The Running Thread - 2020

I return again. I want to start by saying thank you to everyone who offered encouraging words and advice when I dropped in here two weeks ago freaked out about my first half. @Waiting2goback I'm sorry to hear about your dad, and am glad that you've made your own return to the thread.

The good news is that I have a positive Race Report to share! September 20 was the Montana Marathon road race at which I ran the half marathon for the very first time, and it was a successful race for me as well as a great learning experience. Officially, my time was 3:30:16 for a pace of 16:03, which is somehow both better and worse than my Garmin time of 3:30:34 for a pace of 15:51--according to Garmin, the course was 0.18 miles too long, which seemed about right when comparing my mile alerts on the Garmin to when I would see the mile marker come up a short while later. I'm wondering if they didn't take the offshoot gravel road on which they staged us into account?? Anyway, my goal pace was 15:40 and I came close enough to that to feel good about it, particularly since I wasn't actually all that confident I could do better than 17:00/mile to begin with.

The course was almost all downhill, with the opening mile being the steepest portion. The first four miles or so were out on the highway (I told my friends--a road race in Montana is the only time you want a stranger to drive you out onto the prairie and leave you there). Things were briefly exciting when we ran past a rifle range I didn't know existed, since I could hear it for half a mile before I could see the sign at its entrance, but since no one else was bothered (and because it's Montana) I guessed that was what I was looking for pretty quickly. Also I saw some goats in someone's yard, and who doesn't like goats? Also there were people out cheering along the highway and that was very nice, especially when I realized later that those same people packed up and moved up along the course as the event went on.

My housemate and I stayed with a local friend and their S.O. that weekend, and the three of them came out and cheered me--with a local navigating they were able to meet me at a bunch of different points along the course, which was a great experience. The course was mostly on roads; there was the previously mentioned highway portion, a bunch of residential streets, and a few sections of walking paths. It ended at a city park, where I made the mistake of not taking a bottle of chocolate milk because I didn't think I could stomach it (ten minutes later my stomach had recovered and I was inhaling every bit of food I could get my hands on). The last few miles were rough; I kept looking at all the nice lawns in front of the houses and thinking about how I could just go lay down and fall asleep right then.

Overall I was happy with their COVID-19 processes. They had split the full and half each into two starting times and made the 10K virtual, so the course was never crowded. Then within each starting time they split us into waves of 50, and because they staged us on an offshoot we had plenty of space to spread out while we waited to start. The buses to the start were running at maybe 1/3 capacity, if even that, with windows open for fresh air. The aid stations were self-serve with cups of water (and sometimes HEED) on the tables--supposedly there was also Hammer gel at the stops with HEED but I never saw any offered. The aid stations weren't spaced quite at the points where the race info packet claimed they would be, so a few times I passed up the opportunity to take one of the gels I was carrying because I thought there'd be another opportunity for water closer to my planned fueling time only to end up waiting longer to fuel than I wanted because the next aid station wasn't where I expected it.

So! Lessons learned?
  • Don't rely on the advertised spacing of the aid stations and portapotties to be 100% accurate. If I'm coming up on a fueling time, it's better to take the fuel early than to wait and potentially be very late in taking it.
  • Trust! my! goal! pace!--I really think I could have gotten closer to 15:40 overall if I had trusted that I could do it from the start and if I had restrained myself from trying to do more. I had a very fast first mile (thanks, downhill) and at four miles in I literally didn't feel tired at all. That gave me confidence to increase my intervals and try for a faster pace, which was a terrible mistake. My last few miles were very slow and I lost every bit of head start I had against my goal time, and then some.
  • The aid stations alone did not give me enough water (this is handy to know since the spacing was similar to what runDisney does for the marathon). My friends brought gatorade with them when they met me along the course and it saved my bacon. For a course like WDW, where I can't have someone meeting me as frequently, I will need to carry at least one small bottle of water or gatorade.
  • I was right to bring a couple spare uncrustables to the starting line even after eating a small breakfast before getting on the bus. Ate one during staging and put the other in my bag to send to the finish line, and having one right before and one right after the race was just what I needed.
  • I am capable of doing this!! Recovery was rough (for two or three mornings afterward I literally couldn't even get my legs to work to roll over in bed without a bit of warmup first), but it turns out I am fully capable of running a half marathon! So that's nice to know.

