Johnny Depp Trial

[leeniewdw]

It is amazing how quickly people judge people that they really know nothing about. Manson was not on trial here and his on stage persona is probably much different then in personal life. Doing drugs may be illegal, but it harms only the users. Other than what he looks like what else do we know about him. I mean really know, not what we read in some gossip rag.

Obviously, none of us here know for certain, but what IS fact is that Evan Rachel Wood was very specific in her accusations about him. Other women have come forward as well. Apparently MM's former assistant has corroborated some of her claims. There's lawsuits both against and from him. So who knows how this will all shake out.

Here's a USAToday article I found: https://www.usatoday.com/story/ente...manson-drink-blood-phoenix-rising/6984690001/

I don't keep up with MM, but Wood is an actress from the area I'm from, so I'm actually more familiar with her (though I didn't realize there was a documentary about all this) She was only 18 when they became involved and he was in his 30s.

I don't think JD's friendship with him means anything about JD's actions obviously.

And I'll take exception to "drugs only harms the users". That's completely false. It can destroy relationships and can harm the family members beyond measure. It's an extremely consuming thing to deal with if you love someone who is an addict. And that's ignoring the safety issues when someone is under the influence (that's NOT a dig at JD, but it's still a fact).

 

[Mysterian]

It is amazing how quickly people judge people that they really know nothing about. Manson was not on trial here and his on stage persona is probably much different then in personal life. Doing drugs may be illegal, but it harms only the users. Other than what he looks like what else do we know about him. I mean really know, not what we read in some gossip rag.

Not completely sure that drugs only harm the users. Families of a loved one suffering substance abuse might be completely unaware of the issue or could be actively struggling to help the person towards sobriety.

In terms of strictly my own comment about Manson, what I said about him was based on interviews and TV appearances, not at all on his stage persona. I didn't touch upon the allegations, like the one where he supposedly held a glock up to his stylist's forehead.

And what's more, I seem to recall you scoffing at Robert Downey Jr as a role model because of his past substance abuse. RDJ's cleaned and redeemed, but Manson gets defended?

 

[dez1978]

Dang it guys. Thise is making me go down a rabbit hole reading about Manson. Ugh. It certainly seems like he is not a good person. But again, how much of that is what he puts on as his stage persona vs how he actually is who knows. If the allegations of abuse are true, then I'd agree he's a terrible person. But we may never know all of that. Ozzy Osbornes stage persona was pretty dark and gross, but was not that person in real life. He was a drug/alcohol abuser, and certainly did some bad things, but wasn't just a flat out bad person.

 

[leeniewdw]

Dang it guys. Thise is making me go down a rabbit hole reading about Manson. Ugh. It certainly seems like he is not a good person. But again, how much of that is what he puts on as his stage persona vs how he actually is who knows. If the allegations of abuse are true, then I'd agree he's a terrible person. But we may never know all of that. Ozzy Osbornes stage persona was pretty dark and gross, but was not that person in real life. He was a drug/alcohol abuser, and certainly did some bad things, but wasn't just a flat out bad person.

I went down the rabbit hole that I introduced, lol. I read his lawsuit. Certainly seems that Wood got involved (romantically and business wise) with a person he claims is a grifter who set out to ruin Manson. He's suing them both, but most of the language is around the other person.

All of this is just so tough to stomach. If what he claims is true, then Wood has spent most of her adult life in fraught/unhealthy relationships (no clue what her experience was with Jamie Bell).

Wood is a successful actress, so unclear what motivation to expose all this (or what she believes took place) since she's not suing him. And his suit claims she hurt his career with the allegations. Was MM still a big thing in 2021?

Anyway, just another very sad saga, whatever the details actually are.

 

[Mysterian]

Dang it guys. Thise is making me go down a rabbit hole reading about Manson. Ugh. It certainly seems like he is not a good person. But again, how much of that is what he puts on as his stage persona vs how he actually is who knows. If the allegations of abuse are true, then I'd agree he's a terrible person. But we may never know all of that. Ozzy Osbornes stage persona was pretty dark and gross, but was not that person in real life. He was a drug/alcohol abuser, and certainly did some bad things, but wasn't just a flat out bad person.

Ozzy's tame, but has definitely been misunderstood for many years ever since Black Sabbath.

Many would be surprised to see Ozzy and Sharon dressed like.... THIS:

 

[dez1978]

Ozzy's tame, but has definitely been misunderstood for many years ever since Black Sabbath.

