Fifth Gate?

[Alynw]

I realize they're building because of demand that is already there, but every time they add rooms, they are increasing the amount of people that can stay on site, which realistically, yes can impact the parks. Especially when they're marketing onsite packages so hard. This board alone is a shining example of the people that would rather jump off a bridge, than consider staying off site

Our first trip was almost 30 years ago. There were only 3 parks, we went at a traditionally busy time, and the parks were empty compared to what they are now. But there were also only about 10,000 rooms, with those being deluxe resorts (other than the campground). Not nearly as many people could afford that. However today, there are now over 36,000 rooms with how many more in construction? And many of those are now value/moderate rooms, making it easier for more people to come. And Disney markets this, heavily. They absolutely market Disney as a "Come and stay with us" vacation, far more than they used to. I would wager most people WANT to stay on site, and Disney knows that. And the more people on Disney property = more people in Disney parks. So, I do still say that to some degree, increased rooms (combined with increase marketing and other factors) does have an effect on crowds.

It's basically a circle: park popularity increases crowds, which creates the need for more rooms, Disney builds more rooms, which increases the potential amount of people on property/in parks, Disney sees increase in crowds/popularity, builds more rooms and round and round it goes.

Building more hotels and adding rooms wont increase crowds. Adding rooms wont add people. Disney isnt building hotels because the ones they have now are reaching capacity. Its the overall attendance that impacts the crowds, people that stay offsite and those that stay onsite. Like everything, once people see it, do it, experience it a few times they move on to other things or start looking at ways to cut cost. Point being, its the actual parks that bring people in and whether disney builds new hotels or dosent build any hotels at all wont have an impact on the crowd, the people are still going to come whether they stay onsite or offsite. Even though building a new hotel will not change the numbers, it will help convince people to stay onsite and allow disney to capitalize on the money being spent. People visit disney for the parks and attractions, the new hotels is just disneys way of trying to get the already visiting guest to stay onsite.

 

[WelshMorgan92]

wish they would..

I'd love to see Disney change Hollywood Studios to Hollywood Adventure then create a new Disney Animation Studios park based around moana/frozen/pixar

 

[OnSpaceshipEarth]

wish they would..

I'd love to see Disney change Hollywood Studios to Hollywood Adventure then create a new Disney Animation Studios park based around moana/frozen/pixar

Now THAT'S an idea that could alleviate some of the crowding issues at the MK...the only park that comes close to having a consistent "problem" with crowds.

 

[ChipnDale79]

Disney raises prices to keep crowds down. they don't want to be at capacity every day. So they raise prices to counteract that. It's not like that system hasn't been working for them as they continue to profit more and more each year. If Disney offered tickets at the same discount Universal does (Buy two days get 3 free), it would be an absolute madhouse and would be impossible to ride your favorite rides. So its a nice system, as a 6% drop in attendance at MK is only $73k in missed revenue with an average of 3,300 less people in the park (which helps wait times). But this can also be attributed to people simply waiting for larger attractions to open to book their vacation due to the cost.

The whole disney raised prices to control the crowds argument is nothing but disney spin.

They want those parks as full as possible at the highest price every single day, and they want those same guests buying as many mickey ice cream bars as they can sell at the highest price point possible.

They don't answer to their guests, they answer to wall street. It's really that simple.

 

[ChipnDale79]

Building more hotels and adding rooms wont increase crowds. Adding rooms wont add people. Disney isnt building hotels because the ones they have now are reaching capacity. Its the overall attendance that impacts the crowds, people that stay offsite and those that stay onsite. Like everything, once people see it, do it, experience it a few times they move on to other things or start looking at ways to cut cost. Point being, its the actual parks that bring people in and whether disney builds new hotels or dosent build any hotels at all wont have an impact on the crowd, the people are still going to come whether they stay onsite or offsite. Even though building a new hotel will not change the numbers, it will help convince people to stay onsite and allow disney to capitalize on the money being spent. People visit disney for the parks and attractions, the new hotels is just disneys way of trying to get the already visiting guest to stay onsite.

Actually they aren't building hotels much anymore, what they're doing is building DVCs where they are locking in guests long term. Therefore increasing the amount of return guests and adding that to the new guests count, increasing the total attendance.

It's a brilliant strategy to keep people coming to the parks, and its working.

 

[maverik85]

Probably unreasonable, but my personal wish would be for a villains land on the back side of the MK. You could add some scarier stuff while also preserving the milder Main Street USA entry experience. New Fantasyland by way of Gaston's Tavern could work as a transition to darker stuff.

