Is Disney finally seeing consumers say they're pricing themselves out of peoples ability to pay?

[ChasingLeslie]

For us it is not about the indoor hallways and walkability (although that is nice, especially when there are florida thunderstorsm). It is (1) we are a family of 5 so need our space, and the deluxe the rooms are more spacious, and the bathrooms have actual doors instead of a curtain or partition, both of which make it much more comfortable for us to share a room with our three boys; (2) the beds are sooooo much more comfortable; I couldn't sleep well the one time we tried a mod and it left me exhausted at the parks; (3) the on-site dining is a huge benefit for us--we do short stays it is a huge advantage to us to be able to get in a character or signature meal on arrival night without having to lose hours to transportation, and a character breakfast on departure day before a midday flight; (4) I know the mods have themeing, but it doesn't quite blow me away the way the deluxes do, and we like that magical escapist feel you get at a deluxe. Another big reason we have favored deluxes is that we don't like multiple-bus-stops experience at mods which makes bus transportation even more unpleasant, and we like to avoid busses where possible and take the boat/monorail depending on the resort and park. Now that the mods have the skyliner I am more tempted, but I will wait to see reviews of how long it takes and if the lack of AC or thunderstorms make it problematic.

More generally, I am not priced out yet of Disney altogether, but I am priced out of a few things. For example, I won't be purchasing out-of-state annual passes at the current prices. I also won't pay out of pocket for certain character meals if I am not on the dining plan.

Everyone has different things that are important to them. We are a family of four and stay at Coronado. The bathrooms have doors, the beds are AMAZING, the dining options are plentiful, and the theming is great (and I can’t wait to check out the details in the new tower). It’s a “deluxe-lite” hybrid...I’ve stayed at CBR and POR in the past and its just not the same.

 

[sethschroeder]

People have been getting priced out for a long time. We might not like it and we might not agree but pricing is how Disney will control crowds but it comes down to those visiting making up for those not with much higher prices.

Personally Universal isn't that much cheaper (10% - 20%) than I can do Disney and I feel there is a ton less for a family with young kids not to mention pretty much 0 themes they would know, while the 2 year old knows Disney characters through books and movies.

Do I wish it was cheaper? Sure

 

[Captainkidd76]

People have been getting priced out for a long time. We might not like it and we might not agree but pricing is how Disney will control crowds but it comes down to those visiting making up for those not with much higher prices.

Personally Universal isn't that much cheaper (10% - 20%) than I can do Disney and I feel there is a ton less for a family with young kids not to mention pretty much 0 themes they would know, while the 2 year old knows Disney characters through books and movies.

Do I wish it was cheaper? Sure

Pet peeve of mine - Keep calm.

I've asked this before and nobody seems willing to do it. Give me any dates of your choosing and I guarantee you and I can get you a Universal Deluxe property for less money than a Disney Deluxe, and in many cases, even less than a moderate. Just give me some dates...

 

[stewart715]

I'm not going to read all of this but there is virtually no takeaway possible from a single quarter's reporting. A lot happened this quarter between Galaxy's Edge hype and AP blackouts. The numbers are going to be weird. I imagine the next two quarters will more than make up for it. So, I guess I'm saying no, I don't think Disney is pricing themselves out. I still say there are affordable ways to do Disney if you work hard enough and are patient.

That being said, most people don't visit WDW every year like we do. They are every 3 years, every once in the while...at most every other year. So, I do believe in the notion that those types of visitors are postponing their visit until after SWGE opens. Because if they don't, they won't get to see it for many years.

So, I expect the next 2-3 quarters to balance out those numbers if not add additional growth. Disney will keep raising these prices until it breaks and again one quarter proves nothing (especially under the circumstances).

PS: Remember, paid attendance was up, hotel reservations were up, park consumer goods were up..it was unpaid attendance that was down which is almost certainly due to a combination of AP blackouts and SWGE 'crowd' avoidance.

 

[sethschroeder]

Pet peeve of mine - Keep calm.

I've asked this before and nobody seems willing to do it. Give me any dates of your choosing and I guarantee you and I can get you a Universal Deluxe property for less money than a Disney Deluxe, and in many cases, even less than a moderate. Just give me some dates...

Except like I said Universal is 10-20% less expensive but that's not big of enough difference to justify going to Universal with little kids.

As an example: September 1-10 (9 nights), AKV, 1 Bedroom, $2664 ($296/night) {need 1 bedroom with couch bed or 2 guaranteed rooms connecting}

Tickets were $2143 for 9 days w/ hoppers (59.52 day/person)

4 Adults, 2yo, infant

 

[stewart715]

Universal is less expensive because it has less demand and there is not currently enough to do at Universal to warrant the same length of trip that you would do at WDW.

