Is it Even Worth it Anymore?

[HopperFan]

I've helped LOTS plan. If someone asked me now about going anytime before spring 2023, I'd likely tell them don't do it. We have APs, we stay offsite, we don't do lots of the shows or need to do everything. Last and next trip not even making ADRs - choices not great and meh food overpriced. But if they are paying full ticket prices - I would say don't do it. Disney has LOTS to fix and am hoping by next summer they will be functioning better. But who knows. I'm just glad I have the cheapest AP so I don't feel bad about reducing my 4-6 weeks per year to 3-4 weeks per year. I still get value for my money.

We have Universal APs and next trip plan to go to SeaWorld, along with 4 days at Disney plus waterparks.

 

[ML_LovesDisney]

I've seen a couple of folks talking about it still being worth it because of the children in their lives, but what if you don't have any? It's just my wife and I, but I have always been a Disney fan. That said, the last time I was at Universal (also the first time) it felt like they were the park Walt would have built today. I know a lot of folks don't like the simulators but they do offer a level of immersion I personally don't think dark rides can provide.

Hmmm good question. I personally enjoy the Disney parks myself and just love the vibe of being there. Kids just make it more magical for me, I'd still be happy without kids there (DH and I did a 2 day trip July 2021, forgot about that one). I don't care so much about the rides. Universal VR rides cause me motion sickness, but it's definitely wonderful theming and immersion.

 

[tentaguasu]

... it was just as crowded and the crowd was…..very different than the Disney crowd. Whereas at Disney we felt like we were surrounded by super organized families/ Disney lovers/ generally kind people…Universal… let’s just say my kids learned the F word there and my 8 year old daughter came home wanting to wear fishnet stockings. And not in the cute-1983 Madonna kind of way. I almost got projectile vomited on by two drunk people.

Interesting perspective! I haven't been to Universal in about 15 years, but I absolutely 100% noticed a different vibe (and not in a good way). I'll be there for just a day to check out the Potter stuff before hitting Disney again for a longer trip. I'll be curious to see whether I still feel the same way.

As for the crowds and the prices... I alluded to this above, but what do we expect Disney to do?

Lower prices leads to MORE crowds. I only see two paths, though correct me if you see differently:

Option 1: Don't let people in. Sounds great, unless you're the person that doesn't get let in. Imagine the blowback if you started cutting more deeply into AP access, or telling people that they simply can't go to the parks. We already hate park passes, now imagine seeing greyed out days on the reservation calendar for months ahead.

Option 2: Raise prices. You can go if you want to, but it'll just cost more.

And you may argue that it's not just ticket prices but inflation in the price of everything. But again, what should Disney do?

Sure, prices are stupid expensive, but it's pretty simple supply and demand stuff. It's not Disney's fault, it's ours. In a free market system, things are "worth" whatever people are willing to pay for them. I don't think the prices at Disney resorts are even close to "worth it," so I don't use them. But they can charge what the market will bear, and the market is clearly bearing the current pricing. Again, the crowds suggest that prices might be too low. (Shhhh, don't tell them.)

Which is a better outcome? Raising the cost of a Disney vacation to 200% above what it is now and having parks half as full or reduce it to 50% of current prices and have it twice as full?

I mean, I'm not sure how we expect them to keep prices low AND crowds low AND have the parks accessible to us when we want them.

Sure, that's what I want. But how can I fault Disney for not delivering something that seems largely impossible?

 

[MainMom]

To be fair I sorta experience things like that just going out and about. I don't think it's a Disney thing or a vacation thing. We're all a little more short-tempered/less sociable bunch during this pandemic. I know many of us try not to be but even the most mild-tempered of us can need some social interaction brushing up. I also think right or wrong many of us are more hygiene-oriented than before. I may not have thought too much about someone sneezing and now it's like geez cover your mouth..ya know?

So I don't think I would go in thinking guests are just behaving poorly but rather that just because it's Disney doesn't mean that the types of people I encounter every now and then at restaurants or grocery stores aren't going to exist just because it's Disney. I still think many people are behaved well enough but we also may be a bit more hyper-focused on behaviors more than in the past.

I just had a onversation with my DD20 the other day about how we don’t even like to sneeze or cough in public because people are probably thinking the worst. I mean, I do it. Then I immediately tell myself not everything is doomsday.

