Genie+ has GOT TO GO!

[Aurora0427]

Thanks for the report and well put. The theory of arriving for rope drop, taking a break in the afternoon, and staying late is being tested by Genie+. We no longer think about doing rides like Space at night. Due to so many ride breakdowns during the day, there is an abundance of MEPs that need to be burned at night. It just kills the standby line and turns the lightning lane into the regular queue.

Genie+ is a gigantic fail and I want these execs to take their family to DL to experience the unpleasantness it is creating.

I was hoping Disney would just go the route of Knotts and Universal and make people really pay for front-of-the-line privileges. The price tag is so affordable everyone gets it. It's no different than the resort fee at a hotel. You are paying it regardless.

I checked last night and Space had an hour wait at 10pm. You’re right….. it’s basically becoming a park where you rope drop and leave, or enjoy the lines. You can start stacking Genie + for the late afternoons and evenings…. I’m going to try this when we go at the end of November.

 

[irlandaise]

Universal's system is either once per ride or unlimited. This allows self-selection so that if the express pass line looks long, you just won't use it for that ride and do something else in the meantime. With Genie+, you have to deal with the return time windows and once-per day restriction so there's no option to come back to the ride later even if the Lightning Lane is long.

Gelatoni, are you saying that the express passes at Universal don't have specific return times? You can just cruise by a ride and get in the express line if it doesn't look too long to you?

 

[kristensideaoffun]

Gelatoni, are you saying that the express passes at Universal don't have specific return times? You can just cruise by a ride and get in the express line if it doesn't look too long to you?

This is correct. There are no return times for the Express Pass. Gelatoni hit the nail on the head. This is why Express Pass works and Genie + doesn’t. It isn’t about raising the price of Genie+ (although this will help some, it won’t completely fix the problem), Fastpasses used to be free and that system worked well. Maxpass was a low cost option and that worked well. They need to eliminate the single use restriction from Genie+ to take some of the pressure off the Lightening Lanes which will take the pressure off the stand-by lines, as well. The average user of Genie+ doesn’t know they can cancel a return time and get it new one if the time doesn’t work for them or the line is too long. They feel like they are in a use it or lose it scenarios - they HAVE to use it during the return time they chose. In addition, many people do not understand that MEPs can be used on other rides, not just the ride that broke down. This results in a lot of people getting into a packed LL that might otherwise choose to do something else and come back at a later time if they could. The crowds would naturally spread out to other attractions, shops, entertainment, etc if people didn’t feel they HAD to get in line or risk losing their LL pass.

And the terrible ride maintenance issues are only increasing the pressure on lines.

 

[irlandaise]

Gelatoni, are you saying that the express passes at Universal don't have specific return times? You can just cruise by a ride and get in the express line if it doesn't look too long to you?

This is correct. There are no return times for the Express Pass. Gelatoni hit the nail on the head. This is why Express Pass works and Genie + doesn’t.

Thanks for the information. I assume that Disney presented Genie+ as an improvement over FP because you don't have to run all over the parks to get passes and you can plan your day better by having specific return times. But there appear to be a lot of unintended consequences—even more so because of all the ride breakdowns you also mentioned that push more people into the remaining rides.

 

[Kit Jackson]

are you saying that the express passes at Universal don't have specific return times? You can just cruise by a ride and get in the express line if it doesn't look too long to you?

You do not use the app at Universal to get a specific return time. Your understanding of the system is correct. You get in the ExpressPass line, they scan your ExpressPass (which might be a room key because some of the hotels include ExpressPass,) and you are good to go. It's a fantastic system.

I assume that Disney presented Genie+ as an improvement over FP because you don't have to run all over the parks to get passes and you can plan your day better by having specific return times.

They already had an alternative (in Disneyland) for people who didn't want to go to the kiosks and wanted to plan a day with specific return times. It was called MaxPass and while it did cost money, overall it was an excellent system.

 

[Aurora0427]

Gelatoni, are you saying that the express passes at Universal don't have specific return times? You can just cruise by a ride and get in the express line if it doesn't look too long to you?

Express Pass at Universal Studios Hollywood has two options…. The “cheaper” option is one time express. So you can express any ride one time, any time of day you want. They do have a more expensive express pass that gives you unlimited rides, but it is really expensive. Universal also allows platinum annual pass holders to express pass after 3pm. We are platinum pass holders, so we normally will rope drop, ride a lot of rides before lunch, eat lunch, see some of the shows and then ride again using our passes after 3. Or, we’ll just come up later in the day and do everything after 3, although that’s more difficult with their shorter hours in off season.

We absolutely love Universal and their pass benefits!

