Manners?

[Olaf]

What is about WDW that brings out the worst in people and children? I've never seen so many rude people in one place at one time. From grabbing chairs with towels, to line cutting, to yelling in the hallways (BCV), etc. It's hard to keep your own child in line when everyone else is acting like monkeys. I'm not a saint, but I do try and be considerate of other people's feelings and space. Maybe it's just worse when it's hot and crowded.

 

[JerJan]

No...It's not just you....Every time I go somewhere with my family, I am always so proud of my DDs 5 & 13. They always act like ladies in a sea of animals!

 

[BostonDisneyKid]

Must be those BCV peolpe - they are a rowdy bunch!

 

[JimMIA]

What is about WDW that brings out the worst in people and children? I've never seen so many rude people in one place at one time. From grabbing chairs with towels, to line cutting, to yelling in the hallways (BCV), etc. It's hard to keep your own child in line when everyone else is acting like monkeys. I'm not a saint, but I do try and be considerate of other people's feelings and space. Maybe it's just worse when it's hot and crowded.

You might want to go to this thread http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=829216
and then reconsider the "...grabbing chairs with towels" issue.

To quote the current issue of Member's Clubhouse:

"As a reminder, pool areas have a limited number of chairs and therefore can't be reserved for future use. Out of consideration for others, please refrain from leaving towels or personal items on pool chairs when not in use.

"We want as many Members and Guests as possible to be able to enjoy our pool areas," said Disney Vacation Club Resorts General Manager Sonya Deese-Byrnes. "Having all unoccupied pool chairs available for the immediate enjoyment of others is a huge help."

I certainly agree with you about line-cutting and excessive noise, but pool lounges are everyone's shared space...not our space.

 

[Tink10]

Olaf, I agree with you 100%

I think the mindset of these people is "I paid for this vacation & I'll do what I want".....It's sickening.

We used to let these people upset us, but now my DD & I have made a game out of it instead of being bothered.

Not to sound terribly mean, but it's sort of like a "Count the Jerk" game.....we always end up laughing and many times, the "jerk" hears us laughing at them and they really don't like it.....

 

[rocketriter]

I'm not sure that WDW bring out this behavior in people. I suspect that for certain families, the behavior is already there. They simply pack it and bring it with them.

 

[tjkraz]

When you consider that there could easily be in excess of 200,000 people visiting WDW in a single day, and the volume of people to which I am personally exposed, I'd say the number of problems I personally witness is not unreasonable. I also try to allow for the fact that I may be seeing things out of context. That "line cutter" may be a parent and child who had a "bathroom emergency" while waiting in a 30 min line. I hope we can all agree that an entire family shouldn't have to remove themselves from the line because a 5 year old misjudged his/her bladder.

The one problem that tends to stand out to me most is the jockeying for position at parade time. I've seen total strangers get into shouting matches because you just can't squeeze in one more stroller and family 5 min before the parade starts. Sadly, some people just don't understand how soon you need to line-up for the parade, and then go over the line in trying to rectify that error in judgement.

But in regard to general bad behavior, the reality is I can't raise someone else's children (or their parents, for that matter.)

 

[Granny]

I'm not sure that WDW bring out this behavior in people. I suspect that for certain families, the behavior is already there. They simply pack it and bring it with them.

Agreed. I can't say that I see worse behavior at WDW than I see at any local park, shopping mall or restaurant.

I do think that maybe some people have a "I paid huge bucks for this so nobody's going to tell me what to do" mentality. And that includes policing their kids.

For what it's worth, I don't think that there's EVER been a generation of adults who didn't think that the behavior of the younger generation at that time was much worse than their own behavior at a young age.

It's not surprising that many people these days seem to spell manners as

M - A - N - N - E - R - S.

 

[grimgrinnin]

I certainly agree with you about line-cutting and excessive noise, but pool lounges are everyone's shared space...not our space.

I think you've got it backwards. The OP was referring to people 'reserving' chairs with towels, not removing someone elses towel (which is what I first thought as well).


grim

 

[lllovell]

We just got back from a rainy then very hot weekend and I can tell you that the summer months seem to REALLY bring out the worst in people. I suspect its a combination of the heat with the long lines and short tempers that really get things going. I heard one dad tell his 7ish son that he was a pain in the a _ _. We heard countless parents YELLING at their children for what appeared to us to be small infractions. HOWEVER, the boys really got to me a couple of times during the trip too, pushing and tugging on each other, jockeying lap space, in general not listening (nothing really bad - they are actually VERY well behaved), so there might have been a time or two when I said something a bit more harshly than I should, so I just hope when I see or hear things going on around me that the parents calm down, realize they didn't really mean to be so harsh and give the kids a genuine "sorry". That is how it works for us. I am not perfect and get hot and tired just like the boys, and by saying sorry, they know that everyone makes mistakes or gets too upset at times.