This is getting very long, so I'm going to wrap up with some images and then do a second post with my questions for the community.

The view from the bus as we reached the staging area:
View attachment 528972

Staging area selfie--we were required to wear our masks on the bus but not during the race; I just left mine on until it was getting close to time to start. Here you can see I also still had my cardigan on; it was a chilly morning and I was glad for bag check to be able to wear something warm without having to carry it later. You can also see here that it was quite windy, which worried me--but it ended up being a tail wind most of the way!
View attachment 528971

Back home, my new medal display (it's a tie hanger, haha). The new medal is on the left with ye olde Ice Breaker on the right (Ice Breaker being the three miler I ran in a blizzard last year). This little hanger won't work forever, but for now it's a good way to display my medals without having to build anything. I know I got more medals years ago when I made my first attempts to start running, but I don't know if I kept them, or where they'd be--sadly, I suspect I might have tossed them because I didn't think I was a "real" runner and didn't deserve them (despite having earned them?? Past self, why).
View attachment 528978
Way to go!!!
 
My big question is: what now? Part of the reason I dropped off the map (again) is that shortly after running the half I got the news, as everyone did, that the WDW Marathon has gone virtual for 2021. I'm not interested in running my first marathon as a virtual in the dead of winter up here in Montana, so my A-goal race is now off the table. I'd still really like WDW to be my first marathon, which means I can expect to restart the Galloway training program for it next summer. But...what now? The marathon was the one thing that was keeping me motivated to train at all, let alone when winter hits.

I'm thinking this coming year may be a time to put in a couple more half marathons and try to cut down my time at that distance before launching into longer distance training runs. While I'm very proud of the half marathon I ran, realistically it's probably good for me to have another year to build up baseline fitness and better speed before tackling the full. I might also run a couple of 10Ks this fall and push myself on them since I'm not having to hold back and prevent recovery needs for a larger training plan anymore. But at some point I need to map out my larger plan and figure out what my next goal is to tide me over.

Also, side note: cramps. This race was the first time I've gotten leg cramps while running, and it was really bad during the last half mile. Is that something where I should be looking to adjust nutrition? Stretching before or during the race? Or do I just need to train more so my body's used to the distance??
 
My big question is: what now? Part of the reason I dropped off the map (again) is that shortly after running the half I got the news, as everyone did, that the WDW Marathon has gone virtual for 2021. I'm not interested in running my first marathon as a virtual in the dead of winter up here in Montana, so my A-goal race is now off the table. I'd still really like WDW to be my first marathon, which means I can expect to restart the Galloway training program for it next summer. But...what now? The marathon was the one thing that was keeping me motivated to train at all, let alone when winter hits.

I'm thinking this coming year may be a time to put in a couple more half marathons and try to cut down my time at that distance before launching into longer distance training runs. While I'm very proud of the half marathon I ran, realistically it's probably good for me to have another year to build up baseline fitness and better speed before tackling the full. I might also run a couple of 10Ks this fall and push myself on them since I'm not having to hold back and prevent recovery needs for a larger training plan anymore. But at some point I need to map out my larger plan and figure out what my next goal is to tide me over.

Also, side note: cramps. This race was the first time I've gotten leg cramps while running, and it was really bad during the last half mile. Is that something where I should be looking to adjust nutrition? Stretching before or during the race? Or do I just need to train more so my body's used to the distance??
I used to get really bad calf cramps after like mile 16-18. I don't any more, but I changed a bunch of things in the time between getting them and not, so I can't know for sure what worked. Number one cause of leg cramps in my experience, and also my little reading on it, is just fatigue. I was under-trained in my first two marathons and my muscles were just glitching out. Second thing I changed that I think helped, was that I lost 35 or 40 lbs. It's a lot less shock to absorb per footstrike. Third, I also changed my gait from a heel strike to a mid foot strike which may or may not have helped with my calves having to absorb so much shock over many miles. Personally everything I've read on the subject suggests that dehydration is rarely the cause of leg cramps but not impossible. I am chronically dehydrated even to this day but my cramps went away without me addressing that.
 
