If resorts closed, will DVC rental companies and Hotwire refund your money?

[_auroraborealis_]

It also does say about not responsible for operations but it specifically lists what those are. It doesn’t include the words “included but not limited to”, so I don’t know if that would play a role as well.

It says "This would include but is not limited to," so I'm not sure what you're referencing here?

 

[_auroraborealis_]

That and their jump to $20/point really takes away a lot of the savings.

When owners are buying in at $190pp and paying $8.50 per point in dues, expect fewer bargains, honestly.

 

[JenniJ]

They may not be able to, depending on the points. If someone is holding April 2019 points, they expire 3/31. June UY points, they are past banking, and nearly impossible to use at this point even if resorts reopen after Easter.

There are a lot of factors around points usage and expiration in play at this stage. Renters don't see if someone is using banked or borrowed points, or points running up against expiry.

This is why I said the may get them back. But many, if not most, will get the points back to resell or use.
I have a feeling timeshare laws should be relaxed during this time for owners so they do t loose their points or a renter can rebook when the resort and\or parks reopen. With all the accommodations being made in this unprecedented time, this should be one as well. Not just for Disney timeshares but all timeshares. This way ppl don’t suffer more than they already have. Also, when this passes, tourism will need to be back on its feet, relaxing the law will help.

 

[Sandisw]

It says "This would include but is not limited to," so I'm not sure what you're referencing here?

I must have looked at something different, because I missed that

 

[Sandisw]

This is why I said the may get them back. But many, if not most, will get the points back to resell or use.
I have a feeling timeshare laws should be relaxed during this time for owners so they do t loose their points or a renter can rebook when the resort and\or parks reopen. With all the accommodations being made in this unprecedented time, this should be one as well. Not just for Disney timeshares but all timeshares. This way ppl don’t suffer more than they already have. Also, when this passes, tourism will need to be back on its feet, relaxing the law will help.

The bigger problem is with a points based timeshare, you’d have way too many points in the system than rooms to book,

If they make a lot of exceptions now, then what happens down the road,, when other owners can’t book because there are no rooms,

You could then be in the same position next year that owners are going to want extension of points because they can’t use them again, At some point, you’d have to draw a line in the sand and stop,

Unfortunately, it’s not as simple as it sounds. Many members, including myself, are preparing for changes down the road, even with some of the relaxing of the rules that have been happened.

 

[vwlfan]

Wow

 

[embracejg]

Just my own personal experience here, but I had a Hotwire Hot Rate deal for the first week of May at Coronado. Typically, that's nonrefundable, but I was offered a full refund, no questions asked, just by filling out an online form: https://www.hotwire.com/request-cancellation

I see little reason to believe the parks will reopen by then.

 

[Sandisw]

Just my own personal experience here, but I had a Hotwire Hot Rate deal for the first week of May at Coronado. Typically, that's nonrefundable, but I was offered a full refund, no questions asked, just by filling out an online form: https://www.hotwire.com/request-cancellation

I see little reason to believe the parks will reopen by then.

That is great! They are a business though, so it possible they have stricter guidelines to follow when a non refundable reservation can’t happen.

DVC rentals really are, even with a broker, a private transaction between two people. Doesn’t make it any less frustrating.

 

[DGsAtBLT]

I am very frustrated with David’s at this point. They have been so hard to communicate with through all of this. First of all, their method of communication by emails where you’re constantly responded to by a different person flat out sucks in this scenario.

We have insurance like advised, and it would cover us because we are Canadian and are advised against leaving the country (soon to be even stricter). Except David’s has thrown a wrench into that because they have the new COVID message stating they will try and work with you, and we have to attempt to get money back from them first for insurance, apparently. Except we can’t properly communicate. And I will be absolutely furious if their willingness to try and rebook (which we do not want) prevents an insurance claim.

No more rentals for us. And I can’t imagine the savings even hold up much longer anyways.

 

[Susan Mayer]

My agreement states “this is an agreement to rent points that represent accommodations only”. I would think since I didn’t get accommodations I would have a valid argument for a refund.

 

[Lynne M]

I'm going to copy a post I made on another thread because it's relevant here as well...


Let me say up front that I completely, totally, 100% understand the stress and pain of not only having your vacation cancelled, but possibly losing the money you paid for your lodging. I don't want to minimize anyone's frustration or financial losses. I would be upset too.

I just looked at my most recent rental agreement from David's (sent to both parties before any payments are made) and it clearly states that the balance paid by the renter is non-refundable and that David's is not liable for operations changes by the resort (i.e., closures). The only condition I can see under which a refund is offered is if an action is taken by the member that results in the cancellation of the reservation and a comparable reservation can't be secured for the same dates. This would cover situations like members cancelling reservations, or DVC cancelling a member's reservations because they've defaulted on their mortgage or maintenance fees.

