brought up and they said they were working on it. So it's quite possible that in the future (hopefully NEAR future), it may become a guarantee. After all, if they can make a boardwalk view a guarantee, you'd think doing S/NS would be very possible.

 

[pirateparrot]

What I don't get is, if the Holiday Inn down the street for $59 a night CAN guarantee smoking or NS, why oh why can't DVC?

Just because Holiday Inn mades a "guarantee" that you will get either a smoking or non-smoking room does not guarantee they will deliver. On many occasions my Dad who is a smoker was simply handed an ashtray and told to go ahead and smoke in the "non-smoking" room when they could not deliver.

 

[owtrbnks]

Well put Renee - MS are you listening?
"With 100% occupancy, if a resort has 100 smoking rooms (all booked and guaranteed) and one goes out of service unexpectedly, what should the resort do?"
Well, an offer of an upgrade for the same room type at another hotel is what any upscale hotel would do. Not a hard concept. I'm sure with all the brain surgeons (no offense meant to the real ones) at WDW they could come up with a way to guarantee N/S, etc.
No matter what you plan, in any industry, the unexpected always can happen. I'm sure a company like Disney would have a backup plan to accomodate the small % of people that might arrive to find their reservation could not be honored. Don't you think they have a plan right now for when they are booked full and a room goes unexpectedly out of service?

 

[tjkraz]

Well put Renee - MS are you listening?
"With 100% occupancy, if a resort has 100 smoking rooms (all booked and guaranteed) and one goes out of service unexpectedly, what should the resort do?"
Well, an offer of an upgrade for the same room type at another hotel is what any upscale hotel would do. Not a hard concept.

Unfortunately, all of the Two Bedroom villas are part of DVC. With DVC designed to be near 100% occupancy year-round, that's not feasible much of the time.

You're also assuming that someone who booked months in advance at VWL would be more satisfied moving to another resort, which is not necessarily true.

I'm sure a company like Disney would have a backup plan to accomodate the small % of people that might arrive to find their reservation could not be honored.

I'm sure they do. But segregating resort rooms in to a greater number of smaller classes (instead of studio we then have Smoking Studio and NS Studio) means even more need for "make goods".

Let's say that under the current system you have 100 reservations for 102 rooms. You can take 2 rooms out of service for maintenance purposes.

But, if 80 of those reservations are for "guaranteed" non-smoking and you have 80 NS rooms, you have zero margin for error.

And that's not even addressing the (unfortunate) issue of guests smoking in a non-smoking unit. Sure, you could try to charge the outgoing guest...assuming you can prove they were actually the ones to smoke in the room...but that doesn't help the incoming guest who has been guaranteed a non-smoking room.

Under the current system (no guarantees), the reservation HAS been honored. Purely from a financial perspective, increased guarantees is a money-losing proposition for Disney...more likely for DVC, which means we ultimately pay the cost.

I listed a poll on this topic about six months ago and 98% of the respondants indicated they had received their smoking preference. I suspect the results are about the same across the industry. (As noted, the S/NS "guarantee" you get from other Disney resorts and even other hotel chains is often a load of bunk.)

 

[jarestel]

I'm sure they could guarantee smoking/non-smoking ( and probably will in the future ) but for now it's easier for DVC, when dealing with the small percentage of people who don't get their smoking preference, to just say, "well, it's a request, not a guarantee". Some people have the impression that guarantees should be guaranteed ( silly, I know ), and would not be happy if their guaranteed n/s room turned out to be an unwanted smoking room. So as long as DVC can stay away from the word "guarantee" they have an easier way out when the situation crops up.

I think the whole s/ns issue is more of an administrative/customer service problem than a technical one. But I also think DVC will eventually go to a guarantee model.

 

[smjj]

Then there are the cases I have read here on DIS where a smoker was told he could smoke on the balcony of a non-smoking room by a CM. That would bother me unless one could train the smoke to not invade my balcony. So even if they could gurantee a room as smoking or non-smoking, if needed the CM would tell a smoker to take the non-smoking room and smoke on the balcony....smjj

 

[pumpkinboy]

It strikes me as it's only a matter of time until DVC figures out what a lot of other well-run timeshare groups have: that making all the rooms non-smoking makes the most sense. This would reduce cleaning expenses significantly and eliminate the "non-smoker feeling sick in a smoking room" problem.

We were at the Club IntraWest in Mont Tremblant, Canada this summer (gorgeous resort BTW), where the resort is entirely non-smoking, with hefty cleaning charges leveled on any guest parties smoking in the rooms - you are allowed to smoke on the balcony, however, where they provide ashtrays. This is in a cold climate, with the highest percentage of smokers in Canada (Québec), and it has been quite successful. I recall reading that Marriott was also entirely non-smoking now, but I have not experienced this personally.

At DVC, we have always gotten our non-smoking room request, since it is needed for medical reasons (athsmatic DD).

 

[DisneyPhD]

Last year at the annual meetings this was brought up and they said they were working on it. So it's quite possible that in the future (hopefully NEAR future), it may become a guarantee. After all, if they can make a boardwalk view a guarantee, you'd think doing S/NS would be very possible.

Thanks for the info caskbill! I agree about the view verse S/NS.

I don't think that only absolute medical necessity should be given prority. (but I do belive they should be given non somking rooms.) I think everyone who doesn't want to be exposed to smoke should be a medical necessity, because for the most part it is. Second hand smoke effects people who aren't athsmatic. There is no way I would allow my young children to sleep in a smoking room for a week. (or myself pregnant.)

