Lack of crowds and Disney's response

[BadPinkTink]

Look guys you are not getting it, Batuu timeline is when Yoda, Darth Vardar, Luke Skywalker, Princess Leia ate all DEAD. Therefore not now or in the future will there be anything connected to the original train logy as it won't make sense in the timeline.

If you want all that stay in Tomorrow Land. If you want kid friendly stay in Tomorrow Land.

The Disney families think it's all about them and everything in the parks should be for them . So many up to now have had nothing to connect with in Disney Land and now a huge forgotten group of people finally have found their place in the parks.

Like I said 1 person in Batuu is most likely spending as much , if not more as 2 parent 2 kid family in Fantasy Land or Tomorrow Land

 

[azdisneylover]

Look guys you are not getting it, Batuu timeline is when Yoda, Darth Vardar, Luke Skywalker, Princess Leia ate all DEAD. Therefore not now or in the future will there be anything connected to the original train logy as it won't make sense in the timeline.

If you want all that stay in Tomorrow Land. If you want kid friendly stay in Tomorrow Land.

The Disney families think it's all about them and everything in the parks should be for them . So many up to now have had nothing to connect with in Disney Land and now a huge forgotten group of people finally have found their place in the parks.

Like I said 1 person in Batuu is most likely spending as much , if not more as 2 parent 2 kid family in Fantasy Land or Tomorrow Land

Dead, but not forgotten. There could be nods put in, especially at the restaurant to the original cast. They could even do it as "hidden Mickey" type nods sprinkled around the whole land.

 

[SoloDWGuy]

I agree with the "crowd perception" perspectives. I too know many who swore off the parks both DCA and WDW until 2021. I think many thought new land + summer = pandemonium! And for those non-locals who have to plan their Disney trips far in advance, I would suspect many opted to skip this summer.

There is one thing that stands out to me, one that I was concerned about from the beginning. MF:SR is an attraction that you have to control. Unlike many other attractions where you get to sit back and enjoy the ride, this one you have to participate. Yes, there is an auto pilot function, but still, this is a different experience for many park goers. Now, the ride does look amazing and I cannot wait until I can try it when it opens at WDW. But couple that with being the only ride in the land, and it may be impacting the overall interest in SW:GE. I may be way off, but this type of attraction experience may take a while for people to adjust to. There is a reason why attractions like Pirates, Haunted Mansion or Jeez, even A Small World are such fan favorites; all of the magic, none of the work - just enjoy the ride. I suspect things will change once ROTR opens which will compliment MF:SR, and balance out the attractions in the park.

 

[BadPinkTink]

Dead, but not forgotten. There could be nods put in, especially at the restaurant to the original cast. They could even do it as "hidden Mickey" type nods sprinkled around the whole land.

There actually is but they are subtle and probably go over the heads of the Disney families looking for a meet and greet with Luke Skywalker!

They sell Jedi robes, you can sit and take photos of the chess board, there is a hanging marionette of Luke fighting Darth Vader, I saw an Ewok on a shelf, there is a pod racer being used as a barbeque and that's just the things I saw WITHOUT using Disney Play App.

People think the Disney core values of being a place for everyone to enjoy means kid friendly, when in fact many people didn't connect to the kid friendly narrative and either didn't visit or did visit but didn't spend money. Now those people ARE connecting to the Disney brand and guess what, they have the disposal income to hang out in a bar or buy high priced merchandise and they will eat food that's just a bit more adventurous than Mac and cheese or fried chicken or hot dogs

 

[Spaceguy55]

Look guys you are not getting it, Batuu timeline is when Yoda, Darth Vardar, Luke Skywalker, Princess Leia ate all DEAD. Therefore not now or in the future will there be anything connected to the original train logy as it won't make sense in the timeline.

If you want all that stay in Tomorrow Land. If you want kid friendly stay in Tomorrow Land.

The Disney families think it's all about them and everything in the parks should be for them . So many up to now have had nothing to connect with in Disney Land and now a huge forgotten group of people finally have found their place in the parks.

Like I said 1 person in Batuu is most likely spending as much , if not more as 2 parent 2 kid family in Fantasy Land or Tomorrow Land

That is where they want to go but why have Rey there ?
She doesn't fit in the time line unless she doesn't age ...which hasn't been her story so far.
Same thing for Kylo..as far as what we know they are mortal.
And Luke is still alive at the same time as Rey and Kylo..so the time line is a bit off for SWGE.