 

[Smugpugmug]

I agree that it depends entirely on your expectations beforehand. I think if someone who has never been to Disney before asked me if they should go, I would say hold off until late 2023/2024. Disney is going through A LOT of problems right now that I would like to see refined/ironed out before I could recommend a first timer who doesn't have a PhD in Disney planning to go. I'm taking a trip with my friend who hasn't been since the introduction of Fastpass+ and I feel like a school teacher trying to explain all of the new changes to her.

I took a trip for my birthday President's day week of this year and the crowds were insane. I fully expected the crowds due to a lot of kids being off from school that week, so I was not going in with the mindset of the crowd levels being low. But I remember feeling very bad for the people with their first time buttons standing in 2+ hour lines for the big attractions and them looking stressed/upset.

With that said, I feel like a lot of people don't remember the pre-Covid era of the parks being busy and only now are they packed. If anything, the crowdedness level of the parks before Covid was WAY worse. I took trips in 2018 and 2019 and WOW the crowds were horrendous. All of the E-tickets were 3+ hour waits. I remember FOP being 4 hours all day. Fastpass+ absolutely made these lines worse but the pre-planning aspect of Fastpass+ is something I miss SO much. The uncertainty of Genie+ and the glitchy-ness of the app are the two things I hate the most about it.

I also agree that people online overexaggerate and are often hyperbolic about the state of the parks. I never saw overflowing trash cans, rude CMs or anything of that nature. I did notice more ride breakdowns than usual and some rides being in a depressing state (Buzz Space Ranger Spin and Spaceship Earth come to mind). Guest behavior has been the same pre Covid and now. If anything, I see less overly drunk people at Epcot than I did before. I still remember seeing two EXTREMELY drunk guys having a fist fight at the bridge to Boardwalk a few years back.

There is still good at the Disney parks, but even I can't ignore than they don't have the value that they once had.

 

[toontoy]

we just got back and honesty I would look at what your spending. We don't have annual passes so our 5 days in the parks were with a regular park hopper ticket. I felt like we could have spent less and just bought a day ticket to the MK. DHS had 2-3 hour waits for almost everything right when we got to the park. We left after a couple hours as we could ride anything with 2 little kids. 95 Min for MRR did us in and that was our first ride.Once off everything our 6 year old wanted to do was 2 hours plus. Slinky was 3 hours. We left the park went to the hotel and swam and had fun. It cost about 400 for the couple hours that day in the park, we did go to epcot around 6 though so we did get the rest of the night and the deluxe hours in. (I thought it was funny for the deluxe hours, test track and Frozen were down the entire time and after we rode remy Soarin went down so it was a let down). All in all it was or last trip for at least 5 years. I went on a trip to key west a few weeks before and the difference in our deluxe resort and a real luxury hotel were very apparent. we spent 5 times as much at disney as we did in key west per person. If we took our kids to key west it would have dropped even more due to averaging the hotel cost as well. the parks are packed. We had fun at the evening timeframe but I dont think the cost is worth it and we are voting with our dollars and cancelled our wish cruise and resort stay next year and prob will go to Germany or australia for the same amount.

 

[Jrb1979]

Interesting perspective! I haven't been to Universal in about 15 years, but I absolutely 100% noticed a different vibe (and not in a good way). I'll be there for just a day to check out the Potter stuff before hitting Disney again for a longer trip. I'll be curious to see whether I still feel the same way.

As for the crowds and the prices... I alluded to this above, but what do we expect Disney to do?

Lower prices leads to MORE crowds. I only see two paths, though correct me if you see differently:

Option 1: Don't let people in. Sounds great, unless you're the person that doesn't get let in. Imagine the blowback if you started cutting more deeply into AP access, or telling people that they simply can't go to the parks. We already hate park passes, now imagine seeing greyed out days on the reservation calendar for months ahead.

Option 2: Raise prices. You can go if you want to, but it'll just cost more.

And you may argue that it's not just ticket prices but inflation in the price of everything. But again, what should Disney do?

Sure, prices are stupid expensive, but it's pretty simple supply and demand stuff. It's not Disney's fault, it's ours. In a free market system, things are "worth" whatever people are willing to pay for them. I don't think the prices at Disney resorts are even close to "worth it," so I don't use them. But they can charge what the market will bear, and the market is clearly bearing the current pricing. Again, the crowds suggest that prices might be too low. (Shhhh, don't tell them.)

Which is a better outcome? Raising the cost of a Disney vacation to 200% above what it is now and having parks half as full or reduce it to 50% of current prices and have it twice as full?

I mean, I'm not sure how we expect them to keep prices low AND crowds low AND have the parks accessible to us when we want them.

