Self Extenders

[rugrats2001]

What they did was incredibly selfish and wrong, no doubt about that. But you can't simply put them out of the room. There's a civil remedy that has to be followed.

Why can't they put them out? How is it different than Wal-mart making you leave when the store closes? At that time, you should be considered a trespasser, and dealt with by law enforcement officers.

 

[kwimbie]

Only makes sense that if you have a later flight and want to do other things at WDW then just check your bags at the front desk. Plus if you used Magical Express check into your flight and have your luggage head to the airport. I just returned from BWV and that's exactly what we did. We checked our luggage in at 10:45AM went for a walk, did some shopping, and then ate at beaches and cream. headed back to the resort picked our carry on's up at bell services and then jumped on the DME bus for our 4:30PM flight.

 

[crashbb]

I agree with disabling the keys at check out time. In an emergency, such as someone feeling ill, arrangements can be mde with the front desk well in advance of check out time.

I'm not sure that this is possible. In our building (also uses key cards for entry) and key cannot be invalidated until a new key is used in that lock. So - at 11am a new key can be made for that room, but the old key will still work until the new key is physically placed into the lock.

 

[spiceycat]

They don't need to be clairvoyant. The system is already in place and it's been working for years.

1. Housekeeping arrives at the room sometime after 11am.

2a. If a guest is discovered in the room, the front desk is notified so that a manager can interevene.

2b. If no guest, the room is cleaned.

3. After cleaning, the room is "released" by housekeeping.

4. The inbound guest's key is activated and the outbound guest's card is deactivated.

If anything is going wrong in the process it's probably one of two things:

In #2a above, either management is not being informed of late guests in a timely manner or they are not taking action promptly.

you are asking the maid an hourly worker to do the work of a salary employee.

it is NOT her job to see if the guest is check out.

She can't look in the closet or in the drawers. (where I put my stuff).

you are expecting much, too much from someone who is in the room to clean it.

that is her entire job - her only job - is to clean. not to tell management that someone has not checked out - that is not her job - she might tell her manager that she can't clean a room because she can't get in that room. (locked)

but that is all.

now disney is trying - at least now some of the maids are Americans or at least speak English.

Disney doesn't change the lock until the new guest check-in. this is the policy in the industry.

It is rude guests and DVC members who back to the room can see it has been cleaned then wreck it - because they can!!!!

One time we were in the studio - bell services, the maid and finally a manager showed up for the 1-bedroom next door - the guy had called and demanding something - then he and his spouse went for a WALK.

sorry folks rude is rude. When you make someone else wait for you, especially when you know they are coming. this person probably made others in the line for bell services late.

People are rude. lots of the complaints against the maids - are because of this fact.

Until people learn to have consideration for others this is not changing.

so Disney needs to change it policy.

 

[jco_direwolf]

Why can't they put them out? How is it different than Wal-mart making you leave when the store closes? At that time, you should be considered a trespasser, and dealt with by law enforcement officers.

The simplest answer is the law recognizes a difference between a "Store/Retail" business and an "Innkeeper/Hotel" business. The fundamental reason being that people use them as a residents at least for a time. On top of that there are differences between Inn/Hotels and Timeshares.

At any-rate that is why there is that laundry list rules/laws on the back of the door of your hotel room.

johno

 

[canwegosoon]

2) If it appears that the unit has been vacated when housekeeping enters and finishes, keys for previous occupants should be invalidated when housekeeping declares a unit ready for occupancy. The only problem here is that this would require communication on a unit-by-unit basis and that may be inefficient and/or unwieldy from a cost control standpoint.

Most hotels utilize a phone or radio system to accomplish this. They usually radio/call the booker to inform the change in status.

I think a good thing for Disney to start to do is utilize the estimated time of arrival(and departure) in booking. They can at least start to use inhouse information that is already available through ME, and then ask others to give it voluntarily.

When I owned a hotel we had great customers that understood that 10am was check out and check in was 2pm(can you tell that this was over 20 years ago that I am out). Customers also notified us that they would be in at 6pm or later etc. Those units were always cleaned last so that guests arriving early could be accomodated. All our units were booked for choice rooms very few were ROH, so specific units were pre matched to specific customers.