 

[EmJ]

There actually is but they are subtle and probably go over the heads of the Disney families looking for a meet and greet with Luke Skywalker!

They sell Jedi robes, you can sit and take photos of the chess board, there is a hanging marionette of Luke fighting Darth Vader, I saw an Ewok on a shelf, there is a pod racer being used as a barbeque and that's just the things I saw WITHOUT using Disney Play App.

People think the Disney core values of being a place for everyone to enjoy means kid friendly, when in fact many people didn't connect to the kid friendly narrative and either didn't visit or did visit but didn't spend money. Now those people ARE connecting to the Disney brand and guess what, they have the disposal income to hang out in a bar or buy high priced merchandise and they will eat food that's just a bit more adventurous than Mac and cheese or fried chicken or hot dogs

Are those forgotten would-be patrons really coming though? It seems not, since the park is as empty as it’s ever been this time of year. Instead, it just looks like AP holders are NOT coming (because they can’t). Those same AP holders presumable do connect with the balance of kid-friendly Disneyland since they like enough to come multiple times per year. Maybe the all-adult, money-to-burn crowd really was Disney’s target, but if so, they did not show up in numbers great enough to balance the loss of “regular” Disney fans.

 

[lcp9]

huge forgotten group of people finally have found their place in the parks.

...based on numbers I wouldn't call it a "huge forgotten group of people." And the pricey merchandise is likely a one time purchase. You're still talking about 1-2 people in a party buying tickets ($350?) versus the family with 4 kids mentioned above ($1050?) This was not intentional on disney's part.

 

[LizzyS]

This is what I was thinking for awhile. I saw the first movie when it came out but none of the others till last December. The 2 others in the first trilogy were close to being like the first with the right amount of humor. I then thought of why did they kill off Hans Solo, then it occurred to me that he was associated with Indiana Jones so they needed him out so they could move forward with more IP from that.
As far as the new characters , none are as admired as the originals, and that's where I believe is where most fans have been born. Maybe Rey but she's not even close to Princess Leia for us older fans.
How can you be a fan of Kylo when he killed his father, at least Darth didn't kill any of the originals even tho he tried. They should be part of the land , can you imagine a character meet and greet with them "not really them but look a likes" or something, but it would be hard since they have committed to the land as it is now.
I've heard there's room for something else at DHS to the left of ROTR..how about an area that honors the original trilogy, that would get people really excited.
The first 3 movies are what started the fandom so it was decided to make more but they just don't have the draw as the first ones as far as emotional connection, maybe they make more money but that's not going to make people super fans. Plus they are a lot darker than the originals which is what I think makes the first trilogy more loved...just my 2 cents...

I assure you that Kylo Ren/Ben Solo has many fans, myself included. I'm not gonna get going on this topic here or it will reach novella proportions, but Star Wars is about love and redemption.

 

[LizzyS]

This is what I was thinking for awhile. I saw the first movie when it came out but none of the others till last December. The 2 others in the first trilogy were close to being like the first with the right amount of humor. I then thought of why did they kill off Hans Solo, then it occurred to me that he was associated with Indiana Jones so they needed him out so they could move forward with more IP from that.
As far as the new characters , none are as admired as the originals, and that's where I believe is where most fans have been born. Maybe Rey but she's not even close to Princess Leia for us older fans.
How can you be a fan of Kylo when he killed his father, at least Darth didn't kill any of the originals even tho he tried. They should be part of the land , can you imagine a character meet and greet with them "not really them but look a likes" or something, but it would be hard since they have committed to the land as it is now.
I've heard there's room for something else at DHS to the left of ROTR..how about an area that honors the original trilogy, that would get people really excited.
The first 3 movies are what started the fandom so it was decided to make more but they just don't have the draw as the first ones as far as emotional connection, maybe they make more money but that's not going to make people super fans. Plus they are a lot darker than the originals which is what I think makes the first trilogy more loved...just my 2 cents...

Also, holy cow, who killed Obi Wan, again?

 

[Spaceguy55]

The answer is to make a holographic land..after all that's how the whole story started..Princess Leia and R2D2.
The one thing I noticed in the live streams and vlogs was the very small numbers of small children.
Disney needs families that are influenced by what their kids like and are willing to spend what it takes to make it happen.
Kids like Toy Story and stuff like that, the dark side is not kid friendly.
I don't think ROTR will make a meaningful difference for famlies with young kids.

