Reflections: A Disney Lakeside Resort

[SL6827]

Not to mention Riviera just isn’t a desirable resort to some people. I know there are a few people I have spoken to who are still deathly afraid of the Skyliner and wouldn’t want to stay at Riviera, let alone buy there, due to the reliance on the Skyliner.

Not afraid of the Sky Liner, but I just don't feel Riveria. In my opinion Disney could have came up with a better theme for a DVC resort and they went with this.

 

[TiggerBouncy]

It would be great to see some information as to why reports are that it is actually cancelled, not just postponed.

I think it's more like "indefinitely on hold". I am not much for speculation, but I am for past history. Reflections has a tail wind of some 30 permits filed in April for construction including the guard house, bus stop, roads, 6 buildings and a few other odds and ends. These would have pointed to them continuing to go forward.

However, lets rollback the clock 20 years. POP century was well under way with Phase 2 being build across the lake. Phase 2 was further along then Reflections is now - it had in fact gone vertical and the outside building was mostly intact. That was when 9/11 happened and tourism to Florida slumped. It's a very close parallel to what is happening right now, and we can in many ways assume that there will be similar slumps (although even longer and more pronounced than 9/11).

Given that those buildings say there for almost a decade before Disney came up with AoA to move in there, it would be reasonable to draw a similar conclusion for Reflections. Just like AoA, they have the land, it's earmarked, it's been cleared and some work has been done. They will likely resurrect it at some point, but last as likely as with AoA, they they will likely re-address it and open it up to re-imagining. After all, in 3 years or 5 years when they bring it back, Bob Iger will be well out, Chapek will be more in control, and who knows what the Resorts division will look like.

 

[CastAStone]

I think it's more like "indefinitely on hold". I am not much for speculation, but I am for past history. Reflections has a tail wind of some 30 permits filed in April for construction including the guard house, bus stop, roads, 6 buildings and a few other odds and ends. These would have pointed to them continuing to go forward.

However, lets rollback the clock 20 years. POP century was well under way with Phase 2 being build across the lake. Phase 2 was further along then Reflections is now - it had in fact gone vertical and the outside building was mostly intact. That was when 9/11 happened and tourism to Florida slumped. It's a very close parallel to what is happening right now, and we can in many ways assume that there will be similar slumps (although even longer and more pronounced than 9/11).

Given that those buildings say there for almost a decade before Disney came up with AoA to move in there, it would be reasonable to draw a similar conclusion for Reflections. Just like AoA, they have the land, it's earmarked, it's been cleared and some work has been done. They will likely resurrect it at some point, but last as likely as with AoA, they they will likely re-address it and open it up to re-imagining. After all, in 3 years or 5 years when they bring it back, Bob Iger will be well out, Chapek will be more in control, and who knows what the Resorts division will look like.

If indefinitely on hold means that someday in the medium to long term they build a different deluxe or DVC resort on the property, I agree that is likely. But I understand the Reflections project itself to be dead.

 

[Krandor]

If indefinitely on hold means that someday in the medium to long term they build a different deluxe or DVC resort on the property, I agree that is likely. But I understand the Reflections project itself to be dead.

Yeah they are going to need to sell more riviera first and that wasn't going well before the pandemic and will be worse now.

 

[pkrieger2287]

If indefinitely on hold means that someday in the medium to long term they build a different deluxe or DVC resort on the property, I agree that is likely. But I understand the Reflections project itself to be dead.

Indefinite hold or dead... If and when they revisit building on this site I think it will look a lot different than the resort that was proposed as Reflections.

 

[rteetz]

Indefinite hold or dead... If and when they revisit building on this site I think it will look a lot different than the resort that was proposed as Reflections.

Just like AoA. Started as Pop Century Legendary years and is now AoA.

 

[Eric Smith]

Yeah they are going to need to sell more riviera first and that wasn't going well before the pandemic and will be worse now.

Maybe this is wishful thinking, but it would be nice if they put a stop to the ridiculous resale restrictions on those contracts.

 

[Eric Smith]

Indefinite hold or dead... If and when they revisit building on this site I think it will look a lot different than the resort that was proposed as Reflections.

Hopefully they fix the name at least...

 

[SL6827]

Just like AoA. Started as Pop Century Legendary years and is now AoA.

And what a grand change that was. AoA is amazingly themed.

 

[TiggerBouncy]

Just like AoA. Started as Pop Century Legendary years and is now AoA.

But I think again, there are some similarities we can draw. AoA is not very different from POP Legacy, but with a re-skinning / theming. There is a SIGNIFICANT difference in that with AoA, the previous buildings had already gone vertical, so it was a lot more effort to change them.