I think this would work against anyone trying to dispute a charge with their credit card company. If there's an agreement in place that the renter agreed to before sending funds, and that agreement has not been violated, I'm not sure what can the credit card company can do.

I'm not going to get into what I think David's should do; I don't know what they can do. That's their call. I do know that they're a reputable business with a very professional staff, and they will get back for you.

As for the wait for a response, I'll just say that every travel company on the planet is getting slammed right now. This isn't like contacting Disney or Expedia, who have hundreds or thousands of people manning the customer service line. It's a small-ish business getting contacted by every single customer with a reservation in the next few months, all at once. Give it a couple of days so they can dig through the avalanche of e-mail.

 

[lovethesun12]

I am very frustrated with David’s at this point. They have been so hard to communicate with through all of this. First of all, their method of communication by emails where you’re constantly responded to by a different person flat out sucks in this scenario.

We have insurance like advised, and it would cover us because we are Canadian and are advised against leaving the country (soon to be even stricter). Except David’s has thrown a wrench into that because they have the new COVID message stating they will try and work with you, and we have to attempt to get money back from them first for insurance, apparently. Except we can’t properly communicate. And I will be absolutely furious if their willingness to try and rebook (which we do not want) prevents an insurance claim.

No more rentals for us. And I can’t imagine the savings even hold up much longer anyways.

I actually stayed at Beach Club last year on a direct reservation for just $100 more than it would have cost to rent the points (although it would have been a wash because I would have paid an increased fee for the dining plan by renting), which is why I didn't rent. The cost of renting has gone up again this year but it was still cheaper than direct. That said hindsight is 20/20 and I should have booked direct anyway.

That said, my trip is in July. Who knows what will happen by then. I can't believe how much has changed in such a short time. I have the added twist of being Canadian, so for the trip to go ahead I need Disney to be open, borders to be open, nothing to have gone bankrupt (airlines/etc...who knows how they will all come out of this) oh and also not get coronavirus which may even be the least unlikely of them all.

I also don't even know when to contact the member. Since I went through an agency, I know that saying they are busy is the understatement of the decade. But waiting may have repercussions for the member, like banking deadlines/etc. Also there's the fact I don't want to cancel my trip and really would prefer to wait it out. Oh the decisions.

 

[Susan Mayer]

I'm going to copy a post I made on another thread because it's relevant here as well...


Let me say up front that I completely, totally, 100% understand the stress and pain of not only having your vacation cancelled, but possibly losing the money you paid for your lodging. I don't want to minimize anyone's frustration or financial losses. I would be upset too.

I just looked at my most recent rental agreement from David's (sent to both parties before any payments are made) and it clearly states that the balance paid by the renter is non-refundable and that David's is not liable for operations changes by the resort (i.e., closures). The only condition I can see under which a refund is offered is if an action is taken by the member that results in the cancellation of the reservation and a comparable reservation can't be secured for the same dates. This would cover situations like members cancelling reservations, or DVC cancelling a member's reservations because they've defaulted on their mortgage or maintenance fees.

I think this would work against anyone trying to dispute a charge with their credit card company. If there's an agreement in place that the renter agreed to before sending funds, and that agreement has not been violated, I'm not sure what can the credit card company can do.

I'm not going to get into what I think David's should do; I don't know what they can do. That's their call. I do know that they're a reputable business with a very professional staff, and they will get back for you.

As for the wait for a response, I'll just say that every travel company on the planet is getting slammed right now. This isn't like contacting Disney or Expedia, who have hundreds or thousands of people manning the customer service line. It's a small-ish business getting contacted by every single customer with a reservation in the next few months, all at once. Give it a couple of days so they can dig through the avalanche of e-mail.

I don’t disagree about the wording surrounding operational changes but still think since I am not in possession of points or accommodations it is a breech of contract.

 

[Lynne M]

IMO, this phrase in the rental agreement...

”The Intermediary has received from Renter a NON REFUNDABLE payment of...”

...means the contract has not been breached.

 

[SteveMouse]

I have absolutely no skin in the game, but I believe a renter would have a hard time either in court or on a claim with a credit card company for breach of contract if the sales agreement included a "no refunds" clause. While the scope of the purchase is different, it's similar to an "all sales final/no returns" transaction. The renter cannot choose to follow only part of the contract. They have to follow all of it. The contract applies in its entirety.

 

[Susan Mayer]

I have absolutely no skin in the game, but I believe a renter would have a hard time either in court or on a claim with a credit card company for breach of contract if the sales agreement included a "no refunds" clause. While the scope of the purchase is different, it's similar to an "all sales final/no returns" transaction. The renter cannot choose to follow only part of the contract. They have to follow all of it. The contract applies in its entirety.