 

[JenM]

This is what I was thinking for awhile. I saw the first movie when it came out but none of the others till last December. The 2 others in the first trilogy were close to being like the first with the right amount of humor. I then thought of why did they kill off Hans Solo, then it occurred to me that he was associated with Indiana Jones so they needed him out so they could move forward with more IP from that.
As far as the new characters , none are as admired as the originals, and that's where I believe is where most fans have been born. Maybe Rey but she's not even close to Princess Leia for us older fans.
How can you be a fan of Kylo when he killed his father, at least Darth didn't kill any of the originals even tho he tried. They should be part of the land , can you imagine a character meet and greet with them "not really them but look a likes" or something, but it would be hard since they have committed to the land as it is now.
I've heard there's room for something else at DHS to the left of ROTR..how about an area that honors the original trilogy, that would get people really excited.
The first 3 movies are what started the fandom so it was decided to make more but they just don't have the draw as the first ones as far as emotional connection, maybe they make more money but that's not going to make people super fans. Plus they are a lot darker than the originals which is what I think makes the first trilogy more loved...just my 2 cents...

I just turned 45, I saw the original movies in the theaters at 3, 6, and 9 years old...and I adore Rey. I love the new movies, and I love the new characters. I always say that whenever you became a fan was the right time to become a fan. I try not to pull rank just because I'm old enough to have been there through the whole thing (and I know a bunch of fans who can run circles on me when it comes to the books and animated series, which I don't follow as closely).

Han Solo was killed off because Harrison Ford has wanted a death scene for Han ever since Return of the Jedi. I think it has less to do with Indiana Jones (he was making those movies at the same time as the original Star Wars movies back in the day)....then I think he was happy to finally have that death scene he always wanted.

Darth Vader killed Obi-Wan Kenobi, maimed Luke Skywalker, tortured Han Solo, and forced Princess Leia to watch the destruction of her home planet. There's no 'at least' with him. Being a fan of Kylo is no different than being a fan of Darth Vader.

I think Kylo is a great character (and Adam Driver's performance is incredible), and I still think there may be a path for redemption for him yet...or he could credibly still stay a villain. Can't wait to find out in December.

Look guys you are not getting it, Batuu timeline is when Yoda, Darth Vardar, Luke Skywalker, Princess Leia ate all DEAD. Therefore not now or in the future will there be anything connected to the original train logy as it won't make sense in the timeline.

Ahem. To quote a certain Jedi: "No one's ever really gone..."

I don't get to go to Galaxy's Edge/DL until October, but I've been watching these threads to get an idea of what madness might be awaiting in the fall. The park looks amazing, but if people are missing the original characters and the crowds are underwhelming, I don't see why they can't incorporate more of the original trilogy to mix in with what's there.

 

[az4boys]

And from what I saw yesterday, your family of 4 who just are interested in seeing something new are NOT the target market for SWGE. It's not as kid friendly either the prices of food and merchandise or the experiences, or the characters as Fantasy Land or Tomorrow Land. I saw many typical Disney families not having a good time, bored kids, no merchandise bags, kids not liking the food, adults getting frustrated by the citizens of Batuu not knowing anything off land etc etc. However I did see many couples with no kids, older teens and twenty something's, not the typical Disney people, STGE Disney Bounding, with the Savi light sabers, dropping approx $50 each in the Cantina and buying Jedi robes, and tons of other merchandise. There was even a line most of the afternoon for the main shop!

Exactly. I haven't been yet, but IF we did a lightsaber, it would only be ONE and DH would get to build it. I would want to go with him but I have no idea what my kids would do while we go off building a lightsaber for a couple hours. They range in age between 10-16 and I'm comfortable with them going off together, I'm just not sure they would would want to stay in the land even though they all like Star Wars. The food does not sound good for them and we don't typically spend a lot of money in stores.

 

[gottalovepluto]

Look guys you are not getting it, Batuu timeline is when Yoda, Darth Vardar, Luke Skywalker, Princess Leia ate all DEAD. Therefore not now or in the future will there be anything connected to the original train logy as it won't make sense in the timeline....Like I said 1 person in Batuu is most likely spending as much , if not more as 2 parent 2 kid family in Fantasy Land or Tomorrow Land

That 1 big spender in Batuu is a one and done. That family will spend just as much over the course of the next few days. And then they’ll double it when they come back in a couple years.