Sure, that's what I want. But how can I fault Disney for not delivering something that seems largely impossible?

I've been to Universal many times over the last 5 years and have never experienced the vibe that you guys claim.

As far as Disney goes, for many it's not the crowds that is the issue, it's more the cuts and the up charges that have happened. Genie+ is the worst Fast Pass system I have ever seen. I go to multiple amusement parks each year so I have experienced many fast pass systems. IMO the return time should be gotten rid of and it made more like Universal's system.

 

[Jimmy Mouse]

We just came back from a dual Universal/ Disney trip. We had the unlimited express pass at Universal and a Genie plus/ paid for ILLs at Disney. We will not be going back to Universal. Our hotel was beautiful (Royal Pacific), the express pass was great, the rides were awesome, there was minimal stress, but it was just as crowded and the crowd was…..very different than the Disney crowd. Whereas at Disney we felt like we were surrounded by super organized families/ Disney lovers/ generally kind people…Universal… let’s just say my kids learned the F word there and my 8 year old daughter came home wanting to wear fishnet stockings. And not in the cute-1983 Madonna kind of way. I almost got projectile vomited on by two drunk people. I thought the guests were a million times better at Disney IMHO and did not see any bad/ nasty behavior the entire time I was there. In fact it was the opposite. I saw strangers helping each other figure out the Genie plus system in line. The cast members were so nice (both at our hotel and in the parks). We had a great time at Disney. Universal was a one and done for us.

This is surprising. We had such a great time at Universal, we decided to purchase annual passes and after 4 long trips there, it's a must do park when we do Disney. Even during crowded times and having been to HHN, Never have we encountered rude guest or foul language besides the occasional not so bad work here and there. And the Team Members at UO have always been great! Also, be careful describing a bad word as you did. I posted the exact same phrase as you and was given points by the admin here. Even describing a bad word is against the rules.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Not to be a realist but I'm guessing they've heard language elsewhere before suddenly finding it out at a theme park. Language is also something that happens over at WDW whether you've heard it or not plenty of threads show otherwise. I remember a particular thread about a bus ride over at Disney..

Also for attire I actually see more in social media and blogs about Disney guests. Haven't you seen the posts about so and so wore an an unacceptable outfit and was made to do something about it and it being written about as a "hack" to get free merch at WDW since they do do that when you have unacceptable attire.

OMG did you ever read the threads about Food&Wine with Epcot?? Yeah....trust me drunken people don't just congregate at Universal.

Interestingly I think I saw more people imbibe at Epcot back in 2017 than I did at Universal especially in the Simpson's area with the Duff Beer stuff where I thought surely there would be a lot of people drinking. Neither area though were filled with drunkards. But there certainly are many threads about drunken guests at WDW for reals.

I just had to update this spent 3 days at Universal plus a non park day (May 4th-7) and we're on our last Disney day but it's the 7th Disney park day this trip (May 8th-14).

Soooo much more profanity and so much more booty shorts or very short rompers (wind is not friendly here and I have seen many-a butt cheeks inadvertently) and tops that barely cover at Disney and just about nothing at Universal with exception to some tops that were like ones I saw at Disney. Ordinarily I don't notice quite as much about guest attire but I did think of the poster's comparison with Universal to Disney. Disney is far worse for our trip and pretty much nothing at Universal. Also guests were really cranky at Disney and did a lot more line cutting.

 

[Davey Jones II]

I haven't been in years - going in May, hopefully - but I'd take all of the negativity with a grain of salt.

First, why do you think the parks are slammed full? That's people voting with their feet.

Second, there's a reason they call it "the good old days" - everyone remembers the past fondly. But back in the "good old days" people queued for hours to see Country Bear Jamboree (really). Now, rides and attractions are so superior to CBJ that it sits empty all day. How much of the great "new" stuff would you give up to go back? Would you axe Rise of the Resistance and Cosmic Rewind to get paper fastpass? What about all of Animal Kingdom? Sure, much has been lost over the years, but other things have been gained. There is always a push and pull, give and take, grow and contract. The parks will go through down times and up times, but all and all, the last 20 years have show stunning growth and amazing new things.

Third, as for "money grubbing," eh... hasn't it always been that way? I mean, we can complain about too much short-term thinking or prioritizing quick profits over long-term brand building, but I think you're fooling yourself if you think Disney has been anything other than a money making machine from day one.