However, in the case of Reflections, they have put a significant amount of effort into the planning, design, permits, etc. It's LIKELY (but not guaranteed) that they will try to reuse as much of that as possible and just re-theme it. Although the permits will be useless by the time they get around to it (only good if you start within 1 year). But still they will have most of the paperwork done and would just have to re-file. Again, no guarantee, but knowing how Disney works, it's not unreasonable.

 

[rteetz]

But I think again, there are some similarities we can draw. AoA is not very different from POP Legacy, but with a re-skinning / theming. There is a SIGNIFICANT difference in that with AoA, the previous buildings had already gone vertical, so it was a lot more effort to change them.

However, in the case of Reflections, they have put a significant amount of effort into the planning, design, permits, etc. It's LIKELY (but not guaranteed) that they will try to reuse as much of that as possible and just re-theme it. Although the permits will be useless by the time they get around to it (only good if you start within 1 year). But still they will have most of the paperwork done and would just have to re-file. Again, no guarantee, but knowing how Disney works, it's not unreasonable.

There have been numerous plans for that site. Boulder Junction the most notable.

 

[amlynn5]

I hope it eventually does go through. I really like the nature inspired architecture but can sympathize with the Ft Wilderness crew that it is close. Given the Frank Lloyd Wrigh”ness” of it one would hope it would blend seemlessly into the area. My only hope would be that one day they would take Discovery Island and reclaim it as a glamping island. That would be a lot of fun (only accessible via boat). Something like this:


Taken from: https://www.hexapolis.com/2017/02/20/tent-camping-luxury/

 

[PortMickey]

Just like AoA, They will reassess what kind of product is needed when demand returns. If it's 5 to 10 years, a lot of things can change in that time. There are so many variables.

 

[Lumpy1106]

I do know this; wiht Reflections on indefinite hold, the "restrictions" are not such a big deal any more. Riviera isn't THAT nice - I can certainly live without staying there.

 

[TheSouthernBelle]

Wherever "reflections" ends up, I'd like to see the price point on rooms come down, especially when it's not even on the monorail line, and would like to see more imaginative theming other than a luxury lakeside lodge. Lastly, I know Disney is in a world of its own when it comes to their construction management and borrowing, however, most of the capital has already been borrowed and earmarked for a hotel before they ever even begin construction. But they haven't drawn down on the entire loan based on where they are in the process. I think where they realize they need to pump the brakes is demand. They won't need any new resorts with softening in the markets anytime soon and they know that, therefore they won't have the ability to repay the construction loans. Leads me to believe that their lenders pulled back some too. Ultimately, I'm not that sad to see reflections sit and perhaps morph into something more creative.

 

[SL6827]

I do know this; wiht Reflections on indefinite hold, the "restrictions" are not such a big deal any more. Riviera isn't THAT nice - I can certainly live without staying there.

Right. I know they are dissapointed that the "restrictions" won't be so restrictive for the time being. Makes me think they will need to come up with another set that will be.

 

[71 Truck]

Disney changes thing all the time. I am sure they have plans for things that will never be built.
No one remembers at one time DVC was building a new resort in the Fort Wilderness area back in 2001.
They had gone as far as to build a bridge into the area. They were working on infrastructure when the 9-11 attacks happened. The plan was put on hold. This area in now Golden Oak.
They decided to build on what was known as the Disney Institute. Most of the infrastructure was already in place,it would cost less money to build and they knew it would be quicker to get up and running than starting from scratch. We now call it Disney Saratoga Springs.
The only thing we can wait and see.

 

[CastAStone]

Disney changes thing all the time. I am sure they have plans for things that will never be built.
No one remembers at one time DVC was building a new resort in the Fort Wilderness area back in 2001.
They had gone as far as to build a bridge into the area. They were working on infrastructure when the 9-11 attacks happened. The plan was put on hold. This area in now Golden Oak.
They decided to build on what was known as the Disney Institute. Most of the infrastructure was already in place,it would cost less money to build and they knew it would be quicker to get up and running than starting from scratch. We now call it Disney Saratoga Springs.
The only thing we can wait and see.

Eagle Ridge I believe? Something with an Eagle.

 

[CastAStone]

There is an article on XXXX titled Four DVC resorts that might have been. It is really good. I can’t get it to link properly. Eagle Pines was the name of the one you are referring. The others were DVC West (by Epcot) , Newport Coast (in CA) and Fort Wilderness.

Yeah that site is banned here. Thanks for the tip though, I’ll check it out!

 

[iheartglaciers]

I hope it eventually does go through. I really like the nature inspired architecture but can sympathize with the Ft Wilderness crew that it is close. Given the Frank Lloyd Wrigh”ness” of it one would hope it would blend seemlessly into the area. My only hope would be that one day they would take Discovery Island and reclaim it as a glamping island. That would be a lot of fun (only accessible via boat). Something like this:

View attachment 501707
Taken from: https://www.hexapolis.com/2017/02/20/tent-camping-luxury/

Discovery Island glamping would be really cool!!