Scooter Incident at Magic Kingdom Bus Stop

[xxDisneyDancerxx]

I witnessed an interesting situation last night. (After talking about this issue on our trip then finding this thread, I thought I'd share)

After leaving mnsshp last night we ended up at the bus stop behind a family of scooters(two parents in them with their children riding on them with them). The attendant had them wait in line, which at midnight I was glad to seem some enforcement. When the bus came the two parents took down a chain and decided to drive right up to the front door assuming they were getting on first. The driver then started letting the people on and had the scooters wait. They ended up having to wait for the next bus.

I'm glad the attended by thought they should wait in line, which I agree with. The situation was kind of weird but with the family thinking they were going to cut 50+ who have been waiting much longer than us just made me mad. As the bus was leaving I could see the man in the scooter yelling at the attendant. I would like to know how people feel about this situation.

 

[bpadair32]

I witnessed an interesting situation last night. (After talking about this issue on our trip then finding this thread, I thought I'd share)

After leaving mnsshp last night we ended up at the bus stop behind a family of scooters(two parents in them with their children riding on them with them). The attendant had them wait in line, which at midnight I was glad to seem some enforcement. When the bus came the two parents took down a chain and decided to drive right up to the front door assuming they were getting on first. The driver then started letting the people on and had the scooters wait. They ended up having to wait for the next bus.

I'm glad the attended by thought they should wait in line, which I agree with. The situation was kind of weird but with the family thinking they were going to cut 50+ who have been waiting much longer than us just made me mad. As the bus was leaving I could see the man in the scooter yelling at the attendant. I would like to know how people feel about this situation.

I think that based on Disney policy, the attendant was wrong and they should have boarded.

 

[ChloesDaddy]

I believe that under this law the bus system at Disney would be considered public transportation in some ways, because Disney actually has the same rights and responsibilities for self-governance as a "real" city. This was a deal set up years ago with the FL gov't and Disney.

Note: I am also not an attorney, but this is my interpretation.

That's possible, and I did wonder about it. From what I could find the roads are managed by the Reedy Creek District, but the transportation system itself is operated under the Disney World resort operations organization (since March 2014), and the vehicles are maintained under the facilities services division within the Disney corporate structure. Even if they are public, though, the part f requirement applies only to fixed routes, which is defined in part by having a set time schedule.

I want to be clear again, for everyone in this discussion, that I don't have a problem with Disney's policy but was just responding to the notion that they are obligated under section 37.163, and specifically the time requirement of part f.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

I'm also in the camp of "these threads make me nervous to go" knowing a family member will need a wheelchair. Circumstances will allow us to just rent at the parks so we will avoid the bus issue (hopefully), but it does make me sad to think about knowing that some day that might be us. In reality, some day it might be all of us. At some point in our lives, each of us or a family member may temporarily or permanently need a wheel chair or scooter. It's sad that the perception is out there that people in wheel chairs and scooters and the groups with them are only looking out for themselves and are trying to get ahead. I think that they are just like the rest of us. They are just wanting to enjoy the magic of a Disney vacation with their family and are following Disney's directions to do so. I hope that this is just exaggerated here on the boards and that in person and on location at the parks, everyone is treated with dignity and respect.

As I have said up thread. Don't think on it for a moment. I've been with scooter in party, with wheelchair party and all walkers. The majority of people down at Disney are understanding. The Dis is not representative. You'll probably hear maybe one comment if that. I think I've heard a grand total of a couple in my trips. Go down there, get a scooter if you need one and have a good time. Know going in you're not going to be able to ride as many rides as you could when you didn't use one. But you can still have a great time.

 

[Maxpowers]

For 100% clarity, I do not think that wheelchair/ecv users are trying to "get ahead". I hope they enjoy their WDW visit as much as anyone else and I understand that they are limited in many ways that everyone else is not. To me it's about being a considerate person, were I to go with someone in a wheelchair/ecv and we had a large group I would 100% only send 1 or 2 people with the person in the ECV. It's not the end of the world if your group has to split for the bus ride (some circumstances warrant everyone going, and I am 100% understanding of that). What I find crazy is someone in an wheelchair/ecv yelling at the attendant b\c they didn't get right onto the bus or had to wait for the next one. Chill out! It won't kill you to wait for the next one.

