Queen Elizabeth funeral and looking forward

[mom2rtk]

I love them both.

So you've said.

I love Harry and Meghan

I still love Harry and Meghan

 

[TippyThomas]

So you've said.

The comment ended with a statement that they are no longer liked. I just don't agree so I figured I'd mention it once again. Thanks for noticing.

 

[mamamia2005]

Here in the UK in my circle of family, friends, work colleagues etc they are either really really disliked or people have no opinion on them either way (much like they have no opinion on other members of the royal family). I haven't yet spoken to anyone about them who says like them, or respect them, or respect the decisions they have made.

 

[Skywalker]

I only just now realized that "Tipsy Traveller" and "Tippy Thomas" are two different posters. I

 

[TipsyTraveler]

I think the odds are practically nil that Harry was completely content with royal life up until the marriage and kid came along and then when things got rough he thought for the very first time ever “I could leave” and quickly acted on it. I would speculate that he’s had complicated feelings about being part of the monarchy for most of his life. I’m sure his feelings ebbed and flowed throughout the years and there were probably times where things were going well and he was feeling recommitted to it, but the root of the problem (from wherever his dislike of it stems) was always there just below the surface and the thought of walking away from it was always growing like a seed in his mind.

I’ve always viewed the “difficulties Meghan endured” part of it to be the final straw for him, not the whole reason for leaving. Plus, at that point he had a kid and having a child will light a fire under you to act on things that you might have let slide in the past. Because now the media scrutiny and the royal expectations and the invasions of privacy and the safety aspect are no longer hypothetical concepts about the theoretical child you might have one day — they are real, present-day threats to the actual child you do have, know, and love.

I have a (far more mundane) example from my own life. My husband and I never really liked the area we lived in. We moved in with the idea that we were there to build equity for a few years and then move on. The problem is, we never really figured out where we were going to move on to, and we ended up staying in our “5-year starter house” three times longer than we intended. We’d had many, many conversations over the years about relocating, but since we couldn’t figure out where to go and there was no pressing reason to uproot our lives, we didn’t. Until there was a pressing reason. Our first child was almost two and suddenly we couldn’t turn a blind eye to all the things we disliked. That high crime area is where our kid would be growing up. Dumpy playgrounds with broken glass is where he would be making childhood memories. He would be attending failing schools. We got real serious real fast, we made a decision where to go, and we moved four months later. To someone on the outside, it may have looked like we made a rash decision to up and leave. But if it looked that way, it was only because you hadn’t been part of the conversation that had been ongoing for years. I’d bet it was a similar situation with Harry — the idea had been quietly brewing for a long time.

 

[TipsyTraveler]

I only just now realized that "Tipsy Traveller" and "Tippy Thomas" are two different posters. I

Ugh, it drives me crazy. I get confused by it, too!

 

[Marrila]

Ugh, it drives me crazy. I get confused by it, too!

Add me to the confused. I've made a mental note there are two tipler posters.

 

[MrsPete]

Harry was always a weirdly prominent spare, and (due to his mother's premature death) has WAY more money than is usual for someone in his position.

Yes, he's always been more prominent than previous "spares" for two reasons:
- His mother was one of the most beautiful, fashionable women in the world, and she was always in the public eye. Being a hands-on mother was important to her, so her kids ended up in the public eye too.
- Charles & Co. were photographed and talked about, of course, but the world wasn't full of cameras and tabloids and the internet when Charles was a boy. Harry grew up on a larger stage.

But, maybe taking time to listen and learn about the UK and the RF wasn't her deal.

Hubris. She seems always to think she knows better than those around her, even those who have greater experience.

Unfortunately for the two of them, it's a *very* expensive path, and staying solidly on it in the style to which they are accustomed will cost more money than even they have. Thus, the determination to stay firmly in the celebrity spotlight so that their fame can be monetized, because that's the most efficient way for them to maintain that level of income. They claim to hate press attention, but if so, they seem to be nonetheless voluntarily swallowing the jagged little pill.

