Warning massive soap box

[rigs32]

BMI also doesn't take into account frame size. I have a friend who is the same height as me. Her pelvis is much more narrow than mine. My skeleton wouldn't fit into a size 0. She could be grossly overweight and still fit into "normal" sized clothing.

In order to fall into the "normal" BMI category, I know what I would need to weigh. I've been there as an adult, but I could only eat 1200 calories a day and I needed to workout intensely almost every day in order to maintain that weight. I felt cold and weak all the time. It's just not worth it. I'd rather be healthy, fit, enjoy life, and be classified as "overweight".

 

[Orion Nebula]

I went to my doctor years ago with a list of ailments. After running through them he looked down at me and straight out told me that most of them were because I was fat. Yes he used the word fat... and yes he was right. After that I lost weight and felt better.

 

[kdonnel]

I went to my doctor years ago with a list of ailments. After running through them he looked down at me and straight out told me that most of them were because I was fat. Yes he used the word fat... and yes he was right. After that I lost weight and felt better.

Sometimes the bluntness works, sometimes it doesn't. I am glad it worked for you.

I was equally blunt with my doctor a few years ago. He asked me why I was overweight, I answered because it was easier to be fat than the correct weight.

He had never had someone just answer honestly, he said everyone just gave excuses.

My weight rises and falls on 2-3 year cycles. I finally hit a groove where the weight just falls off and is easily maintained. Then something happens in life, I get injured, or some several month long high stress event happens, and my habits change and the weight slowly comes back.

Rinse and repeat.

I know that to live the lifestyle I want to live and eat the foods I want to eat, I can at best make the very high end of the healthy BMI range for my height. I definitely feel my best when 185 or less. Most times I am in the overweight range though because it is so much easier.

I had a personal trainer for many years who was a big advocate for adding how do you feel as another data point of your apparent health. Do you like how you look in your clothes, are you happy with the activity level you can sustain, can you do everything you want to do? If the answer to those questions was yes and you had no health issues attributed to your weight, it was his belief you should be happy.

Despite all the negative feelings around BMI, studies show that a person’s risk of chronic disease and premature death does increase with a BMI lower than 18.5 (“underweight”) or above 30.0 (“obese”).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5499607/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4856854/

 

[dez1978]

Weight doesn't always = health. Being a normal weight does not necessarily mean you are healthy. Being overweight does not always mean unhealthy. My husband is obese. I am not. Other than the number on the scale, he is much healthier than I am. His bp, cholesterol, everything is much better than mine. And since we have the same dr, its not a matter of "drs have different guidelines". Across the board my husband even 75 lb overweight, is in better health than I am.

As far as beauty standards and clothing sizes and BMI.. I am 5'8 and wear a size 8. according to the BMI, I am just above the normal range. But I look and feel much better at this weight than I do 10-15 lb lighter. People can be beautiful at any size or shape, and the fact that there are people who say "its not attractive on anyone" make me so incredibly angry. One person does not decide what is universally attractive, nor does some stupid unrealistic hollywood ideal get to decide what is unattractive to everyone.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

Sometimes the bluntness works, sometimes it doesn't. I am glad it worked for you.

I was equally blunt with my doctor a few years ago. He asked me why I was overweight, I answered because it was easier to be fat than the correct weight.

He had never had someone just answer honestly, he said everyone just gave excuses.

My weight rises and falls on 2-3 year cycles. I finally hit a groove where the weight just falls off and is easily maintained. Then something happens in life, I get injured, or some several month long high stress event happens, and my habits change and the weight slowly comes back.

Rinse and repeat.

I know that to live the lifestyle I want to live and eat the foods I want to eat, I can at best make the very high end of the healthy BMI range for my height. I definitely feel my best when 185 or less. Most times I am in the overweight range though because it is so much easier.

I had a personal trainer for many years who was a big advocate for adding how do you feel as another data point of your apparent health. Do you like how you look in your clothes, are you happy with the activity level you can sustain, can you do everything you want to do? If the answer to those questions was yes and you had no health issues attributed to your weight, it was his belief you should be happy.

Despite all the negative feelings around BMI, studies show that a person’s risk of chronic disease and premature death does increase with a BMI lower than 18.5 (“underweight”) or above 30.0 (“obese”).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5499607/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4856854/

But we’re not talking about underweight or obese. We all know there are health risks that come along with those. It’s also important to recognize that being “normal” weight doesn’t exclude one from those health issues.