 

[MasterGracey84]

My heart goes out to those of you needing assistance, and my angry face goes out to those manipulating the system. Those using personal mobility vehicles wait in line as everyone else should. When it is their turn to board, they receive priority. If their party can fit, then that is great. If not... then they must wait. Pretty simple. Great discussion and apologies to anyone's reponse I have repeated.

 

[cranbiz]

I think that based on Disney policy, the attendant was wrong and they should have boarded.

And you would be incorrect.

If the group was mainstreamed in the queue, which it sounds like they were, they wait like every other guest and the CM managing the queue will decide when to take them and stage them in the wheelchair loading area. This is for everyone's safety. Depending on where they were in line, it could have been a judgement call on if they actually would have been able to board the bus.

The guests took it upon themselves to unhook the chain and move to the front of the bus. Wrong move. All mobility devices and guest with that party (up to 6) will load through the rear doors and whenever possible, load onto an empty bus. Again, this is a safety issue.

With a mainstreamed line, either an attendant or the driver will decide when to board the wheelchair/scooter. It will be decided based on the ability to do it safely.

When I was driving during the EPCOT experiment, if I saw a party in a wheelchair/scooter that would be in the queue in a spot where they would be in a position to ride my bus (maybe 30 or 40th guest in line) I would then lower the chain and board them first. No, they were not cutting the line and they did not take a spot from someone else. The only thing that happened is perhaps someone may need to stand that would not have if I didn't load them first. However, for the greater good of all, this was done so I could load the guest safely and make sure that no one gets hurt.

At midnight, there will be another bus in that load zone pretty quick. It's not a 20 minute wait if you don't make that bus. At a park closing, all buses are manually dispatched by the on site coordinator and there is a rover with a radio to relay trouble spots to the dispatcher. That's why you will see buses double loading at queues like All Stars, POP, AOA, etc.

 

[DisneyPrince1982]

The guests took it upon themselves to unhook the chain and move to the front of the bus. Wrong move.

Bingo. You don't ever unhook a chain, period.

 

[mummabear]

I'm glad the attended by thought they should wait in line, which I agree with. The situation was kind of weird but with the family thinking they were going to cut 50+ who have been waiting much longer than us just made me mad. As the bus was leaving I could see the man in the scooter yelling at the attendant. I would like to know how people feel about this situation

I think it sounds like this guy was entitled and had no business skipping the line.
Glad the attendant dealt with it.

 

[bpadair32]

Here is my opinion, if the scooter areas are available on the bus and there are people in scooters waiting, let them on the bus. If they are already full, then let them wait until the next bus. It seems to me that regardless of lines, it doesn't make sense to make people in scooters wait if the scooter areas are available.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

It seems to me that regardless of lines, it doesn't make sense to make people in scooters wait if the scooter areas are available.

But is does make sense for others to wait so the scooters which arrived later can board ahead of them? I am missing the logic here. Those are not just "scooter" spaces - they are used for scooters and seated passengers.

 

[bpadair32]

But is does make sense for others to wait so the scooters which arrived later can board ahead of them? I am missing the logic here. Those are not just "scooter" spaces - they are used for scooters and seated passengers.

But if the people that are going to use those spaces stand there should still be plenty of room for the same number of people on the bus.

 

[cranbiz]

Here is my opinion, if the scooter areas are available on the bus and there are people in scooters waiting, let them on the bus. If they are already full, then let them wait until the next bus. It seems to me that regardless of lines, it doesn't make sense to make people in scooters wait if the scooter areas are available.

SAFETY. That's the reason they may not be able to board a given bus at a given time.
FAIRNESS. The ADA allows for equal access, not priority access.

It's a fine line between fairness and equal accessibility sometimes. I drove a WDW bus for 5 years. I believe I know the policies and the ramifications of said policies. Guest safety has always been a priority and should always remain a priority.

I firmly believe that Disney does an excellent job in providing equal access to it's resorts and Parks for all guests. The investment in all low floor buses is a prime example. You could still be riding in a RTS style bus with a lift (which does meet ADA rules), they are cheaper than a Gillig or a Nova but the commitment to easy guest access dictate low floor, kneeling capable buses with a ramp that can be manually deployed if the automated mech is broken.

You can't and won't make everyone happy. All you can do is strive to make most everyone happy.

 

[leebee]

Never mind... I had a potential solution with diagram, but the software mutated the diagram and I don't have time to explain it all over again!