I am not choosing to only follow part of the contract. The contract I signed was for point rental for accommodations. At this point, I am no longer renting points as they are being returned to the owner due to the circumstances. And I do not have accommodations, neither are by any choice of my own. How is this not breach of contract? In an all sales are final situation the you have a product. Maybe it doesn’t work and you are left holding the bag but you have something. In this case David’s still has their share, the owner is getting their points back as well as what they have already received from David’s and I have nothing. I feel their is an argument I held up my end of the contract but the others did not.

 

[Marionnette]

I am not choosing to only follow part of the contract. The contract I signed was for point rental for accommodations. At this point, I am no longer renting points as they are being returned to the owner due to the circumstances. And I do not have accommodations, neither are by any choice of my own. How is this not breach of contract? In an all sales are final situation the you have a product. Maybe it doesn’t work and you are left holding the bag but you have something. In this case David’s still has their share, the owner is getting their points back as well as what they have already received from David’s and I have nothing. I feel their is an argument I held up my end of the contract but the others did not.

You agreed to rent points that can be used for a reservation. In my opinion, the owner should work to provide you with accommodations that those points can secure. IOW, if the points expire in June then you have until the end of June to use them. If they expire in November, then you have until the end of November to use them. It’s not as if DVC is cutting the owners any breaks with regard to the lifespan of those points. They will be worthless after their expiration date. You agreed to rent those points. You signed an agreement acknowledging that the monies paid were nonrefundable. You shouldn’t be left with nothing but neither should the owner.

I liken your situation to what a lot of air travelers are facing. The airlines are not offering refunds, even if they cancel your flight. They are waiving their change fees and allowing you to use the travel funds on another flight in the future. If the flight costs more, you will pay more. If the flight costs less, well...too bad for you because the airline is keeping your money. If you can’t fly before the travel funds expire, the airlines are not going to bend their rules for you.

David’s is already bending their rules by asking owners to make refunds if they can. They are also offering to re-rent the points for the owner, if possible. Most owners are not happy with those options. However, I have not read of a single owner who got their points back and is unwilling to re-book a reservation for the renter using the same points.

 

[Susan Mayer]

You agreed to rent points that can be used for a reservation. In my opinion, the owner should work to provide you with accommodations that those points can secure. IOW, if the points expire in June then you have until the end of June to use them. If they expire in November, then you have until the end of November to use them. It’s not as if DVC is cutting the owners any breaks with regard to the lifespan of those points. They will be worthless after their expiration date. You agreed to rent those points. You signed an agreement acknowledging that the monies paid were nonrefundable. You shouldn’t be left with nothing but neither should the owner.

I liken your situation to what a lot of air travelers are facing. The airlines are not offering refunds, even if they cancel your flight. They are waiving their change fees and allowing you to use the travel funds on another flight in the future. If the flight costs more, you will pay more. If the flight costs less, well...too bad for you because the airline is keeping your money. If you can’t fly before the travel funds expire, the airlines are not going to bend their rules for you.

David’s is already bending their rules by asking owners to make refunds if they can. They are also offering to re-rent the points for the owner, if possible. Most owners are not happy with those options. However, I have not read of a single owner who got their points back and is unwilling to re-book a reservation for the renter using the same points.

I was actually given a full refund from the airline on a flight that wasn't cancelled but that is not the discussion topic here. The owner has offered to work with me but no studios which is the room category I booked are available consecutively for the length of the stay my points correspond to. So I can pay more and hope to get a different room category or be out all of my money while the owner has their points. They can use them, they can sell them, they can do anything with them. I fully understand that I entered into a contract and I have tried to work with both David's and the owner as well. Since we are not able to come to a resolution that fits both parties I will be the only one losing out in the circumstances. Given the climate on what is going on I expect more from David's. Offer a partial refund for the part they haven't paid out (including their profit). Or issue a credit to be used for a future date which has availability for the room category I booked for my length of stay. I see no goodwill being offered at this point. Saying they are breaking their policy to ask the owner to work with us or offer a refund really is an act of decency given the situation not a sacrifice on their part.

 

[Kuzcotopia1]

I've spoken with The DVC Rental Store. They have worked through all of the March and most of April reservations, they are moving into May now.

I was given a path forward for two scenarios in my group (purchased PPP, did not purchase PPP).

1. Purchased PPP (Points Protection Plan): You have the option of canceling and receiving a refund based on their cancellation rules/dates. They are not bending these rules to give more flexibility for a larger refund. Contact your representative ASAP via email to confirm if you want to cancel. Email will show a time and date stamp. Personally, we receive the largest refund if we request cancellation before 3/23/2020. She advised the timestamp will reflect this in case she cannot get back to us before that date.

2. Did not purchase PPP: They cannot guarantee a refund (I read this as a don't get your hopes up). DVC Rental Store is working with members to potentially rebook reservations but they are based on availability, use year and points expiration. A member could also say, "too bad, so sad" but you would hope people are being decent human beings because of the situation.

 

[Divaofdisney]

Can anyone recommend a "no questions asked" travel insurance company that would cover full cost of trip?