My big question is: what now? Part of the reason I dropped off the map (again) is that shortly after running the half I got the news, as everyone did, that the WDW Marathon has gone virtual for 2021. I'm not interested in running my first marathon as a virtual in the dead of winter up here in Montana, so my A-goal race is now off the table. I'd still really like WDW to be my first marathon, which means I can expect to restart the Galloway training program for it next summer. But...what now? The marathon was the one thing that was keeping me motivated to train at all, let alone when winter hits.

I'm thinking this coming year may be a time to put in a couple more half marathons and try to cut down my time at that distance before launching into longer distance training runs. While I'm very proud of the half marathon I ran, realistically it's probably good for me to have another year to build up baseline fitness and better speed before tackling the full. I might also run a couple of 10Ks this fall and push myself on them since I'm not having to hold back and prevent recovery needs for a larger training plan anymore. But at some point I need to map out my larger plan and figure out what my next goal is to tide me over.

Also, side note: cramps. This race was the first time I've gotten leg cramps while running, and it was really bad during the last half mile. Is that something where I should be looking to adjust nutrition? Stretching before or during the race? Or do I just need to train more so my body's used to the distance??

Congrats on the HM!

As for what now, I'd say take two weeks off. Rest, recover, and rejuvenate. Maybe do some things that you weren't able to in the last few weeks/months because of training commitments. After those two weeks, come back ready to get back to work. I'd give yourself 2-4 weeks upon returning to running just sticking to the easy stuff before you ramp back up again. So that puts you about 4-6 weeks out from race day. During that time, evaluate what you did in training and what your goals are moving forward. Sounds like Disney Marathon 2022 is the goal. And based on the HM of 3:30:16, you're going to want to get faster to feel comfortable on race day. That's a predicted finish time of 7:18-7:45. The good news is you've got 14 months ahead of you.

So I'd look back at the training and ask yourself if you legitimately can commit to more. Volume and appropriate training paces are going to lead to the best long term return on investment in the next 14 months in the absence of injury. The 12:41 MM you did in July and this 3:30 HM aren't actually that far off from each other.

Screen Shot 2020-09-30 at 12.07.20 PM.png

12:40 MM predicts a 3:24 HM.

Screen Shot 2020-09-30 at 12.06.28 PM.png

So looking at appropriate training paces, you're in this general vicinity. With your easy/long run days in and around an 18:13 min/mile.

Screen Shot 2020-09-30 at 12.07.02 PM.png

I always like to go back to a program like Hal Higdon's Winter program:

https://www.halhigdon.com/training-programs/more-training/winter-training/
I like it because it's time based. Because of your pace for easy/long run days, I think a plan like this will keep you reined in on time commitments and mileage in terms of making a jump from Galloway to possibly something else. If you felt like 5 days a week was too much of a commitment, then cut out Monday. Would the volume of this plan (peaks at 4.7 hrs and 5 mile LR) be more or less than what you were doing prior? I can try and find something that pushes the volume a little higher or lower based on whatever you just completed. A plan like this one (albeit originally meant for walkers) could be another time based option:

https://www.halhigdon.com/training-programs/half-marathon-training/walkers-half-marathon/
Edit - because it posted before I put the link in.
 


Since I did my run for today, I might as well do September totals.

Running
Miles: 39 total (26.5 miles running with my dog)
Time: 7:12:52
Average Pace: 11:23
Average HR: 156

I said I was going to cut down on running in order to do Body Beast, which I did somewhat based on the low monthly mileage. However, last week I decided I'm going to do my local half marathon because it's in-person. I won't be in the best shape, but I'm not racing.

This month, I also really started taking my lab out for runs because he needs to burn some energy. His potty breaks and general being really slowed down my pace, which isn't a bad thing.