 

[Disneylover99]

Pet peeve of mine - Keep calm.

I've asked this before and nobody seems willing to do it. Give me any dates of your choosing and I guarantee you and I can get you a Universal Deluxe property for less money than a Disney Deluxe, and in many cases, even less than a moderate. Just give me some dates...

As I mentioned earlier in the thread, we go in August and it just wasn’t possible for us to find a cheaper Universal Express pass hotel for our dates. We could have got a standard room at AKL for $250 a night though.

The one thing I do like about Disney is that I don’t have to stay at a deluxe for 5 days or more to get a better rate. Our typical deluxe stay is 3 or 4 nights.

 

[Captainkidd76]

Universal is less expensive because it has less demand and there is not currently enough to do at Universal to warrant the same length of trip that you would do at WDW.

You realize that Universal's 2 parks have more attractions than Epcot, Animal Kingdom and Hollywood Studios combined, correct? Also, the attendance at Universal's parks is just about the same as those 3 parks.

 

[Captainkidd76]

Except like I said Universal is 10-20% less expensive but that's not big of enough difference to justify going to Universal with little kids.

As an example: September 1-10 (9 nights), AKV, 1 Bedroom, $2664 ($296/night) {need 1 bedroom with couch bed or 2 guaranteed rooms connecting}

Tickets were $2143 for 9 days w/ hoppers (59.52 day/person)

4 Adults, 2yo, infant

Hard Rock Hotel for those dates - $2,347.
Animal Kinggdom Lodge with fall discount - $2,985
AKL Villas 1 bedroom - $5,692 (assuming you rented points to get the rate you did)

For tickets, can't comment on that. We have AP's for Universal. We pay $402 for preferred passes.

 

[stewart715]

You realize that Universal's 2 parks have more attractions than Epcot, Animal Kingdom and Hollywood Studios combined, correct? Also, the attendance at Universal's parks is just about the same as those 3 parks.

Who said anything about number of attractions being the main focus at WDW? It's literally never been that way (though ridiculous that you conveniently chose to exclude Magic Kingdom from your comparison to Universal ). You forgot to include dining options, shows, experience, theming, resorts, resort integration, Disney Springs, character experiences, etc. Not to mention two full fledged water parks.

Epcot and Animal Kingdom are not typical theme parks, so equating number of attractions is ridiculous (Epcot is barely a theme park). Hollywood Studios is in transition

That being said, it's not a dig on Universal but it's a fact that it has less demand. Same attendance, what?

Magic Kingdom: 21 million
Animal Kingdom: 13.75 million
Epcot: 12.5 million
Hollywood Studios: 11.25 million
...
Universal Studios: 10.75 million
Islands of Adventure: 9.75 million

In what world does 3-4 million people equate to no difference?

Less demand.

 

[Farro]

You realize that Universal's 2 parks have more attractions than Epcot, Animal Kingdom and Hollywood Studios combined, correct? Also, the attendance at Universal's parks is just about the same as those 3 parks.

I think you might just have to accept that some people just don't want to go to Universal.

We will go and have fun I'm sure, but if it came down to it, we would pick going to Disney over Universal every time.

That said, the hotels are just getting too expensive to justify costs. Just the hotels for us, not the food, the parks, the parties, etc., the hotels are what makes me blink now at booking a trip.

 

[sethschroeder]

Disney will keep raising these prices until it breaks and again one quarter proves nothing (especially under the circumstances).

When it breaks they can throw out discounts and people will come back likely as well.

AKL Villas 1 bedroom - $5,692 (assuming you rented points to get the rate you did)

Correct it's the number one suggestion I make to anyone visiting Disney who doesn't stay Value/Off-site. I lined up my reservation on Memorial Day so not even that far ahead of time (90 days).

 

[HopperFan]

Universal is less expensive because it has less demand and there is not currently enough to do at Universal to warrant the same length of trip that you would do at WDW.

I've always said and still believe that while they are both in the theme park / vacation business .... their products are apples and oranges. Both good at what they do. Universal went the "imagineering" route with IOA and slowly making changes to US .... but .....

Won't it be fun in a few years when this new park opens? Universal is now piecing together a product that will legitimately compete with Disney for those dollars. I can't help but think there is way more in their back pocket we don't know about yet that will truly create a Universal District from the OCCC to the Turnpike.