 

[MrsNick]

Thanks for the info caskbill! I agree about the view verse S/NS.

I don't think that only absolute medical necessity should be given prority. (but I do belive they should be given non somking rooms.) I think everyone who doesn't want to be exposed to smoke should be a medical necessity, because for the most part it is. Second hand smoke effects people who aren't athsmatic. There is no way I would allow my young children to sleep in a smoking room for a week. (or myself pregnant.)

Exactly. I don't want be exposed to this hazard more than necessary. Who wants to wonder if this increased one's family's risk to disease?

 

[rwingerd]

I work in the travel industry and when you request smoking/nonsmoking it is only a "request". There are no lodging providers that guarantee your request will be fulfilled. Disney, either a resort or DVC, is no different. If a DVC resort has 75 nonsmoking rooms available and they 85 reservations requesting nonsmoking, the first 75 to check in will have their request honor, while the last 10 will not.

Until the lodging industry makes changes to all lodging nonsmoking this will always occur.

 

[NMW]

When I made our reservation (for a 1 bdr boardwalk view at BWV) I requested non-smoking because my son who is 6 has asthma. I do too, but not quite as bad as him. It was the only request I made. The CM said that he would put medical request on the confirmation (he did). He then told me that I really shouldn't worry because no boardwalk view rooms at BVW are smoking rooms. He said very few rooms at the BWV in general were smoking rooms. He said there used to be a lot more, but people overwhelmingly request non-smoking, so they took most of them away. He said this was true at not just the DVC resorts, but all WDW hotels. He told me not to be surpised if in a few years ALL of WDW is non-smoking. I know all the restaurants are non-smoking, but I believe that's a Flordia state law.

I do wish it could be a guaranteed booking category (like boardwalk view). It would be nice not to have to worry about it. Friends of ours bought 2 Marriot timeshares in Aruba and someplace else I can't remember at the moment last year. Both of them are non-smoking and have large fines if the rooms are smoked in. My friend was thrilled because her mother (a heavy smoker) won't go on vacation with them because of this- . I wouldn't be surprised if Flordia made all hotel rooms non-smoking. Isn't Flordia the state that sued the tobacco companies to recover it's losses for paying for the smoking related illnesses/deaths of it's residents?

 

[jarestel]

If a DVC resort has 75 nonsmoking rooms available and they 85 reservations requesting nonsmoking, the first 75 to check in will have their request honor, while the last 10 will not.

I don't work in the hospitality industry, but here's a thought... if a hotel has only 75 ns rooms and they are already booked, let the 76th caller and beyond know this when they call. Let the guest decide whether or not they want the room at the time of reservation, don't stick them with it when they check in.

 

[Chuck S]

I don't work in the hospitality industry, but here's a thought... if a hotel has only 75 ns rooms and they are already booked, let the 76th caller and beyond know this when they call. Let the guest decide whether or not they want the room at the time of reservation, don't stick them with it when they check in.

So then what happens if one of the 75 ns guaranteed and booked ressies cancels 3 days out...should the hotel have asked for a non-refundable pre-payment of the entire stay? After all, caller number 76 turned down the ressie because ns could not be guaranteed, and the hotel may not be able to re-book the room. Or should hotel rates increase to cover rooms caught in that sort of situation...you see there is no easy answer that is fair to both the customer and the hotel, unless it is 100% smoke free. And ultimately, it isn't the hotel keeper that pays for "guarantees" it is the consumer. Likewise, if DVC resorts were to be undersold to keep rooms free for guarantees, it would increase our dues substantially.

 

[jarestel]

So then what happens if one of the 75 ns guaranteed and booked ressies cancels 3 days out...should the hotel have asked for a non-refundable pre-payment of the entire stay? After all, caller number 76 turned down the ressie because ns could not be guaranteed, and the hotel may not be able to re-book the room. Or should hotel rates increase to cover rooms caught in that sort of situation...you see there is no easy answer that is fair to both the customer and the hotel, unless it is 100% smoke free. And ultimately, it isn't the hotel keeper that pays for "guarantees" it is the consumer. Likewise, if DVC resorts were to be undersold to keep rooms free for guarantees, it would increase our dues substantially.

What happens today when you call to make reservations for a 2-BR at a DVC resort and they are all booked up? You may decide to waitlist, or you may decide to book another resort. Someone could still cancel after you've decided to stay elsewhere, leaving a room available today when it wasn't yesterday, so there's nothing new in any of that. Waitlisting for resort/smoking preference would make up for the cancellation.

I don't understand why you think DVC resorts would have to be undersold in order to make a guaranteed system work. Maybe you could clarify.

DVC is reportedly telling members ( see Caskbill's previous post ) that they are working on making smoking preference a guarantee. So they're either flapping their gums to appease the pitchfork and smokeless torch carrying mob, or they think it IS possible to do it. As with most debates concerning predictions, time will tell.

 

[Coll0610]

Couldn't they guarantee a certain number of non-smoking and smoking rooms, and then treat the rest as requests? For example, if they have 100 n/s rooms available each night, they could guarantee 80 for each night, then treat the rest as requests. Then, when you booked, if they told you they couldn't guarantee non-smoking (or smoking) you would have the option of choosing other dates when a guaranteed room was available.