This would be my biggest hope as well. There is so much they could do with a villains themed park. Basicaly be a dark version of Magic Kingdom. Could pull in some of the other IPs they haven't sued yet but with a focus on the villains. For instance, do a Tangled ride that focuses on Mother Gothel's story. Centerpiece can be Maleficent's castle.
Either that or take the concept of Beastly Kingdom but do it across the whole park with half being a light side and half being a dark side. This dark side/park coudl be a great place to do a scarier Halloween thing geared towards teens and stuff kind of like Hong Kong does for halloween

 

[vacationer1954]

The whole disney raised prices to control the crowds argument is nothing but disney spin.

It really isn't "Disney spin". Disney never said it. It is a fan's interpretation of the more technical truth - that Disney sets prices based on the value guests derive from their hotel stays as reflected in how much they're willing to pay.

They don't answer to their guests, they answer to wall street. It's really that simple.

Very true.

 

[ChipnDale79]

It really isn't "Disney spin". Disney never said it. It is a fan's interpretation of the more technical truth - that Disney sets prices based on the value guests derive from their hotel stays as reflected in how much they're willing to pay.

Very true.

yup, i don't disagree with that, my point was that people are saying thats why they keep raising prices when its not really true. They keep raising the prices because people are still paying it, the goal is to drive as many guests into the parks at the highest price possible.

 

[WelshMorgan92]

wish they would..

I'd love to see Disney change Hollywood Studios to Hollywood Adventure then create a new Disney Animation Studios park based around moana/frozen/pixar

I'd also add the villains land on to this park..

You could have frozen land with the castle
Moana with a volcano/splash mountain-esque ride
Pixar land - I'd personally love a soarin style Up ride
Villains land

 

[Stork]

...Like everything, once people see it, do it, experience it a few times they move on to other things...

Maybe that's an over generalization. I know some hard-core Disney aficionados who religiously attend multiple times a year...every year no matter the $$$. Maybe their numbers are fewer than I realize, though.

...or start looking at ways to cut cost. Point being, its the actual parks that bring people in...People visit Disney for the parks and attractions, the new hotels is just Disney's way of trying to get the already visiting guest to stay onsite.

I agree with the highlighted quote above. Consider this: if there were NO theme parks, only hotels, would the resorts be booked as heavily as there are now? Probably not.

 

[DVC_HK]

I think a lot is gonna change soon for Disney anyway with parks and resorts. Iger has finally gone on record for stepping down ( not holding my breath on that) so if/when that happens it's going to be interesting to see what a new CEO does at the helm. Maybe just maybe they will remember they have to start taking care of the guests. Opening the doors to slammed park is eventually run out

 

[The Jackal]

Now THAT'S an idea that could alleviate some of the crowding issues at the MK...the only park that comes close to having a consistent "problem" with crowds.

It had a problem, because it was half of a theme park. When SWGE opens it will be back to a full theme park. Even still DHS had more people go through last year than Universal in Orlando. The only Universal park that had more guests then DHS was Tokyo.

 

[ChipnDale79]

It had a problem, because it was half of a theme park. When SWGE opens it will be back to a full theme park. Even still DHS had more people go through last year than Universal in Orlando. The only Universal park that had more guests then DHS was Tokyo.

well yeah, but how much of DHS's attendance is propped up by the other parks? meaning how many of those people are going to visit MK but decided to go to DHS while they are there also.

If DHS were a standalone park...it would have been a failure IMO.

 

[writerguyfl]

I've always wondered why they haven't built a new deluxe resort on the very long monorail line from TTC to Epcot. Probably some swamp land they can't build on?

I can't vouch for the accuracy of these maps...but they do look official. I found them search "land use maps disney world" via Bing. No clue when they were created or if they have been supplanted by new maps.




Based on the maps, a resort could be placed along the monorail line in the straight stretch closest to the Transportation and Ticket Center. The area closer to where it turns to go to Epcot is a combination of water and unsuitable land.

Personally, I think the best way to get another monorail resort would be to build on the current parking lot for Disney's Polynesian Resort. Build a parking garage that could be used for the current and new resort. Then, simply have the lobby entrance of the new resort directly across from the current monorail station.

A high-rise like the new resort towers at Disney's Coronado Springs Resort and the upcoming Disney's Riviera Resort could offer fireworks views from roughly the 5th floor and higher. And the "backside" of the resort tower would have distant views of Epcot and Disney's Hollywood Studios.