Every effort is going to seem controversial in some way. But, in fact, there's a very good argument that Genie+ is actually consumer friendly from a pricing perspective. Think of it this way - go back to paper fastpass. Then imagine that Disney offered discounted tickets to skip the fastpass. A lot of folks would have loved that option.

This is that.

They could have just increased ticket prices across the board and made the same revenue. Arguably they should have to keep park numbers more reasonable. But the current model gives you the chance to opt in or not. Two tiers of ticket prices, one including more stuff than the other. We have tiers in hotels, food, etc. If you see my post history, you'll see that I'm 100% about keeping the "we're all in the same boat" vibe in the parks, but I don't think it's crazy (annoying, but not crazy) to offer people the chance to pick their experience with a better experience costing more.

And honestly, it'd be commercial malpractice for Disney to be absolutely overwhelmed with visitors and *not* charge more. In a way, they have to. Half of the posts on here complain about Disney costing too much and the other half about there being too many people in the parks. That some of us here are reconsidering our Disney vacations because we're getting priced out is not a bug, it's a feature. (And I say that as a person who goes roughly every 5 years and absolutely cannot afford to stay on site, even in the cheapest rooms.)

Finally, I've been on this board for 20 years (!!) and if I were to pick the single most popular theme of conversation in every one of those 20 years it has been "Disney is going to hell, the magic is gone." Not saying we can't have complaints, and perhaps I'll come back saying the same after my trip in May, but I'm cautiously optimistic that Disney is still Disney - a bit rougher on this edge, a bit nicer on this other edge - but essentially the same for-profit, money-interested, amazing spectacle creating, magic-inducing company it has always been.

I guess I'll soon find out....

Good point in this post, but I object to the comment that CBJ "sits empty all day." That is false. Whenever I've see the show, it's generally pretty full. It's not the latest high tech attraction, but it still has lots of charm.

As for queueing up for hours to see the show...say what?? I don't think that was ever the case.

 

[Figvention]

In 2023 we'll do a mini trip to the historical district of Charleston South Carolina in the spring

Complete sidetrack... get a great food tour in Charleston. The food culture is excellently diverse and will give you a World Showcase feeling.

 

[glocon]

Complete sidetrack... get a great food tour in Charleston. The food culture is excellently diverse and will give you a World Showcase feeling.

I’ve only ever done one food tour- in Nashville- and it was so fun! Would definitely want to try that elsewhere.

 

[Disney mac]

I think while things may be similar, the negative vibe is caused not by ticket price increases, but instead the nickel and dime cheap feel. People like to be on vacation and not have money on their mind the entire time, aka Sandals. Just charge it up front and let people have a sense of the "magic" of vacation is what I think people miss. Throwing extra charges every day (and multiple times a day) is what is driving this.

 

[lockets]

I think while things may be similar, the negative vibe is caused not by ticket price increases, but instead the nickel and dime cheap feel. People like to be on vacation and not have money on their mind the entire time, aka Sandals. Just charge it up front and let people have a sense of the "magic" of vacation is what I think people miss. Throwing extra charges every day (and multiple times a day) is what is driving this.

100% agree w this. Would add the nickel and dime feel on our time. And time is money! Not having certain things somewhat “set” before the trip is killing it too. It’s one thing to have to schedule things “on the fly” now with G+ and mobile orders etc but there are instances where ride spots or food order spots are sold out for the day or temporarily, and thus more chance and risk involved. Definitely I used to value Disney for it’s all inclusive vibe and time saver feel. It’s lost a lot of that.

 

[skywaywaver]

As you can see by my signature, I've been many times to WDW, even as a resident of NJ/NY. Our last trip was in August 2019, when we sold our vacation townhouse we had in Davenport. We stayed off-site in the townhouse and dreamed about early August 2020, when we would stay on-site somewhere and use up the end of our APs we had as FL landowners, then August 2021, when we would visit DLR for the first time. Then the world shut down. We finally admitted defeat in May of 2020 and lost a lot of value in those APs (I'm still bitter about it and will probably never buy an AP again unless we moved to FL, which doesn't look likely any time soon). We rebooked for August 2021...nope. We didn't feel comfortable still at that point, as my youngest wasn't able to be vaccinated yet at that time. So we rebooked tentatively for August 2022.

With the advent of Genie+, I felt done. I had finally finessed the FP+ system, even as off-site, even though I felt like I missed a lot of vacation experience by being on my phone, always searching for that next FP. I feel like it's going to be about the same now. About Christmas, I was not looking forward to going, but slowly, the excitement has been building up. We contemplated doing DLR this year but stayed with WDW, and will do DLR next summer.