 

[kaytieeldr]

Yup and many families have been waiting longer than yours. I understand that if the scooter doesnt skip the line then they could be waiting longer than we would since only a certain number can be on any given bus. But your extra 5 is my whole family, who have been waiting, we are tired and ready to get back. This discussion is whether the policy is the right one to have and I dont think it is.

You can let Disney know how you feel and why. Maybe they'll even respond. WDW.guest.communications@disneyworld.com
You could consider, though, that you don't know how physically and emotionally exhausting that party's day has been.

I totally understand the issue of the scooter boarding procedure. But what I don't get is the giant entourages that seem to travel with scooters! I always seem to run into the GIANT family reunion and they fill an entire bus! I'd love to see the 6 rule enacted more often.

You probably also encounter many much, much smaller parties. Probably the majority of Mobil device users don't travel with large encourages.

I think that based on Disney policy, the attendant was wrong and they should have boarded.

I think if the procedure described earlier in this thread was/is in effect, the CM was right and the guest was very, very wrong.

But is does make sense for others to wait so the scooters which arrived later can board ahead of them? I am missing the logic here. Those are not just "scooter" spaces - they are used for scooters and seated passengers.

But there are over 30 times as many ambulatory spaces as mobility device spaces. Plus, if multiple buses arrive for a resort, wheelchair/ECV guests are at a severe disadvantage:

• One bus = two wheelchairs + two riders + 62 guests on foot
• Two buses = two wheelchairs + two riders + 134 guests on foot
• Three buses (yes, I've seen three buses stacked up and loading) = two wheelchairs + two riders + 206 guests on foot

So 200 passengers on foot get to travel between two points faster than three passengers on wheels.
No, they're not just wheelchair seats - but all the other spots are just seated/standing spaces.

 

[serenitynow]

On the new buses most people wind up standing up anyway. There is not nearly as much seating in the newest buses. Plus Disney can transport many more people standing than in seats, so maybe this issue will resolve itself over time - everybody stands except the 2 designated ADA disabled parking spots. That way no one can complain about waiting for a bus and not getting a seat.

 

[revdon64]

I guess I shouldn't be surprised that there's an awful lot of self-entitled, selfish responses in this thread. Why not just be thankful that you and no one in your party need to use a device that limits your access and your fun. Sure, there are unscrupulous people that will job the system. And they'll be found out eventually by Disney or their higher power. (Instant Karma's gonna get ya!) Wouldn't Disney be an even lovelier place if we could all treat those who are less capable than ourselves with a little respect and honor?

 

[limabeanmom2003]

Has anyone else notice there are nowhere near as many scooters at the parks since they made queu lines wheelchair accessible and took away the GUest Asst. card for mobility issues? When we were at WDW in August I was shocked at how few scooters there were. If you use a scooter, you get to get on the bus first - that's disneys policy. It is what it is. We dislike the buses and rent a car or bring our own.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

But there are over 30 times as many ambulatory spaces as mobility device spaces. Plus, if multiple buses arrive for a resort, wheelchair/ECV guests are at a severe disadvantage:

• One bus = two wheelchairs + two riders + 62 guests on foot
• Two buses = two wheelchairs + two riders + 134 guests on foot
• Three buses (yes, I've seen three buses stacked up and loading) = two wheelchairs + two riders + 206 guests on foot

So 200 passengers on foot get to travel between two points faster than three passengers on wheels.
No, they're not just wheelchair seats - but all the other spots are just seated/standing spaces.

And I bet that there are well over 30 times more ambulatory passengers as there are mobility device patrons. Bringing in the multiple bus scenario doesn't help the general discussion as it only represents a tiny percentage of the overall bus pickups.

I drive to avoid this mess, and I have done so on the visits with family that required wheel chairs. I am not sure what I would do if I had to travel with a person who needed a scooter, but I know that I wouldn't want priority seating if I were limited to a scooter for transportation. I would want to wait my turn. I would expect to wait my turn. I don't even begin to understand people who expect otherwise.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

I guess I shouldn't be surprised that there's an awful lot of self-entitled, selfish responses in this thread. Why not just be thankful that you and no one in your party need to use a device that limits your access and your fun. Sure, there are unscrupulous people that will job the system. And they'll be found out eventually by Disney or their higher power. (Instant Karma's gonna get ya!) Wouldn't Disney be an even lovelier place if we could all treat those who are less capable than ourselves with a little respect and honor?

So the only self-entitled and selfish people are the ones who wish to be treated equitably while those with disabilities that demand preferential treatment are not? Really? And what is with the name calling?