Now I realize emergencies (someone too ill to move) or unexpected travel problems(snow in the NE can mean you might not have a flight for 2 days)...but I think WDW can handle those issues with compensation or upgrading prior to check in.

I do believe that in most cases of this abuse it is a matter of lack of common courtsey and an entitlement issue. WDW needs to step up the fines, utilize the information they have and do a little proactive work-like a recorded call "Your check out for tomorrow is scheduled for .....(6am to customers ME/flight information, or 10am etc), if for any unforseen emergency prohibits you from your check out the manager needs to be informed prior to 10am). After 10am all remaining guest will be charged *** for extended use of the room."
Also WDW could start to have guests call the booker or other person to report that they are vacating the room, this way housekeeping would not be confused if someone was gone or not.

 

[Debbie H]

Most hotels utilize a phone or radio system to accomplish this. They usually radio/call the booker to inform the change in status.

I think a good thing for Disney to start to do is utilize the estimated time of arrival(and departure) in booking. They can at least start to use inhouse information that is already available through ME, and then ask others to give it voluntarily.

When I owned a hotel we had great customers that understood that 10am was check out and check in was 2pm(can you tell that this was over 20 years ago that I am out). Customers also notified us that they would be in at 6pm or later etc. Those units were always cleaned last so that guests arriving early could be accomodated. All our units were booked for choice rooms very few were ROH, so specific units were pre matched to specific customers.

Now I realize emergencies (someone too ill to move) or unexpected travel problems(snow in the NE can mean you might not have a flight for 2 days)...but I think WDW can handle those issues with compensation or upgrading prior to check in.

I do believe that in most cases of this abuse it is a matter of lack of common courtsey and an entitlement issue. WDW needs to step up the fines, utilize the information they have and do a little proactive work-like a recorded call "Your check out for tomorrow is scheduled for .....(6am to customers ME/flight information, or 10am etc), if for any unforseen emergency prohibits you from your check out the manager needs to be informed prior to 10am). After 10am all remaining guest will be charged *** for extended use of the room."
Also WDW could start to have guests call the booker or other person to report that they are vacating the room, this way housekeeping would not be confused if someone was gone or not.

Perhaps we could recommend that DVC hire you as a consultant! Great suggestions!

 

[LVSWL]

I totally agree that DVC can and SHOULD charge "self extenders", but I'm a little confused about why some of you think blocking the keys at 11 is a "bad" thing. If you are supposed to be out by 11, why should your key work after that?

This is exactly what I was thinking. Well put!

 

[tjkraz]

I totally agree that DVC can and SHOULD charge "self extenders", but I'm a little confused about why some of you think blocking the keys at 11 is a "bad" thing. If you are supposed to be out by 11, why should your key work after that?

To quote from my post a couple pages ago:

According to Florida Statute 509.141 a public lodging establishment has the right to evict a guest who fails to check-out by the agreed-upon time, but only after providing notice as follows:

The operator of any public lodging establishment or public food service establishment shall notify such guest that the establishment no longer desires to entertain the guest and shall request that such guest immediately depart from the establishment. Such notice may be given orally or in writing. If the notice is in writing, it shall be as follows:

"You are hereby notified that this establishment no longer desires to entertain you as its guest, and you are requested to leave at once. To remain after receipt of this notice is a misdemeanor under the laws of this state."

At the very least, Disney has no authority to formally evict a guest (locking them out of their room would qualify) without going thru the process above. This isn't just legal red tape...it's the Florida statute and it's designed specifically to protect the rights of the hotel guest just as much as the operator.

Whether the same applies to DVC members (timeshare owners) has not been established. But it would certainly keep resorts from establishing across-the-board policies, even at resorts like OKW and SSR since they play host to cash guests as well.

That's pretty much the end of the discussion...unless someone can prove that timeshare resort operators have different rights with regard to handling of guests.