Above all, my husband needs this. He works very hard and this the vacation spot he loves. I converted him into a Disney-phile and he loves going, even if he is Grumpy about paying sometimes. But my kids are also super excited - 16, 14, and 9. I bought MNSSHP tickets and the older ones are more excited than the youngest! We're asking them their opinion about which park which days, which restaurants, etc, so they really feel a part of it now.

We are doing an overnight stay at Royal Pacific for USF one day and IOA the next . We did both parks in one day a few years back...too much for one day. We want to hit it one more time while the Simpsons area is definitely there; the express passes for both days of our stay really help sweeten the deal. We like Universal, but it's definitely not Disney to us.

Next year, after DLR, my oldest will be a senior in high school. The next summer will be the one before she starts college. I don't know what vacations will hold for us after that. This is a somewhat blowout trip. If some things change financially, we will be upgrading to OKW from the ASMSuites (such opposite ends of the spectrum!), but we're going to have fun and live life, a life that has been on hold for a few years. I don't know when/if we'll all be back to WDW, so we're making the best of it this year. I'm not thrilled, but tbh, I'm always not thrilled about something lol. This year, I will embrace the fact that I seem unable to sleep in and embrace our onsite status to make 7am ILL reservations, all while listening to the excited footsteps of little ones (absolutely my favorite part of staying at a Disney resort - the sound of excitement).

Sorry so long, but TL;DR - every year's trip has had good and bad. Hopefully our joy at being back will be outweigh the bad things. I think it will be worth it for us, no matter what, to be in our happy place again.

 

[LSUmiss]

Do other theme or amusement parks do this? I feel like people have come to expect some sort of freebie when a ride breaks down which yes bites but it's part of the process. I also think that Disney didn't used to have the mentality of giving away things. I remember my 2011 trip Test Track would break down, not like we got some FP (which was legacy back then) to re-ride it later on..you just you know didn't ride it, waited it out, or came back later. Maybe some people did but I guess we just didn't expect it.

I agree but I feel like now you can experience several ride break downs in one day to the point that it just gets ridiculous.

 

[monorailrabbit]

I think while things may be similar, the negative vibe is caused not by ticket price increases, but instead the nickel and dime cheap feel. People like to be on vacation and not have money on their mind the entire time, aka Sandals. Just charge it up front and let people have a sense of the "magic" of vacation is what I think people miss. Throwing extra charges every day (and multiple times a day) is what is driving this.

This! I super miss the days when we had legacy FP, or even FP+, and our dining plan and I had spending $ ready to go on gift cards and not a single dime of "real" money was actually spent on vacation. This coming trip in October, I'm going to have to stop and think about how much can I comfortably afford to pay extra for some rides because the already up-charged Genie+ doesn't even cover them. It feels like double-dipping. I go on vacation to not worry about money and be able to put my phone away to unplug and this won't be an option for me for this vacation if we want to ride things like GOTG without waiting hours. The pay more for a specific ride is really what got me on G+. It just feels gross.

I will add - I LOVED MaxPass at DLR! It was $10 more each day (FLAT, no pay more for this specific ride), but man did I feel like it was a good bang for my buck!

 

[gharter]

We have been there 3 times in the last 18 months. For us, yes it is worth it.
It is different then what it was, as most things have changed, but we still had fun.

 

[Timandalicia]

I keep hearing so many horrible things about WDW these days and how crowded it is, and how bad the gouging is. I'll only have 3 days and I was thinking of 2 days at Epcot and 1 at Animal Kingdom... but is it even worth it anymore? Or should I just plan for Universal with Unlimited Express Lane built in?

The fact that you would consider the one as a replacement for the other demonstrates to me that you aren’t a hardcore Disneyphile. In which case, I think you’d be happier going the Universal route.

 

[Wiltony]

I keep hearing so many horrible things about WDW these days and how crowded it is, and how bad the gouging is. I'll only have 3 days and I was thinking of 2 days at Epcot and 1 at Animal Kingdom... but is it even worth it anymore?

No it's not. Just don't go. It's time to stop justifying and rationalizing reasons to go. You're on a Disney fan message board so you're obviously going to get a lot of "measured yes's" because none of us want to admit that it's kind of time to just stop going, but it is. Sorry. Time to pass on a Disney trip and spend your hard-earned vacationing dollars elsewhere for the time being. You can get so much more value elsewhere.