 

[Bossy22]

We went to Disneyland this summer (end of July) and didn't get genie as there was 7 of us and we were there for 5 days. We have went to DL 8 times in the last 11 years and we will not be returning anytime soon. The crowds were massive and the lines didn't move. You could be stuck in 1 spot for 20 minutes...not moving...it was crazy. They have lost one of the biggest Disney families around (we are the ones everyone goes to with questions about DL). Can't believe we made it to this point

 

[Aspencreek]

I just got back from a trip there and said basically the same thing as the OP in my quick report about Genie+ -- The parks were very busy but with Genie+ it was tolerable. If we had not bought Genie+ the trip would have been horrible and I doubt we'd ever go again. I see Genie+ now as basically a must have for every visitor (if at all possible). Which means far too many people are using it and then what is the point of it besides $$$?

The best visit we've had for a while was last July 2021. The parks were mostly back to normal from shutdowns, mask mandates had been dropped, and there was NO GENIE+ and NO FASTPASS/LL system in place -- and it was great! Everyone was on a level playing field and I swear the lines were overall shorter and moved at a good pace. We rode probably double the rides overall in the same number of days as the trip we just did. The one ride we didn't do that trip that we wanted was Space Mtn - only because the line was always a bit longer than we wanted to wait. But at least if we DID decide to wait we would know for sure how long it would take (pretty accurately) and wouldn't have to watch 10,000 LLs get ushered past us for 2 hours.

 

[lindyv321]

I think a huge part of the problem is one use per ride per day. People that know how to use it wait until the afternoon/evening to start booking which leads to overcrowding during already peak times. It’s a mess.

I went last November and was nervous about no FP/MP system but it was amazing! Standby lines actually moved steadily and lines were always shorter than the posted wait time.

I know Disney will never revert back to that since they’ve been making money hand over fist with G+ but I think they are (hopefully) going to have to make some changes to the system. I think it all depends on how important guest experience is to them.. I happily paid for MP and would happily do so again.

I would love to see a mashup of MP and Universals Unlimited pass, multiple uses on all rides and no set return time.

 

[Snap Crackle Pop]

It's not going anywhere anytime soon. And of course they are going to let more Genie+ people go through faster than the standby que.. why wouldn't they? Thats the point of Genie+. They need to make it more expensive imo cause I think there are too many people that buy it.

 

[Aspencreek]

They need to make it more expensive imo cause I think there are too many people that buy it.

Exactly. "When everyone is super..... no one is."

 

[Narcoossee11]

It is not going any where.
Disney spent billions on MB, Genie, etc.

 

[GatorChris]

Rope drop is going to be your best friend. You’ll be able to do all of fantasyland and even some of the bigger rides before lunch. We have rope dropped, ridden what we’ve wanted by lunch, and then spent the afternoon seeing shows, meeting characters, parade if there is one etc….

Rope drop for FantasyLand will work because there's no LL there. That's the only place rope drop is worth anything. Now they have G+ LL times for 8:05. By 8:30, there are no walk-ons. Everything is letting all the LL users go and the standby waits go up exponentially.

I feel you on this and then add in the crap wifi and the fact that our roaming international data was hit and miss it made it really suck at times.

Oh yeah! Definitely crap wifi. So glad we'd switched to unlimited data this year.

what I don't get is that Universal has had a paid system for years but doesn't have the line issues like disney does.
what is their secret formula?

You've had this answered several times, but I want to talk about Universal Orlando where they actually have lots of rides and attractions. First, the price starts at $89 and can go up to $150 depending on supply/demand. That keeps 95%+ from getting it. But here's the BEST part at USO. You can fastness all the rides EXCEPT the biggest rides, Hagrid's Motorbike and Vellocicoaster. For those, everyone has to get in the standby line. Everyone is equal. If Disneyland did that for Cars and Rise of the Resistance, it would be way better.

So paid Genie+ made your trip, but it has to go.

It has to be replaced. Like going back to the original FP but with our phones. It "made the trip" only because without forking over an extra $500 for the week, we would've ridden half the rides we did. While my kids enjoyed the normal Disneyland experience, they have no idea what it cost their old man. That took the joy of it all from me, not them.

Our last trip in August, I felt like the entire vibe of the park was different. Everyone seemed miserable. Guest and cast members alike. We go again next month and have already decided that if we feel the same way we did in August, it will be our last trip for awhile. Makes me really sad.

I feel the same way. We did WDW for 10 years, and the last 10 years have been DL. And to think I'm going to be looking for anything else for future vacations makes me sad. I've got a house full of Disney. I've got my office looking like a DL museum. I love Disney. But ALL their garbage lately has me going somewhere else. And it's sad.

The crowds were massive and the lines didn't move. You could be stuck in 1 spot for 20 minutes...not moving...it was crazy. They have lost one of the biggest Disney families around (we are the ones everyone goes to with questions about DL). Can't believe we made it to this point

Yip, right here. Can't believe it. But that feeling we had on Rise of the Resistance line, sitting in the 91 degree heat and not moving at all...I was already in "where else are we going next time" mode.

 

[pinksand]

The average user of Genie+ doesn’t know they can cancel a return time and get it new one if the time doesn’t work for them or the line is too long.

Wait, WHAT (proving your point, but I legit did not know this)

 

[Aurora0427]

Rope drop for FantasyLand will work because there's no LL there. That's the only place rope drop is worth anything. Now they have G+ LL times for 8:05. By 8:30, there are no walk-ons. Everything is letting all the LL users go and the standby waits go up exponentially.