Even IF DVC members could legally be locked out of their rooms, I can't see Disney doing it. You'd have a daily stream of people to the front desk who needed their keys re-activated for whatever reason. That creates additional work for the CMs, hassle (albeit justified) for the outgoing guest, and additional wait time for the incoming guests who are stuck in a line longer waiting for others' key cards to be re-activated. Given our society, it would probably generate more than a few lawsuits, too ("Disney kept me from getting to my medication", "my cell phone was locked in the room and I missed an important business call", "my baby's formula was in the room", etc.)

When you figure the 30,000 resort rooms at WDW, many of which are turned-over 2-3 times per week, the number of complaints that can be traced to late departures appears infinitesimal, IMO. Just look back at the original post here, for example. The resort KNEW that the room assigned to OP had guests who were staying another night and they ultimately DID find OP a vacant room. It was only their lack of responsiveness that kept OP from getting into that room until well after the posted check-in time.

I agree with every adjective that one would apply to people who willfully violate the rules (discourteous, rude, self-centered, entitled, etc.) But given the fact that a housekeeping CM handles a dozen or more rooms on any day, I doubt that the number of late departures often has a bearing on guests' ability to access rooms.

 

[Debbie H]

These are taken from a few other resorts in Florida:

Check-Out Procedure:

Check out time is 11am on the day of departure. Unauthorized late check-out will result in the guest having a balance due equal to ½ of one day’s rental fees. By signing the reservation confirmation, the guest is authorizing management to charge this additional fee to the major credit card on file.

Check-out Time. Check-out time is no later than 10:00 AM Late check-outs are available for a fee.

Absolute check-out time is 10 a.m. so that we may prepare for our next arrival. Please refer to your confirmation notice for check-in location and late arrival instructions.


Check-in/Check-out: Check-in is 4pm. Check-out is 10am. Early check-ins and late check-outs are subject to a discretionary service charge.

Check-out time: 10:00 AM - STRICTLY ENFORCED. Late check out may be subject to eviction and/or additional rental fees.


So, if other resorts can strictly enforce and apply late fees and are subject to eviction, then so can DVC. Obviously Florida Statute 509.141 does not always apply.

 

[tjkraz]

So, if other resorts can strictly enforce and apply late fees and are subject to eviction, then so can DVC. Obviously Florida Statute 509.141 does not always apply.

1. I don't recall anyone claiming that Disney could not apply late fees if they chose to do so. In fact, I'm fairly confident that between the docs signed at check-in and the notices on the back door of each guest room, Disney is already warning guests that they are subject to late fees for not being out in time.

2. Just because a resort warns that guests "may be subject to eviction" doesn't give them the ability to disregard the law. There is still a process that must occur prior to the eviction.

 

[Debbie H]

2. Just because a resort warns that guests "may be subject to eviction" doesn't give them the ability to disregard the law. There is still a process that must occur prior to the eviction.

Well, obviously some disney guests feel they can disregard the law by not getting out. Whether or not it is in a Florida Statute or not, they still have the ability to get people out. If not, why not everyone stay? Perhaps by the time disney decides to evict us it will be time to go home.

I think perhaps those of us that do not like the fact that people self-extend, should let DVC know about it. I spoke to a cm and he said it is far more common than people think. I don't believe that those who choose to do this should be allowed to do it time after time and get away with it. I'm sure if they've done it once, they do it everytime.

 

[tjkraz]

Well, obviously some disney guests feel they can disregard the law by not getting out.

You're confusing the law with hotel policy. There is nothing in Florida law that states that a guest must leave a hotel on the scheduled day/time. In fact, the law protects guests from being forced out on the street by hotels. It's perfectly legal for a guest to extend his/her stay, as long as they are willing to pay the price.

Hotel policy may impose fines or exhorbitantly high rates (usually Rack Rates) for people who extend their stay. However the guest is still protected (by the law) in that he/she cannot be forced out on the street as long as they are willing to extend their stay under the agreed-upon terms.

Whether or not it is in a Florida Statute or not, they still have the ability to get people out. If not, why not everyone stay?