It all comes down to making your own magic. Too many people think it is bought and paid for when they plop down that credit card only to find out that they are just as unhappy at WDW as at home. I feel sorry for them and move on.

(On an occasion or two, I have actually tried to distract the parents if I felt like things were truly getting out of control. A little "boy, its really tiring for them in this heat isn't it?" comment will sometimes get them talking and calm things down. One day I will get my "just reward" for it, but if I am truly worried about the wellbeing of a child, then I guess its worth it.)

 

[jarestel]

I don't think WDW brings this behavior out in people, but crowds and heat certainly contribute to it if someone is predisposed to act selfishly. We've all been stuck in traffic jams on the highway and noticed the drivers who drive down the breakdown lanes to get nowhere fast. Or the people with the 20 items in the 10 or less express aisle at the market. Anyone who's ever attended a sporting event knows that it only takes one or 2 loud, obnoxious fans to spoil the event for hundreds of fans within earshot of the buffoons.

Unfortunately, there will always be people anywhere who are only interested in what they want and the heck with everyone else. We try not to let them affect our good time. And besides, we meet many more nice folks at WDW than we do jerks.

 

[JimMIA]

I think you've got it backwards. The OP was referring to people 'reserving' chairs with towels, not removing someone elses towel (which is what I first thought as well).


grim

Now that I go back and re-read it, I think you're probably right. Ooops, sorry.

Probably won't be the only thing I get backwards today, unfortunately!

 

[Plus4206]

i overheard a conversation a couple years ago between to older gentlemen that pretty much sums up my opinion of todays situation with children & parenting: He was telling how he notices when people make a comments like " Oh Jonnie is such a well behaved little boy..... " because years ago this behavior was just the norm. Back then you heard comments like " That Jonnie is such a brat....". The point he was making is that today a child that is a pleasure to be around is such an annomally that people take notice of it.

Very sad. And while it may be the child that is causing my irratation, I know the blame lays directly on the shoulders of the parents.

 

[tjkraz]

i overheard a conversation a couple years ago between to older gentlemen that pretty much sums up my opinion of todays situation with children & parenting: He was telling how he notices when people make a comments like " Oh Jonnie is such a well behaved little boy..... " because years ago this behavior was just the norm. Back then you heard comments like " That Jonnie is such a brat....". The point he was making is that today a child that is a pleasure to be around is such an annomally that people take notice of it.

Very sad.

Part of the reason may be that children weren't permitted to be noticed years ago. My wife (who is in her mid-30s) still likes to tell the story about the aunt she dreaded having to visit. She and her two older brothers were told to stay in one corner of one room and go no further, and they were given empty toilet paper rolls to play with for the duration of the stay. They had to ask permission to use the bathroom, and expected to return to their "play corner" PROMPTLY.

The manner in which children were treated years ago often crossed the line into child abuse by today's standards. If you think slapping knuckles with rulers and otherwise ruling by fear would be a step in the right direction, then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

And while it may be the child that is causing my irratation, I know the blame lays directly on the shoulders of the parents.

Sounds like the naive POV I used to maintain before having children of my own.

Sorry, but no matter the quality of the parenting skills, kids have a way of being...kids!!! That means they occasionally throw temper tantrums when they don't get their way...they won't always eat the dinner placed in front of them...and they don't mind voicing their opinions on a particular topic, even when not asked.

No amount of parenting can turn a 4 year old into a mini-adult.

I, for one, certainly hope that the hundreds of parents surrounding me at WDW don't presume to judge my parenting skills just because they happen to witness the one "meltdown" my child may have during a trip. When I see other children doing that, my response is usually to grin and walk away, silently thankful that it's not my child THIS time.

 

[Plus4206]

Personally, I doubt the story your DW tells is typical of child upbringing 30 years ago. I was a teenager back then and I definitely wasn't treated that way when we were in someone elses home. We were however instructed during the car ride there that we'd better mind our P&Q's ( although I never did find out what P and Q actually stood for ).