We’re talking about the overweight category. For some people “normal” is the perfect place to be. For some people, they are an unhealthy weight. Menstrual cycles change, hair falls out, fatigue sets in. They may not be eating enough calories and over-exercising to maintain it. That is NOT where they’re healthiest, despite what BMI says.

It is not a one size fits all measurement, which is what makes it flawed. I’ve never said it was useless. It just can’t be the only measurement of health (or apparently attractiveness for some) because it DOES have issues.

 

[kdonnel]

It is not a one size fits all measurement, which is what makes it flawed.

It's not flawed, it just shouldn't be used as the single data point to tell you if you are healthy or not.

I don't think there are any reputable medical professionals who only use BMI to determine if their patient is healthy.

 

[disykat]

I'm the opposite. I look "fat" when I have a healthy BMI. I tend to carry weight in my stomach and my face so I look pudgy while the my arms and legs are quite thin. The rare times people have tried for one reason or another to guess my weight, they ALWAYS guess my weight higher than it is.

Over the years, I've been in the healthy, overweight, and obese categories at varying times. I've honestly never had a doctor talk to me about my weight except as part of prenatal care during pregnancy. I guess they can see that I go up and down and obviously am making some efforts towards controlling it? (I've had multiple doctors over the years, so it's not just one doc not mentioning it.) The only time I remember talking about my weight at a regular doctor visit is when my blood pressure became an issue in my early 40's. I asked the doc if losing weight would help, he looked at my weight graph and said I'd weighed more before with lower numbers so, while it couldn't hurt, it probably wasn't just a weight issue.

 

[tzolkin]

And it isn't inevitable due to genes. If you look at old photographs from 3-4 generations ago, look at the adults in those pictures (I'm not talking about old adults who are living and eating in our current world, I'm referring to what most adults looked like then, 50 years ago or more). Being overweight was much rarer then. It happened, of course, but it was the exception. Times have changed so much in regards to Americans' health that our perceptions have changed and many Americans now regard being overweight as normal and inevitable. It isn't. Go to continental Europe or Asia, and compare the people you see there with the people you see in America. Sorry, but Americans aren't cursed with uniquely terrible genes. We are living in a society that encourages excess weight, partly for the reasons you mentioned, and that's a major public health problem.

It isn't inevitable due to genes, but there is certainly a genetic component that makes you more predisposed to become overweight just like there is for other health issues. Indigenous people are twice as likely as whites to develop diabetes. The Tarahumara have a long tradition of running (400 miles at a time). To be able to exercise like this, their bodies hold on to everything they eat so, of course, if they eat a normal modern diet and don't run hundreds of miles they get extremely overweight.

For some people eating healthy and exercising regularly makes it effortless to maintain a normal BMI. For some it's nearly impossible.

I have quite a few photographs of my great grandparents. They were not fat/obese, but the women were extremely "solid". Even as teenagers working on farms during the depression I would guess based on appearance that their BMI was in the overweight category. My sisters have the same body type and it's really impossible for them to be "normal" weight on the BMI scale. Eating disorders, obsessive exercise, and gastric bypass surgery have not helped them achieve a BMI <25

For some people “normal” is the perfect place to be. For some people, they are an unhealthy weight. Menstrual cycles change, hair falls out, fatigue sets in. They may not be eating enough calories and over-exercising to maintain it. That is NOT where they’re healthiest, despite what BMI says.

This is absolutely true. Unfortunately the belief that "if you just eat less and exercise more you'll be thin" has made it very difficult for anyone who truly struggles to be taken seriously. I eat very little calories, walk 5-10 miles per day, plus go to the gym regularly and my BMI is still in the overweight category. I take 100mg of a medication for some endocrine issues. At 150mg I do not menstruate, at 50mg I gain weight daily while eating 800 calories and lose a ton of hair. I'm honestly not sure what "healthy lifestyle change" I could be making to get my BMI under 25. Any measures I can come up with at this point would just have the goal to be thin, not to make me any healthier.

 

[dez1978]

It's not flawed, it just shouldn't be used as the single data point to tell you if you are healthy or not.

I don't think there are any reputable medical professionals who only use BMI to determine if their patient is healthy.

Sadly that seems to be the measurement my kids dr focuses on the most. My 9 yr old who is so skinny you can see his ribs and spine is overweight by the BMI. Even though he could still wear a size 7 shorts if they wouldn't be too short on him. She made mention of it at his last appt, going over his growth chart. Then a min later mentioned he hadn't really gained any weight in the last year, and that might be a concern. Look lady, either his BMI is too high, or he's not gaining enough weight. Make up your mind, bc it can't be both. Then when I said well considering he's only in the 50th %ile for weight for his age, and look at how skinny he is, she finally said well, BMI isn't always the most accurate thing to look at.