Agree they're living an expensive lifestyle, but they're also in an odd position: they don't need to live in a mega-mansion, etc., etc., etc. -- but they do need a whole lot more security than the average person, and that need will last their whole lives.

Incidentally, I read something once about Harry's great-great-uncle (?) who abdicated the throne. Apparently he was in a position not unlike Harry's: his brother, the new king, would not allow him to make a living giving speeches, etc. -- but he also didn't provide him money on which to live (at least not in the manner to which he had become accustomed). Now, this was a one-sided article, so I don't know that it was truthful, but I was sympathetic. The crown can't have it both ways: Get out, but you need to live well, and you can't do it in any way that would question Us.

The day after the great photo was released of "the four" -- the new King and future king along with Camilla and Catherine -- H&M released a photo of the two of them with her looking like she was ready to take on the world.

Yes, Charles and William seem to be promoting themselves as the future of the monarchy -- and why shouldn't they?

I still wonder what to believe about wanting to delay Netflix ... If it's about toning down, that means there are a lot of personal interviews and it's about being royal.

Megan has been royal about 15 minutes. How much could she have to say?

Absolutely Harry wanted out of most of his official duty calendar, probably since his teens, and certainly since his money came through. The tricky part was that he wanted to continue being the Patron Saint of Wounded Veterans, but ditch everything else, kind of as if you'd told your boss; "Well, I like actually signing checks, but you'll have to find someone else to do the rest of it. FYI, I'll only be working on Mondays from here on out, but I'm keeping the top-floor corner office because it has a really nice view."

Basically, QEII informed him that that isn't how it works. You don't get to be the Patron Saint of anything unless you also empty the rubbish bins & polish 10 staircases per week, figuratively speaking. And furthermore, there is a labor & cash-flow shortage right now, so ixnay on us paying an assistant to empty baskets and shake the feather duster for you.

A good analogy, and QEII didn't seem to be afraid to do the hard stuff herself /expected her family to put their noses to the grindstone too. I think she had a very realistic picture of what the monarchy is -- that, in addition to the very big perks, she had responsibilities -- but I'm not sure Harry does.

 

[Skywalker]

I think the odds are practically nil that Harry was completely content with royal life up until the marriage and kid came along and then when things got rough he thought for the very first time ever “I could leave” and quickly acted on it. I would speculate that he’s had complicated feelings about being part of the monarchy for most of his life. I’m sure his feelings ebbed and flowed throughout the years and there were probably times where things were going well and he was feeling recommitted to it, but the root of the problem (from wherever his dislike of it stems) was always there just below the surface and the thought of walking away from it was always growing like a seed in his mind.

I’ve always viewed the “difficulties Meghan endured” part of it to be the final straw for him, not the whole reason for leaving. Plus, at that point he had a kid and having a child will light a fire under you to act on things that you might have let slide in the past. Because now the media scrutiny and the royal expectations and the invasions of privacy and the safety aspect are no longer hypothetical concepts about the theoretical child you might have one day — they are real, present-day threats to the actual child you do have, know, and love.

I have a (far more mundane) example from my own life. My husband and I never really liked the area we lived in. We moved in with the idea that we were there to build equity for a few years and then move on. The problem is, we never really figured out where we were going to move on to, and we ended up staying in our “5-year starter house” three times longer than we intended. We’d had many, many conversations over the years about relocating, but since we couldn’t figure out where to go and there was no pressing reason to uproot our lives, we didn’t. Until there was a pressing reason. Our first child was almost two and suddenly we couldn’t turn a blind eye to all the things we disliked. That high crime area is where our kid would be growing up. Dumpy playgrounds with broken glass is where he would be making childhood memories. He would be attending failing schools. We got real serious real fast, we made a decision where to go, and we moved four months later. To someone on the outside, it may have looked like we made a rash decision to up and leave. But if it looked that way, it was only because you hadn’t been part of the conversation that had been ongoing for years. I’d bet it was a similar situation with Harry — the idea had been quietly brewing for a long time.

