ROFR and actual sale prices questioned

[Lisa Ronan]

I was aggressive in buying but I would definitely also be a jerk seller, holding out for the uneducated buyer who just puts asking price because they’re too timid to haggle.

I can understand that side of things too

 

[Sandisw]

I do think the thread includes offered and passed.

There is no thread that tracks offers made and rejected by sellers.

I believe that is what the poster meant. If we tracked how many times a buyer offered befote they secured a deal, we wouldsee a different picture

For example, it took my four offers before I had a seller accept my low offer years ago.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

There is no thread that tracks offers made and rejected by sellers.

I believe that is what the poster meant. If we tracked how many times a buyer offered befote they secured a deal, we wouldsee a different picture

For example, it took my four offers before I had a seller accept my low offer years ago.

@Sandisw would we be allowed to start a thread of rejected offers under these board rules? I actually think it would be even more popular than the ROFR thread. Maybe “TOTGA” for The One(s) that Got Away?

 

[Ruttangel]

What is sometimes useful in ROFR thread is a story of getting offer accepted but not always.

I bought BCV for $120 in March and bid $110,115 and 118 before agreeing it.
That was with Fidelity but other brokers were calling my bids crazy on listings that were on for $60pp more. Probably had 8-10 bids rejected before that, some were more than $120 as smaller contracts/came with more points.

Ultimately best advice is start bidding at least 10% under ROFR best deals and then negotiate upwards. Might hit a brick wall a few times but don’t be deterred.
This obviously only works in a buyers market. A 25pt BCV contract or subsidised AUL is going to sell same day so no point dithering on those.

 

[Sandisw]

@Sandisw would we be allowed to start a thread of rejected offers under these board rules? I actually think it would be even more popular than the ROFR thread. Maybe “TOTGA” for The One(s) that Got Away?

If someone wants to set something up for people to share deals that were rejected they could.

I would just suggest that brokers where the listings were is not be part of it and that it include simple info as DISboards is not an aggregator site.

But, sharing just resort, contract size and price rejected would be generic enough to be okay.

 

[stevehudd]

What is sometimes useful in ROFR thread is a story of getting offer accepted but not always.

I bought BCV for $120 in March and bid $110,115 and 118 before agreeing it.
That was with Fidelity but other brokers were calling my bids crazy on listings that were on for $60pp more. Probably had 8-10 bids rejected before that, some were more than $120 as smaller contracts/came with more points.

Ultimately best advice is start bidding at least 10% under ROFR best deals and then negotiate upwards. Might hit a brick wall a few times but don’t be deterred.
This obviously only works in a buyers market. A 25pt BCV contract or subsidised AUL is going to sell same day so no point dithering on those.

I don’t think gaslighting potential buyers gets them to raise their offers very often. Not a good business practice.

 

[Ruttangel]

I don’t think gaslighting potential buyers gets them to raise their offers very often. Not a good business practice.

Can you explain that please, I don’t understand your meaning

 

[stevehudd]

Can you explain that please, I don’t understand your meaning

Telling someone they are crazy for making a reasonably low offer is a psychological tactic to make that individual question their own reality and doubt their valuation metrics. Im exaggerating here, but its still a crappy way to treat people.

 

[KalamityJane]

Telling someone they are crazy for making a reasonably low offer is a psychological tactic to make that individual question their own reality and doubt their valuation metrics. Im exaggerating here, but its still a crappy way to treat people.

Agreed. I went back to brokers that were not ok with my low offers and told them about the offer I did get (which was actually lower than I was offering to them!).

 

[stevehudd]

Agreed. I went back to brokers that were not ok with my low offers and told them about the offer I did get (which was actually lower than I was offering to them!).

Good for you! Everyone needs to do the same.

 

[Brian Noble]

A good broker has an OBLIGATION to present every offer to the seller

Not necessarily.

The broker works for the seller. If the seller has told them not to bother them with bottom-of-the-range bargain hunters, then not presenting it is proper. If too much time passes with many below-threshold offers, the broker might advise the client of that. Might.

The gotta-break-the-ROFR-thread-record buyers here on DIS are probably a pain to deal with vs. many other buyers in the universe. If I were a seller, I might be inclined to give the broker similar instructions.

 

[MsChristy12]

Not necessarily.

The broker works for the seller. If the seller has told them not to bother them with bottom-of-the-range bargain hunters, then not presenting it is proper. If too much time passes with many below-threshold offers, the broker might advise the client of that. Might.

The gotta-break-the-ROFR-thread-record buyers here on DIS are probably a pain to deal with vs. many other buyers in the universe. If I were a seller, I might be inclined to give the broker similar instructions.

Hence, I think that's why the sponsored site added the "firm price sale" disclaimer on some of their listings.

I agree that if the seller doesn't wanna go below certain threshold, why waste anyone's time? It's a lot of work going back and forth between each buyer/seller. If they get no bites, maybe after some time they will change their mind and lower the price. However, regardless it's a rejection or brokers not presenting the offer to the seller, I think most members here just want some courtesy from the brokers. If it's explained in a courteous manner, I don't think a lot of us would be mad at them. It's all about the delivery.