“Look you guys are not getting it...” omg YES. I don’t get it, I don’t care to get it, I see the new movies when they come out but I don’t think about them, I know what I know of the old ones from being a kid because I’ve watched them repeatedly through life and I really just want Marvel Land to open already. I also don’t “get” Pandora. I never saw Avatar and don’t have much interest in seeing it. But I like the land! I’ll visit every chance I get because it’s jaw dropingly beautiful and FOP is THE BOMB. Enjoyment of a land shouldn’t be linked to “getting it”.

If Disney hadn’t goofed so bad with ROTR this would probably work because we’d all be distracted talking about how the ride blew our minds and the ride would get us to engage with the next generation of SW. But Disney didn’t so here we are wondering what bandaid they’ll stick on their parks next to fix their summer crowd problem.

 

[az4boys]

FWIW - I don't have a problem that they built a land that appears targeted toward adults (mostly men) who have money to spend. We don't expect to enjoy every part of DL and DCA. However, I think Disney has a problem that they spent so much $$$$$$$$ on it and the opening of this new land has tanked overall attendance. I really wish we could go right now because of the low attendance. If they offer some sort of ticket special not related to knowing an AP holder then we just might. We still probably wouldn't spend much time in SWGE though. DH is a lifelong Star Wars fan and it has rubbed off on our four boys, but there is only so much of wandering around in the land that they would enjoy. The rest of it (except for trying the ride) doesn't seem super family friendly. That is Disney's problem, not mine.

 

[BigCheese]

the opening of this new land has tanked overall attendance.

I don't disagree with your post, but I think 'tanked' is a bit of an exaggeration. M-Th last week was extremely light. Friday-Sunday the parks were busy. But yes, as a whole, attendance is most definitely well below Disney's projections and below average attendance values for this time of year in the past. But tanked? That's hyperbole.

If Disney hadn’t goofed so bad with ROTR this would probably work because we’d all be distracted talking about how the ride blew our minds and the ride would get us to engage with the next generation of SW. But Disney didn’t so here we are wondering what bandaid they’ll stick on their parks next to fix their summer crowd problem.

This 100%. Disney Imagineering blew it on ROTR and TPTB wanted to open GE 'early' in order to start earning revenue from their new land as soon as possible. For the most part, I think they are in the short term because of the early revenue on their high margin products (Oga's, Savi's, Droid Depot, Dok's), due to the 'newness' of the land, but, they also overplayed their hand in the long run. No offense to Deluxe AP holders, but I personally love that they're blocked right now. However, I believe Deluxe makes up the largest share of APs at DLR, and I think the third week of July is going to tell the tale and we could see the Deluxe AP's potentially get unblocked before August. But the bigger issue has always been pricing and value in the grand scheme of things. That's the problem. I think they've reached a breaking point and even if the flex pass gets Disney a ton of new AP holders, it won't make up for the amount of time Deluxe holders are in the parks relative to the price increases that this tier in particular has endured over the past few years. You can only take away so much before you reach a breaking point, and when they took away parking and nearly doubled the price of Deluxe APs between 2015 and today, you can't blame people for not renewing.

On a side note I personally feel FOP and Pandora as a whole are overrated and when we're at WDW we visit that land once for maybe a couple of hours and don't spend money there, but, I can appreciate Pandora as a well themed and beautiful land, and it is impressive for what it is.

All that said, I want to bring up an issue that I haven't seen on these boards (which I personally and fully believe contributes to lower crowds) and that's the 'minimal' offerings Disney currently has for the Lion King. I know, they have the Tale of the Lion King (a lovely and well produced show, but difficult to last through in an area with zero shade), and a small merchandise booth as well as the AP corner, but this is the 25th anniversary of what many still believe is the pinnacle of the Disney Renaissance. Plus, they're releasing their "live action" adaptation this year. Crowds would be flooding DLR if they had a lot more offerings. Character meet & greets? Some special food offerings? More merchandise celebrating its 25th anniversary? Sneak preview? C'mon Disney. Yeah, it probably wouldn't shift the balance of the crowds, but I needed to rant about TLK somewhere.

 

[poptart90]

I think for Hans Solo it was a request of the actor kill him off. I do not know about Luke, but it was an interesting character arc. Now what are they going to do with Leia is the question.

