The direct points shaming factor here

[jodifla]

After reading all the replies to the person who had the audacity to run the numbers and still buy direct for convenience sake, among other reasons, it occurs to me that buying direct has become just like the "Don't buy unless you can pay cash" bludgeoning that goes on in the boards.

The truth is, direct points have a lot of value today, and they will likely have even more value in days to come as DVC continues to incentivize direct points, particularly with ticket deals.

The 25 point direct loophole is likely to become a thing of the past in a hurry for new buyers.

It's one thing to point out to new people that, "Hey, there's a resale market" and another to go after them because they value what the direct points offer.

There's no doubt about it: Direct points today are premium points. We'll save several hundred dollars on the passes this year, and WDW ticket prices are going nowhere but up.

 

[supersnoop]

On average, direct points are $65 per point more expensive than retail. It’s always important to evaluate if the actual benefits are worth the premium. For anything other than a small add-on or the newest resort, that’s a difficult case to argue.

That’s not shaming; it’s just simple math.

 

[Cyberc1978]

I haven’t read the thread so can’t comment on that.

After April 2016 the best value is to buy most points resale and then add 25 direct. As long as you can get the benefits by buying 25 points then that’s the way to go. What the future will bring we can only guess.

If the minimum amount are changed for all properties to say 50 points then you really need to figure out if the benefits are worth it vs resale points. You need to buy many AP’s for the savings to add up enough to be worth it.

 

[jarestel]

I'm sure that pointing out to potential buyers that a resale market exists has saved many readers of these boards some money and that is certainly beneficial. Once armed with those facts though, I would agree that how someone decides to spend their money is their business and not ours.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

And the AP benefit has to last a number of years. As of right now, past precedent for benefits is not that they endure.

 

[Ben E N]

I have not viewed what people have said about resale vs. direct as shaming, but rather as important advice. I have not seen anyone post "gosh, Timmy is so dumb because he bought direct", but may have missed it. Rather, I have seen posts like "Timmy, you could save $5000 by going resale and then direct."

While Timmy in the above example may not have taken that advice, it is still important to post it, as other people read it. Disboards is one of the first things that comes up when people do Google searches for DVC, and if one of the first things they see is to consider resale, it encourages them to not give in to DVC sales pitches.
I know that reading the posts on this board helped me save over $10000 by encouraging me to go resale, and I appreciate it. Without other people's posts, I may have been more easily misled.

With that being said, I am happy for people who are satisfied with their direct purchases. They obviously have the money and are allowed to spend it how they want. They also most likely bought into a new and exciting resort that was only available via direct sale.

 

[amccu18007]

Having both direct and resale contracts, I can say for certainty that resale saves money. With that being said, my parents just bought a 50 point direct contract yesterday. We have gotten them a resale VGF contract and they wanted a few more points at Boardwalk. The ease of them calling, paying and getting the number the same day was AMAZING!! No judgment on how anyone wants to spend their money.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

I admit that when someone was talking buying 250 BWV points direct and financing a while back, I may have called that cray. I also showed the math on why, though.

My logic: People with tons of money aren't financing timeshares. People don't end up with tons of money by paying $50-60/pp more for a timeshare and then paying 12% to finance. That's a $10-15k difference.

 

[glamdring269]

Seems the market for small contracts at some resorts are basically a wash right now. Tried bidding on a 50 point BWV contract over last couple of days and the price is set such that I might as well just get on a direct add on wait list. BCV seems to be similar. Could just be a small sample and the overall market isn't really like that but it's not like the market is hopping with sub-100 points contracts that match specific UY requirements.

 

[Wakey]

I read that thread, the OP had posted describing how he justified to his/ herself buying direct, thus starting the debate. If OP had not wanted debate and comment, presumably he/ she would not have posted their thoughts on a public board.
I tend to find the only aggressive people are those that suffer buyers remorse, often trying to convince themselves they are not suffering buyers remorse, when they discover they could have saved a lot of money but failed to research until it was too late. Then they don’t like anyone giving facts as it has sullied their purchase in their own minds, and they want to believe in ‘pixie dust’ or similar.
The advice on here taught me a lot about DVC and set me along the road to a very considered and researched purchase. As a result I was a very educated and happy buyer, for which I thank those posters who did things like post the facts. Before I read it on here and other blogs, I hadn’t even considered resale.