 

[Brian Noble]

If I know I am making a bottom-of-the-range offer that many sellers will reject, and I know I am not going to go much higher than that, I am willing to accept that some brokers will be short with me because I am wasting their time.

Courtesy is nice, but in the immortal words of the various Corleone Dons: It's not personal, it's strictly business.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

If someone wants to set something up for people to share deals that were rejected they could.

I would just suggest that brokers where the listings were is not be part of it and that it include simple info as DISboards is not an aggregator site.

But, sharing just resort, contract size and price rejected would be generic enough to be okay.

Thanks @Sandisw — I agree that just resort, # of points and price rejected would be extremely helpful (but not specific enough to identify brokers)—and if I was still making a lot of offers I’d be happy to do it, however I’ve added 426 points already this year and we’re leaving for Tokyo Disney in a few days!

 

[RoseGold]

I’ve used/offered through two different companies and the agents have both said that they do not think what is being shared as far as actual closing prices is not accurate.

Anonymous strangers on the Internet are allowed to lie, and so are timeshare brokers. Maybe they are both lying?

 

[stevehudd]

Anonymous strangers on the Internet are allowed to lie, and so are timeshare brokers. Maybe they are both lying?

Nope. DVC owners are 100% perfect and never lie cheat nor steal. Liars, line cutters, and people who are rude to cast members are usually those taking a day detour from their sea world and universal trip.

 

[crisi]

Not necessarily.

The broker works for the seller. If the seller has told them not to bother them with bottom-of-the-range bargain hunters, then not presenting it is proper. If too much time passes with many below-threshold offers, the broker might advise the client of that. Might.

The gotta-break-the-ROFR-thread-record buyers here on DIS are probably a pain to deal with vs. many other buyers in the universe. If I were a seller, I might be inclined to give the broker similar instructions.

I definitely would. If I sold, I'd list at what I think would be the fair price given the current market and my own urgency to sell - it would be listed for under what the going list price is because I know that usually the going list price is a starting point for offers - but I'll have done my research before listing to know what the current state of the market is. And I'd tell the broker "don't bother with anyone who isn't offering that - don't waste my time on the phone call/email message - I've listed for what I want, and that is that." If I got impatient, I'd call and lower the list price - with the same instructions. But I have so many things I want to do in a day, and none of them involve talking to a broker about offers I'm not going to accept or discussing with a broker my urgency to sell (that's my business, not theirs, if I want their advice on pricing, I'll ask.) and I'm unlikely to be selling with a real urgent need for the cash.

And frankly, that's sort of the reality of the market - people can rent pretty easily under current conditions to more than cover the cost of dues plus, if they don't have a loan, make enough cash to make it worthwhile as long as the capital is already invested - so the only reason to sell is if you really need the cash or you just don't want it anymore - the first group of sellers you might be able to get a bargain with....the second can wait out a down market and rent out their points while they wait if they don't just want it gone.

 

[Sandisw]

I definitely would. If I sold, I'd list at what I think would be the fair price given the current market and my own urgency to sell - it would be listed for under what the going list price is because I know that usually the going list price is a starting point for offers - but I'll have done my research before listing to know what the current state of the market is. And I'd tell the broker "don't bother with anyone who isn't offering that - don't waste my time on the phone call/email message - I've listed for what I want, and that is that." If I got impatient, I'd call and lower the list price - with the same instructions. But I have so many things I want to do in a day, and none of them involve talking to a broker about offers I'm not going to accept or discussing with a broker my urgency to sell (that's my business, not theirs, if I want their advice on pricing, I'll ask.) and I'm unlikely to be selling with a real urgent need for the cash.

And frankly, that's sort of the reality of the market - people can rent pretty easily under current conditions to more than cover the cost of dues plus, if they don't have a loan, make enough cash to make it worthwhile as long as the capital is already invested - so the only reason to sell is if you really need the cash or you just don't want it anymore - the first group of sellers you might be able to get a bargain with....the second can wait out a down market and rent out their points while they wait if they don't just want it gone.

This was us and why I don't always understand why people get upset, annoyed, or sometimes even angry when a broker tells them that their offer is not within market rate. For that broker, it might not be or that is the way they do business.

I have dealt with many and some have been a little more direct than others, but then again, I always start out with "Here is my offer, I know it may be way low but if the seller is accepting them at this rate, please present". Never had one turn me down yet.

It really is just business and if they did give me a hard time, I would say "You are probably right, but that's all I can do at this time...I will just have to try elsewhere"

 

[CarolMN]

This was us and why I don't always understand why people get upset, annoyed, or sometimes even angry when a broker tells them that their offer is not within market rate. For that broker, it might not be or that is the way they do business.

Maybe the brokers should be telling those buyers that the seller has instructed them not to present any non-full price offers. I suspect that some are not conveying that message properly and that is why the buyers are upset.

As you know (others may not), in Florida, the brokers are almost all licensed as 'transaction' brokers. They are not supposed to represent either the buyer or the seller, but are to 'facilitate' the transaction only.

 

[Brian Noble]

They do not have a fiduciary duty to the seller in preference to the buyer. But, they are empowered to not forward offers if the seller has instructed them not to.

https://floridarealestate.law/the-transaction-broker-relationship/