Body Beast
Workouts: 20
Time: 15:02:31

I'm really enjoying Body Beast, though I know I won't see as much change because I'm still running. But after the first three weeks and not eating crap, I lost 2 pounds and around 3.5 inches.

Between Body Beast and running, there were only 5 days in September that I didn't exercise.
 
I might as well jump on the bandwagon for September. Wednesday is a rest day from running so no activity to log for today.

Runs: 21
Miles: 136.55 mi. / 219.76 km
Time: 21:35:47 (edited this - put up my year's total by mistake...oops)
Average Speed: 6.3 mph
Average Cadence: 173
Average Pace: 09:29
Average HR: 146
VO2max : sitting at 48

I have finally turned my weight/cross-training into a habit. It was a struggle in the past to be consistent, but I think I am over the hump now.

Goal for October: Stay motivated and complete my training plan (week 8 of 22 right now) even though MW is a bust.
 
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My big question is: what now? Part of the reason I dropped off the map (again) is that shortly after running the half I got the news, as everyone did, that the WDW Marathon has gone virtual for 2021. I'm not interested in running my first marathon as a virtual in the dead of winter up here in Montana, so my A-goal race is now off the table. I'd still really like WDW to be my first marathon, which means I can expect to restart the Galloway training program for it next summer. But...what now? The marathon was the one thing that was keeping me motivated to train at all, let alone when winter hits.

I'm thinking this coming year may be a time to put in a couple more half marathons and try to cut down my time at that distance before launching into longer distance training runs. While I'm very proud of the half marathon I ran, realistically it's probably good for me to have another year to build up baseline fitness and better speed before tackling the full. I might also run a couple of 10Ks this fall and push myself on them since I'm not having to hold back and prevent recovery needs for a larger training plan anymore. But at some point I need to map out my larger plan and figure out what my next goal is to tide me over.

Also, side note: cramps. This race was the first time I've gotten leg cramps while running, and it was really bad during the last half mile. Is that something where I should be looking to adjust nutrition? Stretching before or during the race? Or do I just need to train more so my body's used to the distance??

Pesonally I would do a few more halves before you dive into a full, especially since you have a goal first full in mind and it is off the table for now. I have a few fall races but in reality right now I'm just in perpetual training mode until some certainty opens up.
 


I'm thinking this coming year may be a time to put in a couple more half marathons and try to cut down my time at that distance before launching into longer distance training runs. While I'm very proud of the half marathon I ran, realistically it's probably good for me to have another year to build up baseline fitness and better speed before tackling the full.
I find that each new distance teaches me that much to learn I still have about running. I made a series of mistakes training for and then running my first half marathon. Some of them I learned from and did not repeat in subsequent races. Others did not become a problem until I was training for a marathon. So experience becomes an invaluable instructor.
Pesonally I would do a few more halves before you dive into a full, especially since you have a goal first full in mind and it is off the table for now. I have a few fall races but in reality right now I'm just in perpetual training mode until some certainty opens up.
I ran my first half in 2011, ran the 2012 Disney Coast to Coast Challenge and then did not resume running again until 2014 with my first race after that layoff until 2015. From there I have run at least semi-regularly every year. I had run 8 half marathons, including 4 runDisney challenge weekends before I finally felt like the marathon was something I might want to attempt. I believe that having successfully finished multiple half marathons gave me a good base to build off in terms of internal confidence to attempt the marathon. Every race will throw something new and different at you, so having run a few half marathons first helped me to know what worked well and what didn't work so well.
 
I used to get really bad calf cramps after like mile 16-18. I don't any more, but I changed a bunch of things in the time between getting them and not, so I can't know for sure what worked. Number one cause of leg cramps in my experience, and also my little reading on it, is just fatigue. I was under-trained in my first two marathons and my muscles were just glitching out. Second thing I changed that I think helped, was that I lost 35 or 40 lbs. It's a lot less shock to absorb per footstrike. Third, I also changed my gait from a heel strike to a mid foot strike which may or may not have helped with my calves having to absorb so much shock over many miles. Personally everything I've read on the subject suggests that dehydration is rarely the cause of leg cramps but not impossible. I am chronically dehydrated even to this day but my cramps went away without me addressing that.