 

[Wendy1985]

My mom just recently before this thread was started said I looked like I was losing weight when I was maintaining my weight at145-150

 

[Colleen27]

Hard disagree. I think as a society we found an obsession with skinny (think Twiggy days) and now our view of what’s normal is skewed.

But back to my example, there is no way you’d look at my friend and see overweight. Which goes back to the topic at hand - the BMI scale is outdated and antiquated. And not accurate.

I think it works both ways. Youth culture is undoubtedly skewed to the skinny. When I was in high school, I absolutely obsessed about being 12 lbs over the "ideal weight" for my height (according to the august medical experts at Seventeen magazine - my doctor thought otherwise, but you know how teen girls can be...) and thought of myself as *huge* as a size-7 high-achieving athlete. That's the mental image I had of myself until the day my own daughter stumbled upon some of my old clothes and started wearing them. And I see it with my girls too - kids who wear a 5 or a 7 absolutely compare themselves to heavily photoshopped ideals of size-zero beauty and think of themselves as fat while they're at a healthy weight. My daughter is a double D and struggled with feeling fat because it was so hard to wear junior sizes; a tiny waist didn't matter when nothing at Forever 21 would fit across her chest. But as we get older and less concerned with superficial standards of beauty, I do think there's a normalization of being heavy that sets in. It is viewed as what is normal for middle aged moms, much as balding is normal for older men. No, Hollywood doesn't embrace it, but everyday people certainly do.

I'll go a step further, too... I think the two are inseparably connected, that we spend so many years getting all the wrong messages about weight and health that we tilt to the other extreme, either developing "why bother" thinking because the ideal is so impossible or taking a position of radical acceptance as a rejection of the messages that kept us perpetually insecure in our younger days. So the youthful obsession with thin sets the stage for the middle aged acceptance of fat.

 

[Colleen27]

Weight doesn't always = health. Being a normal weight does not necessarily mean you are healthy. Being overweight does not always mean unhealthy. My husband is obese. I am not. Other than the number on the scale, he is much healthier than I am. His bp, cholesterol, everything is much better than mine. And since we have the same dr, its not a matter of "drs have different guidelines". Across the board my husband even 75 lb overweight, is in better health than I am.

In my marriage, it is just the opposite. Husband is at a good weight for his height/build (though not by BMI, which says he's on the line between overweight and obese, but body fat % and height/waist ratio and other measures put him at an appropriate weight), but he's got high blood pressure, high cholesterol, and frankly, awful eating habits with way too much fast food, red meat and beer. I'm obese and could stand to lose about 50lbs to get to the weight where I look and feel my best, but my bloodwork and other measures are consistently normal, I eat a better balanced diet than he does, and I exercise more often. But we're the epitome of that stupid meme that goes around every now and then, where the husband switches to lite beer and loses 10lbs, while the wife gives up sugar, exercises 5 days a week, and gains 2. Switching to lite beer is literally the only diet change he's made in 20-odd years together, and he actually did lose a few lbs that way, enough to get back into the jeans size he wore in high school. I had a 2ltr-a-day soda habit when we met and didn't lose a single pound either when I switched to diet soda or when I gave it up entirely.

 

[BlueStarryHat]

Every woman on my Mom's side of the family get a spare tire around the middle when they hit their 40s, myself included. At family reunions we all look alike from the neck down. After I had a hysterectomy and went through menopause my spare tire got bigger, and no matter what I did to lose it, it stayed put. I eat sensibly, I stretch, I do yoga, I walk. Nothing works. it's in my DNA to have this spare tire. My BMI says I'm too fat, and it's true. But what else can I do? I've accepted my body as it is now, that's what I can do. People who think it's not attractive are not my problem.

 

[mommasita]

My mom just recently before this thread was started said I looked like I was losing weight when I was maintaining my weight at145-150

Can I be really kind to you ? You often post that you are exercising a lot, perhaps even working in that field ? Muscle weighs more than fat, so if you are exercising /training, you will weigh maybe more than you did, but be in better shape.
Please don’t spend all your time obsessing about your size, enjoy your life, you look fantastic from your previous pictures. You are healthy, you are exercising, hopefully eating right. Try not to worry or obsess about the number on the scale or your size in clothes. Enjoy your life, it’s a gift. ❤

 

[mommasita]

Every woman on my Mom's side of the family get a spare tire around the middle when they hit their 40s, myself included. At family reunions we all look alike from the neck down. After I had a hysterectomy and went through menopause my spare tire got bigger, and no matter what I did to lose it, it stayed put. I eat sensibly, I stretch, I do yoga, I walk. Nothing works. it's in my DNA to have this spare tire. My BMI says I'm too fat, and it's true. But what else can I do? I've accepted my body as it is now, that's what I can do. People who think it's not attractive are not my problem.