 

[lbus42]

On average, direct points are $65 per point more expensive than retail. It’s always important to evaluate if the actual benefits are worth the premium. For anything other than a small add-on or the newest resort, that’s a difficult case to argue.

That’s not shaming; it’s just simple math.

I suggest that you look at some of the current asking prices for resale. People are asking for and getting $100 or more per point for OKW and SSR. AKV is usually over $100. BCV, GFV, and CRV go for $140 pp and up. I've seen some POLY listings lately for as much as $150 pp. I would pay the direct price for BCV, GFV, CRV, and POLY before paying this much for the resale contracts.

 

[Wakey]

I suggest that you look at some of the current asking prices for resale. People are asking for and getting $100 or more per point for OKW and SSR. AKV is usually over $100. BCV, GFV, and CRV go for $140 pp and up. I've seen some POLY listings lately for as much as $150 pp. I would pay the direct price for BCV, GFV, CRV, and POLY before paying this much for the resale contracts.

One things for sure, resale is getting less attractive for some resorts, particularly for small contracts. Even the ones where there are still good savings, the price has gone up a lot. I think SSR is probably going for $90 + now, with contracts on at 100 as you say- a fully loaded was only $75 at the start of the year. But for many resorts there can still be a saving of 40 a point, it will be interesting to see if resale prices drop back at Christmas.

 

[jodifla]

I read that thread, the OP had posted describing how he justified to his/ herself buying direct, thus starting the debate. If OP had not wanted debate and comment, presumably he/ she would not have posted their thoughts on a public board.
I tend to find the only aggressive people are those that suffer buyers remorse, often trying to convince themselves they are not suffering buyers remorse, when they discover they could have saved a lot of money but failed to research until it was too late. Then they don’t like anyone giving facts as it has sullied their purchase in their own minds, and they want to believe in ‘pixie dust’ or similar.
The advice on here taught me a lot about DVC and set me along the road to a very considered and researched purchase. As a result I was a very educated and happy buyer, for which I thank those posters who did things like post the facts. Before I read it on here and other blogs, I hadn’t even considered resale.

But posters do do the research, and decide they want the direct points anyway. To me, you can flip the argument: Resale buyers are justifying their points, which go for less because they are worth less. You are not a "true" member in DVC's eyes, and they are starting to go go great lengths to make it a two-class system.

I bought well before there was much of a resale market -- but I financed. I've heard a lot over the years what a terrible decision that was, (even that I was going to go bankrupt!, etc.) But 21 years later, it turned out to be a great decision: our points are worth more than double what we paid for them. If we had stalled and waited until we had a lot of cash on hand, we would have paid a lot more for the points -- and we would have still been paying money for WDW hotel rooms that aren't nearly as nice as the ones we've stayed in the last two decades.

 

[supersnoop]

I suggest that you look at some of the current asking prices for resale. People are asking for and getting $100 or more per point for OKW and SSR. AKV is usually over $100. BCV, GFV, and CRV go for $140 pp and up. I've seen some POLY listings lately for as much as $150 pp. I would pay the direct price for BCV, GFV, CRV, and POLY before paying this much for the resale contracts.

One of the brokers seems to be setting asking prices higher than anyone else. There’s a big difference between asking price and selling price. Check the ROFR thread here. AKV is “usually” in the $80’s.

 

[noreen99]

.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Also, most people will grant that for 50 points or less, direct will be far more efficient. For a resort like CCV, it is obviously direct or bust -- but at $176pp make sure you want home resort, and be realistic about 7 month bookings.

 

[disneynutz]

In a way I think that we are trying to counter the marketing affect that Disney has on the public. Even though some can save thousands of dollars, in their eyes Disney is a friend who can do no wrong. The guide was so nice, they spent time with me, picked me up in a van, gave me refreshments, fast passes, a gift card and free points plus I got the points that day!

If I would have bought resale it could take forever and it isn't a sure thing, but they don't think about is that Disney is the reason that it takes so long and that Disney's ROFR makes it not a sure thing.

While Disney has a great product and provides wonderful entertainment, DVC can save you money, buying DVC resale can save you even more money.

