Sept 17-30 incentives - speculation

[1983DisneyFanatic]

I was told by an agent that the minimum will increase in October. I just purchase the 100 minimum today.

 

[Cony]

My agent just informed me this morning that the incentives after September 16th will not be better than the current incentives.

 

[CLE2WDW]

My agent just informed me this morning that the incentives after September 16th will not be better than the current incentives.

That’s quite surprising. I’m just guessing that demand for DVC is near record lows and yet Disney seems content with it. So odd.

 

[Sandisw]

That’s quite surprising. I’m just guessing that demand for DVC is near record lows and yet Disney seems content with it. So odd.

IMO, now that Reflections is not happening or on hold, and there is nothing new on to sell other than RIV, the rush to get it sold isn’t there as they always like to have something in active sales,

Not to mention that what isn’t sold at RIV can be rented for cash or used by Disney to relocate guests who are at resorts net yet open,

The fact that they put incentives on sold out resorts leads me to believe they are currently content with whatever sales happen given the climate we are in.

 

[davidl81]

That’s quite surprising. I’m just guessing that demand for DVC is near record lows and yet Disney seems content with it. So odd.

I also think its diminishing returns on discounts. For RIV the current discounts are pretty good, so what level of discounts would Disney have to go to really entice more buyers? Would another $10 off per point really be enough to generate more sales (and enough to offset the lost profit)? And with the parks at minimal capacity there are fewer people to even sell to. I think keeping the current incentives would be fairly good honestly.

I just think ultimately RIV is an overpriced resort with too high of a point chart and too high of fees IMO. I looked into it with the current discounts and it still does not make sense to me. The location is okay (only because of the skyliner) and while the resort is nice it is not VGF nice IMO. So being priced at $195 is already tough, but combined with the point chart and crazy high fees makes it a no go for us. And I am not sure how much of a discount it would take to make me change my mind. My guess is somewhere around $130 to $140 a point it could maybe make sense, and even that is a stretch.

 

[Cony]

I think if they removed the resale restrictions on Riviera, it'd help them a lot with sales. I personally love the style of Riviera and would choose Riviera over VGF (I do also love VGF, don't get me wrong). I'd rather be in a building with everything in one place than walking outside of VGF to avoid the heat and rain. The food there is amazing, it's close to two of my favorite parks, and we have a rental car every time we go so transportation for me is the same. Just my personal opinion of why I chose Riviera.

 

[davidl81]

I think if they removed the resale restrictions on Riviera, it'd help them a lot with sales. I personally love the style of Riviera and would choose Riviera over VGF (I do also love VGF, don't get me wrong). I'd rather be in a building with everything in one place than walking outside of VGF to avoid the heat and rain. The food there is amazing, it's close to two of my favorite parks, and we have a rental car every time we go so transportation for me is the same. Just my personal opinion of why I chose Riviera.

Yeah the resale restrictions are really the nail in the coffin for me. Just an added negative that makes it hard to justify.

 

[sethschroeder]

I also think its diminishing returns on discounts.

I think you flatten the discount with a specific timeline of increases laid out through Jan 1.

As an example:
100-500 all the same discount until Oct 1
150-500 all the same discount until Nov 1
200-500 all the same discount until Dec 1
250-500 all the same discount until Jan 1 (everything expires)

Since a vast majority buy in at the 100-200 point range this would drive extra incentive to purchase at the $150 (existing member) and $160 (new member rates)

Yeah the resale restrictions are really the nail in the coffin for me. Just an added negative that makes it hard to justify.

Exactly the resale restrictions in 25-30 years time will not be a consideration but for now what that means is that every other contract I buy would need to be direct otherwise my points are completely split from one another with no chance of combining at one of my home resorts.

So now I am left banking/borrowing to consolidate to a specific year or forced in to a split stay every trip if I want to stay in the Epcot area (unlikely to plan on getting 8-9 nights at BCV/BWV in a 2BR or Studio).