I haven't given much thought to my gait beyond minding that it doesn't hurt, but it may be worth revisiting. Honestly, I'm not surprised if the answer is just fatigue and stress. By all technical definitions I am obese, and it adds a layer of difficulty to--well, everything. I've been thin before and I know how much easier it is to run without carrying the extra weight, so lately I've been turning my attention more toward healthy eating to try to lose some of it. In a way it's been really reassuring to show myself that yes, I can run a half marathon while still at my heaviest, that it doesn't define my ability to go out and accomplish things, but I also know that it would make things much easier if I were lighter. I'd probably go through running shoes less quickly, too.

Congrats on the HM!

As for what now, I'd say take two weeks off. Rest, recover, and rejuvenate. Maybe do some things that you weren't able to in the last few weeks/months because of training commitments. After those two weeks, come back ready to get back to work. I'd give yourself 2-4 weeks upon returning to running just sticking to the easy stuff before you ramp back up again. So that puts you about 4-6 weeks out from race day. During that time, evaluate what you did in training and what your goals are moving forward. Sounds like Disney Marathon 2022 is the goal. And based on the HM of 3:30:16, you're going to want to get faster to feel comfortable on race day. That's a predicted finish time of 7:18-7:45. The good news is you've got 14 months ahead of you.

So I'd look back at the training and ask yourself if you legitimately can commit to more. Volume and appropriate training paces are going to lead to the best long term return on investment in the next 14 months in the absence of injury. The 12:41 MM you did in July and this 3:30 HM aren't actually that far off from each other.

View attachment 529013

12:40 MM predicts a 3:24 HM.

View attachment 529016

So looking at appropriate training paces, you're in this general vicinity. With your easy/long run days in and around an 18:13 min/mile.

View attachment 529018

I always like to go back to a program like Hal Higdon's Winter program:

https://www.halhigdon.com/training-programs/more-training/winter-training/
I like it because it's time based. Because of your pace for easy/long run days, I think a plan like this will keep you reined in on time commitments and mileage in terms of making a jump from Galloway to possibly something else. If you felt like 5 days a week was too much of a commitment, then cut out Monday. Would the volume of this plan (peaks at 4.7 hrs and 5 mile LR) be more or less than what you were doing prior? I can try and find something that pushes the volume a little higher or lower based on whatever you just completed. A plan like this one (albeit originally meant for walkers) could be another time based option:

https://www.halhigdon.com/training-programs/half-marathon-training/walkers-half-marathon/
Edit - because it posted before I put the link in.
Here I've been feeling lazy because this weekend will be the 2 week mark and I don't feel quite ready to jump back in--the pain's gone, though. Think I need to start at least walking this weekend, though, because it's just weird not going out and putting the time in.

The numbers look about right for where I've been. I'm not great at maintaining an even pace, but on long runs I've been holding myself to at least keeping it slower than 18 minutes/mile. I'm still doing run/walk intervals; on an easy pace training run that looks like 10 seconds run/50 seconds walk with an extra break thrown in every mile to slow it down; for the half marathon I went with 10/40 and that seemed pretty comfortable for the 15:40 minute/mile pace.

I'll be honest, a lot of my hesitation around Hal Higdon is the daily time commitment. I sometimes find it hard to get out for my weekday runs at all, so doing just two of those and the long run has been manageable (though maybe having it be closer to a daily thing might help make it more routine). Walking for at least some of it makes it seem more doable; I can typically walk to/from work at least two days each week (1.2 miles each direction) and somehow that doesn't feel like such a commitment. I kind of like the idea of going time-based for the winter months, too. There's a half marathon in February I'm halfway considering, but I have a feeling that once it comes to that time of year I won't actually be excited to go out in the cold and run it, so I'm not currently planning my training around that.

