How are we not more outraged about these shootings?

[gwynne]

I think it's one thing to document...another to just bold faced ignore the man dying. Obviously I've never been in her shoes, and as much as I try not to, I'm totally judging right now. I can't imagine being that man's family and seeing him not only die, but die being ignored like that.

I can tell you for certain that people in shock react in a variety of different ways. His family may not see it like you do. I saw his mother interviewed today. She wasn't criticizing
the documentation of what happened to her son.

 

[sksjasams]

For the video in the car...it's a terrible situation. But I watched the video and I'm thinking...so your boyfriend was just shot. And bleeding and moaning and dying. And rather than comfort him, hold him, SOMETHING...you whip out your phone to live stream and talk to THE PHONE. And not the man dying 2 feet to your left. The whole thing is just so messed up.

The thing is, you can't know what she was feeling or thinking at the time. She knew he had been shot but didn't know he was dying. I get the impression she was trying to remain in control and stay calm, not make sudden movements or freak out. Isn't it possible she was worried she would also get shot? You are aware her child was in the car, right? Please try not to judge...

 

[Hikergirl]

The thing is, unfortunately, I believe the officer reacted in part BECAUSE he was a black man, if only subconsciously. The man was told to get his license and registration. That's what he was doing. I'm trying to picture the same interaction with a white man, and not picturing the same result. There are a TON of people with concealed carry permits in this state. Many. Minnesota is an armed state. I have to believe that people with guns in their vehicle get pulled over all.the.time. Yet, this is the FIRST time I remember a shooting in a traffic stop. Am I surprised it was a black victim? No. No I am not.

And you are free to believe that. I have no idea if that cop is a racist out to rid the world of non-whites or if he just made a mistake.
IMO, that could have happened to anyone, black, white, blue or green. When my dh got his permit, one of the first things he said was everything about getting pulled over was going to change. That is because in the back of his mind he knows that anything can happen when you carry a gun, even something like this incident.

 

[mom2rtk]

The thing is, you can't know what she was feeling or thinking at the time. She knew he had been shot but didn't know he was dying. I get the impression she was trying to remain in control and stay calm, not make sudden movements or freak out. Isn't it possible she was worried she would also get shot? You are aware her child was in the car, right? Please try not to judge...

I agree. Just like people should try not to judge what was in the officer's mind.

 

[sksjasams]

This video was featured on our local news this morning. The Boys and Girls Club will be hosting meetings with teens to discuss this issue, how to interact with police and get home safely.

http://www.pbs.org/black-culture/connect/talk-back/10_rules_of_survival_if_stopped_by_police/

 

[akhenaten]

Can someone explain to me why this man was left to bleed out? Was an ambulance called? Just horrific and inexcusable!! A broken tail light should not be a death sentence ! And why was she handcuffed? Unreal? A broken tail light leads to this! Something is very very wrong.....

 

[gwynne]

I agree. Just like people should try not to judge what was in the officer's mind.

With a bit of an exception, the officer certainly wasn't calm, in control, trying to defuse the situation. I watched and listened to the tape. The woman appeared to be putting a great deal of effort into being calm, listening, defusing...even as her boyfriend was shot.
I think she was doing what she could to keep her child safe.

 

[Soldier's*Sweeties]

With a bit of an exception, the officer certainly wasn't calm, in control, trying to defuse the situation. I watched and listened to the tape. The woman appeared to be putting a great deal of effort into being calm, listening, defusing...even as her boyfriend was shot.
I think she was doing what she could to keep her child safe.

I agree. The officer sounded very panicked when he spoke. I'm not faulting him... I would be too.

 

[megster1123]

The thing is, you can't know what she was feeling or thinking at the time. She knew he had been shot but didn't know he was dying. I get the impression she was trying to remain in control and stay calm, not make sudden movements or freak out. Isn't it possible she was worried she would also get shot? You are aware her child was in the car, right? Please try not to judge...

Yes I'm aware her child was in the car. And I never pretended to know what she was feeling or thinking...so how do you know what she knew?

I do see what you're saying...but IMO people are so focused on documenting and being the one that tells the "real story" that sometimes what is happening RIGHT next to them is ignored. People judge right and left...just like posters here are now judging me for my observations of the video.

 

[akhenaten]

I agree. Just like people should try not to judge what was in the officer's mind.

The difference is that the officer chose a job which requires many many skills.. Including good judgement and courage as part of the job..... This poor woman was just riding in a car with her family.....
He needs to use better judgement and deserves to be judged..more than she does..

 

[Pooh2]

I saw more news about the Baton Rouge shooting than I did about this 64-times-more-deplorable story:

More than 60 shot in Chicago over July 4th weekend
CHICAGO — At least 64 people were shot in the nation’s third largest city over the Independence Day weekend, including four people who were fatally wounded.
The grim violence in Chicago, which has recorded 329 homicides already this year, continued despite stepped up street patrols by theChicago Police Department and the arrest of 88 gang members in two of the city’s most violent neighborhoods ahead of the holiday weekend.
...
The homicide victims included a man in his 30s who police found shot in his abdomen, another man who was found shot dead in a lot across the street from an elementary school and a 31-year-old man who was killed outside his father’s auto shop. The wounded included a 5-year-old girl and her 8-year-old cousin, who were each shot in the leg as they played with sparklers Monday night, the Chicago Tribunereported.​

Thankyou for sharing. It is beyond heartbreaking what a sad forgotten hell-hole Chicago has become.