1000x this. I think we only accept this at a certain age/maturity.

Having said that, genetics play zero factor in my life. I come from the land of the giants. Both parents over 6 feet, my sister is 6’4, I’m barely over 5 feet on a good 80’s hair day. I have always gotten teased about my size, and after traumatic events, lost so much weight that people told me how “awful I looked”, hello, I know.

 

[winterwhite]

The “spare tire” is also a result of age-related muscle wastage. Sarcopenia causes you to lose 3-5% of your muscle mass for every decade after age 30, and much more over age 60. Thus, even if your weight is the same, more of it is fat as you age, which changes your appearance.

That being said, I commonly see people holding themselves up as a high performance athlete and saying that BMI doesn’t apply to them because they have so much muscle mass. Bzzt, wrong answer. While there are of course athletes, the average person is not a competitive gymnast or CrossFit Games champion. Going for a 3 mile run 4 days a week does not put you in the category with bodybuilders, even if it is good for you.

If there is a travesty with the whole focus on “diet culture” etc it is that women are told not to strength train because they will get “big” or it’s “dangerous.”

the single greatest thing you can do for your health, mobility, and longevity is eat green vegetables, lift heavy weights, and walk a lot.

 

[summermom2]

And as a result, most American adults are overweight, and it's a major public health problem. It isn't an alternative lifestyle or just a different look. It's a health problem.

And it isn't inevitable due to genes. If you look at old photographs from 3-4 generations ago, look at the adults in those pictures (I'm not talking about old adults who are living and eating in our current world, I'm referring to what most adults looked like then, 50 years ago or more). Being overweight was much rarer then. It happened, of course, but it was the exception. Times have changed so much in regards to Americans' health that our perceptions have changed and many Americans now regard being overweight as normal and inevitable. It isn't. Go to continental Europe or Asia, and compare the people you see there with the people you see in America. Sorry, but Americans aren't cursed with uniquely terrible genes. We are living in a society that encourages excess weight, partly for the reasons you mentioned, and that's a major public health problem.

Thank you for saying this so many people do not want to face the truth. Yes it does hurt your feelings when someone says you are overweight but that is just a fact and it is out of control.

 

[Jennasis]

I remember when I went for my annual physical a few years ago. The nurse looks at my chart with my current weight, BO etc and cheerfully exclaims "Ooh good! You're no longer obese!"

I'm 5'7". 175lbs.

 

[Colleen27]

That being said, I commonly see people holding themselves up as a high performance athlete and saying that BMI doesn’t apply to them because they have so much muscle mass. Bzzt, wrong answer. While there are of course athletes, the average person is not a competitive gymnast or CrossFit Games champion. Going for a 3 mile run 4 days a week does not put you in the category with bodybuilders, even if it is good for you.

The problem with this perspective is that it presupposes one has to be an elite athlete for BMI to be a less-than-accurate indicator. That just isn't true. My husband isn't an athlete at all; he's just a blue collar guy with a fairly physical job. By BMI, he straddles the line between overweight and obese. By literally every other tool actual medical professionals use to gauge healthy weight, he's in the ideal range... and he's seen them all because his high BMI result triggers an evaluation and discussion of weight management every time he changes doctors.

BMI alone isn't the be-all, end-all, and it isn't only inaccurate for Olympians and champion lifters. It is meant to be a *rough* screening tool, one that is probably better/more accommodating of different body types and shapes than what came before but still only a starting point for a fuller evaluation rather than a measure that stands alone.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

The problem with this perspective is that it presupposes one has to be an elite athlete for BMI to be a less-than-accurate indicator. That just isn't true. My husband isn't an athlete at all; he's just a blue collar guy with a fairly physical job. By BMI, he straddles the line between overweight and obese. By literally every other tool actual medical professionals use to gauge healthy weight, he's in the ideal range... and he's seen them all because his high BMI result triggers an evaluation and discussion of weight management every time he changes doctors.

BMI alone isn't the be-all, end-all, and it isn't only inaccurate for Olympians and champion lifters. It is meant to be a *rough* screening tool, one that is probably better/more accommodating of different body types and shapes than what came before but still only a starting point for a fuller evaluation rather than a measure that stands alone.

This last part is exactly right. It was meant to give a broad picture. It was never meant to be used on an individual level and yet we do.