Many would be surprised to see Ozzy and Sharon dressed like.... THIS:

Exactly. His stage persona did not match who he really was outside of that. Granted he was high or drunk a good portion of that time, but even then he wasn't violent really. But lord, to hear the way he was talked about you'd have thought he was some crazed killer lol

 

[goofyernmost]

Not completely sure that drugs only harm the users. Families of a loved one suffering substance abuse might be completely unaware of the issue or could be actively struggling to help the person towards sobriety.

In terms of strictly my own comment about Manson, what I said about him was based on interviews and TV appearances, not at all on his stage persona. I didn't touch upon the allegations, like the one where he supposedly held a glock up to his stylist's forehead.

And what's more, I seem to recall you scoffing at Robert Downey Jr as a role model because of his past substance abuse. RDJ's cleaned and redeemed, but Manson gets defended?

I did not defend Manson, I was saying the judging of Depp based on the fact that he partied with Manson is a major leap in possibly the wrong direction. I was once at a party the included two very stern looking mafia people. That did not make me a criminal. It did, however, send a chill up my spine.

I know that drug use will harm family members and I will admit that was an error. I didn't think about and excessive use will hurt others, but likely kill the user. I apologize for my indiscretion.

 

[izzy]

 

[izzy]

 

[Planogirl]

A lot of abuse happens behind closed doors and often we don't even know about it until the victim comes forward. I agree that it is a major leap to assume that somehow Johnny Depp was involved or even aware. The drug use is troubling but if anything might make someone even less aware.

 

[mefordis]

This video answers some questions I had, like can she declare bankruptcy to get out of paying Depp. (No).

 

[FlightlessDuck]

Doing drugs may be illegal, but it harms only the users.

I take it you never lived with an addict.

 

[goofyernmost]

I take it you never lived with an addict.

I addressed that later on in the thread. That said, however, I feel that regardless of intent, someone lives with an addict out of choice. In this case it seems to have been a mutual drug fest.

 

[Karin1984]

Someone lives with an addict out of choice.

If it only was that simple. Living with an addict is hard. Leaving an addict is much harder. Especially if that addict is a loved one.

 

[leeniewdw]

I addressed that later on in the thread. That said, however, I feel that regardless of intent, someone lives with an addict out of choice. In this case it seems to have been a mutual drug fest.

If it only was that simple. Living with an addict is hard. Leaving an addict is much harder. Especially if that addict is a loved one.

Exactly. And did they even consider that a loved one might be someone's child?

Depp's success with this suit it one thing, but that doesn't mean that Depp's own substance issues didn't inflict great pain on the people that cared about him. I have all the sympathy in the world because of my own experience with people who struggle with substance issues. Some have returned to health, one died with a shortened life. It's BS to just shrug it off to suggest they did drugs with mutual participants, so no harm, no foul.

 

[TLSnell1981]

Yes an addict can affect those who love and/or live with then very profoundly. Although they ultimately hurt themselves the most. Not only does Amber have substance abuse issues herself but is also an enabler. Let's throw borderline and histrionic personality disorders into the mix. Yike! Nothing but a recipe for disaster.

 

[goofyernmost]

If it only was that simple. Living with an addict is hard. Leaving an addict is much harder. Especially if that addict is a loved one.

I totally agree, but it is still a choice. Sometimes not leaving can be looked upon as enabling. I never said it was easy.

 

[Karin1984]

I totally agree, but it is still a choice. Sometimes not leaving can be looked upon as enabling. I never said it was easy.

And saying this can also be looked upon as shaming the side-victims.
I would strongly suggest, if you ever come across someone who has a loved one with an addiction in their lives: Do not say this to their face.

 

[goofyernmost]

And saying this can also be looked upon as shaming the side-victims.
I would strongly suggest, if you ever come across someone who has a loved one with an addiction in their lives: Do not say this to their face.

That's not shaming. Enabling is a common and understandable thing. It is less shaming and more facing reality. I know with a loved one it is difficult and I also understand why it happens. That, however, does not stop it from being an accurate description. This a thread about Johnny Depp and Amber Heard. That is a far cry from what you are talking about. Every situation is different. One size does not fit all.

 

[Karin1984]

Amber Heard gave an interview, to be aired this Friday. One of her arguments why she lost is because Johnny Depp is a good actor. I can't help, but I it read as:. "He is a better actor than me."

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/...r-trial-against-Johnny-Depp-social-media.html