 

[stewart715]

I've always said and still believe that while they are both in the theme park / vacation business .... their products are apples and oranges. Both good at what they do. Universal went the "imagineering" route with IOA and slowly making changes to US .... but .....

Won't it be fun in a few years when this new park opens? Universal is now piecing together a product that will legitimately compete with Disney for those dollars. I can't help but think there is way more in their back pocket we don't know about yet that will truly create a Universal District from the OCCC to the Turnpike.

100% - Universal is trying to get the non-Disney freaks to spend their week at Universal and instead visit WDW for a day or 2 (where its usually the opposite right now). That is good competition for Disney park fans. Puts pressure on Disney to keep WDW as the primary destination.

 

[disneyseniors]

I agree. I used to go crazy with spending as I always found so much that was unique. I always had to ship my stuff home because it was too much to fit into our suitcases without going over luggage weight. Now I go and hardly spend anything on souvenirs as everything seems so generic. It's very disappointing.

Yep, you are so right! I used to buy their unique items too. Now I go to Target or Kohl's before a trip and buy Disney Tshirts for 10 or 12 Dollars! I see similar stuff while at WDW for much, much higher cost. All generic, so I'll stick with my Target shirts I search out some unique things, and these are at Haunted Mansion gift shop. Those are truly unique and true to HM.

 

[Tigger in a kilt]

I think you might just have to accept that some people just don't want to go to Universal.

We will go and have fun I'm sure, but if it came down to it, we would pick going to Disney over Universal every time.

This. I have no interest in going to Universal. Last year I went to Disney for 4 weeks, basically all of October, and didn’t leave WDW property the whole time.

While the length of stay is unusual, most people in my life were, like me, pretty disinterested in Universal, or at least didn’t think it was worth the money. If you don’t like simulators, or you are plus size, or you have medical issues, Disney is so much better than Universal.

I’m not Universal’s target demographic, and that’s ok - I’m happy to take my money to Disney instead. I just don’t understand the idea of comparing the hotel prices of Disney vs Universal, as if that’s the only difference.

 

[scullylam]

Everyone has made a very good point about the costs and how you all try to do a Disney trip nowadays.

My last time to WDW was 2012. This October I am going for a short weekend doing the Halloween party and a 2 day Hopper with my dad. The ticket price did make me choke since I went to WDW as a kid in the late 80s up through 2000 about every other year. But with all the changes and pricing, it is awful.

As pointed out, even hotel room rates are overpriced and parking fees rising more. And with merchandise, I agree. I was able to go to Disneyland in October 2016 and last year to the April Dapper Day. Merchandise did not seem unique. It makes me miss the times when the parks sold sterling silver traditional charms instead of the generic Pandora ones you see everywhere. And having the same design clothing with only a change in park name is sad.

So, since costs are too high just to go to a US Disney park, maybe it is more cost efficient to take a trip to the parks in Japan? Paris? Hong Kong? Shanghai?

 

[stewart715]

As pointed out, even hotel room rates are overpriced and parking fees rising more.

Last quarter's rising occupancy to 88% begs to differ.

 

[Captainkidd76]

I think you might just have to accept that some people just don't want to go to Universal.

I'm totally fine with that. People should go wherever they want to. My issue is when people claim they can stay at a Disney Deluxe for less money than a Universal Deluxe. 95% of the time, that's simply not true. And in addition, again, you get certain perks from Universal staying Deluxe that you don't get at Disney.

 

[Tigger in a kilt]

Everyone has made a very good point about the costs and how you all try to do a Disney trip nowadays.

My last time to WDW was 2012. This October I am going for a short weekend doing the Halloween party and a 2 day Hopper with my dad. The ticket price did make me choke since I went to WDW as a kid in the late 80s up through 2000 about every other year. But with all the changes and pricing, it is awful.

As pointed out, even hotel room rates are overpriced and parking fees rising more. And with merchandise, I agree. I was able to go to Disneyland in October 2016 and last year to the April Dapper Day. Merchandise did not seem unique. It makes me miss the times when the parks sold sterling silver traditional charms instead of the generic Pandora ones you see everywhere. And having the same design clothing with only a change in park name is sad.

So, since costs are too high just to go to a US Disney park, maybe it is more cost efficient to take a trip to the parks in Japan? Paris? Hong Kong? Shanghai?

Speaking as a Brit: Disneyland Paris is freaking expensive. I’m paying more for 4 days in DLP over Christmas, in a Moderate hotel, and I am for 2 weeks in AKL next year. The only reason DLP would be cheaper is if you pay less in flights (which obviously I do, but which US guests won’t).