 

[CastAStone]

My agent just informed me this morning that the incentives after September 16th will not be better than the current incentives.

Do you believe them? Maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong but my understanding was that the guides find out the new incentives the morning of.

 

[Cony]

Do you believe them? Maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong but my understanding was that the guides find out the new incentives the morning of.

I don’t see a reason for him to lie to me as I’ve already purchased with a delayed closing in late September. He found out yesterday morning.

 

[LTJoeFlo]

Do you believe them? Maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong but my understanding was that the guides find out the new incentives the morning of.

From my experience working with a large sales organization (think market cap of Disney), we didn't inform the sales staff until the last possible minute. Leadership is still evaluating the impact of current incentives. Why would they make a decision this far out??

I'm not suggesting that the sales staff is doing anything nefarious. But, I might be tempted to stretch the truth if I had been unable to sell contracts for several weeks prior. I really like my guide, but our relationship is purely business.

 

[Cony]

From my experience working with a large sales organization (think market cap of Disney), we didn't inform the sales staff until the last possible minute. Leadership is still evaluating the impact of current incentives. Why would they make a decision this far out??

I'd say to increase the urgency for customers who are currently thinking about purchasing?

 

[sethschroeder]

From my experience working with a large sales organization (think market cap of Disney), we didn't inform the sales staff until the last possible minute. Leadership is still evaluating the impact of current incentives. Why would they make a decision this far out??

Depends really incentive information could be conclusions drawn based on feedback they are being asked for. It could also be that this specific guide has higher level information that they have access to. Also could be that since incentives are not getting better they are making sure to tell everyone to avoid sales being delayed.

You also are likely looking at a large sales division and not a smaller division (not revenue but number of actual sales people there are maybe 10 guides currently working????).

 

[Hopfather28]

I think I know the answer to this but figured I would ask. If I chose to add on say 200 direct but didn't want a 200 point contract would they split that into 3 or 4 smaller ones and still qualify for Blue Card?

 

[Cony]

I think I know the answer to this but figured I would ask. If I chose to add on say 200 direct but didn't want a 200 point contract would they split that into 3 or 4 smaller ones and still qualify for Blue Card?

Yes, you'll just have separate closing fees per contract.

 

[i<3riviera]

͏

 

[CarolMN]

I think if they removed the resale restrictions on Riviera, it'd help them a lot with sales. I personally love the style of Riviera and would choose Riviera over VGF (I do also love VGF, don't get me wrong). I'd rather be in a building with everything in one place than walking outside of VGF to avoid the heat and rain. The food there is amazing, it's close to two of my favorite parks, and we have a rental car every time we go so transportation for me is the same. Just my personal opinion of why I chose Riviera.

Yeah the resale restrictions are really the nail in the coffin for me. Just an added negative that makes it hard to justify.

I find the take on restrictions interesting. It tells me that many buy with the expectation that they can resell and get a high percentage of their buy-in cost returned. I bought (in 1999) assuming the initial buy in was a sunk cost and that should I resell, I would be OK with getting little or nothing back.

So I can get past the restrictions, but not the high annual fees and NOT the point chart. I currently own at BWV and that's probably why I am having trouble with the point charts and fees. Riviera resort is beautiful, its rooms are well done and I do like the Skyliner. But the location is NOT better than that of the BWV and I can't see why I should pay a lot more to own Riviera than the BWV. YMMV.

 

[davidl81]

I find the take on restrictions interesting. It tells me that many buy with the expectation that they can resell and get a high percentage of their buy-in cost returned. I bought (in 1999) assuming the initial buy in was a sunk cost and that should I resell, I would be OK with getting little or nothing back.

So I can get past the restrictions, but not the high annual fees and NOT the point chart. I currently own at BWV and that's probably why I am having trouble with the point charts and fees. Riviera resort is beautiful, its rooms are well done and I do like the Skyliner. But the location is NOT better than that of the BWV and I can't see why I should pay a lot more to own Riviera than the BWV. YMMV.