Bill

 

[Ben E N]

In a way I think that we are trying to counter the marketing affect that Disney has on the public. Even though some can save thousands of dollars, in their eyes Disney is a friend who can do no wrong. The guide was so nice, they spent time with me, picked me up in a van, gave me refreshments, fast passes, a gift card and free points plus I got the points that day!

If I would have bought resale it could take forever and it isn't a sure thing, but they don't think about is that Disney is the reason that it takes so long and that Disney's ROFR makes it not a sure thing.

While Disney has a great product and provides wonderful entertainment, DVC can save you money, buying DVC resale can save you even more money.

Bill

I can confirm that this countering affect works. If I had not read information from the Disboards forum prior to a trip to Disney World this past summer, then my wife and I probably would have been 'proud' owners of 100 points at $185 a point. Because I was well informed, though, I was able to respectfully counter our salesperson's arguments for buying direct, and ended up getting more points for less money via the resale market.

While comments about finances on this board may be lacking "pixie dust", they help people make an informed decision. When the information can get too sobering here, I just pop on a YouTube video of a ride or resort tour.

 

[Bing Showei]

But posters do do the research, and decide they want the direct points anyway. To me, you can flip the argument: Resale buyers are justifying their points, which go for less because they are worth less. You are not a "true" member in DVC's eyes, and they are starting to go go great lengths to make it a two-class system.

I bought well before there was much of a resale market -- but I financed. I've heard a lot over the years what a terrible decision that was, (even that I was going to go bankrupt!, etc.) But 21 years later, it turned out to be a great decision: our points are worth more than double what we paid for them. If we had stalled and waited until we had a lot of cash on hand, we would have paid a lot more for the points -- and we would have still been paying money for WDW hotel rooms that aren't nearly as nice as the ones we've stayed in the last two decades.

I'd be interested to know what your advice would be to a buyer today when there is more of a robust resale market than when you bought in. I'm not convinced you actually prescribe to this marketing strategy of "true" members vs. resale members, but if you do, I would ask where you would draw that line for "true" members?

Pre March 2011, where their resale points afford them exactly same privileges as a direct buyer?

Pre April 2016, where their points allow them to get all of the same discounts and invitations as a direct buyer? Or do you need to be able to use your points on DCL or at the Mandarin Oriental?

Or are "true" members only those who buy direct for the entirety of their points?

I agree that DVD is trying to create a two-class system, as this narrative serves Direct Sales quite well. The psychology underlying these efforts is compelling enough that I can understand how members who buy resale are moved to compensate for that by buying un-needed 25-point add-ons to gain the incidental benefits, blue card, DVC bag, and whatever other swag one gets.

Just as it is you did your research and made the informed decision to do what you felt best served your personal needs and your financial situation, I did my research and made the decision on how to buy into my DVC stake.

Two contracts (not without their waiting frustrations and stresses about ROFR) later, I saved $21,964.00 for my two VGF contracts over buying direct (which I was told initially by my guide had a closed waitlist). If DVD wants to label me label me a 2nd class member for that, so be it. As long as I'm able to book the same room you can at 7 months, and I can resell my contract as you can if I ever outgrow them (or decide the Riviera is the bees knees and "want to go to there"), I'm just as comfortable with my decision to put those saved dollars towards whatever annual passes I decide I need and whichever character breakfasts I think my kid will enjoy.

You and I are lucky. We are both pretty happy with our choices. The best thing we can do on these boards is help others get to the same place. Whatever place that might be.

 

[jodifla]

One of the reasons I bought when I did 20 plus years ago is that I A) Knew we'd be going to WDW consistently over the years and B) Disney was only getting more expensive and C) the Disney timeshare project looked like a much different animal than other timeshares. So after doing research, we bought. We financed to buy direct, determining that was going to be the best deal for us to acquire the property quickly and go on immediate trips -- trips we were already taking to WDW. For us, we just postponed a car purchase, and paid off the timeshare. We did pay more because we financed, but that was worth it to us to not drag out the process and watch the point amount keep climbing.

To the previous poster, I'm not sure I'd buy today. Even the resale points are twice or more what we paid. I totally understand why people would buy resale. But I understand too, while some people, looking at the current market, buy direct and feel like it's the best deal. It's just where the Disney timeshare market is at these days. I think the point price of resales and direct is going to be closer and closer as Disney starts opening up new attractions. It's been so static the past decade or so, and now there are many more things to go see.