All of that could be done without making any changes to the monorail system.

Something similar could be done at Disney's Grand Floridian Resort and Spa. I'm not sure there's space at Disney's Contemporary Resort for a parking garage and another tower. (Over there, the parking garage would likely ruin the sightlines.)

 

[MadamLeota]

Actually that’s been gone for at least 5 years.

Well darn. I was pretty sure it was gone, but I didnt realize it's been that long!

 

[DanBoris]

I can't vouch for the accuracy of these maps...but they do look official. I found them search "land use maps disney world" via Bing. No clue when they were created or if they have been supplanted by new maps.

View attachment 425408
View attachment 425409

Based on the maps, a resort could be placed along the monorail line in the straight stretch closest to the Transportation and Ticket Center. The area closer to where it turns to go to Epcot is a combination of water and unsuitable land.

Personally, I think the best way to get another monorail resort would be to build on the current parking lot for Disney's Polynesian Resort. Build a parking garage that could be used for the current and new resort. Then, simply have the lobby entrance of the new resort directly across from the current monorail station.

A high-rise like the new resort towers at Disney's Coronado Springs Resort and the upcoming Disney's Riviera Resort could offer fireworks views from roughly the 5th floor and higher. And the "backside" of the resort tower would have distant views of Epcot and Disney's Hollywood Studios.

All of that could be done without making any changes to the monorail system.

Something similar could be done at Disney's Grand Floridian Resort and Spa. I'm not sure there's space at Disney's Contemporary Resort for a parking garage and another tower. (Over there, the parking garage would likely ruin the sightlines.)

That map is mostly accurate, except for the areas that have been developed since it was made. This is from the RCID 2020 planning document, so it's going to be interesting to see if a new document is released next year covering 2020 to 2030.

 

[Scalemaster34]

I can't vouch for the accuracy of these maps...but they do look official. I found them search "land use maps disney world" via Bing. No clue when they were created or if they have been supplanted by new maps.




Based on the maps, a resort could be placed along the monorail line in the straight stretch closest to the Transportation and Ticket Center. The area closer to where it turns to go to Epcot is a combination of water and unsuitable land.

Personally, I think the best way to get another monorail resort would be to build on the current parking lot for Disney's Polynesian Resort. Build a parking garage that could be used for the current and new resort. Then, simply have the lobby entrance of the new resort directly across from the current monorail station.

A high-rise like the new resort towers at Disney's Coronado Springs Resort and the upcoming Disney's Riviera Resort could offer fireworks views from roughly the 5th floor and higher. And the "backside" of the resort tower would have distant views of Epcot and Disney's Hollywood Studios.

All of that could be done without making any changes to the monorail system.

Something similar could be done at Disney's Grand Floridian Resort and Spa. I'm not sure there's space at Disney's Contemporary Resort for a parking garage and another tower. (Over there, the parking garage would likely ruin the sightlines.)

There is a plot for another Seven Seas Monorail Resort between TTC and Contemporary... if they wanted to add a Monorail resort.

Adding more load & stops to the Monorail would be an issue no matter where you built... Epcot, next to existing Resorts or on the land set aside for a new resort. Disney has looked at it going back to the 90's...

 

[vacationer1954]

What is suitable and unsuitable changes more than the condition of the ground itself, due to innovations in construction.

 

[Waldorf_Statler]

It had a problem, because it was half of a theme park. When SWGE opens it will be back to a full theme park. Even still DHS had more people go through last year than Universal in Orlando. The only Universal park that had more guests then DHS was Tokyo.

I still say its half a theme park maybe 3/4, GE has one ride when it opens, two later on, for all that space 2 rides, thats even less than TSL in the same park. But they sure made room for all the food and merchandising they can fit in it. I can't wait to go to it, but once the newness wears off i bet people will pop in for a ride (ROR) maybe 2 and be on there way right out of there.

 

[WelshMorgan92]

I still say its half a theme park maybe 3/4, GE has one ride when it opens, two later on, for all that space 2 rides, thats even less than TSL in the same park. But they sure made room for all the food and merchandising they can fit in it. I can't wait to go to it, but once the newness wears off i bet people will pop in for a ride (ROR) maybe 2 and be on there way right out of there.

agreed, I think HS needs more.. maybe some updated shows to eat up crowds.

I'd personally pull the Indiana jones show and utilise that and the old star wars space for a new land