A few things there. First people here on Disboard are for the most part pro resale purchase. So we look at resale value very hard and many of us think (although no real proof to back this up yet) that resale value for RIV is going to be very bad (some think sub $100 to maybe lower etc). Thus since resale is so prevalent here we most likely view the resale restriction much harder than the average DVC direct buyer. I was the same as you and we bought into DVC at first not even understanding or thinking about resale, so our cost was a true sunk cost. Since then we have added on one resale contract and I am in ROFR for another, but I would do direct again if the cost delta was not huge.
Your second point to me is much more valid about the downsides of RIV. the fees are crazy high but you can maybe talk yourself into that, but the points chart makes no sense to me. Of course as we have seen point requirements for newer DVC rooms have been creeping up over time. And to an extent some make sense (ie I think VGF can demand a premium over SSR in points needed, it is a superior resort in almost every way). But RIV is not really in the same prestige league as VGF, and I equate it to a tad bit less than BLT (you can argue this depending on if you really like MK or if you are more of an Epcot/DHS fan). And for a 1BD at RIV to be 10% or so more in points than a 1BD MK view at BLT is insane to me. So what does RIV really have going for it? It is a nice resort, with very high point demand, high buy in right now (direct versus resale at BLT etc), and fees that are substantially higher than other on site resorts. I just think its a tough sell. The current incentives are just low enough that I looked into it, but once I started weighing point chart, dues, resale restrictions etc I quickly took it off of my list.

 

[Cony]

A few things there. First people here on Disboard are for the most part pro resale purchase. So we look at resale value very hard and many of us think (although no real proof to back this up yet) that resale value for RIV is going to be very bad (some think sub $100 to maybe lower etc). Thus since resale is so prevalent here we most likely view the resale restriction much harder than the average DVC direct buyer. I was the same as you and we bought into DVC at first not even understanding or thinking about resale, so our cost was a true sunk cost. Since then we have added on one resale contract and I am in ROFR for another, but I would do direct again if the cost delta was not huge.
Your second point to me is much more valid about the downsides of RIV. the fees are crazy high but you can maybe talk yourself into that, but the points chart makes no sense to me. Of course as we have seen point requirements for newer DVC rooms have been creeping up over time. And to an extent some make sense (ie I think VGF can demand a premium over SSR in points needed, it is a superior resort in almost every way). But RIV is not really in the same prestige league as VGF, and I equate it to a tad bit less than BLT (you can argue this depending on if you really like MK or if you are more of an Epcot/DHS fan). And for a 1BD at RIV to be 10% or so more in points than a 1BD MK view at BLT is insane to me. So what does RIV really have going for it? It is a nice resort, with very high point demand, high buy in right now (direct versus resale at BLT etc), and fees that are substantially higher than other on site resorts. I just think its a tough sell. The current incentives are just low enough that I looked into it, but once I started weighing point chart, dues, resale restrictions etc I quickly took it off of my list.

I agree, which is why we decided to go for a guaranteed week during a Canadian long weekend in the fall. With the point chart changes from 2020 to 2021, it was only a 5% increase instead of 10% and with the future increase in points, we definitely won't be able to get a studio with the points we've purchased as the years go on. MFs are higher, but we have a small contract so doesn't hurt TOO badly.

 

[Sandisw]

I think I know the answer to this but figured I would ask. If I chose to add on say 200 direct but didn't want a 200 point contract would they split that into 3 or 4 smaller ones and still qualify for Blue Card?

Yes, but if you sell any of them and go below the threshold, you lose them and would only qualify again for whatever the new minimum is,

So, I would suggest one at 100 and the rest smaller, Now, last year there was a report or two that for a new member, the smalleSt they’d go is 100 as that was the minimum for RIV. That may not still be the case though.