I had gotten to week 13 of the Galloway beginners' marathon training plan from the runDisney website (https://www.rundisney.com/running-training-programs/). Longest training run I did was 13 miles and it was challenging. Garmin says that one took me 4 hours and 11 minutes and I was doing two half hour runs during the week, so purely in terms of hours spent running the Higdon plan isn't more onerous--it's just talking myself into getting out there four or five days each week instead of three.

In a very immediate sense, this weekend's race (the Ice Breaker, rescheduled from spring) has been cancelled, and the lack of info available on another local race on October 10 has me thinking it was quietly cancelled as well. That really only leaves me with either a 5K or a 10K on Thanksgiving before the season is over.
 
I actually have something to report!

September total: 54 miles

So I started running again after 3+ months of no running and 5+ months of neck issues. I am several pounds overweight, slow and in a bit of a muddle as to what to do. I need a plan, and am torn between just building up a HM base or by trying (probably in vain) to get some speed back at a shorter distance. The problem with going for speed is that I am totally incapable of running speed intervals without a treadmill, and I have put my gym membership on pause.

So, blah, blah.....better make up my mind soon.
 
September 2020 totals
Distance: 132.6km (82mi)
Average pace: 5m37s/km (9min/mi)
2020km family challenge: Goal achieved!

September started by being very exciting: We completed our family 2020km on the 3rd, we ran our virtual family 5k on the 6th now that our medals had arrived, DH extended that run to complete his first HM, I ran my longest run for my M training on the 13th and maintained a great pace.

Then, on the 18th, the M got canceled. I did not take that well and took almost a week off serious running. I went hiking 15km the day after the announcement though but that doesn’t count in my running totals.

I finally got back in the groove and am finishing my training plan which means that I am now tapering for an inexistant race this coming Sunday.

I am therefore also wondering: What next? I have a few ideas (coupled with some medals) and will let you know.

September tasted nutrition
Not much new because I was confirming some of my preferences for the upcoming race. Like a dress rehearsal.
  • Tailwind Tropical Buzz: Meh 😑
  • Xact Fruit2 Orange: Good pâte de fruits
 
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September miles = 153

Even though some small races (5K’s/10K’s) are happening in Connecticut, no long races have happened live. And thus, no surprise, the last 2020 half marathon I was watching went virtual. So, I decided to register for a half marathon in Providence, RI on 10/4. This race group has already done several long races with precautions so I am confident it is happening. It will be an “open start” race, which means you go once you get to the starting line - anytime between 7am-9am.

As for September, I was three weeks into my Dopey training when we received the Marathon Weekend cancellation notice. I was 95% sure the races were going to get canceled so I was only loosely following the plan and thus, September ended up being a typical running month for me.

August = 148
July = 153
June = 140
May = 191
April = 164
March = 164
February = 101
January = 110

2020 total miles = 1,324
 
I'm not interested in running my first marathon as a virtual in the dead of winter up here in Montana, so my A-goal race is now off the table. I'd still really like WDW to be my first marathon, which means I can expect to restart the Galloway training program for it next summer.

First, CONGRATULATION! I know that sense of accomplishment after finishing your first half. Mine was in January 2019. Since that one was a Disney and more “for fun”, I ran my second one in April that year for time. I also got my first leg cramps in a race. I honestly don’t know why. They haven’t happened since then:confused3 . I think mine was a combination of fatigue and dehydration.

I am with you on the virtual full! It’s certainly not how I want to run my first marathon either. My goal for first full is also MW 2022!

As far as what’s next - Other than some virtual races (just because I like the bling), I don’t have anything on the horizon. So my focus is improving my pace. I’m still following my training plan for W&D while trying to improve my pace overall. Once it is completed, I’ll make another plan. I do much better on a training plan even without a race in the near future. I am also incorporating some cross training and trying to lose weight. I too fall in that obese range. The weight loss isn’t going near like I would like but my pace is improving. I would encourage you to set some kind of goal that keeps you moving. I have some mini goals that I‘m working towards until time to start training for my next BIG goal of running my first full. They will all help me with the big goal.

side note - I signed up to do “Run the Year 2021” to give me something “big” for the next year. I’m afraid I might need the motivation to keep me moving with MW 2022 being so far away ;)
 

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