We’re locals and go all the time… there are not huge lines for Space etc by 8:05. In fact, we were just there last Friday and got on Space at 9:30 with less than a 30 minute wait. It helps that everyone and their brother is running to Rise and HMH right now at rope drop….. but you can still get a lot done early in the morning, and the poster I was responding to has small children, so even better.

What stinks now is the evenings are so jam packed, and there’s no LL return times, so the old strategy of rope drop, rest in the morning, and then come back in the evening isn’t really a great one anymore. It stinks.

 

[twodogs]

Sadly, everyone who says “why don’t they bring back FP or Max Pass, that worked so well” really means “worked so well for the GUESTS”. Disney cares more about increasing the profits than the guest experience. So they actually don’t care about how long the waits for the SB and the LL are; they don’t care that you are paying more for less. They care that they increase profits, which increases shareholder value, and that they showed “growth” and they get a big bonus and get to keep their job. IMO, no free or even MP-like system is ever coming back. They will just raise the prices and keep monetizing it as much as the guests will allow.

They also don’t want to limit the number of people in the parks so that the guest has a better experience. Why leave a “seat” unfilled if they could have made money on that? They are literally pushing it all to the edge of guest revolt, in the name of profits and growth. And remember that making consistent profits is not enough to keep your job if you are a C-suite exec. You have to show quarter on quarter growth. Where does that growth come from???

It’s a harsh reality and makes me really sad as a very long time guest to both DLR and WDW….

 

[icc2515]

Sadly, everyone who says “why don’t they bring back FP or Max Pass, that worked so well” really means “worked so well for the GUESTS”. Disney cares more about increasing the profits than the guest experience. So they actually don’t care about how long the waits for the SB and the LL are; they don’t care that you are paying more for less. They care that they increase profits, which increases shareholder value, and that they showed “growth” and they get a big bonus and get to keep their job. IMO, no free or even MP-like system is ever coming back. They will just raise the prices and keep monetizing it as much as the guests will allow.

They also don’t want to limit the number of people in the parks so that the guest has a better experience. Why leave a “seat” unfilled if they could have made money on that? They are literally pushing it all to the edge of guest revolt, in the name of profits and growth. And remember that making consistent profits is not enough to keep your job if you are a C-suite exec. You have to show quarter on quarter growth. Where does that growth come from???

It’s a harsh reality and makes me really sad as a very long time guest to both DLR and WDW….

People need to realize that a corporations job is not to take care of the customers, it's job is to make money for their shareholders. If they have to take care of their customers to do that, they will. If their customers allow them to save money by providing less for more, they have a duty to those same shareholder to do that. I cannot stress enough that with Disney, customers always have the final say on everything.

 

[disland7]

Wait, WHAT (proving your point, but I legit did not know this)

I will say. While this is technically true and I know it’s possible. The rides wait times go out so fast in the afternoon/evening. If I cancel, there might not be any left and I can’t see where it’s at if I already have an LL. I didn’t want to risk it. All previous maxpass users are supremely disappointed. Wow my trip was different.

I’m normally a 5 day trip, stay at the Grand, annual pass holder, blue bayou fantasmic dinner buying, dessert party buying type of customer (for 7-9 people). With their new prices/systems, I went down to 2 day and a Halloween party for this last trip. Going down to 2 days made me feel like I didn’t want to spend the time doing the up charge experiences like WOC dessert party.

It’s interesting/sad to see the changes in trips die-hard fans are having to make at this time. Disney just has to be counting on new families coming to experience it, that families like mine will still give some $$ (albeit less) and eventually everyone will get used to it?!? I don’t know but I am really sad.

 

[CT Yankee]

I see you, OP. For several years, we vacationed almost exclusively at a Disney venue including DL, WDW and DCL. Given the overall decline in service level and quality, while prices keep increasing, we have no plans to go back anytime soon. Perhaps DCL because it seems like the quality of service still remains. Disney prices were always stupid to begin with, but at least you got a sense that you were getting a quality product and excellent service for your money. As you pointed out, the price is high but the attractions keep getting shut down. I understand that guest safety is a priority and rides have to be closed if they are malfunctioning, but the frequency of the closures makes me think that Disney skimped on the quality of the ride construction and maintenance.

Sadly, as many have already written, Disney has absolutely zero reason to change anything. Look at the most recent quarterly report. Park attendance and per-guest spending increased. Disney is still getting plenty of money from guests who want to visit despite the price increases. Frankly, they have no reason to cater to us "legacy guests" because we are being easily replaced by scores of new guests who have no prior expectations of what Disney used to offer.

 

[V.I.N.CENT.]

Universals system works, Disneyland's system doesn't. We visited Universal back in October 2021 and had a great time with their fastlane system. Was it pricey, yes. But it kept the standby lines manageable. Disney really needs to increase the price and limit the number of sales. Flex pricing with unlimited users will not work.