People don't arbitrarily stay late because it opens the door to financial penalties dictated by hotel policy.

I don't have anything in front of me to quote, but I can guarantee that either the card signed at check-in or the notices on the back of each guest room door (probably both) indicate that the resort can charge for an additional night's stay if guests do not vacate by 11am.

The DVC POS actually addresses this situation under the heading of "Holdover Owners", which are essentially any people who stay past their check-out day/time. According to the POS, DVC is responsible for taking the proper steps to remove Holdover Owners and for making alternative arrangements for any incoming guests inconvenienced by the situation. DVC can then bill the Holdover Owner for the cost of the alternate accommodations and an administrative fee of $50.

Despite specific member inconveniences and statements made by resort staff, I think the fact that DVC isn't imposing these penalties speaks volumes about how little of a problem really exists. Even DVCMember.com has this to say about check-out time: "For the consideration of all guests (as well as our busy housekeeping staff), we ask that you please do your best to respect these timeframes."

While I am NOT condoning the actions of those who or extend their stay, DVC's mildly-worded request that members "please do your best" isn't exactly the harshest threat I've ever heard.

Please feel free to share your comments with DVC. I try to make a habit of sharing my own comments with them following my trips. I wouldn't suggest expecting immediate policy changes, but if the situation truly is worsening perhaps they will eventually be more agressive in fining members.

 

[OneMoreTry]

I say charge em an exhorbitant fee and split it with the guest who is inconvenienced.

 

[Deb & Bill]

I say charge them an exhorbitant fee and give a portion of it to the housekeeper who had to stay overtime to get the mess cleaned up. The quicker they get the villa ready for the next guest, the bigger the bonus.

 

[canwegosoon]

I say charge them an exhorbitant fee and give a portion of it to the housekeeper who had to stay overtime to get the mess cleaned up.

The quicker they get the villa ready for the next guest, the bigger the bonus.

I'm all for the first part ...but the second is the fastest and surest path to shoddy housekeeping. Sorry I would rather wait for a throughly cleaned villa(and checked) than a quick turnover. Hotel bonuses should be paid for excellence in service, with in a time frame.

 

[Debbie H]

I say charge them an exhorbitant fee and give a portion of it to the housekeeper who had to stay overtime to get the mess cleaned up. The quicker they get the villa ready for the next guest, the bigger the bonus.

here here!!!

 

[wdw4us2]

I did not realize that this was such a problem at DVC.

We have been members since 1997. We always remain on the property all day during our check out day, but we pack up and store our bags by 11 a.m..

Why is it that some people feel that they don't have to obey the rules?

 

[Boardwalker]

I did not realize that this was such a problem at DVC.

Why is it that some people feel that they don't have to obey the rules?

Because they paid a lot of money to be nasty. Didn't you see the perception thread?

Let's unite here people and just support the hotel in their rules. Maybe we have met the enemy and we are them, well not me, but the rest of you. We have always made the 11 am checkout,....and have been out by 9 am 99% of the time, and we let the front desk know so that the housekeepers are made aware that the room is cleared.

When you have to get into a debate of Florida Real Estate Law, it is time not only for eviction, but for a refund of the money paid for the points and a giant Mickey shaped boot on someone's backside. They reserve the right to terminate at the mouse's discretion, right, law dude?

But remember, the next DVCer may have spent even more moneythan you and so may deserve to be treated better than you are, so your tantrums may be invalid. You still may be average, so just get over yourselves.

We have been members since 98 and have never been in the room later than the 11 am posted time. Suck it up and move it out, people, the parks are waiting! And so are the rest of us.

To me leaving my Boardwalk villa is like removing a bandaid... you know you have to go, so just get it over with quickly so you can start healing.

 

[anabelle]

I left one time at exactly 11 AM. I felt horrible. My laundry was taking forever to dry. I finally packed it wet. I apologized to housekeeping who were waiting at my door profusely and tipped them $10 .

Now that some resorts have airline check in at the hotel. I try to get out early to check in then squeeze at little more park time.