So reportedly, Mark Hamill said, “Are you kidding me??” exiting the premier of The Last Jedi. He was quickly shushed up...got a Star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame...then got on board to promote the “new” story line. Who knows? I just remember the drama following the release of The Last Jedi and the general disappointment with the whole movie. Was it the same as ESB?? I say no. Did Darth Vader milk an alien for sustenance? Did Darth Vader act like an old curmudgeon? Yoda did, but there was theatrics in the delivery...when he lifted the X-wing and spoke to Obi-wan everyone felt like a jack-***!! Right?? Where was that moment with Luke? To me, they tore apart all that was special about the Skywalkers. Maybe the plan all along? If no one is special, then everyone is...right, broom boy?

Hope I’m wrong and have to eat every word. Truly. I am actually betting on JJ...don’t let me down, dude. Redeem Luke...please.

And for SWGE, that’s what’s missing for me. If it’s “somewhere in the future after the Skywalker Sagas”... then perhaps Disney should’ve waited until the land was fully complete with more than one ride and we knew what the bleep was going on? As in after IX??

Maybe not such a soft opening then? Just sayin.

Ok. Flame away!!

 

[az4boys]

I don't disagree with your post, but I think 'tanked' is a bit of an exaggeration. M-Th last week was extremely light. Friday-Sunday the parks were busy. But yes, as a whole, attendance is most definitely well below Disney's projections and below average attendance values for this time of year in the past. But tanked? That's hyperbole.

"tanked" is pretty subjective - to me if attendance is well below Disney's projections that means it tanked. I've seen pictures of Fantasyland lines completely empty after park opening, including Dumbo. People are riding Peter Pan multiple times with 15 min waits. Whatever you want to call it, Disney has a problem.

 

[GoldeneyezCA]

I have to respectfully disagree with the assessment that SWGE is meant for middle-aged men. That's the kind of thinking that left Rey out of Star Tours and the early The Force Awakens merch. I am proud nerd raised in the 80's who saw ESB in the movie theater with my family and grew-up watching Sci-Fi and Fantasy. I love Disney, travel and the arts, but I also attend San Diego Comic Con. I'm raising two well-rounded female nerds who, at the ripe ages of 6 and 10, love Darth Vader and Harry Potter, respectively, and were willing to get up at 5:15 am twice to make 8 am reservations for SWGE. SWGE is for us, too!

I loved SWGE, and my girls loved their Savi's lightsaber experiences, but I do think that a 14-acre land dedicated to Star Wars should have more family-friendly offerings that don't cost $100+. Not everyone can afford the prices in SWGE, and they shouldn't have to fork over that much money to enjoy the land with their families. (I mean, you can buy 4 wands at WWOHP for the cost of one lightsaber!) I wrote DL guest services last night asking for them to reinstate Jedi Training, or some kind of interactive show, for the land. Because at this point, WDW is winning for the family-friendly Star Wars destination, between SWGE, Jedi Training, the Star Wars Galactic Spectacular Dessert Party (which was my then 4 yo's favorite thing at WDW in 2017), and the upcoming hotel. I remain loyal to DL, but I do think there is room for improvement at SWGE apart from the opening of ROTR.

 

[BigCheese]

"tanked" is pretty subjective - to me if attendance is well below Disney's projections that means it tanked. I've seen pictures of Fantasyland lines completely empty after park opening, including Dumbo. People are riding Peter Pan multiple times with 15 min waits. Whatever you want to call it, Disney has a problem.

Subjective, yes. But by that definition Toy Story 4 tanked at the US box office in its opening weekend because it earned $20M below Disney’s official projection despite having one of the biggest domestic openings in history for an animated film. We were at DLR four days last week and opening is light everywhere in all parts of the park because everyone heads to GE at 8:00 and artificially inflates the MFSR wait time unnecessarily. Things leveled off eventually throughout the park and no one is saying attendance hasn’t been lower on average. But until Disney releases their quarterly earnings for their theme parks division, in all fairness they should be allowed time to solve the issue. They spent a lot of money on SWGE but shouldn’t be judged after just one week of being open to the general public. Their problem will be if at the end of the quarter their revenues are down and haven’t made the proper adjustments yet.

 

[Mamabun]

I think the third week of July is going to tell the tale

Curious, what is special about the 3rd week of July, vs the first two weeks of July, say?