We could start a new thread each Monday for the sad stories of Chicago gang violence and murder that take place each weekend, often the victims are children and teens.

If the media does not feel the stories and loss of the Chicago victims are interesting enough to report on, perhaps they could explore why a community with some of the strictest gun laws in the country is victim to such high crime and figure out what in the world is going on there.

 

[CPanther95]

At this point we are only getting one side of the story, but it paints a scary picture if completely true. This isn't a case where there is a debate about excessive force (I probably generally allow a wider latitude for a police officer than many do for what should be considered excessive), this is a case where the victim did everything he was supposed to do - and then some - during a routine traffic stop and he was shot and killed. There were no extenuating circumstances that could cause misinterpretation. (Again, if what we are told is true) This was simply a police officer not equipped mentally to handle being a police officer.

 

[mom2rtk]

With a bit of an exception, the officer certainly wasn't calm, in control, trying to defuse the situation. I watched and listened to the tape. The woman appeared to be putting a great deal of effort into being calm, listening, defusing...even as her boyfriend was shot.
I think she was doing what she could to keep her child safe.

That's a fair observation about his behavior. I was talking about reading his mind.

The difference is that the officer chose a job which requires many many skills.. Including good judgement and courage as part of the job..... This poor woman was just riding in a car with her family.....
He needs to use better judgement and deserves to be judged..more than she does..

Same point here. His behavior seems fair to discuss. Just not his motives since none of us can read minds.

 

[Disneylover99]

For the video in the car...it's a terrible situation. But I watched the video and I'm thinking...so your boyfriend was just shot. And bleeding and moaning and dying. And rather than comfort him, hold him, SOMETHING...you whip out your phone to live stream and talk to THE PHONE. And not the man dying 2 feet to your left. The whole thing is just so messed up.

That is all I could think about too.
And her daughter was in the car? How old is she?

 

[gwynne]

That is all I could think about too.
And her daughter was in the car? How old is she?

She's 4.

 

[megster1123]

The difference is that the officer chose a job which requires many many skills.. Including good judgement and courage as part of the job..... This poor woman was just riding in a car with her family.....
He needs to use better judgement and deserves to be judged..more than she does..

No one knows yet what happened before the video started. But as I listened to the rest of the video, her story changes slightly. We don't know what the officer said, what requests were made and how the man reacted. It's impossible to say that the officer needed to use better judgement without being given the facts of what happened leading up to what we see. My observations were made just off of how I saw her reaction - or lack thereof - to the man being shot and dying.

 

[GrnMtnMan]

For anyone interested in learning some facts about police-involved shootings (rather than taking-as-fact the misleading drivel that come out of the mouths of the many idiots-who-read-teleprompters), the Washington Post has done some pretty excellent fact-gathering.

Here’s one screenshot of the 2015 data:

 

[kamik86]

now this guy may have done everything right but I have definitely seen people fight with officers. I think everyone needs to be taught how to react when stopped.

I am a white middle class woman probably a group that is statistically extremely unlikly to be shot and even I was taught that if I am stopped to only get out licence and registration if I can do it well before the cop gets to my car and have them in plain sight. Not to make sudden movements and to calmly explain before I do things.

so when I was stopped for having no sticker 2 days after I bought my first car (rule here is you have a week to get one) I calmly stated when I had no sticker and said "The paper work is in my glove box would you like me to get it" and waited until he said yes to reach over and open it.

I also work on a miltary base and one of the things we tell people due to the guards being armed is that we don't care whose approval you have at the moment when your standing in front of an 18 year old holding a semi-automatic rifle he is always right. If he is not right you can let your supervisor know and they can have a discussion with his superiors after you are no longer standing in front of a gun.

No one has been shot on the base but we would like to keep it that way.

 

[fly girl]

For the video in the car...it's a terrible situation. But I watched the video and I'm thinking...so your boyfriend was just shot. And bleeding and moaning and dying. And rather than comfort him, hold him, SOMETHING...you whip out your phone to live stream and talk to THE PHONE. And not the man dying 2 feet to your left. The whole thing is just so messed up.

Although I'm not a black person in America I can see why she pulled out her phone to video the situation.

She wanted to show what was actually occurring. Given what has happened in our country over the years with bad cops getting away with actions similar to this, it is the best tool she had to show the situation in real time versus the he said, she said game in court.

It doesn't appear to me that they were arguing with the cop. Yet again, we don't see what happened before the shots. I hope the cop had a body camera on him as well.

No, I don't believe all cops are bad. Quite the contrary. But if I were in her shoes with knowing the limited history I have, I would've likely done the same thing. Sad, absolutely. But smart in reality.

FWIW, from the footage I've seen this appears to be a tragic accident. You can hear the officer swearing. You can hear him physically shaken up.

I'm sad all the way around. My heart aches when I hear the 4 year old little girl trying to comfort her mom.

 

[rajak73]

For anyone interested in learning some facts about police-involved shootings (rather than taking-as-fact the misleading drivel that come out of the mouths of the many idiots-who-read-teleprompters), the Washington Post has done some pretty excellent fact-gathering.

Here’s one screenshot of the 2015 data:
View attachment 179985

Don't try to bring facts into this! The 494 whites shot compared to 258 blacks just don't fit the agenda!