***"Sounds like the naive POV I used to maintain before having children of my own.

Sorry, but no matter the quality of the parenting skills, kids have a way of being...kids!!! That means they occasionally throw temper tantrums when they don't get their way...they won't always eat the dinner placed in front of them...and they don't mind voicing their opinions on a particular topic, even when not asked." ***

But in this thread we're not talking about the "occasionally" child that is properly raised and disciplined by two attentive parents. We're talking about the child that's still screaming and whining an hour after he didn't get his 3rd ice cream cone. Or the kid that's climbing all over the furniture or tearing up a flower bed while mom & dad just look away as if nothing is wrong. Or the one that's hitting mom or dad in the face during their temper tantrums. Those are the kids that people are rolling their eyes at but it's the parents who deserve the stares.

 

[dianeschlicht]

(snip)But in this thread we're not talking about the "occasionally" child that is properly raised and disciplined by two attentive parents. We're talking about the child that's still screaming and whining an hour after he didn't get his 3rd ice cream cone. Or the kid that's climbing all over the furniture or tearing up a flower bed while mom & dad just look away as if nothing is wrong. Or the one that's hitting mom or dad in the face during their temper tantrums. Those are the kids that people are rolling their eyes at but it's the parents who deserve the stares.

I totally agree. I have no problem with kids being kids. It's the bad parents that obviously encourage bad behaviour that troubles me. I am likely to offer a small child the opportunity to sit or stand in front of my front of the parade spot, if they are behaving and so are the parents. I'll defend my spot if those same parents and children think they are "entitled" to it at the last minute.

 

[Simba's Mom]

I don't know if this is true, but this is my theory. For many people, a trip to WDW is very costly so they feel that all that money they spent has bought them superiority, an "I deserve everything MY way" attitude. Unfortunately, if this is a contributing factor to all the rudeness (the "I deserve everything MY way now" attitude) is going to increase as Disney prices become increasingly higher and a greater strain on the average family. I hope I'm wrong-I hate the rudeness!

 

[dianeschlicht]

I don't know if this is true, but this is my theory. For many people, a trip to WDW is very costly so they feel that all that money they spent has bought them superiority, an "I deserve everything MY way" attitude. Unfortunately, if this is a contributing factor to all the rudeness (the "I deserve everything MY way now" attitude) is going to increase as Disney prices become increasingly higher and a greater strain on the average family. I hope I'm wrong-I hate the rudeness!

Interesting theory. Either that, or it will improve because there will be fewer families with children who can afford to do Disney.

 

[wtpclc]

I don't know if this is true, but this is my theory. For many people, a trip to WDW is very costly so they feel that all that money they spent has bought them superiority, an "I deserve everything MY way" attitude. Unfortunately, if this is a contributing factor to all the rudeness (the "I deserve everything MY way now" attitude) is going to increase as Disney prices become increasingly higher and a greater strain on the average family. I hope I'm wrong-I hate the rudeness!

That goes along with what I overheard on a bus one night. A little boy (6or7?) was on a bus around 7 or 8 at night. He very quitely said "I'm tired." The day replied very harshly, "For a $100 a day, you better not be tired!" Way to spread that Disney magic.

I know sometimes kids have a meltdown. Those of you who worry that you are being judged when it happens likely have nothing to worry about. It's the ones that Plus4206 has a good description of the kids that could use some additional parent time.

As to only seeing the kids with more money, I think that will make it worse. Many times, those are the children who's parents have very time-consuming job and just bribe the children with gifts to make up the lack of time they spend with them. That is SOO sad. Not saying all families with money are like this. Unfortunately, the bad ones really stick out.

 

[tjkraz]

We're talking about the child that's still screaming and whining an hour after he didn't get his 3rd ice cream cone. Or the kid that's climbing all over the furniture or tearing up a flower bed while mom & dad just look away as if nothing is wrong. Or the one that's hitting mom or dad in the face during their temper tantrums. Those are the kids that people are rolling their eyes at but it's the parents who deserve the stares.

I don't disagree, but realistically how often does one have time during a WDW visit to put the behaviour in context? Are you following that family around for an hour to see if junior is still crying for the ice cream cone?

For what it's worth, 99% of the time when I see something that appears to be totally offensive, I choose to assume that there is more to the situation than what I am seeing. Can I think of experiences similar to what you describe? Yeah. I quickly came up with one memory from a past trip that was pretty indefensible. But unless you're seeing a lot more of the furniture climbing and flower bed destruction than I am, I don't necessarily agree that there's enough ammo for broad social commentary. There were bad apples 30 years ago and there are bad apples today.

My $.02...