Maybe, but in the end it seems he didn't just want to "leave" but also try and burn it all to the ground behind him. I am not sure the guidance he is getting is the best.

I mean I have no idea what is in Harry's heart. I just know I miss the days when he was my favourite royal, when he and his brother (and later, Kate) were inseparable and seemed to be having fun. They were always laughing and smiling at their engagements. Harry seems pretty downhearted most of the time now.

This is my favourite royal portrait, I believe the first official painting of William and Harry. Its anything but stiff and stuffy and instead shows their relaxed closeness.

https://www.npg.org.uk/collections/...Duke-of-Cambridge-Prince-Harry-Duke-of-Sussex

 

[BayouQueen]

I love them both.

With no discourtesy at all intended, what is it you love about them? You have been a really good advocate for them -- making excuses for their actions with true compassion, I think. But what is it that you admire about them?

 

[maddiel]

Incidentally, I read something once about Harry's great-great-uncle (?) who abdicated the throne. Apparently he was in a position not unlike Harry's: his brother, the new king, would not allow him to make a living giving speeches, etc. -- but he also didn't provide him money on which to live (at least not in the manner to which he had become accustomed). Now, this was a one-sided article, so I don't know that it was truthful, but I was sympathetic. The crown can't have it both ways: Get out, but you need to live well, and you can't do it in any way that would question Us.

Did the article happen to mention that the Duke of Windsor, who was King Edward VIII before he abdicated, was supportive of appeasing Hitler, contrary to the British position? There are reasons beyond money that it was problematic for him to be giving speeches.

 

[TippyThomas]

With no discourtesy at all intended, what is it you love about them? You have been a really good advocate for them -- making excuses for their actions with true compassion, I think. But what is it that you admire about them?

I am not claiming to admire either of them. I am simply stating that I have love for them.

 

[BayouQueen]

I am not claiming to admire either of them. I am simply stating that I have love for them.

Fair enough.

 

[MrsPete]

Did the article happen to mention that the Duke of Windsor, who was King Edward VIII before he abdicated, was supportive of appeasing Hitler, contrary to the British position? There are reasons beyond money that it was problematic for him to be giving speeches.

I'm aware of his pro-Hitler opinions, and if he had remained king the world wars might've looked different. However, that wasn't really the point.

 

[Karin1984]

Pro Hitler opinions were not uncommon among royalty and nobility in Europe, mainly trying to stay in power and keep things normal for their subjects.

In the Netherlands there is/was a rumour that in the 1940s Prince Bernhard, spouse of Queen Juliana (back then still heir to the throne), wrote a letter to Hitler with an offer to become a steward in the Netherlands on his behalf. The Prince always denied the existence of the letter and it was never found, but it is a rumour that got stuck.

 

[anniemae]

Just heard that the coronation of King Charles will take place on May 6th.

 

[OnceUponATime15]

King Charles coronation will be held at Westminster Abbey on Saturday May 6th 2023

 

[OnceUponATime15]

Camilla will be crowned at the same ceremony

https://twitter.com/x/status/1579881776331509761

 

[mamamia2005]

So we won't be getting an extra bank holiday then - boo!
King Charles is said to want a scaled down coronation, so I'm guessing that's why it's going to be on a Saturday.

 

[NotUrsula]

One of the things I'm curious about for the Coronation is what he will wear.

Up until now, Kings typically dressed in 17thC court dress (minus the wig) for the coronation, because of the religious requirement of the "colobium sindonis" which is a plain white linen robe worn over the clothing for part of the ceremony. They wore the old court dress because it includes white stockings, thus with the robe on down to their knees or so, and a white shirt under it, they appeared to be dressed in all-white. (Queens had this part easier by just wearing long gowns, and only the Sovereign does the religious part of the ceremony with the white overgown; consorts do not do that part.)

The thing is, that court dress is really ornate, with the ruffled cuffs, skirted coat, buckled shoes and whatnot, and will make him appear very out of touch at an event he is planning to "scale down". I wonder if he might choose to wear a plainer military uniform instead, and make the robe longer so that it covers regular trousers.